Top U.S. general says no changes yet to transgender policy

[webfact]

Top U.S. general says no changes yet to transgender policy

By Phil Stewart and Idrees Ali

 

Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Joseph Dunford testifies before the Senate Armed Services Committee on Capitol Hill in Washington, D.C., U.S., June 13, 2017. REUTERS/Aaron P. Bernstein/Files

 

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The United States' top general told the military on Thursday there had been no change yet to Pentagon policy on transgender personnel, after President Donald Trump's announcement of his plans to ban them appeared to catch senior officers by surprise.

 

Marine General Joseph Dunford, chairman of the military's Joint Chiefs of Staff, began his note to service chiefs, commanders and senior enlisted leaders by acknowledging the uncertainty that followed Trump's announcement.

 

"I know there are questions about yesterday's announcement on the transgender policy by the President," Dunford wrote.

 

"There will be no modifications to the current policy until the President's direction has been received by the Secretary of Defense and the Secretary has issued implementation guidance," Dunford said in the message, first reported by Reuters.

 

Dunford then made the assurance that the U.S. military would "treat all of our personnel with respect." The message neither voiced support nor opposition to Trump's decision.

 

Trump made his announcement on Wednesday morning in a series of Twitter postings, saying he would ban transgender people from the U.S. military, a move appealing to some in his conservative political base but creating vast uncertainty for active-duty and reserve transgender service members, who say they number in the thousands.

 

The Trump administration on Thursday told a U.S. appeals court in New York that federal law does not ban discrimination against gay employees, a sharp reversal of the position Democratic former President Barack Obama took.

 

As a presidential candidate, Trump last year vowed to fight for lesbians, gays, bisexuals and transgender people. His decision drew condemnation from rights groups and some lawmakers in both parties as politically motivated discrimination. But it was also praised by conservative activists and some of his fellow Republicans.

 

The White House said Trump had "extensive discussions with his national security team," and that Defense Secretary Jim Mattis was informed after the president made the decision on Tuesday to go ahead.

 

But the chief of staff of the U.S. Army, General Mark Milley, said on Thursday he had no advance knowledge of Trump's decision before his announcement via Twitter on Wednesday. He added that was not unusual.

 

"I personally did not, but nor would I have expected to," Milley said while speaking at the National Press Club.

 

One official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said Dunford, in a separate message sent more narrowly to heads of the Army, Navy, Marine Corps and Air Force, acknowledged that Trump's announcement on Wednesday was "unexpected."

 

Trump cited "tremendous medical costs and disruption" as a justification for the ban, a point disputed by experts and advocates for allowing military service to be determined by an individual's capabilities, not gender identity or sexual preference.

 

Trump's tweet appeared to preempt an ongoing Pentagon review looking at allowing openly transgender recruits to join the military. The Defense Department had been expected to begin formally allowing transgender people to enlist this year. But Mattis on June 30 approved a six-month delay in that step to allow time for a review.

 

ORDERS VIA TWITTER?

 

Trump's tweets stoked alarm among some senior military officers and Pentagon civilians, who were caught off guard by it, three general officers in two services said early on Thursday.

 

"I hope our commander in chief understands that we don't transmit orders via Twitter, and that he can't, either," one said by telephone, speaking on the condition of anonymity.

 

"Even if this were an order, implementing it legally would take considerable time, if it's even possible."

 

Trump's plan to ban transgender service members unleashed a storm of legal threats from advocates who say they are seeking plaintiffs who want to sue.

 

Trump's tweets did not make clear when a ban would go into effect, nor whether it applies to serving members of the military or those wishing to join.

 

But if the Defense Department actively roots out transgender people and discharges them from the military, the Pentagon is likely to face an especially contentious fight, legal experts say.

 

"There's no valid justification for excluding transgender people from the military," said Jon Davidson, legal director for LGBT rights group Lambda Legal.

 

It was also unclear whether it might go beyond active-duty forces and apply to members of the reserve.

 

Indiana National Guard reservist Cameron St. Andrew, who resigned from full-time service after the November election, told Reuters that as a transgender person he was concerned about his status.

 

"I try to be tough about it," he said, but added: "It breaks your spirit down."

 

One active-duty U.S. military officer, speaking on condition of anonymity, said senior officials were not consulted.

 

"We're scratching our heads and asking where the hell this came from," the officer said by phone.

 

"Maybe the president is in step with some members of Congress and some voters, but he is out of step with today’s military. Our service personnel today don’t give a damn about the personal lives of their comrades so long as they know they can trust them when it counts."

 

(additional reporting by John Walcott, Letitia Stein, Daniel Trotta)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-07-28

[darksidedog]

It seems Bozo the Clown has done it again then. Three separate Tweets to tell us of all the discussion on the matter, only for it to be revealed that in truth, no one knows anything whatsoever about it. It seems to be a misguided, untrue and delusional pile of tosh to keep his right wing homophobic supporters cheering. Way to go America. Your great leader becomes a bigger laughing stock with every day that passes.

[williamgeorgeallen]

Trump seems to have gone off half cocked on this one.

[Rancid]

Was reading that the military is by far the largest employer of transgenders in the US. If they do get the boot that will presumably make quite a social impact.

[MyFriend You]

5 hours ago, Rancid said:

Was reading that the military is by far the largest employer of transgenders in the US. If they do get the boot that will presumably make quite a social impact.

Not the US Army I knew, the cost of the meds and procedures for the transitions are pretty high, you have to ask - how many enlisted just to get the free meds and operations??  Just look at Chelsea manning, had all his work done in a Military Prison.   A General was asked "What benefit does the military get from someone changing his/her gender??  He couldn't think of any   ............   Personally I don't give a rats ass what their gender is, as long as they can run, shoot, and kill when needed.  But obviously there must be issues with bathrooms, squad bays, etc etc  that outweigh a minorities' feelings.   I was almost disqualified for being partially color blind back in the 60's, wonder what they would have done if I had said - "Oh by the way, I think I am a woman trapped in a man's body, so will need to go thru the transition"  Not being flippant, just trying to put a perspective on things.

 

I don't think anything will happen anytime soon, maybe a suspension on future enlistments but am sure current enlistees will be allowed to stay in at least up to their current contract.  The Military has come a long way, wasn't long ago when women were immediately discharged for becoming pregnant..........so wait this one out, this too shall pass.

[mettech]

One thing that would work is to get a full division of transgender dood or doodees or lady boy and one base just for them.

Like that American air force base way up north Tule groenland if I remember well .

[Scott]

Please don't post in colored fonts.   Continuing to do so will result in your post being removed.  

[mjef]

23 hours ago, TunnelRat69 said:

Not the US Army I knew, the cost of the meds and procedures for the transitions are pretty high, you have to ask - how many enlisted just to get the free meds and operations??  Just look at Chelsea manning, had all his work done in a Military Prison.   A General was asked "What benefit does the military get from someone changing his/her gender??  He couldn't think of any   ............   Personally I don't give a rats ass what their gender is, as long as they can run, shoot, and kill when needed.  But obviously there must be issues with bathrooms, squad bays, etc etc  that outweigh a minorities' feelings.   I was almost disqualified for being partially color blind back in the 60's, wonder what they would have done if I had said - "Oh by the way, I think I am a woman trapped in a man's body, so will need to go thru the transition"  Not being flippant, just trying to put a perspective on things.

 

I don't think anything will happen anytime soon, maybe a suspension on future enlistments but am sure current enlistees will be allowed to stay in at least up to their current contract.  The Military has come a long way, wasn't long ago when women were immediately discharged for becoming pregnant..........so wait this one out, this too shall pass.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/transgender-military-ban-latest-spend-viagra-transition-medical-care-donald-trump-a7862111.html

[MyFriend You]

5 hours ago, mjef said:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/transgender-military-ban-latest-spend-viagra-transition-medical-care-donald-trump-a7862111.html

Random unsubstantiated reports by a UK based Independant group  -  "The US military is said to spend roughly $41.6m (£31.7) annually on Viagra alone...........no proof of this, they offer no statistics other than their own.  I am still not convinced.  Just this morning, the Dept of Defense Surgeon General laid out the facts - a soldier going thru transgender transitioning loses 268 days of duty, that is, it takes approx 268 days to recover from any of these Meds, and procedures.  I stand by my statements, a lot of these people may have joined the military to get the free medical benefits for their 'self inflicted wounds'  and Yes, I am not being politically correct.

[ilostmypassword]

16 minutes ago, TunnelRat69 said:

Random unsubstantiated reports by a UK based Independant group  -  "The US military is said to spend roughly $41.6m (£31.7) annually on Viagra alone...........no proof of this, they offer no statistics other than their own.  I am still not convinced.  Just this morning, the Dept of Defense Surgeon General laid out the facts - a soldier going thru transgender transitioning loses 268 days of duty, that is, it takes approx 268 days to recover from any of these Meds, and procedures.  I stand by my statements, a lot of these people may have joined the military to get the free medical benefits for their 'self inflicted wounds'  and Yes, I am not being politically correct.

What makes your remarks particularly clueless is that you wrongly accuse the Independent of making things up and then you go ahead and make up stuff yourself.

DoD spends $84M a year on Viagra, similar meds

According to data from the Defense Health Agency, DoD actually spent $41.6 million on Viagra — and $84.24 million total on erectile dysfunction prescriptions — last year.

And since 2011, the tab for drugs like Viagra, Cialis and Levitra totals $294 million — the equivalent of nearly four U.S. Air Force F-35 Joint Strike Fighters.

 

http://www.militarytimes.com/pay-benefits/military-benefits/health-care/2015/02/13/dod-spends-84m-a-year-on-viagra-similar-meds/

[MyFriend You]

13 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

What makes your remarks particularly clueless is that you wrongly accuse the Independent of making things up and then you go ahead and make up stuff yourself.

DoD spends $84M a year on Viagra, similar meds

According to data from the Defense Health Agency, DoD actually spent $41.6 million on Viagra — and $84.24 million total on erectile dysfunction prescriptions — last year.

And since 2011, the tab for drugs like Viagra, Cialis and Levitra totals $294 million — the equivalent of nearly four U.S. Air Force F-35 Joint Strike Fighters.

 

http://www.militarytimes.com/pay-benefits/military-benefits/health-care/2015/02/13/dod-spends-84m-a-year-on-viagra-similar-meds/

another report from the Military Times also says:  

Feb 13, 2015 ... Defense Department spends millions on Viagra, Cialis, with most going to retirees. ... 

I am retired Military, I never got a bottle of Viagra or any of the other stuff.  If they are spending that much, $294 million since 2011,  then something is wrong in accounting.  That would be about 59 million doses )@$5 each) over a 9 year period  =  turns out to be about $6,500,000 per year.  I was taught in Accounting 101 that "figures don't lie but liars figure"

 

BTW I don't make things up, I was quoting a report on a news channel about the "time lost due to transgender re-assignment surgeries, the average was 268 days.  It's a slow day here in Jomtien, I'm game.

[MyFriend You]

19 hours ago, Scott said:

Please don't post in colored fonts.   Continuing to do so will result in your post being removed.  

Sorry, I'll cease..........

[Andaman Al]

On 7/28/2017 at 6:18 AM, webfact said:

One official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said Dunford, in a separate message sent more narrowly to heads of the Army, Navy, Marine Corps and Air Force, acknowledged that Trump's announcement on Wednesday was "unexpected."

 

Trump lied in his tweet when he said he had consulted with all his top Generals (he actually said ALL his Generals).

 

Now at Westpoint he would already be catching the bus home for lying as a potential Military Officer, and yet here he is as Commander in Chief making his Generals look like stupid bar..... stewards. How he must inspire followership and loyalty in his Military personnel.......NOT!

[Langsuan Man]

The only positive is that the military is sworn to defend the Constitution of the United States and not this bozo 

 

When is the base going to realize that they are next ?

[ilostmypassword]

3 hours ago, TunnelRat69 said:

another report from the Military Times also says:  

Feb 13, 2015 ... Defense Department spends millions on Viagra, Cialis, with most going to retirees. ... 

I am retired Military, I never got a bottle of Viagra or any of the other stuff.  If they are spending that much, $294 million since 2011,  then something is wrong in accounting.  That would be about 59 million doses )@$5 each) over a 9 year period  =  turns out to be about $6,500,000 per year.  I was taught in Accounting 101 that "figures don't lie but liars figure"

 

BTW I don't make things up, I was quoting a report on a news channel about the "time lost due to transgender re-assignment surgeries, the average was 268 days.  It's a slow day here in Jomtien, I'm game.

I'm reading that article and I don't understand where you are coming up with these numbers.

"In the DoD system, which dispensed eight types of ED meds in 2014, Viagra, added to the DoD formulary in 2012, tops the list for most popular: Of the 1.18 million prescriptions, 905,083 were for Viagra, at a cost of $41.6 million."

As for "time lost due to transgender re-assignment surgeries, the average was 268 days." Without knowing how many gender re-assignment surgeries that were performed, knowing the cost of one is no help at all.

Edited July 29, 2017 by ilostmypassword