Backlash against Trump intensifies after his comments on Virginia violence

[Opl]

Just now, FreddieRoyle said:

No. The important thing to understand is that Mr Lee lived 150 years ago, in a very different world to today. There was no PC and affirmative action culture back then, people said it as they saw it, and lived by a very different set of rules. This is our history, this period of time shaped what would become today's world. A little bit of respect for your history wouldn't go amiss. 

So you are saying Robert E.Lee would today disavow those  who pretend to defend his statue? 

[JCauto]

1 minute ago, Trouble said:

Can't see where Trump took the side of the white-supremacists and in fact denounced them. Trump could put them all before a firing squad at this point and it would be said he supports them.  Citing Arab extremists is a pathetic attempt to create an analogy that does not exist and has no bearing on the issue at hand. Now Trump and Kushner are arms dealers? Why not call Trump anti-semitic too? 

It's called "equivalence", trying to make an extreme side appear to be similar to one that is not extreme. It's become one of the most common tactics. He used it again when he referred to the "Alt Left", a construct that does not actually exist in any real sense. As noted by one wag on Twitter, "Alt Left attempts to equate White Supremacism with people who want single payer health care". Anyone can see these are in no way the same thing. Similarly, anyone can see that a bunch of Neo-Nazis bearing torches, making Nazi and KKK salutes and screaming "Jews will not replace us" are not the same as a group of people there to oppose racism. I presume you oppose racism. Does that make you similar in outlook to a White Supremacist but just on the other side? I think you'd object to that.

I agree about the Arab extremist/arms dealers point. Irrelevant.

[iReason]

6 minutes ago, FreddieRoyle said:

This is our history, this period of time shaped what would become today's world. A little bit of respect for your history wouldn't go amiss. 

 

Naa, I have no respect for traitors.

 

Neither should you.

[retarius]

Donald revealed his lack of PC and the PC brigade are furious. More furious than if he starts a nuclear wars with NK. The anitfa demonstrators were acting illegally...they had no permit for their demonstration....some were also armed and the websites advocate violence. Trump sees a moral equivalence between them and the people protesting the removal of Robert E Lee's statue. His view is not shared by many on the left and in the PC brigade. Shame the police didn't keep the groups apart or arrest the antifa group for inciting violence.

[JCauto]

18 minutes ago, FreddieRoyle said:

No. The important thing to understand is that Mr Lee lived 150 years ago, in a very different world to today. There was no PC and affirmative action culture back then, people said it as they saw it, and lived by a very different set of rules. This is our history, this period of time shaped what would become today's world. A little bit of respect for your history wouldn't go amiss. 

Here's an interesting graph showing when the majority of these statues were erected. As you can see, there construction directly corresponds to times of major conflict of race and later on attempts to provide civil rights to black people. Yes, it's a relevant part of US history, but very much one where the losers have tried to inculcate their views on future populations despite having both lost the debate and the battle that it was based on. 

Of course, the protest had very little to do with the statue, it was a "Unite the Right" rally intended to whip up support for White Supremacists. Any of the videos will show this to be true, there's not a single word about statues or Robert E. Lee. There's a hell of a lot about Jews though - were they a major part of the Civil War?

 

[edwinchester]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

"In his comments at a heated news conference in New York on Tuesday, Trump said "there is blame on both sides" of the violence in Charlottesville, and that there were "very fine people" on both sides."

The number of times this ignorant moron engages full retard is absolutely astonishing.

[JCauto]

17 minutes ago, retarius said:

Donald revealed his lack of PC and the PC brigade are furious. More furious than if he starts a nuclear wars with NK. The anitfa demonstrators were acting illegally...they had no permit for their demonstration....some were also armed and the websites advocate violence. Trump sees a moral equivalence between them and the people protesting the removal of Robert E Lee's statue. His view is not shared by many on the left and in the PC brigade. Shame the police didn't keep the groups apart or arrest the antifa group for inciting violence.

Incorrect - the counter-protesters had a permit as well. Incorrect - the protest had nothing to do with Robert E. Lee's statue. Correct - the police handled it poorly. Incorrect - it appears the White Supremacists incited the violence but this is not conclusive at this point.

 

While some of the counter-protesters were armed, most of the protesters were more heavily armed. I actually must give them some credit for not shooting anyone, although it's only a matter of time until they do. 

 

As to us being furious with the Donald, it's because of his tolerance for White Supremacists, incompetent governance, poor policy choices and inability to consider the views of the entire population. Not because he's not PC, although of course one might expect a President to act, you know, presidential rather than like some street corner guttersnipe.

[ilostmypassword]

50 minutes ago, FreddieRoyle said:

No. The important thing to understand is that Mr Lee lived 150 years ago, in a very different world to today. There was no PC and affirmative action culture back then, people said it as they saw it, and lived by a very different set of rules. This is our history, this period of time shaped what would become today's world. A little bit of respect for your history wouldn't go amiss. 

Back then there was no broad based abolitionist movement. And the British hadn't outlawed slavery. In your alternative universe.

Edited August 17, 2017 by ilostmypassword

[tonray]

2 minutes ago, iReason said:

 

Is that right?

Multiple you say?

InforWars and who else?

 

Let's see 'em instead of some silly meme.

I just hope InfoWars gets to the bottom of that story about NASA using slave children in Mars. 5555

[iReason]

33 minutes ago, retarius said:

Trump sees a moral equivalence between them and the people protesting the removal of Robert E Lee's statue.

 

Protesting a statue?

 

 

[Scott]

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[iReason]

America’s Military Leadership Sends Message To Trump Over His Defense Of Nazis

 

"Four members of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, representing the highest posts in their respective branches of the U.S. military,

have come out to directly condemn white nationalists since violence erupted over the weekend in Charlottesville, Virginia."

 

"These comments came from President Donald Trump’s top military officials."

http://reverepress.com/news/americas-military-leadership-sends-message-trump-defense-nazis/

 

Edited August 17, 2017 by iReason

[Pinot]

5 hours ago, maewang99 said:

Scott Adams has it nailed.

mass hysteria. social and mass media fed.

Adams is trying to use it the other way.  it's not gonna work any better than trying to convince most Americans that Oswald alone killed Kennedy... or that, let me borrow an even better one... "the Japanese" attack at Pearl Harbor, this is from a lecture by Chomsky at West Point that is on Youtube the last I saw... is the only and best example of 'justifiable warfare'. but you can't let emotions take control over rational thought.

Trump is not a racist. 
 

I am so far to the left.... that most Americans wouldn't even have a word to describe me.

you all got it wrong. it's our system trying to vomit out an 'outsider' president.

a good one.

 

 

 

Who/what is a good one? It's the POTUS supporting Nazis and the KKK. I don't really know what you're talking about. Try some punctuation. 

 

3 hours ago, 212Roger said:

The "Unite The Right" has the right to protest, just like the leftist liberals.  Also, they had a permit to protest.  The left started the dispute, all while the police sat on their hands.  To quote Rambo, the left "drew first blood."

Oh please. A variation on the both sides are doing it ridiculous argument. That's how these jerkoffs see themselves...Rambo.  

[JCauto]

8 minutes ago, iReason said:

America’s Military Leadership Sends Message To Trump Over His Defense Of Nazis

 

"Four members of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, representing the highest posts in their respective branches of the U.S. military,

have come out to directly condemn white nationalists since violence erupted over the weekend in Charlottesville, Virginia."

 

"These comments came from President Donald Trump’s top military officials."

http://reverepress.com/news/americas-military-leadership-sends-message-trump-defense-nazis/

 

Freakin' Libtard socialist commies!

[JHolmesJr]

18 minutes ago, iReason said:

America’s Military Leadership Sends Message To Trump Over His Defense Of Nazis

 

"Four members of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, representing the highest posts in their respective branches of the U.S. military,

have come out to directly condemn white nationalists since violence erupted over the weekend in Charlottesville, Virginia."

 

"These comments came from President Donald Trump’s top military officials."

http://reverepress.com/news/americas-military-leadership-sends-message-trump-defense-nazis/

 

they're basically agreeing with trump…..dont be a spinboi.

[boomerangutang]

3 hours ago, Opl said:

So you are saying Robert E.Lee would today disavow those  who pretend to defend his statue? 

A quote from Robert E. Lee, when asked about the wisdom of erecting a memorial at Gettysburg:

 

“I think it wiser, not to keep open the sores of war but to follow the examples of those nations who endeavored to obliterate the marks of civil strife, to commit to oblivion the feelings engendered.”

 

LINK:  more about Lee and his ideas about war monuments....

 

 

 

 

Edited August 17, 2017 by boomerangutang

[boomerangutang]

                           Whatever the opposite of a 'white-supremacist' is what I am.  Indeed, I'm not even a 'human-supremacist' (I don't think humans are better than other species), which is a basic tenet of all the world's religions and moral codes.  Even so, from what I've garnered from studying history, I respect Robert E. Lee as a person.

 

                     Incidentally, during the US war against the Mexicans, Lee (then a young scout), was sent to try and find a way to attack a Mexican stronghold.  It was a quagmire, because the region between the Union forces (yes, Lee was an admired member of the Union, before becoming head of the Army of Virginia) and Mexican forces was a seemingly impenetrable labyrinth of limestone karst.  Young Lee went out alone, and found a way through, thereby enabling Union forces to attack the Mexicans.  I'm a rock climber, mostly going out solo on limestone karst, so I can relate to Lee's excursion.  

[ilostmypassword]

1 minute ago, boomerangutang said:

                           Whatever the opposite of a 'white-supremacist' is what I am.  Indeed, I'm not even a 'human-supremacist' (I don't think humans are better than other species), which is a basic tenet of all the world's religions and moral codes.  Even so, from what I've garnered from studying history, I respect Robert E. Lee as a person.

 

                     Incidentally, during the US war against the Mexicans, Lee (then a young scout), was sent to try and find a way to attack a Mexican stronghold.  It was a quagmire, because the region between the Union forces (yes, Lee was an admired member of the Union, before becoming head of the Army of Virginia) and Mexican forces was a seemingly impenetrable labyrinth of limestone karst.  Young Lee went out alone, and found a way through, thereby enabling Union forces to attack the Mexicans.  I'm a rock climber, mostly going out solo on limestone karst, so I can relate to Lee's excursion.  

So he was involved in 2 unjust wars? His resumé is looking worse and worse.

[iReason]

28 minutes ago, JHolmesJr said:

they're basically agreeing with trump…..dont be a spinboi.

 

Man are you gettin' desperate.

 

 

Edited August 17, 2017 by iReason

[Thaidream]

This isn't about whether Robert E. Lee was a 'good' man. It is about  the KKK; White Supremists and other racists who are trying to use the removal of Lee's statutes to spread their ant black and anti semitic  philosophy.  On the other side, there are people of good conscience who are rejecting this philosophy as having no place in Ameerica or the World.

 

Donald Trump's statements are being seen as giving moral equivalency to these hate groups when there can be no moral equivalency between the two groups.  One group wants to espouse a racisct agenda and the other group opposes it. Trump may not be racist but he is surely ignorant ad is trying to make the issue about whether a commuity has the right to remove a statute of a historical figure.  That is not the real issue and by Trump not  forcefully condemning the racist groups and praising the forces of those who are anti racist he gives credence to the racist agenda.  

 

It's not about statues; clashes of philosophies; or political correctness. It's about what is right and what is wrong.  There is nothing right about Neo Nazism; the Klu Klux Klan (KKK); anti semitism or any type of philosophy that advocates superiority based upon race. These groups represent the destruction of 6 million Jews during World War II; they represent the murder and lynchings of black Americans; and the discrimination against people because of ethnic background.  No one that has any type of  moral standard or humanity can believe in any of these groups and what they represent.

 

Donald Trump is not only ignorant but shows a complete lack of understanding of History; common sense and human decency.  The man is totally incompetent and each time he speaks he drives a wedge between people.  The only way to really make America great again is for all people to work together and once and for all put America's racist and intolerant history on the scrapheap forever.

 

It is really time for the 25th Amendment to be invoked and remove Trump from the Presidency.

Edited August 17, 2017 by Thaidream

[boomerangutang]

12 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

So he was involved in 2 unjust wars? His resumé is looking worse and worse.

                                 People are influenced by their times.  If you were a 19 year old guy in Atlanta in 1862, there's a 99% chance you would have been a Confederate soldier.   Be careful about judging the actions of hundreds of years ago, by the PC prism of today.

 

                                Taken back further, the megafauna (giant sloths, mastodons, woolly rhinos, etc) from tens of thousands of years ago were slaughtered by my and your ancestors, in order for humans to continue to exist.  No slaughter = no survival.  Are you going to condemn your long-ago ancestors for pushing those mega fauna to extinction?

[ilostmypassword]

Just now, boomerangutang said:

                                 People are influenced by their times.  If you were a 19 year old guy in Atlanta in 1862, there's a 99% chance you would have been a Confederate soldier.   Be careful about judging the actions of hundreds of years ago, by the PC prism of today.

 

                                Taken back further, the megafauna (giant sloths, mastodons, woolly rhinos, etc) from tens of thousands of years ago were slaughtered by my and your ancestors, in order for humans to continue to exist.  No slaughter = no survival.  Are you going to condemn your long-ago ancestors for pushing those mega fauna to extinction?

No. But I'm not going to put up statues to honor them for it either.

[boomerangutang]

2 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

This isn't about whether Robert E. Lee was a 'good' man. It is about  the KKK; White Supremists and other racists who are trying to use the removal of Lee's statutes to spread their ant black and anti semitic  philosophy.  On the other side, there are people of good conscience who are rejecting this philosophy as having no place in Ameerica or the World.

 

Donald Trump's statements are being seen as giving moral equivalency to these hate groups when there can be no moral equivalency between the two groups.  One group wants to espouse a racisct agenda and the other group opposes it. Trump may not be racist but he is surely ignorant ad is trying to make the issue about whether a commuity has the right to remove a statute of a historical figure.  That is not the real issue and by Trump not  forcefully condemning the racist groups and praising the forces of those who are anti racist he gives credence to the racist agenda.  

 

It's not about statues; clashes of philosophies; or political correctness. It's about what is right and what is wrong.  There is nothing right about Neo Nazism; the Klu Klux Klan (KKK); anti semitism or any type of philosophy that advocates superiority based upon race. These groups represent the destruction of 6 million Jews during World War II; they represent the murder and lynchings of black Americans; and the discrimination against people because of ethnic background.  o one that has any type of  moral standard or humanity can believe in any of these groups and what they represent.

 

Donald Trump is not only ignorant but shows a complete lack of understanding of History; common sense and human decency.  The man is totally incompetent and each time he speaks he drives a wedge between people.  The only way to really make America great again is for all people to work together and once and for all put America's racist and intolerant history on the scrapheap forever.

 

It is really time for the 25th Amendment to be invoked and remove Trump from the Presidency.

                     I somewhat agree with your missive.  My issue is; it's sad, in my view, that Lee has become the poster boy for Neo-Nazis and White Supremicists - because Lee was as divorced from that as Martin Luther King.

 

                    Let them pick Belgium's Leopold II, who caused tens of thousands of black Congolese to be maimed and killed. That would be more appropriate.

[selftaopath]

4 hours ago, mtls2005 said:

 

Well Gary Cohn is supposedly close to quitting; Steve Mnuchin would probably work for A. Hitler?

45 is the 2nd coming of A.H. believe me.

[edwinchester]

2 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

Back then there was no broad based abolitionist movement. And the British hadn't outlawed slavery. In your alternative universe.

The British Parliament passed the Slavery Abolition Act in 1833.

[boomerangutang]

5 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

No. But I'm not going to put up statues to honor them for it either.

If you want to start talking about statues that offend, how about Jesus statues?  A man who was subjected to the strictest form of painful punishment - yet that's the image that adherents of that belief system put up everywhere they can.   It was Jesus who spearheaded the movement which resulted in the Spanish Inquisition, and endless other atrocities.  Let me know how it goes - banishing crucifixes worldwide.

[ilostmypassword]

Just now, boomerangutang said:

If you want to start talking about statues that offend, how about Jesus statues?  A man who was subjected to the strictest form of painful punishment - yet that's the image that adherents of that belief system put up everywhere they can.   It was Jesus who spearheaded the movement which resulted in the Spanish Inquisition, and endless other atrocities.  Let me know how it goes - banishing crucifixes worldwide.

Are you saying Jesus was responsible for the Spanish Inquisition? Seriously?  I always thought it was the Holy Spirit.

[iReason]

Here are the Republicans denouncing Trump by name

 

Ohio Gov. John Kasich didn't tweet but instead told NBC's "Today Show" on Wednesday that Trump's remarks were "pathetic."

 

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/08/16/politics/republicans-list-denouncing-trump-by-name/index.html

Followed by a number that didn't need to mention his name.

Perhaps to difficult to utter it.

It is for me.

 

 

 

Edited August 17, 2017 by iReason

[JCauto]

6 minutes ago, iReason said:

Here are the Republicans denouncing Trump by name

 

Ohio Gov. John Kasich didn't tweet but instead told NBC's "Today Show" on Wednesday that Trump's remarks were "pathetic."

 

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/08/16/politics/republicans-list-denouncing-trump-by-name/index.html

Followed by a number that didn't need to mention his name.

Perhaps to difficult to utter it.

It is for me.

I look forward to JHolmesJr telling you that they're agreeing with Trump and that you're a "spinboi". 

[Thaidream]

The philosophy of Jesus is no more responsible for the Inquisition than any other philosophy that has been subverted by certain groups of people to satisfy their own agenda . Hitler  had his own agenda and that was to rid the World of those he considered inferior yet he convinced the German people to vote for him because they thought his agenda was to restore greatness to Germany humbled by defeat after World War 1.. The unfortunate thing was that he was ultimately able to convince a goodly number of people that Jews were responsible to an extent and they acquiesced to his agenda by keeping quiet.

 

What we have learned from History is that people who see and face evil have to speak up and oppose it-otherwise their silence allows it to propagate and take hold,  Donald Trump doesn't understand History; nor people in general. He as a person of privilege has been isolated from the American public and his philosophy is based on a very narrow  perspective. As President, he must deplore the Neo Nazi's and KKK simply because they represent a philosophy that destroys people based upon racial lines.  there is no moral equivalency between hate groups and those who are opposing them.  Those who are opposing them are opposing oppression and those who support these groups are saying they want to allow Jews and people of color to be oppressed.

 

Their idea of making America great again is to go back to the days when the KKK  rode into town, grabbed a black man, and hung him on a tree in the countryside or used blacks as slaves because they were 'inferior'. What the majority of America is saying is that those days are gone forever; that  groups who support them must be always denounced; and that Americans have to respect and work together and that those who would oppose this hatred is to be applauded and not lumped together with the oppressors. The question is why doesn't President Trump understand all this.