johnnybangkok

The UK is signed up to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights (Article 14), which states that everyone has the right to seek and enjoy asylum from persecution in other countries. It doesn’t discriminate on mode of transport so whether a person arrives by plane, lorry or rubber dinghy , there are laws in place to how they are treated. The fact that you don’t like this is irrelevant. The law is the law and the UK rightfully follows the law. And since you probably thought Brexit was going to improve the immigration issue then as you are clearly seeing every day, you were lied to about that as well. Stopped a few Polish guys from working in Cricklewood though.

No one is denying there is a huge cost to processing asylum seekers but the main problem is there is such a huge backlog that the process is dragging out much longer than usual and costing much more than it ever did. This is NOT the fault of asylum seekers though. This is a government problem, one of its very many. And I’m just going to ignore your “criminal element” comment. It’s puerile and unsubstantiated.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing. If you recall Boris and the Tories were actually going to do this and with his “best thing would be to ignore it” statement and “herd immunity” nonsense but he was forced to do a dramatic u-turn when his advisers extrapolated the numbers out and found out a LOT of people were going to die. A LOT. Nothing you are saying is wrong, but they did what they did at the time with the information they had so I’m a bit less harsh on this one.

You guys are really struggling with this. Firstly the “attack” you are referencing is regarding the politics of what is happening. It even says straight after “Take a few minutes to find out why we call the Government’s flagship ‘Nationality and Borders Bill’ the Anti-Refugee Bill. Secondly (and probably more importantly) no one on here is supporting illegal immigrants. I think that has been made crystal clear. We are however supporting a persons right to claim asylum (like most civilized countries do) and the right to stay in the UK whilst that process is happening. If the process is broken ( and again I highlighted this on a previous post as I agree it needs to be fixed) then that’s a government failing and NOT the fault of those claiming asylum. But here’s the rub; if someone is in the UK illegally then it’s not costing you a single penny as since they are illegal and flying under the radar, they’re hardly bowling into the nearest dole office with their hand out and screaming to be housed. So in summary, asylum seekers should be allowed in but deported if they don’t qualify. Illegal immigrants should be deported once they have been found (easier said than done) and other immigrants should be allowed in on a points system which is exactly what happens currently. The UK’s current troubles are NOT because of immigrants, legal or not. That’s just an argument from the ill informed. No, the problems are a mixture of an ill-advised Brexit, a VERY expensive pandemic and 12 years of Tory incompetence. But I don’t see any of you pointing the finger at who actually is to blame because your beloved Boris delivered Brexit and you can’t bring yourself to admit it’s been a farce from the beginning with no noticeable benefits whatsoever. And that includes immigration.

Care to elaborate or is this the height of your debating skills?

You are completely missing the point and I think it’s telling that you don’t know the difference. If someone lands in the UK (or any country) and claims asylum, they are an asylum seeker. If they come in without declaring asylum and don’t get caught (in the back of a lorry for example), they are an illegal immigrant. Two different things. Two different subjects. And the EU are not “hurting”. They owe the UK nothing. The UK decided to leave so it now has to follow whatever processes any other country would have to who also gave up their trade deal with the EU. Maybe start blaming the people who actually did the leaving (who were warned constantly about what was going yo happen) rather than the EU.

You are conflating two different things. Illegal immigrants are NOT asylum seekers (you’re original post). By definition they are illegally entering the country and will be thrown out if caught. Asylum seekers on the other hand have a process to follow that will/won’t allow them to remain. I’m sure there are plenty of mafia Albanians in the UK but they are likely to be illegal immigrants rather than asylum seekers. No one is condoning illegal immigrants. They shouldn’t be there, hence the “illegal” bit. And by the way 40,000 is nothing. With 148,200 applicants registered in 2021, Germany accounted for 27.7% of all first-time asylum applicants in the EU. It was followed by France (103 800, or 19.4%). https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php?title=Asylum_statistics&oldid=558844

I really wish people would do at least the minimum of research before they comment on matters they clearly have no understanding of. Firstly the UK is NOT the preferred choice for many asylum seekers. Almost every single other European country gets far more asylum seekers than the uk. Secondly “People seeking asylum are not allowed to claim mainstream welfare benefits in the UK. In most cases, they are also banned from working. They can access support in the form of housing and basic living expenses while in the UK through the Home Office. This is usually known as ‘asylum support’, but you may also hear people refer to ‘section 95 support’, or ‘section 4 support’, which are different types of support available depending on people’s circumstances and the status of their asylum claim. This means that the majority of people seeking asylum in the UK end up living on £5.66 per day to cover almost all their needs, including food, clothing, transport and medicine. This places them more than 70% below the poverty line. Many are forced to make impossible decisions between feeding themselves or buying medicine for their families.” https://www.refugee-action.org.uk/about/facts-about-refugees/ That took me all of 2 minutes to find.

Unfortunately I don't think the US is ready for a woman never mind one of latin ethnicity. Americans penchant for old, white men will continue because as much as Biden isn't everyone's favourite POTUS, he was VERY effective against Trump. It's a shame as I like AOC but her left wing credentials are too easy for the GOP to denigrate and lampoon and their inability to understand the difference between socialism and communism certainly doesn't help.

The Dems should be delighted that Trump has declared; they know they stand a much better chance of beating him than say DeSantis. However, I don't think he'll get the Republican nomination as many Republicans are now openly calling him out on his inability to win and his polarising effect on the electorate. Couple this with his many, many legal troubles and you've got an awful lot of problems with Trump being your Presidential candidate. It should make for some entertaining stuff though over the coming months.

Vetting in the Uk is quite stringent (and has got more stringent after Brexit) and is based on a very similar 'points based' system to Australia. https://www.y-axis.com/migrate/uk/ ELIGIBILITY In 2020, the UK government announced a points-based immigration system. The main features of the points-based migration are: Candidates for immigration to the EU and non-EU countries shall be considered equally. The points-based system must be followed by highly skilled workers, skilled workers, and students who wish to come to the UK. For skilled workers, a job offer is required. The salary level has been cut from 30,000 pounds to 26,000 pounds per year. Applicants must demonstrate their ability to communicate in English (A-level or equivalent). Highly skilled professionals must be endorsed by a UK authority, but they are not required to have a job offer. 70 points is the minimum score required to be eligible for a visa To say 'the majority of those in rubber dinghies are economic, illegal gate crashers with Albanian mafia connections' is somewhat harsh but there is a point to establishing whether people are in fact true asylum seekers or just economic migrants. There is supposed to be a stringent vetting process for asylum seekers v economic migrants but even if someone is refused asylum, a lot of them get to stay in the country https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/jun/22/nine-in-10-people-refused-asylum-in-2020-free-to-remain-in-uk-home-office This is obviously a huge problem that needs addressing. Again though, this is for the Tories to sort out after campaigning so strongly on immigration for Brexit.

So it's the Dems fault that the Republicans put forward the candidates they did? Do you actually read back any of this stuff you write?

More anecdotal nonsense. You cannot keep using your own cr@p experiences in life to blame a whole education system. And in the Uk if you want to be an electricians or plumber there are vocational courses you can take and also plenty of apprentiships around but whether people see these professionas as 'worthwhile' really does depend on their personal ambition.

You continue to demonstrate your lack of understanding on this matter, now with simple arithmatic. The UK's population may well be 67 million but obvioulsy that includes children, OAP's, the sick and the 'can't be bothered working'. The actual number of the WORKING polulation is approx. 75% i.e. 50 million. so 3.5% of this number is approx 1.7 million.

Actually a deeper and more insidious swamp.

I'm sure there is an intense battle for hod carriers going on in Cricklewood right now but you really shouldn't think this exemplifies the whole of the UK. And wasn't it the Irish everyone was complaining about in the 70's and 80's for doing the exact same thing in the building industry? 'Those pesky Paddy's taking all of our hod carrying jobs!' If a Polish national can come over and do exactly the same job (and I hear they actually do much better) than the Brit at a much lower rate, then perhaps you should be blaming the Brit.

Another myopic post that doesn't understand the true economics of the UK. The Office for National Statistics said the unemployment rate fell to 3.5% over the three months to August – the lowest since February 1974. https://www.itv.com/news/2022-10-11/uk-unemployment-falls-to-lowest-rate-since-1974-amid-rise-in-long-term-sickness This shows that more people than ever are actively working in the UK, a number that has been consistently going down well before Brexit and is now higher due to Covid and people leaving the work force. Also in the same piece “However, the number of people neither working nor looking for work continues to rise ......' In other words, people just decided not to return to the work-force but this doesn't mean they are 'rotting on the dole' as you are trying to say. They've just taken themselves out of the labour market. 'The figures come as employers said severe shortages of workers after the Covid pandemic and Brexit were holding back the British economy, with the number of job vacancies close to a record high at more than 1.2m. https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/oct/11/uk-unemployment-long-term-sick-jobless-level-pay-inflation There are more people gainfully employed in the UK than ever before, but demand is outstripping supply. This is made a greart deal worse now that the free movement of EU nationals means they aren't coming to the UK and not taking the lower level jobs that Brits turn their nose up at. This is also on the back of the government initiative that says 'After four weeks, job seekers will be required to apply for and accept offers for all types of work - including lower-paid, less-skilled roles than their last job - or face welfare payment cuts'. https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/uk-government-tightens-welfare-rules-unemployed-2022-01-27/. But even this isn't working as there's simply too many jobs vacancies open to be ever filled by Brits, especially lower level, more menial jobs that a lot of Europeans eagerly took.

Ok, since you don't want to handle those answers (to YOUR questions by the way), how about this one? 7. No longer propping up the economies of Poland, Greece, Hungary with vast net contributions set by Brussels. From January 2021, the estimated bill was £25bn left to pay by 2057, according to the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR), almost £18bn of which will be paid in the first five years. https://www.bbc.com/news/51110096. Also, The UK contributes to a fund which could be used to channel emergency funding to Eurozone countries, but an EU law made in 2015 ensures that the UK would be “immediately and fully compensated” for any losses caused by a Eurozone member. https://fullfact.org/europe/will-uk-pay-future-eurozone-bailouts/ Any thoughts?

I am absolutely not laying the blame for the UK's ills all on Brexit. I think I've been consistent in saying it's part of the problem (but a fairly major one). No. I entirley blame the Tories. You are obviosly not up on UK economics so let's just give you a quick rundown. The UK isn't doing well. If you paint yourself as a major pillar of worldwide financial stability, you can't just do the nonsense we have seen from the Tories in the last 5 years. They started with Brexit, blundered through Covid (whilst spending a HUGE amount of money) and in their pearls of wisdom, thought the 'cure' was to lower taxes and 'free' financial markets. This was such a bad policy that the Bank of England had to intervene to basically save the country and voila, the shortest reigning PM of all time. Aside from this debackle, the actual major downside is government debt is no longer seen as a safe bet, and borrowing costs are more; much more. The Office for Budget Responsibility estimates that the debt interest payable on central government's outstanding debt will be £87.2 billion for the current financial year. This figure isn't going to get any smaller any time soon, hence the Tories panick offering of (which you will see the week) Austerity 2.0. They need to get interest payments down and borrowers wants to see a clear way of paying down the debt and there's not many ways of doing this (and the one Truss offered got the reception it deserved) other than raise taxes and spend less. This is why the uk is struggling more than other countries and why you personally are going to start seeing the downside very, very soon. They have no choice but to go for higher taxes and austerity, so tell me in 3 months how that doesn't affect you. As usual, the poor will be made to pay but I think the public uproar of Truss's blunder will at least mean that the rich will also feel the pinch, but as usual, it won't hurt them nearly as much.

Lol

The point being, it's legal. You're yet again badly infering that 'cheap' labour is somehow attached to the movement of labour in EU states, when someone from Worksop is paid the same in the Uk than someone from Warsaw. There is a requirement to pay a certain, minimum wage in the UK so your 'employing cheap E.U workers' doesn't work as the are just the same 'price' as Brits. The difference being many Brits just don't want to pick berries in Somerset or carry hods in Cricklwood. And just as a footnote, I do think large corporations have sacrificed the good of the common man for share-holder interests but that's a bit left wing thinking for you but is at the heart of why the uk is struggling more than other countries (Hint: that's what Brexit was about).

I feel like a Polish hod carrier in Cricklewood.

One more time for the hard of understanding. You cannot employ 'cheap labour' as the UK has a minimum wage requirement (which the boss of Next would only be too aware of). Perhaps hod carriers in Cricklwood are different but it certainly isn't the case for 99% of British companies.

That's just simply not true. Astra Zenica is a prominent pharmaceutical company who just happens to be British (and Swedish). They already had a rich history in vaccine production so it made absolute sense for the government to invest in a known entity to try and come up with the vaccine. But this can also be said of Pfizer, Biontech, Moderna, J&J and even Sinopharm who's 'mother' countries did exactly the same. This idea that we had to 'make our own vaccine for our own people' is just disingenuos and completely false as once others had come up with their vaccine, they were more than willing to sell it to anyone who had passed it and had the money (which we did). The UK is just very good at this sort of thing and was always going to be a player in the field. The only criticism I have of the EU is they listened too much to all the anti-vaxxer nonsense about AZ giving you blood clots. They investigated this and it was proven not to, hence their delay and reluctance when taking it up. This had no bearing on the UK though.

Is that all you've got as I can come up with stats that say exactly the opposite? U.K. unemployment rate for 2021 was 4.53%, a 0.05% increase from 2020. U.K. unemployment rate for 2020 was 4.47%, a 0.73% increase from 2019. U.K. unemployment rate for 2019 was 3.74%, a 0.26% decline from 2018. U.K. unemployment rate for 2018 was 4.00%, a 0.33% decline from 2017. https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/GBR/united-kingdom/unemployment-rate And obvioulsy unemployment is going down now as, you know, worldwide pandemic and all that. And is that the only reply you are going to offer? Are you just going to ignore the other 6 points the YOU raised?