suiging

jumbo,

thank u for the stats u gave here. The difference is not so big. It gives me a confirmation that my country (Germany) is one of the most safe and quiet countries in the world now. Why is it so? I think it depends on the education level. We are well educated in a humanistic tradition. The actual education level in Thailand - I would suppose u agree - is not from its best. Education gives u the possibility to know, to reflect, to differentiate and at least to control yourself. These things have to be improved and to be corrected in the future. There are a lot of other stuff and hidden matters but I think it's enough for now.

Sorry to disagree ( well flame to be honest )

The standards of education in Thailand are as good as anywhere in the Region and the graveyards of Europe groan under the weight of your humanistic tradition. Germans, Brits and indeeed Thai's have strong martial traditions, don't kid yourself that all is well in the back streets of the industrial towns in your former East or the slums of inner city UK. Perhaps the Thai's are a tad more honest in their approach to statistics. It certainly appears they are a little more honest in acknowledgment of their problems.

In Hong Kong, I get so tense I want to kill everybody.

In the UK, I get so paranoid I think everybody wants to kill me.

In the LOS, I drink buckets of Chang, chill out and don't think about much at all, perfect.

I once gave a young girl in the malabar restaurant a large tip. She was well worth it looking after my family in a first rate manner. BIG mistake, I heard the shouting and noticed the girl was upset as we left, it appeared the manager had given her a huge telling off accusing her of forcing the tip !!

I went up to him and explained the situation but he insisted i take half the tip back. Learned a lesson or two from that one about genuine, well run establishments that care for their customers........The Manhattan.......mmmmmm

Contacted my pal this AM. He promises to resurect this thread when informed by the company ( he as asked ) that service to LOS will start.

It looks like bookdepository.co.uk does not ship to Thailand:

http://www.bookdepository.co.uk/WEBSITE/WW...lpInfo.php?ID=7

Apologies for this. I have used them in HK and my friend in LOS has used them by prior arrangement only. ( I checked with him and it was not easy, a one off, however, he was informed full service in the pipeline )

Put this out to the Patters lads, but have a look at www.bookdepository.co.uk.

Free postage anywhere in the world. Set up I am told by ex-amazon employee.

Alf has made fine points I often think we are missing the historical perspective to the recent on the face of it "enforcement", of existing legislation.

Do the Thai powers that be want to force the likes of little me out of my home ? They didn't seem to feel that way until an interim administration applied the EXISTING law, to stop a certain ex-PM and his cronies from committing what amounted to the rape of the countries national assets.

While they were on, was it not unreasonable to apply this EXISTING legislation to try to draw a line under some absurdly blatant land grabbing on Islands, which again by existing law amount to National Parks ?

If we were in their position, would we have not done the same ?

As of yet there is no evidence whatsoever of the application of this EXISTING legislation on any single TV member who just wishes to be left alone on his little piece of heaven and contribute to the local economy.

If anyone has such evidence please post it so I can run around Pong shouting "the sky is falling".

Please do not feel I am putting my head in the sand and hoping things will just go away, far from it, my whole retirement plans ( IE: my life ) are at risk here. I just can't see the motivation for the Government to persecute the likes of me which would surely send a message about investing in Thailand which would take more than a generation to correct.

As always, Mobi is right. I too resign from the Pattaya Defence League, you will never defeat bigatory, so why sanction it by taking the bait.

Only thing to say is that if people are reading this thread trying to make their minds up to visit patters or not ? Please do not be put off by the strength of feeling on both sides of the argument. There is plenty of room in Patters for every type of tourist you can name, come and take an unbiased look for yourself.

I've just come back from two nights in Rome with my business colleagues. We spent the whole time in a down town bar area which was disgusting !!!

Anyone who says they go there for the culture is a downwright liar !!!

Thank the lord i've found an Italian web site so I can put all those perverts who visit that city right.................. scum of the earth ( heard the same about Venice, Barcelona etc etc, wait til I find their web pages, sick sex tourists the lot of em..... )

My wife's four best Chinese female golfing buddies have just come back from a week in Patters staying in the lovely Pong ( just outside the city for the OP and his mates ).

They played different courses every day, enjoyed the fine food available and did all the things the people who actually take the time to see the place in a different light, harp on about on here only to be put down by the likes of the OP and the last ignoramus on this thread.

Those of you who come for two days and camp out on walk in street, or mindlessly join the bandwagon claiming everybody who likes the place is a pervert, be careful, as your posts say more about your petty shallow little minds than they do about a city in Thailand that has plenty to offer for those who actually " Visit " the area, rather than spend their time in " Boy's town " and then become cyber warriors on the net.

Never forget the chance that you may fall foul of a minor functionary of the system who will demand a " cash " payment for your indiscretion whatever it may be. Failing to pay leads to a close examination of your circumstances and bye bye

In addition, planning to retire to a country with a firm cash culture soceity as a pauper makes no sense. Everyone falls sick at some stage in life and you as a nice white boy will no doubt cop the local germs in the early stages of your stay until your immune system kicks in. Paying for drugs from back street chemists is a bit like buying a lottery ticket with the consequences of being unlucky very unpleasent indeed...........stay at home.

I transferred 40k pounds sterling earlier this year from the Uk to my account with Siam Commercial Bank and never got charged at the Thai end.

Did get charged at the Uk end though 18 pound.

Yes, if you TT the money charges are loaded at the front end . I have transferred quite large amounts for building work to accounts with SCB and only charged at UK end.

HSBC account in your own country, withdraw from HSBC LOS, with HSBC credit card .

Disgraceful to the extreme.

What's difficult to understand ? The surrounding countries to the LOS are either at war now or have been within a generation. These wars have left a legacy of violence to end arguments, couple this with poor education and it's a volotile mix. These people are in the LOS in considerable numbers to feed the need for cheap labour as LOS picks itself up and goes forward in the world. The casual violence displayed by these new boys has an affect on our own rural poor, as does their exposure to the wealth in towns like Patters when they are brought in to help with the building boom. The figures come from this section of soceity as a whole, and as many on here have said, if you don't mix with them and go out of your way to be civil, LOS in reality for Farangs should be a long way down that list in terms of real danger.

I f my memory serves, the guy running the Mabprachan Resort is from your neck of the woods and has good sausage on the menu. If he is not selling it, I'm sure he would know where you can get it.

Some books for sale inside the retail complex on second road just before you hit Dolphin roundabout.

Interesting when the mib make an arrest and appear to do the right thing for once......silence on the board.

It's often been said on here that Consulates from further afield are more forgiving in nature when it comes to visas. When the dust settles and the true picture of the current situation is known, those in trouble may like to sit down with a travel agent and check out bucket seat prices to consulates that are a tad more helpful than the norm in Asia. Perhaps a type of consulate league table may be a thread worth starting in a month or two ( along with members, bucket seat recommendations ).

For as much as it's worth, these arguments have merit from either perspective, however the one fact that is indisputable is ......TIT

They will do what they like as they are a sovereign country who do not give a rat's ass for the USA or the EU. One of the last bastions of national pride left in the world, and i kinda respect that.

When buying my first house in Patters, I was booked in by the selling agent into a brand new, cheap and clean Hotel at the rear of his premises. The door to the room ( brand new, I being first paying customer for that room ) was opened by a pass card key and in I went bursting for a widdle. Couldn't find the ###### magnetic holder for the key so opened the bathroom door in semi-darkness. A rubber snake fell over my arm which had been placed over the bathroom door by my now ex-pal the developer. I screamed threw the ###### thing on the bed, had the widdle and put the light on just in time to seem the ###### thing slithering towards me for his/her own bit of revenge.

Moral of the story. Pattaya Real Estate Agents have no sense of humour and the rubber snake you think is a prank, will probably be real !!!!!

The power of hindsight must be a wonderful thing. I too am one of the many idiots who took advise from reputable Thai lawyers and agents some years ago and as a result have genuine concerns for the future.

Perhaps idiots is the correct term for we in this unfortunate situation, who have allowed ourselves to be surrounded by so many wise men after the fact

I have tried this company in Hong Kong and found them to be very reliable. They deliver books ANYWHERE in the world for free !!!!

www.bookdepository.com

I have no links with them, but share the info as it is ###### difficult in LOS to get some up to date books without paying dreadful postage.

most definitely, it reminds me of small, christian-themed family-fun-park.

Yes !!

At last an honest post

Good luck with point and click Thai building....it might work with some crews but you could end up with a house you are not satisfied with if you have the average Thai crew....from what I've read on this forum anyway. My own experience is if you let a Thai carpenter from your village make decisions on his own then the details and quality will be like what the rest of the houses in the village are like. If you find yourself hiring locals who are part time carpenters (and part time farmers...like the people I hired) then you should go look at some of the houses in the village that they have worked on (probably their own homes) and see if they do things as you like them.....if not then be prepared to do alot alot alot of explanation and alot alot alot of watching to make sure they actually do understand the explanation and are actually doing it as you explained....and then do alot alot alot of more explanation.....rinse and repeat.

Chownah

I'll agree with you there. My wife was the biggest driving force for our home. She was there everyday and every step of the way. She bought everything, and maintained tight control over everything. The builders built what she wanted and that's it. Our house started a boon in our area, now there are several houses similar going up, there's even a hotel towards Chok Chai that was modeled after our style. There were several bankers that stopped by after the house was finished. A house like mine has it's upsides, but then you really have to watch what's going on and at least have a bit of knowledge of construction. For us, the idea of doing it together, building exactly what we wanted and doing it a stage at a time has made it "OUR" home. It's simple, but it's become a part of our lives and we couldn't ever think of making another home anywhere.

Fantastic story. Well done to you both, great example of what can be done by local people, you do not always have to go to the big boys for a fine home.