TroubleandGrumpy

No - that is the DTA - I am asking him to provide the original announcement about the rule change. QUOTE - I will refer you to the paragraph in the original announcement ( that you fastudiously ignore, or are incapable of understanding ) that people from Countries that have a DTA with Thailand will be exempt.

These are some quesations that I would like answered by Thai RD. This is based upon an Expat that stays 180+ days, and does not earn any money in Thailand, and remits money into Thailand from overseas. Anyone know how to ask them? Does a long term Expat have to lodge an annual tax return from 2024 tax year onwards, in order to 'prove' that the money they have remitted into Thailand in that year, is not taxable or is exempt under an existing DTA ? Can an Expat 'decide' that they do not have to lodge a return from 2024 tax year onwards, because they believe that the money they have remitted into Thailand in that year is not taxable or is exempt under an existing DTA ? Can an Expat 'decide' that they do not have to lodge a return from 2024 tax year onwards, because they have calculated that some/all of the money they have remitted into Thailand in that year is 'taxable income', but it is below the Thai tax free threshold (with or without Allowances and Deductions) and therefore payment of income taxes is not required ? Will/Does the Thai RD provide an English speaking (plus maybe Japanese, Korean, Chinese etc) call centre or service, whereby Expats as detailed above, can call and seek advice regarding their obligations to lodge income tax returns. My position is and has been clear from the start - this is a very serious matter and discussing it and expressing opinions is not 'fear mongering'. If some people only erver want to hear good news and are wearing rose coloured glasses, then they should just stay away. This new income tax rule means that unless Thai RD answers those questions above positively in our favour, then all Expats are going to be 'expected' to complete annual tax returns and pay income taxes if the Thai RD deems that applicable. BUT - that has not been confirmed or denied by Thai RD - they are not answering our questions.

Go ahead - show me that quote in a link or attach a document. This is going to be fun.

Subject to Paragraph 2 of Article 21 ............. Have you read that ? What does it say??

EV cars are not 'reliable' and there is no way I will get one anytime soon. On my last trip back home, I was in a taxi in Aust that was a brand new Hybrid. The driver told me how he had just got rid of an EV. When I asked why, he said that the EV was only a few months old when it just stopped about half a Km from his house. The lights doors a/c all worked, but the engine was 'dead'. He called a mechanic - but he could not get it to move/start. The EV was towed to his house and a dealer mechanic came a few days later - he could not get it to start - he was very confused. He organised for the EV to be taken on a tow truck to the dealer's workshop. After much testing, they found that the left rear door sensor had failed, and because the car 'thought' the door was open, it refused to run/start the engine. There was no indicator in the car advising that - nor anything in the basic faults plug-in diagnostics - only found through the specialist system back in the workshop - and there was no way around the problem (it was a core design feature). He refused to take it back, and they eventually reached agreement to trade it in on a new Hybrid. I agree with his logic - being totally reliant on the battery and its management system designed by non-mechanics is not 'wise' - especially for a taxi. It might be OK when talking about a high end brand like Tesla, but not a cheaper Chinese brand. I was telling that story to another guy and he told me how his wife's EV car kept unlocking itself for several weeks - while she was shopping etc. - she refused to get rid of it because she was 'saving the planet'. Same thing - faulty sensor. Being married a long time he knew to just 'shut up' - but he made sure she was reminded about it whenever the issue of him changing his petrol car came up. Another bloke told me how his wife had 'convinced' him to also save the planet and they both had an EV - same brand. They both had a similar feature whereby you could use a smartphone to activate some functions on the car - like opening the doors and starting the engine. The wife was trying to demonstrate this feature of her planet saving car to her friends after a coffee/chat in the city, but it did not work (very embarassed). The bloke went to the garage at home later that day and all the doors on his car were damaged and the rear gate was jammed up against the garage door - several $thousands of damage - not covered under insurance. She had somehow selected his car not hers and was opening and closing all his doors and the rear tail gate - and as he found out that 'feature' was available over the net - and could not be removed. No thanks - no EV for me.

I was told it is because of the prohibited hours law (2pm to 5pm) and they cannot stop orders being placed, or delivereies being made, in those times. Yeh - makes no sense - but that is why I thought it is probably right.

NO. Got a wife and a life - and far too old for that crap (anymore).

Throw it away if you must - but you deserve all the recognition that goes with receiving it.

You clearly deserve recognition - you used the word fatuous while saying something completely fatuous.

Mate - you need to take a Bex and calm down and go and have a lie down. Did you read what I wrote about how DTAs work? Do you understand basic English? There are no 'exemptions' because you have paid taxes under DTAs - you can claim 'tax credits' under a DTA for taxes already paid. And in Australia the tax free threshold is $18K or 400K - in Thailand the threshold is 180K (please dont go on about 'allowances' - they have them in Australia too). The CRS requires financial institutions to identify the tax residency of all customers and report information on customers who are tax resident outside of the country where they hold their accounts. Similar to FATCA, the purpose of CRS is to aid automatic exchange of information between bilateral treaty partner countries about account holders/investors maintaining accounts in foreign jurisdictions so as to avoid tax evasions on the funds parked in such countries.

Young Turk is a general saying for a young male rebelling against authority and doig things like riding big loud motorbikes etc. I think it was Rod Stewart who had a hit song back called that - way back in the day.

Fair point. I was referring to anyone riding a big bike fast in Thailand - which is not the smartest move. But maybe the young turk rides very carefully and not too fast - maybe.

Good point - and that is not a bad strategy. That is now on my list for one of the things to maybe do (if they hit me with income taxes).

Am I the first to say - Darwin Award. Sounds like the idiot and the gene pool will soon have another 'win'

Go in and see an IO in your locall Office - with the Thai wife. The IO will advise and give you the options available. Often they will an exemption to just about any rule, if they are nice and you and the wife ask them nicely.

On 12/2/2023 at 2:06 PM, TroubleandGrumpy said: It will all be taxable from 1 January 2024 onwards. From that date forward it is irrelevant when the 'earnings' were made. Any money remitted into Thailand that is 'taxable earnings/income' from 1 Jan 2024 onwards is taxable, irrespective of what year that earnings/income was made/received. Read my words above again. Any earnings made from Jan 1 2024 will be taxable whenever it is remitted into Thailand - no more holding on to it for 2-3 years and then brining it into Thailand tax free in the future. I can see why you misunderstood me - that chart makes it very clear. Thanks.

Absolute rubbish - a person from a DTA is not 'exempt' - it totally depends on what the source of the money is - pensions, investments, savings, salary, property rental, etc etc etc. If it is a taxable income - as defined by the Thai RD (not you) - you can under the DTA claim exemtions or reductions (through tax credits). If using a DTA as the reason for not payoing income taxes, a person has to PROVE that the money they brought into Thailand is either exempt and/or they have tax credits to apply against the taxes applicable in Thailand. That has to be lodged in a form that is acceptable to the Thai RD, and they have to accept lodgement is valid, and then they have to agree with your claim that you do not have to pay income taxes. It is not your/my call. The Thai RD makes it very clear in a published advice, that retired and married Expat's bringing money into Thailand from pensions, and/or earned from previous employment, and/or previous investments, are exempt. That is what I am hoping they will do - and sooner rather than later. Sorry to be negative - but it aint as simple as many people like you think. Under a DTA a person can claim exemptions (payment types) and credits (for taxes already paid). A DTA does not mean that Thailand cannot apply income taxes to a person of a DTA country who has brought money into Thailand. How and when and if any exemptions and credits are applied under a DTA, is at the sole dicretion of the taxation authority in that country. If a person disagrees with any decison made, they have the right to appeal and to then go to Court.

Go look in the nearest Thaiwatsadu store. They are the best priced hadware store chain in Thailand for most things. Dig deep and dig once

Yes mate - I hear you and understand - I like to live that way too - struggling at the moment. In fact - I have made my plans and done all the numbers - now is a good time to pull out of this and just wait. I am renting and so we can leave at any time - just a matter of deciding. Unfortunately, I can see things going more and more in a negative way in Thailand. Back in 2010 Thailand was so laid back and yes it was great for a long time. Then the Junta came in with the 'good guys in, bad guys out' etc etc. I (foolishly?) thought that removing the Junta would result in more of the 'mai pen rai' ways coming back. Looks like I was wrong - they now seem hell bent on steaming ahead with taxing everything that moves. There are many reasons why I have concerns and this is the big one:- There has been no media statement or clarification from PM/or a Minister or Thai RD stating that they do not want to tax Expats money. This Govt has been very proactive is addressing negative media issues, and yet there has been nothing said about the about 200K Expats living in Thailand, nor to the about 400K Thais working overseas, or any other groups this tax rule change could affect. Meanwhile, in The Philippines they have recently clarified (again) that no working or retired or married Expats in thgeir country will be taxed on any income they earn overseas - only the income they make in The Philippines. And that is something that this Thai Govt has not seemed to have considered - how will this impact working Expats - especially the Executives of Companies operating in Thailand. Recently, Tesla made the decision to base its new SEAsia Headquarters in Malaysia - Thailand missed out - 20-30 years ago Thailand was the only real and obvious choice - not nowadays. Vietnam, Malaysia and Indonesia are winning business investment business against Thailand for a reason - they are offering more attractive deals. Same applies for the older Expats with money - there are better offers on the table than Thailand has to offer. I would rather stay here because of the Thai wife - but if they are going to hit me with income taxes (unless a minimal amount) then we are leaving. Many people dont agree with me - and that is fine - but many do. And new well-off Expats who have a lot more than the Pension to live on, and are looking around for where to retire, will not pick a place that will hit them with income taxes when they bring their hard-earned money into Thailand. That is where I stand and why - over and out of here. This time for sure Rocky - nothing up my sleeve .............. This song is very 'on point' - the cover picture was taken in Bangkok.

OK - here you go: POST - The owner of the car, 40 year old Boy (nickname) had been driving home from a garage in Nakhon Sawan where he had taken the car for injector repairs. POST - Not saying the obvious. (meaning - a 40 year old boy). POST - I was playing golf a while ago, and there was a group of Thai men ahead of us - about the same age as 'Boy' I would have said. As one bloke said - "They just never grow up do they?" Yes - a bit off topic - but very relevant.

There is your problem right there Mike.

Only if we have to pay income taxes (unless a very small amount). We will certainly move address if we somehow end up living near you mate

I think we are in 'violent agreement' - the source of the funds means everything - maybe I misunderstood you. You do not have to complete a tax return unless you have income taxes to pay. Thailand does not want 30? 40? million people to file a tax return - it is optional. Many Thais do not pay income taxes, not because they dont earn over 150K, it is because they dont lodge a tax return. The Thai RD has no way of 'finding them' because many Thais earn their money in the 'cash economy'. But when the Thai RD gets a list of people from the banks who have remitted over (say) 2-5-10 Million Baht, they can and will 'find them'.

We are joking Mike - sarcasm.

It will all be taxable from 1 January 2024 onwards. From that date forward it is irrelevant when the 'earnings' were made. Any money remitted into Thailand that is 'taxable earnings/income' from 1 Jan 2024 onwards is taxable, irrespective of what year that earnings/income was made/received.