Strange

9 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Happy to.  Trump lost the popular vote and the electoral college is being used in a manner contrary to it's intended purpose.

There are a lot of different trains of thought regarding the EC. 

My opinion is that its roots are based on the idea of giving individual states a voice, with their own representatives, so that all states have to be taken into consideration, instead of huge population centers stealing every election. We are 2 million votes over trump, and there is another thread on this subject, but those votes are primarily from California, New York, Illinois & DC. In my honest opinion, the EC did its job and trump won the EC votes in a landslide based on the way we do it. Both parties knew full well going into it. 

Is the EC perfect? Probably not but I believe its better than the popular vote. Its not all about the very large population centers. There is a whole lot of america out there that need different things and have different issues. 

Now, Im not completely opposed to the idea of the popular vote as long as voter ID is enforced, and there is plenty of time for government funded awareness campaigns, and clear majority votes for it, and even then I still think trump would win looking at it now. more people would vote. 

The problem I have is this whole after the fact crybaby campaign thats going on right now. 

44 minutes ago, heybruce said:

I think if you were to poll all Americans and remind them that both W. Bush and Trump were elected by the EC after losing the popular vote, you'd find more than 64.2 million eager to eliminate the EC.

So in other words, whatever you can do to discriminate against republicans. 

Honestly, its really weird to me that some posters are such bad losers that they want to change how the game is played AFTER its finished. 

38 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Stated without evidence or any valid rationale for keeping the EC, other than you like minority rule.  I expect nothing less from you.

Honestly, where is your evidence that there is a literal majority of people that want to abolish the EC? Its gonna take both sides no matter how you wanna spin it.  

Spare me the click-bait & passive aggressive insults and lets just stick to the facts. 

2 minutes ago, heybruce said:

62.2 million who are happy that the EC will allow minority rule, 64.2 million who think the system is broke.  Clearly you prefer minority rule.

False. There are not 64 million who think the system is broke. There may be 64 million that don't like trump and are disappointed by the HRC loss, but that does not mean they do not support the EC nor the outcome. 

The minority is clearly the people that oppose the EC and cry about it. 

1 hour ago, heybruce said:

Unfortunately it seems the EC has lead to the exact opposite of its intended purpose.

1 hour ago, heybruce said:

This coming from a supporter of the candidate who was claiming the election was rigged and his supporters would riot if he wasn't elected.

 

The reason the Electoral College was developed was to prevent someone like Trump becoming president:

 

"The function of the College of Electors in choosing the president can be likened to that in the Roman Catholic Church of the College of Cardinals selecting the Pope. The original idea was for the most knowledgeable and informed individuals from each State to select the president based solely on merit and without regard to State of origin or political party."  http://uselectionatlas.org/INFORMATION/INFORMATION/electcollege_history.php 

 

Obviously it hasn't worked that way, and, considering all the changes in the US since the constitution was written, the Electoral College no longer serves any useful purpose.

 

When the UK chose Brexit by a margin of 52% to 48%, nobody challenged the results (at least nobody that has been taken seriously).  Even politicians that hate the idea are working to implement the stated will of the majority of the voters.

 

When two million more people, a clear majority, voted for the Democrats than the Republicans, the Republicans still "won" the Presidency, the Senate and the House of Representatives.  That indicates a major flaw in the system.  The EC is only part of the problem, shameless gerrymandering is also an issue.  Recognizing these things is not sour grapes, any more than calling for the abolition of slavery or other necessary changes to the constitution was sour grapes.

This whole wall of text right here^^ 

There are 60+ million voters - probably a hell of a lot more than that because there are surely a shit-ton of Democrat voters that support the EC and the result in full - that feel the EC did, infact, do its job by not allowing HRC to win the election. 

The house, senate, and justices are icing on the cake. 

This dog just won't hunt. 

I don't care what the UK does. 

4 minutes ago, Tawan Dok Krating Daeng said:

North Carolina NAACP Sues State Over Voter Suppression

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/north-carolina-naacp-voter-suppression_us_5817634fe4b064e1b4b385df

 

Like I said, when black voices tell you that that voter ID impacts them negatively, you do not listen. You are so fixated on your ideology that you refuse to accept anything that contradicts what you are sure is reality. Undocumented immigrants having the right to vote. They do not have a right to vote in Federal or State elections and if they do so it is done improperly. Which is something that those who regulate elections and I believe that is each individual State based Secretary of State, needs to address.

 

Whoever has claimed that Voter ID laws targets blacks and minorities. Experience and research demonstrates that the impact of such legislation impacts these groups. An entirely different concept altogether. You are trying to divert away from the issue.

The post I was replying to had the words racial and racist in it 5 times. For it to be racist it has to target people based on race. You link does not prove anything to be racist or racial. It was an incident that effected both whites and blacks as their address was not deliverable. No intentional suppression or racist behavior about it. Nobody trying to silence anyone. 

You just really want everything to be about race, racism, etc.. 

Illegal Immigrants should never be able to vote even if its done 'improperly' and by improperly you mean illegally, witch they do, can be done, and is done. Wether or not its done on a scale that has any real impact is irrelevant. 

3 minutes ago, Opl said:

So EC has to do what needs to be done, what it was meant for ! 

There is always a way to spin something isn't there? 

Just now, heybruce said:

 

A few years of Trump and I'm sure there will be lots of people willing to make changes and prevent a similar disaster.

The possibility of that happening is so minuscule its a non-issue. There is a reason the EC was developed, and of course there is always a way to spin it to favor however you feel about it. 

You can't play a game based on a certain set of rules, lose, then cry about the rules that were wholly agreed to, and say that its "Un-Fair". Then claim that the EC should be abolished because 2 million more people voted for HRC. The game was not played on the popular vote. 

You do not know and can not speculate how this election would have turned out if it was played by popular vote rules. Im inclined to think that trump still would have won. More people would vote. Im sure other people would think the same about HRC. 

1 hour ago, Tawan Dok Krating Daeng said:

Your puerile name calling notwithstanding, nobody is arguing that persons not eligible to vote should be voting. You may believe the whole fake new nonsense about undocumented persons being brought into the country by Democrats to vote for them in future elections, but it really does not pass the laugh test for a rational person. Legislation that requires the demonstration of qualification at the polling station, beyond what is required for the registration process, impacts on minorities and the poor who, as is well known, tend to vote Democrat. That is why voter suppression is racist.

 

I do not worry so much about Republicans playing games with the voter registration, which is well documented, since managing an election requires establishing timelines and deadlines. I support Democrat efforts to get voters registered before such deadlines.

 

When minority voices tell you something has a negative impact on them, you dismiss this because you refuse to admit racial bias. I can admit my own racial bias and how I deal with it but you make a game out of refusing to acknowledge it even exists.

 

You don't want to be seen as a racist, then don't say things that are racist. Not that difficult to understand I think.

What you find rational, another may find irrational. Such is life and you really should learn to deal with it. 

Plenty of poor whites vote Republican. Plenty of Poor whites would be effected just the same as poor blacks. Illegal Immigrants should never be rewarded the power of a ballot. There is no legislation in Voter ID that targets blacks and minorities only. There is always a spin to everything. 

1 hour ago, sgtsabai said:

I call it voter suppression! And racist on top as it is directed mostly at black voters. For the right wingnut Kool-aid snorters, there is no voter fraud, there is massive voter suppression by the right wing Republicans and they brag about it.

Calm down man. I really don't think the intention is voter suppression and racism. I can understand how it would negatively impact some, but geez you can't do anything without negatively impacting someone, even with the best of intentions. 

By population of the USA, the percentage of African Americans to Whites, I'm more than sure that there are just as many White people that would be negatively effected just the same. Poverty is not just a black thing and its hardly targeting anyone in particular. Plenty of impoverished whites as well. 

There are plenty of completely legit youtube videos exposing not only the issue, but step by step on how to do it. 

38 minutes ago, Tawan Dok Krating Daeng said:

Yes. It's called the Electoral Roll man.

 

People register then turn up on election day and give their name. The system has worked for ages when everyone respects the dignity and equality of others. That's not the case now when all these minority voters clearly aren't entitled to that trust.

Illegal Immigrants & People that should not be voting are not entitled to this honor system. I do not want them voting. I see nothing wrong with legislation that keeps them out of the polling station. I know some will whine and cry and say that some minorities have a hard time locating their birth cert or going through the process of getting a local ID card but there are ways to make sure everyone that has the right to legally cast their vote, does. Thats not racist but I know you want to call it that. 

35 minutes ago, Tawan Dok Krating Daeng said:

I do not need to edit your post to distort its meaning as you have done to mine. Such editing changing the focus from your implication that a non American poster knows less about US politics than you because he is non American to something quite different.

 

I have a go at a number of non Americans who comment on US politics when they tend to post in a way that they have a dog in the fight when they don't but I never accuse them of ignorance just because they are not American. The posts are not about knowing another person from their posting history. You have no idea about who I am or my politics apart from the fact that they are generally liberal and you don't look any deeper than that.

 

If the popular vote being in favor of Clinton, how can you claim that the majority of Americans share your view? And attacking others on the basis of perceived ignorance due to their nationality (race) is, well... I will use word stereotyping. There are many good reasons why a non American may have more knowledge or experience about the US Presidential election process than you.

I did not edit your post, I chose what I wanted to reply to. Its common practice but you can always report it if you don't like it. 

I literally do not care what a non-american thinks about america or its politics or policy. Just like I don't comment or barf up my opinion on UK, Brexit, European politics. Its their business and they have their reasons for doing what they do, and thats inherently for what they believe is the betterment of their country and themselves. 

Americans will have more insight as to the reasons that propel american people to vote the way they do. 

Go ahead and get it out of your system and call me a racist. I know your radical trigger finger is itching to. 

18 minutes ago, sgtsabai said:

There is a tremendous amount of Republican right wing voter suppression that denied the vote to eligible voters, black, brown, poor, elderly, students, those that tend to vote with a brain with more than 2 working brain cells .

There has to be some kind of limit or procedure to verify citizenship and legitimacy of voters man. 

9 hours ago, webfact said:

The newspaper reports many of the comments came from a link from a pro-Trump Reddit forum.

Lol Reddit. 

Not gonna lie, that site is a superpower of people. 

The ole "Hug of Death" comes to mind.

8 hours ago, webfact said:

Read article. Saw Picture. 

Thoughts - "Smug"

2 minutes ago, maoro2013 said:

8 hours ago, Andaman Al said:

I bet if they did a physical count of the paper she did not lose

You must be democrat.

He's English. 

1 hour ago, Tawan Dok Krating Daeng said:

Do you think you know me? Do you think you know anyone who happens to disagree with your particular point of view?

Going purely the debates we've had and your post history - yes I think I know you. Just like you think you know me. 

Yes I know many who disagree with my (and the majority of americans) point of view. 

But.... But..... But.... "POPULAR VOTE" 

Yeah everyones got it. 

1 hour ago, Tawan Dok Krating Daeng said:

Smug self satisfaction will not remain long once the resistance starts to organize.

This appears to be a threat.

Is what you were going for? 

2 hours ago, impulse said:

Can you imagine the constitutional crisis if it went the other way?

I really don't want to. 

7 minutes ago, MikeyIdea said:

 

??? Sure you talk to the right person? This is my first post on this subject after the election 9-Nov

You stated "Non-Democratic" 

The USA is a Democratic Republic. 

We don't operate by your standards, and its time for you to deal with it. 

Regardless of how you feel about it. 

1 minute ago, MikeyIdea said:

5 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

Get over it. She LOST! 

 

In a non-democratic election system yes. It is as it should be because the law says so

Ever get tired of it? 

You know, barfing up the same thing over and over?

Just now, teacherpaul said:

Probably the same satisfaction we'd feel if it happened to you.

No doubt. 

Ill happily take my chances. 

9 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

I suspect you wil bel too busy kicking the dog! Ha! Ha!

7 minutes ago, Silurian said:

Keep on telling yourself that land mass votes, huh? The power of Gaia at work.

4 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

I think you will find that 2 million more will agree with me

Slapped-Ass syndrome at work. 

1 hour ago, DriveByTrucker said:

Thats a statement based on your (completely unfounded) assumptions only.

The stupidity of the statement is actually really funny.

Let me ask you, how many millions of Americans do you personally know? And how many of these millions discussed their voting decision with you? Can I also conclude that you dont read any media, because that influences the perception you have on the voting decision of Americans? If you dont know millions of Americans, and you do read media, that would mean according to your own rules that you know absolutely nothing about America!

Lmao. 

Straight up - you, as a foreigner, know more about American life and the reasoning behind the votes cast, than an American? 

Just now, dunroaming said:

 

And time will prove you right and me wrong, or will it be the other way round?

No idea. Im not gonna speculate. 

I will however tell you and anyone else that is reading that I fully support whatever the outcome. 

I will not, however, cry like a little biatch.