Getting a new passport to "reset your SETV count" sounds too good to be true

[acenase]

2 hours ago, smccolley said:

I just have to wonder why the OP doesn't get a visa that reflects his real status in Thailand. If you really want to be here, a valid long term visa is probably available. I get really tired of posters trying to "beat the system" when I, my friends, and many posters here on TV have lived in Thailand for decades without resorting to trickery or outright fraud to stay here.

 

what if i told you.... unless you are 50+ years for a retirement visa, going to school for an education visa, employed for work permit or married to thai... your only eligible for a Tourist Visa! I dont fit any of those requirements so as long as I can prove that I have money to support myself then I am eligible for a tourist visa

 

Edited September 15, 2017 by acenase

[ericthai]

3 hours ago, darrendsd said:

You, like all of us are here at the whim of the Thai Government, nothing more, the rules could change at any time, you would do well to remember that

 

not all.. some have PR and I have a few friends that have Thai citizenship.   

[tropo]

3 hours ago, JackThompson said:

The opportunity for trickery and fraud is primarily prevalent on ED, Retirement, Marriage and Business-based visas, where agents (or a school) can fenagle things for a fee shared with corrupt IOs.  I believe Tourist Visas are picked-on at certain locations, because they do not enable this profitable fraud.

That is not to imply that everyone using the other options is participating in fraud - only to point out that those on Tourist Visas are the only ones who must follow the law to obtain their visas.  Some may work illegally in water-sports or as teachers (easy to catch, if anyone wanted to do so) - but working without a work-permit is a potential violation with any visa-type.

The immigration officers at entry points don't have to catch people working illegally. They make an on-the-spot assessment. Their decision is final. Young guys with back-to-back visas or many visa-free entries are highly suspect.

[juice777]

 
I have been debating if I should apply for a new PP in Thailand or back home in the US, but then I realized, I can't erase my history in the computer monitors so even if I wait so I avoid having that extra stamp by renewing my PP in Thailand, they will still know when I get to immigration of my history.
 
I keep reading about Vientiane only allowing 3-4 Tourist Visas before you get the red stamp.. but does that mean "back to back" or TOTAL in your passport? 
 would it make a difference if you have 2 TR Visas from Vientiane, then 1 in HK or Penang, then go back to Vientiane for 2 more compared to if you just did 4 straight runs to Vientiane for the TR Visa?
 
 

Forget Vintanine go to Savannakhet print out a bank statement at least 20000THB in it. And get a 1000THB cheap ticket out of the country.Then repeat. You almost probably won't have any problems.

This is my visa history

Tripple from london
Double from Vientiane
2 singles from Vientiane
5 singles from Savannakhet

No problems yet

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

[juice777]

I did that for decades, keep the old passport till it was full or till I got the first red warning stamp.Then you apply for a new one at your embassy in Bangkok, but ask them to send the new one to an embassy in a neighboring country for pick-up,which they will do for a fee:This way you get a completely 'clean' passport, that doesn't even have the transferred Thai visa from your old passport in it.
With the current crackdown on serial TV runners that might not be a foolproof solution to long-term stay anymore.

Not a bad plan but I would be scared that I will be hanging around for ages waiting for it. Actually I thought they took your old passport away why you was waiting. My plan is to before I get a new one use one of my land crossing. Then serif I can extend it straight away. That way I have 60 days for my passport to get here and I don't have TVs in it.

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[juice777]

I just have to wonder why the OP doesn't get a visa that reflects his real status in Thailand. If you really want to be here, a valid long term visa is probably available. I get really tired of posters trying to "beat the system" when I, my friends, and many posters here on TV have lived in Thailand for decades without resorting to trickery or outright fraud to stay here.

Oh here we go. Some of us are not married or not old enough to get a retirement Visa. But are lucky enough to not have to work.

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[lkv]

7 minutes ago, juice777 said:

Oh here we go. Some of us are not married or not old enough to get a retirement Visa. But are lucky enough to not have to work.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
 

And then there will be the ones saying that if you are lucky enough not to have to work you should buy into the Thai Elite visa.

 

As for the ones that cannot afford Thai Elite, they will say oh well, Thailand cannot accomodate everybody.

 

Meanwhile, I'll take a shot on SETV no 6 on this passport shortly. Fingers crossed lol.

Edited September 15, 2017 by lkv

[juice777]

The immigration officers at entry points don't have to catch people working illegally. They make an on-the-spot assessment. Their decision is final. Young guys with back-to-back visas or many visa-free entries are highly suspect.

Highly suspect maybe. But That doesn't mean we are you to anything dodgy. That's why I aways carry proof of income from the UK with me when on a visa run.Dosent mean I am not working but it proves I can support myself with out working. To tell the Truth if they said no more no more It probably be a good thing for me. I would go to Cambodia or go home to work.

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[JackThompson]

7 hours ago, tropo said:

The immigration officers at entry points don't have to catch people working illegally. They make an on-the-spot assessment. Their decision is final. Young guys with back-to-back visas or many visa-free entries are highly suspect.

Yes, I agree that people entering by air will not have the benefit of any formal legal standards of proof - especially given the hateful things said to many of them, which show the motivation has little to do with "concern about illegal-working."  

 

The few who do work illegally could be stopped if the labor-laws were enforced at schools frequently enough to set an example that would scare off any Thai who would consider hiring illegally.  The story/sentiment needs to be: "No way, man.  When the H.R. guy at that other school got nailed for that, they took all his savings plus he still owes his lawyer, which he will have to pay back after his miserable year in the monkey-house." 

Meanwhile, foreigners from neighboring countries are exempt from the 2x-land-crossing rule, so the hi-sos can get all the slave-wage labor they need.  I hate hypocrisy on this - same as in my own country - policies which literally force our a nation's citizens out of the middle-class by allowing a flood of cheap foreign workers, while treating people who fly-in like suspected criminals.

[JackThompson]

 

4 hours ago, juice777 said:

Highly suspect maybe. But That doesn't mean we are you to anything dodgy. That's why I aways carry proof of income from the UK with me when on a visa run.Dosent mean I am not working but it proves I can support myself with out working. To tell the Truth if they said no more no more It probably be a good thing for me. I would go to Cambodia or go home to work.

This is a good idea.  I always carried by Bangkok Bank book showing foreign-transfers.   I don't know if it would actually help - but cannot hurt.

The sad thing for Thailand, if you leave, are the Thais who will lose your business.  And it's not just the Thais who provide goods and services to you, but the other Thais from whom they buy "sum-tum lao," etc.  Preventing people with money - even moderate amounts - from spending it into the Thai economy, causes a chain of economic destruction.  

 

I suppose it is good for the Cambodians and Vietnamese, but I doubt this is being done as a charitable gesture.  If Thai IOs considered that their denials of entry were throwing Thais into poverty to help Cambodians, they might have 2nd thoughts.

[overherebc]

6 hours ago, juice777 said:

Forget Vintanine go to Savannakhet print out a bank statement at least 20000THB in it. And get a 1000THB cheap ticket out of the country.Then repeat. You almost probably won't have any problems.

This is my visa history

Tripple from london
Double from Vientiane
2 singles from Vientiane
5 singles from Savannakhet

No problems yet

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
 

In the case of 'yet'? I take it you have flight ticket, 20,000 baht and accom' proof. Without those it's likely you will be at least questioned. I hope it doesn't happen but it might.

[acenase]

Will there be a problem if you haven't applied for a new Passport yet and your new Visa is on the last empty page of your Passport and they have to find an empty spot on the middle pages to stamp your Entry/Exit stamp? Can they refuse entry and say not enough space in Passport? Or what if you just tell them that you are waiting for your new passport to arrive at the Embassy?

Edited September 16, 2017 by acenase

[CaptainKiiNiaw]

9 hours ago, juice777 said:

print out a bank statement at least 20000THB in it. [...]
 

 

Is a printed page from my bank's website sufficient?  I have U.S. bank accounts and don't receive any paper mail in Thailand.

 

Thanks for your report.  It's interesting how much variation there is in visa policy among the Thai embassies/consulates.

[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, acenase said:

Will there be a problem if you haven't applied for a new Passport yet and your new Visa is on the last empty page of your Passport and they have to find an empty spot on the middle pages to stamp your Entry/Exit stamp? Can they refuse entry and say not enough space in Passport? Or what if you just tell them that you are waiting for your new passport to arrive at the Embassy?

I have had IOs in various countries put their stamps in the strangest places, so I as long as there is space for the stamp somewhere, I think you will be OK.  If you have a receipt indicating a passport has been purchased, bring it with to answer any questions on that point.

[JackThompson]

Just now, CaptainKiiNiaw said:

Is a printed page from my bank's website sufficient?  I have U.S. bank accounts and don't receive any paper mail in Thailand.

Thanks for your report.  It's interesting how much variation there is in visa policy among the Thai embassies/consulates.

A printout has been reported as sufficient at Savanakhet and other consulates.  Some people have reported being asked to show a bank-card with a matching account# to verify the statement is genuine.

[thecyclist]

9 hours ago, juice777 said:

Not a bad plan but I would be scared that I will be hanging around for ages waiting for it. Actually I thought they took your old passport away why you was waiting. My plan is to before I get a new one use one of my land crossing. Then serif I can extend it straight away. That way I have 60 days for my passport to get here and I don't have TVs in it.

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They do not take your old passport away when you apply for a new one.They invalidate your old one when you pick up your new one:In the meantime you can do whatever you want with the old one:Travel around the world or do another Thai visa run.If you're living in Thailand, there is no waiting around either, you are here anyway.

[tropo]

9 hours ago, juice777 said:

Highly suspect maybe. But That doesn't mean we are you to anything dodgy. That's why I aways carry proof of income from the UK with me when on a visa run.Dosent mean I am not working but it proves I can support myself with out working. To tell the Truth if they said no more no more It probably be a good thing for me. I would go to Cambodia or go home to work.

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6

Immigration officers at point of entry don't need proof of dodgy activity, but frequent new passports would be a red flag. I wouldn't do it. New passports cost a lot of money and time to get and if the officers can see previous entries on the computer getting new passports is pointless. Yeah, you can get a new visa with it, but that's no guarantee of entry.

[tropo]

20 minutes ago, thecyclist said:

They do not take your old passport away when you apply for a new one.They invalidate your old one when you pick up your new one:In the meantime you can do whatever you want with the old one:Travel around the world or do another Thai visa run.If you're living in Thailand, there is no waiting around either, you are here anyway.

It depends if you want to pick it up or have it posted to you. If they mail the new one they will invalidate the old one at the time of application. Well, that's how they do it in Australia - other countries may do it differently.

[juice777]

Immigration officers at point of entry don't need proof of dodgy activity, but frequent new passports would be a red flag. I wouldn't do it. New passports cost a lot of money and time to get and if the officers can see previous entries on the computer getting new passports is pointless. Yeah, you can get a new visa with it, but that's no guarantee of entry.

You don't need to keep getting new passports if you are organized. Stay ahead of the rules with TVs. I've never had to get a new passport unless I filled it up.

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[juice777]

It depends if you want to pick it up or have it posted to you. If they mail the new one they will invalidate the old one at the time of application. Well, that's how they do it in Australia - other countries may do it differently.

OK but i am still a bit unclear. Both my old passport have the corner cut of. So how can they invalidate your old passport why you are in loas. I would have thought they don't invalidate your old one until they know you have your new one in your hand.

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[tropo]

1 hour ago, juice777 said:

OK but i am still a bit unclear. Both my old passport have the corner cut of. So how can they invalidate your old passport why you are in loas. I would have thought they don't invalidate your old one until they know you have your new one in your hand.

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I'm sure different countries have different systems, but for an Australian passport you have to attend an interview at an Australian Consulate, and they will cut it at the interview if you intend to receive the new one by post, or cut it when you receive the new one if you want to pick it up.

[tropo]

1 hour ago, juice777 said:

You don't need to keep getting new passports if you are organized. Stay ahead of the rules with TVs. I've never had to get a new passport unless I filled it up.

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The topic of this thread is about getting replacement passports for the express purpose of "resetting the SETV count".

[BritTim]

5 hours ago, tropo said:

7 hours ago, juice777 said:

You don't need to keep getting new passports if you are organized. Stay ahead of the rules with TVs. I've never had to get a new passport unless I filled it up.

The topic of this thread is about getting replacement passports for the express purpose of "resetting the SETV count".

Sure, and +juice777 made the valid point that it is possible to manage your visa situation such that replacement for that purpose alone is unnecessary (reasonable though some may disagree).

[tropo]

1 hour ago, BritTim said:

Sure, and +juice777 made the valid point that it is possible to manage your visa situation such that replacement for that purpose alone is unnecessary (reasonable though some may disagree).

The OP was suggesting that replacing one's passport could be a convenient way of resetting the SETV count. Let's say you have just obtained a new passport within the last few years (a passport valid for 10 years, for example). What other purposes would you be replacing your passport for? Sure, if your passport is near expiry and nearly full, then getting a new passport would be reasonable as you would need a new one anyway.

 

The main point here is that a new passport does not solve the problem of being allowed to enter with a long list of previous entries on the computer.

[BritTim]

2 hours ago, tropo said:

3 hours ago, BritTim said:

Sure, and +juice777 made the valid point that it is possible to manage your visa situation such that replacement for that purpose alone is unnecessary (reasonable though some may disagree).

The OP was suggesting that replacing one's passport could be a convenient way of resetting the SETV count. Let's say you have just obtained a new passport within the last few years (a passport valid for 10 years, for example). What other purposes would you be replacing your passport for? Sure, if your passport is near expiry and nearly full, then getting a new passport would be reasonable as you would need a new one anyway.

 

The main point here is that a new passport does not solve the problem of being allowed to enter with a long list of previous entries on the computer.

You make another valid point: regardless of whether you can continue to get tourist visas, immigration may eventually deny you entry anyway. However, I disagree that this was the main point of the thread. The main point was that you cannot, for instance, get six tourist visas from Vientiane in the same passport. They red stamp you. You can, however, get three in one passport, change your passport and get three in the new passport. That is a loophole in getting more tourist visas that the consulate intends to allow you, albeit having no impact on what immigration might decide.

[StayinThailand2much]

15 hours ago, juice777 said:

OK but i am still a bit unclear. Both my old passport have the corner cut of. So how can they invalidate your old passport why you are in loas. I would have thought they don't invalidate your old one until they know you have your new one in your hand.

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You apply for your new passport, then, if you later pick it up in person, you have to hand in your old passport, which, probably, will be returned to you, but with the corners cut off, so you always have a valid passport.

 

You may have to transfer your current visa, e.g. Laos visa, to your new passport. Depending to which countries you are travelling, you may want to take your old passport with you too for the next six months. (I lived in China for a while, and     border immigration there regularly asked me for my old passport, even months after I had gotten a new one.)

[ubonjoe]

18 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

You may have to transfer your current visa, e.g. Laos visa, to your new passport.

A visa cannot be transferred to a new passport. If it is a valid multiple entry visa you have to use both passports on entry to use the visa in the old one.

Immigration only transfers stamps they have done.

[tropo]

7 hours ago, BritTim said:

10 hours ago, tropo said:

11 hours ago, BritTim said:

Sure, and +juice777 made the valid point that it is possible to manage your visa situation such that replacement for that purpose alone is unnecessary (reasonable though some may disagree).

The OP was suggesting that replacing one's passport could be a convenient way of resetting the SETV count. Let's say you have just obtained a new passport within the last few years (a passport valid for 10 years, for example). What other purposes would you be replacing your passport for? Sure, if your passport is near expiry and nearly full, then getting a new passport would be reasonable as you would need a new one anyway.

 

The main point here is that a new passport does not solve the problem of being allowed to enter with a long list of previous entries on the computer.

You make another valid point: regardless of whether you can continue to get tourist visas, immigration may eventually deny you entry anyway. However, I disagree that this was the main point of the thread. The main point was that you cannot, for instance, get six tourist visas from Vientiane in the same passport. They red stamp you. You can, however, get three in one passport, change your passport and get three in the new passport. That is a loophole in getting more tourist visas that the consulate intends to allow you, albeit having no impact on what immigration might decide.

I should have used "important point" rather than "main point".

 

 

[NanLaew]

On 9/15/2017 at 3:50 AM, BritTim said:

It has long been a convenient loophole which the Ministry of Foreign Affairs has not seen fit to close. To eliminate it, they would need an efficient and reliable computer system to track all visa applications. Thailand struggles to create such systems. It might happen, but does not seem likely in the near future.

In the meantime, I revel in the perpetual false hope that it frequently inspires in some.

[jamieoutlook]

3 hours ago, StayinThailand2much said:

You apply for your new passport, then, if you later pick it up in person, you have to hand in your old passport, which, probably, will be returned to you, but with the corners cut off, so you always have a valid passport.

 

You may have to transfer your current visa, e.g. Laos visa, to your new passport. Depending to which countries you are travelling, you may want to take your old passport with you too for the next six months. (I lived in China for a while, and     border immigration there regularly asked me for my old passport, even months after I had gotten a new one.)

NZ passport is modern tech.

When you request a new one and receive it, the old one is auto cancelled online..none of the old cut the corners nonsense  now.