Refused Entry at Suvarnabhumi...almost

[manonthemon]

My girlfriend is being refused entry at Suvarnabhumi airport. She's just arrived from Kolkata, India, with a tourist visa in her passport. 

The officer is very unpleasant, not just to her but to other arriving passengers too. He gives no reason for refusing entry, but we suppose it's because this is her second tourist visa in a row. My girlfriend went to Kolkata to obtain a Non B visa for a teaching position in Thailand, with the papers provided by the school, but at the visa processing centre, she was told the papers were not sufficient and that she'd have to go back to get the missing documents. Hence the tourist visa. 

 

The officer seems to be a very angry man, shouting, telling my girlfriend that "she only thinks about herself" and "she's the boss, so what should he do?". Other immigration officers are all smiles, letting people in, just this one bossing around. He also refused entry to a Korean girl who has a 3 months ed visa for a  pre-booked Thai course. He told her to call the school...at 2 AM.  
Update: Literally halfway through writing this post I got a message that he...let her in. A sudden change of heart. Don't know about the Korean girl though

Seems like pure harassment just for the sake of it. We've been living here for 6 years now, always legally, with work permits and proper visas. We have two kids here, all our lives here. And frankly, we've never had this kind of problems before. In fact, we've mostly encountered kind and friendly people at the immigration (except one doctor at Bangkok immigration who tried to force my girlfriend for a visa run to Cambodia when she was 8 months pregnant and advised by other doctors not to travel ...long story.) But now that my girlfriend has found herself between jobs, things are getting complicated. She's Indian, her visa options are limited, and she can only get a visa back in her home country. 

I began writing this post to ask for advice, but now I'll leave it here just as a  little horror story. Won't' be easy going back to sleep tonight. 

 

[dbrenn]

Generally, immigration officers in Thailand are polite and reasonable. There is a small minority who behave like pigs, and it sounds like your girlfriend was unlucky.

[stevenl]

Living here for 6 years and entering on a tourist visa points to illegal employment.

[manonthemon]

36 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Living here for 6 years and entering on a tourist visa points to illegal employment.

Well, this is complete paranoia. She also asked the officer for other suggestions on what visa to use to on in order to get the additional documents requested by the embassy. No reply but more abuse. 

[anon789561]

"And frankly, we've never had this kind of problems before. In fact, we've mostly encountered kind and friendly people at the immigration"

you said it yourself. might as well forget it now. always gonna be a few miserable arse holes in life, no point letting them ruin your day. anyway, he let her in on her 2nd tourist visa and she's been living here for 6 years so he can't be that bad 555

[catman20]

2 hours ago, dbrenn said:

Generally, immigration officers in Thailand are polite and reasonable. There is a small minority who behave like pigs, and it sounds like your girlfriend was unlucky.

they love the power and control

[Bob12345]

2 hours ago, dbrenn said:

Generally, immigration officers in Thailand are polite and reasonable. There is a small minority who behave like pigs, and it sounds like your girlfriend was unlucky.

Then i have been unlucky on my last 10-15 arrivals, because I have never seen a smile or heard a reply to my "sawaddee krab".

 

Compare that to immigration at my home country where they smile, give a polite greeting, and make some small talk while checking your passport in under 30 seconds.

[stevenl]

1 hour ago, manonthemon said:

Well, this is complete paranoia. She also asked the officer for other suggestions on what visa to use to on in order to get the additional documents requested by the embassy. No reply but more abuse. 

Why do you think this is paranoid? I would find it strange if somebody who is living here for 6 years is entering on a tourist visa, and if I were the immigration officer I would ask some questions about that.

[Bullie]

I don't know on what visa the O.P. is in Thailand, but I presume it is a job-related one, based on your statement that you live here for 6 years and have 2 children together, that, in fact, your whole life is here.

Her visa problems would be over if she could piggy-back on your visa as your dependent.

 

Go on then, make an honest woman out of her!

[ubonjoe]

3 minutes ago, Bullie said:

Her visa problems would be over if she could piggy-back on your visa as your dependent.

They are not married so that would not be possible if he had an extension of stay. It is not possible with only a visa entry.

[manonthemon]

32 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

They are not married so that would not be possible if he had an extension of stay. It is not possible with only a visa entry.

Right, we're not married yet. We want to but obtaining all the necessary documents from our countries is, well, a challenge. 

And I'm on one of those multiple entry Non B visas. The first time, before it was always a one year extension of stay. Not even sure how this one works. 

Anyhow, we are now happily reunited and looking for a more solid, permanent solution to the visa issue. 

 

[ICECOOL]

2 hours ago, Bob12345 said:

Then i have been unlucky on my last 10-15 arrivals, because I have never seen a smile or heard a reply to my "sawaddee krab".

 

Compare that to immigration at my home country where they smile, give a polite greeting, and make some small talk while checking your passport in under 30 seconds.

Interesting. Been coming here for 7 or 8 years on different visa and got plenty of smiles. Even came in once without realising my retirement visa had just expired. Cheerful  immigration officer just gave me 30 day exempt and advised to sort it out. I always start with a smile and stay polite.

[manonthemon]

1 hour ago, stevenl said:

Why do you think this is paranoid? I would find it strange if somebody who is living here for 6 years is entering on a tourist visa, and if I were the immigration officer I would ask some questions about that.

Because it doesn't make sense. How is it feasible - for the employer (school) and employee (teacher) to have the latter leave the country every 2 months to apply for a new tourist visa in India which is both costly and takes lots of time? And why would someone who has worked here legally for 6 years suddenly decide to go through all the trouble of playing the system with tourist visas? It just doesn't add up.  

IMO the mess we found ourselves in boils down to a lack of a proper visa solution for people not yet employed in Thailand but in the process of getting a job. They are not tourists but a tourist visa is the only option for them to enter the country. And with the work permit and visa procedures being what they are and changing often, it sometimes takes more than one entry to obtain all the papers. So people who try to go the right thing and get legal, end up being punished. 

Another thing is that after 6 years here some sort of a more permanent residence option would be welcome. 

Edited October 6, 2017 by manonthemon

[Mattd]

Apart from the obvious being that you and your wife want to be together, then would it have not been easier, cheaper and in the end quicker for the school to have gathered the missing paperwork and then courier them over to India, then your wife could have applied for the non b and flown to Thailand only once?

[stevenl]

6 minutes ago, manonthemon said:

Because it doesn't make sense. How is it feasible - for the employer (school) and employee (teacher) to have the latter leave the country every 2 months to apply for a new tourist visa in India which is both costly and takes lots of time? And why would someone who has worked here legally for 6 years suddenly decide to go through all the trouble of playing the system with tourist visas? It just doesn't add up.  

IMO the mess we found ourselves in boils down to a lack of a proper visa solution for people not yet employed in Thailand but in the process of getting a job. They are not tourists but a tourist visa is the only option for them to enter the country. And with the work permit and visa procedures being what they are and changing often, it sometimes takes more than one entry to obtain all the papers. So people who try to go the right thing and get legal, end up being punished. 

Another thing is that after 6 years here some sort of a more permanent residence option would be welcome. 

All the IO knows is that she is living here, has been doing so for 6 years, and is trying to enter with a tourist visa a second consecutive tourist visa. So yes, I understand the questions, and I also understand he does not trust her on her (presumably) brown eyes. So questions asked, and after that she is allowed to enter. Nothing wrong with that.

[likeke]

Just unlucky for sure. Odds are you will never encountered this again. Good luck to you.

[anon789561]

2 hours ago, Bob12345 said:

Then i have been unlucky on my last 10-15 arrivals, because I have never seen a smile or heard a reply to my "sawaddee krab".

 

Compare that to immigration at my home country where they smile, give a polite greeting, and make some small talk while checking your passport in under 30 seconds.

true, i went to HK the other week and handed the guy my passport as normal, he did his thing handed it back and said, 'welcome to HK, enjoy your stay'. after so many trips through immo here i was kind of taken aback. I was like, yeah cheers. just not used to friendly immo here guess. it's a shame really

if seven can get their staff to greet everyone that walks through the door all day long then surely the government can get the io's to greet everyone too 555

Edited October 6, 2017 by Happy enough

[Mattd]

Always remember arrivals at Don Muang when it was the only BKK airport, as you approached immigration, then on the back wall of the baggage reclaim area facing you was a big 'Welcome to the Land of Smiles' sign, never once did I see an IO smile 

[manonthemon]

8 minutes ago, stevenl said:

All the IO knows is that she is living here, has been doing so for 6 years, and is trying to enter with a tourist visa a second consecutive tourist visa. So yes, I understand the questions, and I also understand he does not trust her on her (presumably) brown eyes. So questions asked, and after that she is allowed to enter. Nothing wrong with that.

Just that it wasn't simply questions asked, but a straightforward "I'm not letting you in" with no explanation, followed up by more rudeness and shouting. Believe me, my GF is beyond kind and gentle and I'm sure she didn't wind that guy up, which as we know can happen in Thailand if you come here with a wrong attitude. We've been here long enough to know that it's better to smile and wai then get into arguments. 

I think in the end it's her composure and soft approach that saved the day. She politely asked the office "Not to get angry" and talk with her calmly and explain his reasons. In the end, he reluctantly stamped her in.  All the drama was unnecessary. 

 

[JackThompson]

16 minutes ago, stevenl said:

All the IO knows is that she is living here, has been doing so for 6 years, and is trying to enter with a tourist visa a second consecutive tourist visa. So yes, I understand the questions, and I also understand he does not trust her on her (presumably) brown eyes. So questions asked, and after that she is allowed to enter. Nothing wrong with that.

The rudeness reported is the "wrong" part.  I was interrogated on exit* at Arana/Poipet once (not on overstay, either - I have a clean record), but at least the officer was polite and professional about it.

*Note: I was told at that time that future entry on a Tourist Visa at a land border would not be possible because I had significant time in-country, so needed to "fly in" (ah yes, right into the trap where the IO above would have been waiting to greet me).  I didn't argue with him - simply entered at a different land-border-point a week later with my new Tourist Visa, hassle-free.

[speckio]

let it go...  and just chalk it up to the officer having a bad day. She was allowed entry so everything corrected itself.

 

again you said it yourself this happened out of how many entries? problems occur from time to time.

[jeab1980]

7 hours ago, manonthemon said:

We've been living here for 6 years now, always legally, with work permits and proper visas.

Then surley your GF should have known the papers for the Non B were not in order after 6 years. 

[hawker9000]

3 hours ago, manonthemon said:

Well, this is complete paranoia. She also asked the officer for other suggestions on what visa to use to on in order to get the additional documents requested by the embassy. No reply but more abuse. 

Not paranoia at all.  Furthermore, showing attitude to the IO wasn't such a hot idea either.  IOs don't make decisions on granting visas.  The embassies and consulates do that.  Different governmental depts. entirely.  IOs simply decide whether to permit or not permit entry - based on the regulations pertaining to the visa being presented.  Her trying to put it all on the IO was a terrible idea.  She's very fortunate to have been let in if he had any suspicion of her working illegally, which on a tourist visa she would've been/will be; I'm actually kind of surprised.   But she WAS allowed to enter and the IO's questioning her was entirely appropriate.

 

If there's any question of paranoia here, it certainly doesn't rest with the IO...   Arrivals have been turned away based on far less.

 

 

 

 

[globalspark]

I  come  twice a year into    Bangkok and have noticed  immigration officers been heavy handed.  The last  2 years they been asking  where I am staying and in many cases  asking for proof of my booking.

 In a lot of cases I arrive so late  with cathay pacific from Hong kong and it  seems the officers are in a go slow mode.

  In am not sure if the are under staffed  or have been given directives  to   do better checks. Seems the  African Whores  around  sukhumvit road do not have any problems  with these heavy handed    immigration officers.

[jimster]

6 minutes ago, globalspark said:

I  come  twice a year into    Bangkok and have noticed  immigration officers been heavy handed.  The last  2 years they been asking  where I am staying and in many cases  asking for proof of my booking.

 In a lot of cases I arrive so late  with cathay pacific from Hong kong and it  seems the officers are in a go slow mode.

  In am not sure if the are under staffed  or have been given directives  to   do better checks. Seems the  African Whores  around  sukhumvit road do not have any problems  with these heavy handed    immigration officers.

They do indeed. Read the recent story about Africans being deported in the Nana area. These stories come about almost every week.

 

Although there are clearly some troublemakers (whores, scam artists etc.) that seem to slip through the cracks, for the most part, Africans, particularly west Africans from countries like Nigeria are the most scrutinized by immigration.

 

I once saw an immigration officer hassle an African guy at immigration at Suvarnabhumi about a yellow fever certificate. He was pounced upon simply for being black - he was the only African person in the whole immigration area. The passenger felt harassed, but the immigration officer wouldn't budge - he took him out of the line and then before I could see what happened to him I was through to the baggage claim area.

[anon789561]

"Seems the  African Whores  around  sukhumvit road do not have any problems  with these heavy handed    immigration officers"

555 where did that last sentence come from!?, funny

[jimster]

just one question to the OP mentioned in his original post: what was a doctor doing at immigration? So your wife was 8 months pregnant - if this was the case an OB/GYN from any hospital could have written a note stating she was unable to travel and this should have been acceptable to obtain a 90 day medical extension of stay. You mentioned this was done, but what I don't understand is the presence of a doctor at immigration. Since when do doctors have any business at immigration?

[JackThompson]

20 minutes ago, hawker9000 said:

Not paranoia at all.  Furthermore, showing attitude to the IO wasn't such a hot idea either.  IOs don't make decisions on granting visas.  The embassies and consulates do that.  Different governmental depts. entirely.  IOs simply decide whether to permit or not permit entry - based on the regulations pertaining to the visa being presented.  Her trying to put it all on the IO was a terrible idea.  She's very fortunate to have been let in if he had any suspicion of her working illegally, which on a tourist visa she would've been/will be; I'm actually kind of surprised.   But she WAS allowed to enter and the IO's questioning her was entirely appropriate.

 

If there's any question of paranoia here, it certainly doesn't rest with the IO...   Arrivals have been turned away based on far less.

I didn't detect any bad "attitude" on the part of the lady in what was described - only on the part of the IO. 

 

Why was she "fortunate" to have been allowed to enter the country using a legally-obtained visa (not so easy to get from VFS in India)?   Did the IO have evidence of her breaking the law?  If not, why did he ever insinuate he would not let her in?  Why hurt her - put her through that emotional turmoil?  To What End??

 

Yes, arrivals have been turned away without any evidence of wrongdoing by rouge-IOs, before, which is a stain on Thailand's reputation. 

[LannaGuy]

5 hours ago, dbrenn said:

Generally, immigration officers in Thailand are polite and reasonable. There is a small minority who behave like pigs, and it sounds like your girlfriend was unlucky.

 

They all seem unwelcoming and surly to me. Guess it's a boring job but LOS they ain't.

[PerkinsCuthbert]

Like it or not, talk about it or not, but ethnicity plays a part with officialdom in Thailand, as it does in the West.