Offered a job, wondering about visa

[MrKFC]

I was just offered a job teaching English and music, hadn't considered it before and I'm clueless about the process and visa requirements. I don't plan to live here full time, would do 6 months back and forth, the school knows that.

 

I'm from the US without a Uni degree, a friend said he thinks I'd need to re-enter, get a work permit , then get a non-immigrant O visa.

 

Any guidance and suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks!

 

DS

 

 

[NanLaew]

No degree sounds potentially perilous.

[MrKFC]

Perilous? 

 

per·il·ous

ˈperələs/

adjective

 

1. full of danger or risk.

   "a perilous journey south"

   synonyms:

   dangerous, fraught with danger, hazardous, risky, unsafe, treacherous; More

   • exposed to imminent risk of disaster or ruin.

[anon789561]

you won't get a work permit to teach without a degree i don't think. therefore, you'll probably have to use tourist visas, which i assume you are on and risk working without the WP. schools are normally safe i think but officially you should not work and potentially could get into trouble, but i doubt that would happen. some may have other views on the matter

Edited November 16, 2017 by Happy enough

[Just Weird]

And some people wonder why Thailand's children are not so good at English.

[BritTim]

Working illegally, without a work permit, on tourist visas might be possible. Much depends on the relationship of the school with the authorities. Do not risk it if deportation from Thailand, and blacklisting, is something you could not bear to happen.

 

I believe some people have managed work permits in situations like yours by using job titles other than 'teacher'. That might be worth pursuing.

[NanLaew]

2 hours ago, MrKFC said:

Perilous? 

 

per·il·ous

ˈperələs/

adjective

 

1. full of danger or risk.

   "a perilous journey south"

   synonyms:

   dangerous, fraught with danger, hazardous, risky, unsafe, treacherous; More

   • exposed to imminent risk of disaster or ruin.

Yes, that's exactly what I meant.

 

Good work!

 

(...on finding the correct meaning of perilous, not about getting an unqualified teaching job in Thailand).

[JackThompson]

 

1 hour ago, Just Weird said:

And some people wonder why Thailand's children are not so good at English.

The key factors to learn basic English are access to a native speaker's accent and command of basic English, a teacher's genuine desire to impart the language, and the student's earnest-interest in learning the subject.  Little that is learned to obtain an "English degree," as required in Thailand (though a waiver for other majors allows a temporary exception), would come into play teaching the basics.  Those I have spoken with to who teach in Cambodia, but have taught in Thailand in the past (left when it became more difficult to qualify) say the primary difference is Cambodian students' eagerness to learn English. 

 

To be competitive in modern international fields, and given an apparent shortage, Thailand should expedite visas for native English speaking teachers.  Passing a standardized test and TEFL course should be sufficient, subject to class-performance reviews.  The goal should be to encourage English teaching and learning in every way possible.  Instead, we have the inverse - a process considered such a hassle, that most schools are reported (by other posters) to insist that English teachers teach illegally for months before they can receive the required stack of paperwork for a proper visa and work-permit.  Then, a pointless trip to a consulate in another country for the initial Non-B Visa is required.  This is counterproductive.

 

If the concern is pushing qualified Thai applicants out of English teaching jobs, require each native-English speaker's classes to be open to a Thai uni-student trainee (should be required for all foreigner-occupied occupations across-the-board), who can take over the job when they are sufficiently fluent in English to do so.

[LaoPo]

35 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

 

The key factors to learn basic English are access to a native speaker's accent and command of basic English, a teacher's genuine desire to impart the language, and the student's earnest-interest in learning the subject.  Little that is learned to obtain an "English degree," as required in Thailand (though a waiver for other majors allows a temporary exception), would come into play teaching the basics.  Those I have spoken with to who teach in Cambodia, but have taught in Thailand in the past (left when it became more difficult to qualify) say the primary difference is Cambodian students' eagerness to learn English. 

 

To be competitive in modern international fields, and given an apparent shortage, Thailand should expedite visas for native English speaking teachers.  Passing a standardized test and TEFL course should be sufficient, subject to class-performance reviews.  The goal should be to encourage English teaching and learning in every way possible.  Instead, we have the inverse - a process considered such a hassle, that most schools are reported (by other posters) to insist that English teachers teach illegally for months before they can receive the required stack of paperwork for a proper visa and work-permit.  Then, a pointless trip to a consulate in another country for the initial Non-B Visa is required.  This is counterproductive.

 

If the concern is pushing qualified Thai applicants out of English teaching jobs, require each native-English speaker's classes to be open to a Thai uni-student trainee (should be required for all foreigner-occupied occupations across-the-board), who can take over the job when they are sufficiently fluent in English to do so.

 

You bring good ideas in a kind and positive way.

The big Q is: does "BKK" want what you suggest?

 

I think not.

 

I'm visiting Thailand for more than 35 years, both for holidays and business, now mainly for holidays but with a sense and excitement for business (my wife's) 

I don't see nor experience much progress in English abilities by the majority of Thai people and a majority still speak very poor  or no English at all which is a big disadvantage versus other nations and countries in the region.

 

Example:

WHO produces rubber/latex products in enormous quantities?

Right: Thailand!

 

What do the Thai do with this fabulous product range other than the well known products, exported to other countries?

Not much.

 

Niche market:

 

2 briljant young Chinese guys, just 18 and 19 years old and Uni friends started a new business a few months ago.

One is based in China (18 years old) and the other (19) is based in Bangkok.

They initially were planning to buy and sell head cushions from pure latex onto the Chinese market.

 

They were immediately successful and sold way above their own expectations an were selling around 1 million Yuan per month (BAHT 5 MILLION) which is of course staggering; 

The demand expanded onto latex toppers and mattresses which are basically quite an expensive product but apparently in huge demand.

 

My wife talked to the 19 year old chap a few days ago...

 

They sold over 1 million Yuan in 30 hours during the Singles Day on 11-11 !!

That's an equivalent of around Baht 5 million in 30 hours, next to their "normal" sales of 1 million yuan/month.

They pack (vacuum packed) everything in BKK and ship within 36 hours to every destination in China.

 

WHY ON EARTH couldn't 2 brilliant Thai students (speaking Mandarin and English) have launched this idea and started this business, selling a native Thai product onto the Chinese market but left the opportunity to 2 smart Chinese guys ?

 

You tell me.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[MrKFC]

Thanks for the input. I'm fully qualified to teach both subjects, college degrees are not always a requirement and is not in any way illegal. My question was about the non immigrant O visa. I'll try elsewhere.

 

[ubonjoe]

2 hours ago, MrKFC said:

My question was about the non immigrant O visa. I'll try elsewhere.

What would the non-o be based upon? Marriage, retirement or volunteer work?

For teaching it would be a non-b visa.

[MrKFC]

Hi Joe - someone who knows something!  :-)  

Would be volunteer work... 

[Orton Rd]

Surely no degree means NOT qualified looking at it from an official Thai perspective?

[ubonjoe]

21 minutes ago, MrKFC said:

Would be volunteer work... 

You wrote you were offered job which implies you would be paid for it. 

You would have to be doing the volunteer work for an organization and they would have to supply the supporting documents to get the non-o visa. For volunteer work you could probably get a work permit without a degree.

[MrKFC]

OK ... it's a school here that has no budget for an extra teacher. My Thai language skills are decent, happened to meet a class out on an excursion yesterday, got to talking with the teacher, she asked if I could come around 2-3 days a week. 

 

I don't need a job, I'm a self-published musician/author promoting my goods online, have a bit of Social Security coming in, a 'digital nomad' type, but I enjoy interacting with the locals and plan to return again next winter.

 

I'm here on a tourist visa, getting to be time to renew it, so I just thought I'd see if there's another option.

 

Plus, I bought a motorscooter last time I was here, and since I am on a tourist visa, it's registered to a Thai friend. I got the driver's licenses, and also got insurance for it recently but of course he's the one named on the insurance policy. That's not a problem, but it would be better if I could register it in my name.

 

Sorry that I wasn't clear about all the details.

 

DS

[Peterw42]

7 hours ago, LaoPo said:

WHY ON EARTH couldn't 2 brilliant Thai students (speaking Mandarin and English) have launched this idea and started this business, selling a native Thai product onto the Chinese market but left the opportunity to 2 smart Chinese guys ?

Why would the Thai guy, in Thailand, benefit from speaking English? The example you give is 2 Chinese guys setting up a business and doing well, i presume speaking Thai at this end and mandarin at the other end.

Your analogy works if dealing with an English speaking country but wouldn't Mandarin be a better common trade language for dealing with China.

[GLewis]

4 hours ago, MrKFC said:

Thanks for the input. I'm fully qualified to teach both subjects, college degrees are not always a requirement and is not in any way illegal. My question was about the non immigrant O visa. I'll try elsewhere.

Pretty sure of yourself. Best you figure it out on your own...

[ubonjoe]

30 minutes ago, MrKFC said:

Plus, I bought a motorscooter last time I was here, and since I am on a tourist visa, it's registered to a Thai friend.

You could of registered it on a tourist visa. You don't need any particular visa to buy a bike or car.

[JackThompson]

28 minutes ago, MrKFC said:

OK ... it's a school here that has no budget for an extra teacher. My Thai language skills are decent, happened to meet a class out on an excursion yesterday, got to talking with the teacher, she asked if I could come around 2-3 days a week. 

...

Answer to her question, "Yes, but I will need the paperwork required to obtain a Non-O Visa based on volunteer-work plus a work-permit." 

In some volunteer situations, the person desiring the visa and work-permit pays the cost of the lawyer/agent who organizes the paperwork. 

[rkidlad]

11 hours ago, Just Weird said:

And some people wonder why Thailand's children are not so good at English.

Wow! Thanks for adding nothing to the post. Mods should really delete this sort of nonsense as it adds nothing but pettiness. 

 

As for the poster, as far as I know you need a degree in any field to teach English as a second language. You get a certain amount of waivers (three I think) and then you'd have to have a PGCE or a degree in education, etc. Working in any field in Thailand without the proper paperwork of course comes with risks. Teaching English in a school would probably come with the least risk. 

 

My advice - take the risk if you wish or get qualified. 

[MrKFC]

Thanks guys. 

 

[LaoPo]

3 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

Why would the Thai guy, in Thailand, benefit from speaking English? The example you give is 2 Chinese guys setting up a business and doing well, i presume speaking Thai at this end and mandarin at the other end.

Your analogy works if dealing with an English speaking country but wouldn't Mandarin be a better common trade language for dealing with China.

 

Benefitting speaking English, in case he doesn't speak Thai?

 

There are only a few large companies in Thailand, making latex products like cushions, toppers and mattresses, big enough to produce at competitive prices and they have English speaking staff for exports.

Not sure if they have staff, speaking Mandarin.

 

The point I was making is that there are always opportunities, not just in IT and new technologies but also in the "old" economics and why wouldn't smart Thai young guys have jumped in, in cooperation with Chinese or by themselves ?

 

It's attitude and being smart I think.

 

Edited November 17, 2017 by LaoPo

[FritsSikkink]

11 hours ago, LaoPo said:

 

WHY ON EARTH couldn't 2 brilliant Thai students (speaking Mandarin and English) have launched this idea and started this business, selling a native Thai product onto the Chinese market but left the opportunity to 2 smart Chinese guys ?

 

You tell me.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Maybe because you need the demand in the Chinese market, which is a bit easier when you are from China.

[LaoPo]

20 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

Maybe because you need the demand in the Chinese market, which is a bit easier when you are from China.

 

Creating demand is another story. How do you think people all over the world started drinking Coke when they never ever heard of it before? They did not have a demand, it was created for them.

The same with KFC, Hamburgers, and so on.

 

The same with latex products from rubber plantations from Thailand.

You just create a demand and people start buying.

[FritsSikkink]

7 hours ago, LaoPo said:

 

Creating demand is another story. How do you think people all over the world started drinking Coke when they never ever heard of it before? They did not have a demand, it was created for them.

The same with KFC, Hamburgers, and so on.

 

The same with latex products from rubber plantations from Thailand.

You just create a demand and people start buying.

Typo from me, should be:

you need know the demand in the Chinese market,

[Just Weird]

On 11/17/2017 at 12:14 AM, JackThompson said:

 

The key factors to learn basic English are access to a native speaker's accent and command of basic English, a teacher's genuine desire to impart the language, and the student's earnest-interest in learning the subject.  Little that is learned to obtain an "English degree," as required in Thailand (though a waiver for other majors allows a temporary exception), would come into play teaching the basics.  Those I have spoken with to who teach in Cambodia, but have taught in Thailand in the past (left when it became more difficult to qualify) say the primary difference is Cambodian students' eagerness to learn English. 

 

To be competitive in modern international fields, and given an apparent shortage, Thailand should expedite visas for native English speaking teachers.  Passing a standardized test and TEFL course should be sufficient, subject to class-performance reviews.  The goal should be to encourage English teaching and learning in every way possible.  Instead, we have the inverse - a process considered such a hassle, that most schools are reported (by other posters) to insist that English teachers teach illegally for months before they can receive the required stack of paperwork for a proper visa and work-permit.  Then, a pointless trip to a consulate in another country for the initial Non-B Visa is required.  This is counterproductive.

 

If the concern is pushing qualified Thai applicants out of English teaching jobs, require each native-English speaker's classes to be open to a Thai uni-student trainee (should be required for all foreigner-occupied occupations across-the-board), who can take over the job when they are sufficiently fluent in English to do so.

Spoken just like a teacher who does not have a degree.

[Just Weird]

16 hours ago, rkidlad said:

Wow! Thanks for adding nothing to the post. Mods should really delete this sort of nonsense as it adds nothing but pettiness.

You're welcome. It was a relevant opinion about the unqualified wanting a serious job that requires a qualification and trying to find a way around the requirements.

 

If my comments are that objectionable to you then report the post.  Don't assume the position of the moderator that you're not by suggesting whose posts should be deleted.

[Ruffian Dick]

A work permit or teaching license? I believe there are different requirements.

Your employer may be able to game the system.

 

There are websites for English teachers in Thailand and may be better places for straighter answers.

Edited November 17, 2017 by Ruffian Dick

[Just Weird]

21 hours ago, MrKFC said:

Thanks for the input. I'm fully qualified to teach both subjects, college degrees are not always a requirement and is not in any way illegal. My question was about the non immigrant O visa. I'll try elsewhere.

 

" I'm fully qualified to teach..."

No, you're not, not here in Thailand and that is where you want to teach, unqualified if a degree is necessary ("I'm from the US without a Uni degree..".).  By announcing that you're not qualified you invited comment yourself.

[rkidlad]

5 hours ago, Just Weird said:

You're welcome. It was a relevant opinion about the unqualified wanting a serious job that requires a qualification and trying to find a way around the requirements.

 

If my comments are that objectionable to you then report the post.  Don't assume the position of the moderator that you're not by suggesting whose posts should be deleted.

It is a serious job but the salary isn’t; hence the fact people who don’t have degrees get offered these jobs. 

 

Schools are responsible for the people they employ. Thailand, and the powers that be, are the reason the level of English is so low. 

 

If you employ someone ‘you know’ isn’t qualified, that’s on ‘you’. But it sure is easier to blame someone else. How’s that for being relevant?