Thailand to declare war on plastic bags - by charging for them

[473geo]

6 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

Your assumption that paper must be greener implies some laziness on your part, reused plastic bags are actually more environmentally friendly than paper lining your bin.

If paper is not to your liking use banana leaf - delaying the entry of plastic bags into the waste system is better than re-used paper such as advertising flyers which will eventually rot?

It is begining to look like you made a rash statement and are desperately trying to turn it around - give up

Edited December 17, 2017 by 473geo

[iroc4life]

People are far too excited to think its going to be that easy. They will likely try putting gps trackers on them and charge you a fine of 100,000 baht if you toss them out and 1 year in jail before they actually ban them :)

[Parsve]

That single action is totally wrong, but let's first look at who presented the proposal at the meeting. It was the head of Thailand's largest producer of plastic bags. He said that "if we made bigger and better plastic bags and took charge of them it will make consumption decrease. Does he this because he thinks that his company earn too much or because he thinks that the environment should be protected, or because he sees an opportunity to increase the price of their product? If we then look on the actual problem, it's littering. Internationally, Thailand is considered to be among the sixs worst countries in this area. Will the Thais to stop throwing plastic bags in nature and instead put it in the dumpster because they paid for the bag? Littering is a problem, but the only way to solve this is to inform and fine, only to put a charge on plastic bags will not solve the problem.

[fishhooks]

Sounds like the problem is still   "Not in the BAG" 

[maprao]

1 hour ago, mlmcleod said:

We need to see if this will be a tax or just another way for the grocer to get more revenue.  I always dispose of my trash in the many plastic bags that I get, so I am ambivalent.  Just about every Thai gets their food in bags from the street vendors so they will object.  Once again, there is a theory that taxing the customer is a great idea!  How about educating the children and parents and providing trash bins that will be emptied.  This is free and should have been done long ago.  Charging a customer a few baht for a bag will not make any difference in the litter on the streets and in the ocean.  While plastic bags are a huge part of the litter problem here, styrofoam cups and boxes are just as bad.  Paper waste is also a problem.
 
The solution is to teach children to have pride in their country and to have a standard of public cleanliness.  That seems to be totally lacking here.  Charging for bags will not solve the problem.

Well written post.[emoji122] [emoji122]
In Europe they tackled litter first after they educated people and fined them for littering they then reduced plastic bag use by charging.

This the way ahead but it takes at least a couple of generations for it to sink in....

Sent from my [device_name] using http://Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

[Kieran00001]

1 minute ago, 473geo said:

If paper is not to your liking use banana leaf - delaying the entry of plastic bags into the waste system is better than re-used paper such as advertising flyers which will eventually rot?

 

 

While there are plastic bags around, using them as many times as possible is the best solution for them, ignoring their many potential uses only speeds up their entry into the waste system.

And no, advertising flyers are very bad for the environment, glossy paper can be as little as 50% wood and contains VOC's, petroleum and often carcinogenic coatings, not things we want entering the water system.  To accumulate enough paper to use as bin liners you will be contributing far more co2 and other pollutants than someone who does not pick up advertising flyers in quantities to replace a bin liner.

[dfdgfdfdgs]

9 hours ago, markaoffy said:

Why the hell the staff aren’t trained to ask customers if they want a bag ?

 

A lot of them do if you're just buying one small item.  I think they probably ask Thais more than they do foreigners because they worry about the foreigner not understanding them.

[Kieran00001]

9 minutes ago, Parsve said:

That single action is totally wrong, but let's first look at who presented the proposal at the meeting. It was the head of Thailand's largest producer of plastic bags. He said that "if we made bigger and better plastic bags and took charge of them it will make consumption decrease. Does he this because he thinks that his company earn too much or because he thinks that the environment should be protected, or because he sees an opportunity to increase the price of their product? If we then look on the actual problem, it's littering. Internationally, Thailand is considered to be among the sixs worst countries in this area. Will the Thais to stop throwing plastic bags in nature and instead put it in the dumpster because they paid for the bag? Littering is a problem, but the only way to solve this is to inform and fine, only to put a charge on plastic bags will not solve the problem.

 

Of course people will be less likely to litter if they paid for a bag that they plan to reuse.

[KonKorat]

How about 100,000 baht fine and 1 year in gaol for littering!

[Parsve]

Of course people will be less likely to litter if they paid for a bag that they plan to reuse.

 

 

Not, of course, I am from a country where we have had to pay for the plastic bags for more than twenty years and still most of the people pay for them and reuse them for trash in the bin box. In 1950;s however it started a campaign saying that we should not litter in the nature and for people living today that is in their mind. You put the litter in the bin not in nature, and there is where  Thailand should start as well. To just put a cost on a bag do not change the behavior or at least very little. 

[sqwakvfr]

I was at a bakery today and the lady in front of me purchased 10 individuals pieces of rolls, cakes and croissants.  Each of the pieces was placed in a clear plastic bag and sealed with tape.  Would the surcharge apply to  bakeries as well?

[wavemanwww]

Quote, :

•  

"A conference has heard that it is time for the Thais to declare war on plastic bags that are one of the reasons there is so much trash in the kingdom".

 

Yep the trash is also called the politicians, the corrupt cops and land developers and so on . Recycle them all!

[Skeptic7]

5 hours ago, gwynt said:

I was in Singapore last week where I bought milk at a 7/11 that very question was asked, " do you require a bag" 

But then traffic stops at red lights as well ?

Korea too (Seoul & Pusan). Will give a bag, but if small item(s)...will either not offer or ask if needed.

[sambum]

1 hour ago, mlmcleod said:

We need to see if this will be a tax or just another way for the grocer to get more revenue.  I always dispose of my trash in the many plastic bags that I get, so I am ambivalent.  Just about every Thai gets their food in bags from the street vendors so they will object.  Once again, there is a theory that taxing the customer is a great idea!  How about educating the children and parents and providing trash bins that will be emptied.  This is free and should have been done long ago.  Charging a customer a few baht for a bag will not make any difference in the litter on the streets and in the ocean.  While plastic bags are a huge part of the litter problem here, styrofoam cups and boxes are just as bad.  Paper waste is also a problem.

 

The solution is to teach children to have pride in their country and to have a standard of public cleanliness.  That seems to be totally lacking here.  Charging for bags will not solve the problem.

Agree with you to a certain extent, but not "providing trash bins that will be emptied.  This is free and should have been done long ago"

 

This is part of the problem. On  another thread it was explained that in one area the Council took away the trash bins as people were not paying the few baht tax per month it was costing for the service! Needless to say, that merely increased the trash that was dumped at the side of the street in plastic bags, so charging for them will work to a certain extent. One sensible suggestion was to include the "garbage collection and disposal tax" in the electricity bills, but whether that will be considered by the authorities is a different question! This is the same area that has an incinerator that has not worked for years because of money "disappearing" that was provided for its repair. So people are disinclined to pay "garbage tax" when it is not even being disposed of properly! 

 

Regarding charging for bags, in the UK, Tesco and similar supermarkets began charging 5p for plastic bags a few years ago, but also provided the option of purchasing more expensive reusable bags. (Which Macro do here anyway) Most of the "perishable" items are in flimsy plastic bags anyway - why not make those bags biodegradable? I know that when we shop at Macro, we take their "big red bag" with us, but obviously it would not be "socially acceptable" to use that when shopping at Tesco, where the use of plastic bags is phenomenal! (But we do take a canvas bag for the non perishables and tins) 

 

"The solution is to teach children to have pride in their country and to have a standard of public cleanliness."  I agree wholeheartedly, but until ample receptacles are provided for the rubbish/garbage, the problem will continue.

 

 

[Skeptic7]

5 hours ago, djayz said:

I hear what you're saying, but a 2-3 Baht per bag "fine" wouldn't deter too many people from using them and make the whole exercise futile. 

Agreed...but the vast majority of customers Kingdom-wide are Thai and B10-15 per is extreme. B5 would do the trick for most locals...and for me too. 

[Nong Khai Man]

Just Bought 2 Packs of Cigarettes ( 40 ) At 7-11......& Yeah Got a Plastic Bag.....

 

[wump]

9 hours ago, davehowden said:

And get rid of those stupid small satang coins at the same time.

Good luck with that. Even in rich countries like Germany the majority of people are opposed to getting rid of these stupid 1 cent coins which are worth even less than 50 satang. Morons.

Edited December 17, 2017 by wump

[Crossy]

Once, not so very long ago, plastics were the wonder material, now we wonder why...

 

Those of a certain age will remember this 1962 production as a BBC2 Trade Test Transmission.

 

 

[wakeupplease]

Wonderful Idea how did they think of such a great way of cutting plastic usage, is it a tax or just another way of the retailer making more money? Thailand again being first to use their dynamic ways to help the planet.

 

Hey sorry wait a minute other countries are doing this aren't they and have been for years so there is a model Thailand could follow like the UK version Oh dam then the face thing comes into it. But you watch some one will set it up so they can make money as we cannot have the plastic bag people loose money can we.

[Skeptic7]

AS a kid in the USA, still remember the TV commercial of the Native American shedding a tear at the sight of all trash and litter. Made a HUGE impact in The States. Probably much more than an ad needed here, but  knowledge and awareness are essential in youngsters.

[wavemanwww]

Aldi in Australia did it for me. No plastic bags. I now feel I am saving sea life and reducing this crap plastic bags use and  once only usage, Get with it or kill the world and your next generation!

Edited December 17, 2017 by wavemanwww

[473geo]

28 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

While there are plastic bags around, using them as many times as possible is the best solution for them, ignoring their many potential uses only speeds up their entry into the waste system.

And no, advertising flyers are very bad for the environment, glossy paper can be as little as 50% wood and contains VOC's, petroleum and often carcinogenic coatings, not things we want entering the water system.  To accumulate enough paper to use as bin liners you will be contributing far more co2 and other pollutants than someone who does not pick up advertising flyers in quantities to replace a bin liner.

Advertising flyers are delivered to my mail box .......but at this moment I feel it is prudent to accept your explanation that throwing a re-used plastic bag into the waste system is more beneficial than any alternative I have suggested.

 

So back to reality

 

Today I am cooking up Tom yum gai in the UK

 

Bought from a UK Supermarket

 

Chicken - in heavy duty plastic container with plastic wrapping

Tomato - in heavy duty plastic container with plastic wrapping

Mushrooms - in heavy duty plastic container with plastic wrapping

 

Brought back from Thailand

Lemon grass in light thin plastic bag

Ginger 1 kg in light thin plastic bag

Shallots 1 kg in light thin plastic bag

 

Well you get the idea - maybe this is not about who does it best, but rather who controls/hides it better

[metisdead]

An offensive troll post has been removed. 

 

Off topic posts and replies have been removed. 

[Basil B]

10 hours ago, djayz said:

because some n*bj*b thought that charging for plastic bags would "not be good for tourism because tourists wouldn't want to pay for the bags". ?

Seen plenty of tourist paying for some old bags in Thailand... 

[Skeptic7]

Just now, Basil B said:

Seen plenty of tourist paying for some old bags in Thailand... 

Yes quite common these days! 

[Basil B]

8 minutes ago, wakeupplease said:

Wonderful Idea how did they think of such a great way of cutting plastic usage, is it a tax or just another way of the retailer making more money? Thailand again being first to use their dynamic ways to help the planet.

 

Hey sorry wait a minute other countries are doing this aren't they and have been for years so there is a model Thailand could follow like the UK version Oh dam then the face thing comes into it. But you watch some one will set it up so they can make money as we cannot have the plastic bag people loose money can we.

I do not think the UK thing will work, the 5p is supposed to go to charity...

 

Better taxing the bags at source.

[Kieran00001]

3 minutes ago, 473geo said:

Advertising flyers are delivered to my mail box .......but at this moment I feel it is prudent to accept your explanation that throwing a re-used plastic bag into the waste system is more beneficial than any alternative I have suggested.

 

So back to reality

 

Today I am cooking up Tom yum gai in the UK

 

Bought from a UK Supermarket

 

Chicken - in heavy duty plastic container with plastic wrapping

Tomato - in heavy duty plastic container with plastic wrapping

Mushrooms - in heavy duty plastic container with plastic wrapping

 

Brought back from Thailand

Lemon grass in light thin plastic bag

Ginger 1 kg in light thin plastic bag

Shallots 1 kg in light thin plastic bag

 

Well you get the idea - maybe this is not about who does it best, but rather who controls/hides it better

 

What you dont don't give is an alternative for the plastic bag, they do actually exist, either people use them before they are thrown or they are just thrown, it is pretty obvious that using them is better but hey ho, clearly you think you are better because you don't help reuse any of them.

 

It may sound like the simple solution is to use less plastic by making thinner bags, but actually it would be better here if they were thicker as then they would have more value and they would be recycled. 

[473geo]

7 minutes ago, Skeptic7 said:

Yes quite common these days! 

Apparently you can feel good about yourself if you re-use them later.

[IvanLaw]

11 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

It is about bloody time that this idea gets discussed and (hopefully!) implemented in Thailand; the sheer number of plastic bags in this country is both shocking and disgusting.

 

I am a figure of awe when I go to my local market, buy my stuff, then whip a used plastic bag out of my pocket for my purchase.

 

"GASP!" "Look at that!" "Wah!" "I didn't know you could do that!" "Double Wah!"

 

Make it five baht a bag, and watch the use of plastic bags plummet. Please.

 

Worked in England , Can but try

 

[trainman34014]

''The Government needs to act with firm leadership in the matter ''   Well; that would be a first !