The Urgency of Addressing Iran’s Nuclear Threat

[rooster59]

As government shutdown begins, White House slams Senate Democrats

 

U.S. President Donald Trump prepares to address the annual March for Life rally, taking place on the National Mall, from the White House Rose Garden in Washington, U.S., January 19, 2018. REUTERS/Carlos Barria

 

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - As U.S. government funding ran out at midnight, the White House issued a statement blaming Senate Democrats for blocking a bill to avert a shutdown and said it would not negotiate on immigration, a key demand of Democrats.

 

"We will not negotiate the status of unlawful immigrants while Democrats hold our lawful citizens hostage over their reckless demands," the statement said after the funding legislation failed to get the 60 votes needed to overcome a procedural hurdle.

 

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2018-01-20

[khwaibah]

Morons. One and all.

[Silurian]

Just another failure in a long list of failures for Donny John. He has Republican control of the House and of the Senate and can't even manage to keep the government running for a year. Yeah, there is the "dealmaker" himself. All Donny John wanted to do is to to Mar-a-lago and celebrate his one year anniversary. He didn't care about the shutdown. Go. Donny John. Go and celebrate your failure!

 

[darksidedog]

It was OK for the Republicans to do the same thing in 2013 with the Obama marquee Health law, at which time Donald Trump told Fox & Friends that the ultimate blame for a shutdown lies at the top. "I really think the pressure is on the president," he said.

Things seem to have come full circle.

[buick]

31 minutes ago, Silurian said:

He has Republican control of the House and of the Senate

the republicans don't control the senate when the vote requires 60 yes votes (a requirement for certain spending bills).  it is amazing how many media outlets i've seen reporting this same statement about 'controlling'.

[Slip]

How many republicans voted "no" again? Was it 4 or 5?  

And of course a number of dems voted "yes".

[buick]

i believe it was 4 reps that said no and 5 dems that said yes.  if i recall correctly, the 5 the dems that voted yes, are up for re-election this year in districts which trump won during his election.  kind of interesting....

Edited January 20, 2018 by buick

[Silurian]

10 minutes ago, buick said:

the republicans don't control the senate when the vote requires 60 yes votes (a requirement for certain spending bills).  it is amazing how many media outlets i've seen reporting this same statement about 'controlling'.

 

Republicans hold a majority in the US Senate therefore they are in "control" of the Senate. Certainly it takes 60 votes for some bills but it doesn't change the fact that Republicans are in the majority and thus "in control".

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/114th_United_States_Congress

 

Quote

The 2014 elections gave the Republicans control of the Senate (and control of both houses of Congress) for the first time since the 109th Congress. 

 

[buick]

4 minutes ago, Silurian said:

Republicans hold a majority in the US Senate therefore they are in "control" of the Senate. Certainly it takes 60 votes for some bills but it doesn't change the fact that Republicans are in the majority and thus "in control".

that applies to 99% of the votes that are made so that is how the term is often used and it is correct, they control the senate in nearly all cases.  but in this case they don't as they can't win a vote of 60 with only 51.

 

control means they can win any vote as long as they all vote together.

 

are you an american ?

[Thakkar]

[attrayant]

 

This is the first ever government shutdown while one party has majority control.

 

22 minutes ago, buick said:

the republicans don't control the senate when the vote requires 60 yes votes (a requirement for certain spending bills).  it is amazing how many media outlets i've seen reporting this same statement about 'controlling'.

 

 

The 60 vote requirement is to prevent a majority from bullying the minority.  That means the majority party has to actually work with the opposition and make compromises.

[buick]

6 minutes ago, attrayant said:

The 60 vote requirement is to prevent a majority from bullying the minority.  That means the majority party has to actually work with the opposition and make compromises.

that used to be the case in nearly all votes in the senate, at one time it was 2/3rds and then that was reduced to 60.  and then it was reduced to 50 for most votes.  there were so many filibusters and such that it was a total disgrace to all members of the senate.  so once they got it down to 50, one party or the other might finally be able to pass something.  said another way, it was impossible for them to work together !!!

 

i'm not an expert but i know the basics.  google it if you want more info.

 

i assume you are not american ?

[attrayant]

I'm referring to the 60% cloture vote.  This is a rule the Senate imposed on itself to force compromise, and make legislation more likely to be well received by constituents.

 

Quote

i assume you are not american ?

 

I see you made that assumption about another poster too.  What does that have to do with anything?

Edited January 20, 2018 by attrayant

[RichardColeman]

Like most countries politicians elected by the public - working to make elected chaos to prove a point. All parties seem to vote now against things they think a good idea, just on principle - or come up with some meaningless argument. If they actually worked together for us, the world would be a better place. 

[buick]

6 minutes ago, attrayant said:

I see you made that assumption about another poster too.  What does that have to do with anything?

lack of knowledge on the american system.

 

 

[attrayant]

2 minutes ago, buick said:

lack of knowledge on the american system.

 

Tell us, then.  What was the reason for the 60% cloture rule?

 

And by the way, do you really think an in-depth understanding of the mechanics of the legislative branch of government is a useful indicator of somebody's nationality?  If so, I'd like you to meet 62,985,134 Trump voters.

Edited January 20, 2018 by attrayant

[buick]

20 minutes ago, attrayant said:

Tell us, then.  What was the reason for the 60% cloture rule?

 

And by the way, do you really think an in-depth understanding of the mechanics of the legislative branch of government is a useful indicator of somebody's nationality?  If so, I'd like you to meet 62,985,134 Trump voters.

as i noted before, i'm not an expert.  you can google it, it is complicated.  most of the international coverage of US politics focuses on the president and not so much the two houses of congress (unless there is a shutdown type thing like this).  so foreigners might not have much exposure to it.  the senate hasn't been able to collect 60 votes on many matters in recent times, so they use methods that require only 51 to pass what they can.  as a result, recent polls of the american public give the two houses of congress an approval rating of 10%. 

 

edit:  you'll note that approval rating is below trump's rating.  that says alot !!!

Edited January 20, 2018 by buick

[Basil B]

3 hours ago, buick said:

the republicans don't control the senate when the vote requires 60 yes votes (a requirement for certain spending bills).  it is amazing how many media outlets i've seen reporting this same statement about 'controlling'.

The Democrat's said it was not just them who voted against...

 

The Republican's should do a bit of navel gazing before blaming it all on the the Democrats.

[RPCVguy]

3 hours ago, buick said:

the republicans don't control the senate when the vote requires 60 yes votes (a requirement for certain spending bills).  it is amazing how many media outlets i've seen reporting this same statement about 'controlling'.

The ability of the Democrats to waive the 60 vote threshold requires unanimous consent. This won't happen. Mitch McConnell won't let that happen because the behavior indicates the Republicans lack the 50 votes out of their 51 caucus members. Go to the 5 minute mark in this segment - worth viewing Lawrence O'Donnell at this time because he had been a senate staffer and knows the rules well.

Ex-Senate aide: Shutdown 'manufactured' by Republicans

The above said, on the PROCEDURAL VOTE the GOP did get 50 votes
How senators voted on the government shutdown
 

 

Edited January 20, 2018 by RPCVguy
news update

[Get Real]

Hurray! It´s all going down as expected!

[jerojero]

Wonder if Trump and GOP are tired of winning yet. So much winning, it's gotta hurt.

[attrayant]

Trump himself predicted this would happen, five years ago:

 

[USPatriot]

Laws begin as ideas. First, a representative sponsors a bill. The bill is then assigned to a committee for study. If released by the committee, the bill is put on a calendar to be voted on, debated or amended. If the bill passes by simple majority (218 of 435), the bill moves to the Senate. In the Senate, the bill is assigned to another committee and, if released, debated and voted on. Again, a simple majority (51 of 100) passes the bill. Finally, a conference committee made of House and Senate members works out any differences between the House and Senate versions of the bill. The resulting bill returns to the House and Senate for final approval. The Government Printing Office prints the revised bill in a process called enrolling. The President has 10 days to sign or veto the enrolled bill.

 

There are republicans, rinos and democrats.

 

A lot of new york, California and Illinois Republicans are rinos including mccain and flake from arizona

[WM1]

Trump Shutdown. ..Schumer Shutdown...as she has decided to weigh in I must say this is all starting to look like a "My Big Fat Sarah Huckabee Sanders Shutdown".

[FritsSikkink]

11 hours ago, buick said:

lack of knowledge on the american system.

 

 

The 2 parties had a deal, the president didn't want to sign. You don't need to be that smart to understand that it is the sole responsibility of the president that this has happened.

[janclaes47]

25 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

The 2 parties had a deal, the president didn't want to sign. You don't need to be that smart to understand that it is the sole responsibility of the president that this has happened.

Wasn't there a shutdown under Obama as well?

[janclaes47]

6 hours ago, attrayant said:

Trump himself predicted this would happen, five years ago:

 

Good troll post, because you know very well who that comment was directed at.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_federal_government_shutdown_of_2013

 

Renewed efforts in 2013

In January 2013, Republican Sen. John Cornyn of Texas wrote that "it may be necessary to partially shut down the government in order to secure the long-term fiscal well being of our country, rather than plod along the path of Greece, Italy and Spain."^[43]The New York Times later reported that, soon after Obama began his second term that month, a coalition of conservative activists led by former Reagan administration Attorney General Ed Meese (who is also an emeritus fellow of the conservative think tank The Heritage Foundation),^[44] began developing plans to defund the Affordable Care Act.^[45] They strategized that they would be able to block implementation of the Affordable Care Act if they could persuade congressional Republicans to threaten cutting off financing for the entire federal government.^[45] Meese's coalition produced a "blueprint to defunding Obamacare". The plan, which said "Conservatives should not approve a CR [continuing resolution] unless it defunds Obamacare,"^[46] was signed by leaders of more than three dozen conservative groups.^[45]

Edited January 20, 2018 by janclaes47

[Sir Swagman]

15 hours ago, buick said:

lack of knowledge on the american system.

 

 

You mean to the degree tRump displays such a lack?

 

[wayned]

5 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

The 2 parties had a deal, the president didn't want to sign. You don't need to be that smart to understand that it is the sole responsibility of the president that this has happened.

Until Trump stops listening to his 32 year old senior political advisor, Steven Miller, nothing will change.  He's a white supremacist and has been all of his life.  If he gets fired he could go get a swastika tattooed on his neck and go buy a white sheet and he would immediately get a job with the white supremacist movement or become and advisor to David Duke.  Unfortunately General Kelly's hard line immigration policies doesn't help much either. IMHO, I would have expected more from the General after serving in the Corps for so long, but the military is one place where those in command were allowed to harbor and practice their feelings about inequality.  I really thought that he would tell Trump to shove it after he politicized the death of his son!

[stevenl]

6 hours ago, janclaes47 said:

Wasn't there a shutdown under Obama as well?

Was there a deal between the 2 parties then as well?

 

Why make comparisons between non comparable events? If you want to compare, compare Trump's tweets at that shutdown with the pre4sent shutdown. First it was the man at the top who is responsible, now it is the Democrats, even though there is a deal between the 2 parties on the table.

 

This has gone beyond words now, it is all about rhetoric and driving through what he wants, not about the country. And an additional problem is that what he wants varies day by day.