Brexit has created chaos in Britain – nobody voted for this

[The Renegade]

1 minute ago, sandyf said:

Once again a distorted response. TM had decided to leave the SM and CU before talks had started.

There is no distorted response.

 

There was a simple question on the Referendum paper.

 

There was no soft or hard Brexit, no should we leave the CU and SM on the ballot paper.

 

These are all the distortions that remainers have come up with since the Referendum.

 

Leave means leave, warts and all.

 

£9 million remain propaganda leaflet.

 

Quote

The EU is by far the UK’s biggest trading partner. EU countries buy 44% of everything we sell abroad, from cars to insurance. Remaining inside the EU guarantees our full access to its Single Market. By contrast, leaving creates uncertainty and risk.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/515068/why-the-government-believes-that-voting-to-remain-in-the-european-union-is-the-best-decision-for-the-uk.pdf

 

Ohhhhh Betty.  

 

What could that mean ? Does that mean if we vote to leave we will also leave the Single Market ? Or leave bits of the SM ?

 

What it states in black and white is that the only way to retain full SM access is to vote remain.

 

Yet strangely, people still voted to leave.

[candide]

5 minutes ago, nauseus said:

They just turn up to knock back any UK proposals and call them "negotiations".

 

"Keeping up appearances" in name only! But goodwill? Not a lot!

 

Fond Regards

 

Hyacinth Bucket

Anyway, in a negotiation, showing or not goodwill is not as important as the respective negotiating power of the two entities involved.

[transam]

3 minutes ago, candide said:

Anyway, in a negotiation, showing or not goodwill is not as important as the respective negotiating power of the two entities involved.

It could be 26 against one....

[soalbundy]

3 minutes ago, transam said:

Muddle in the past...Hmmm...So tell me how the muddled country became a huge financial country for it's size...Why is the UK pumping more money than countries of a similar size into the EU...?

and who owns all this money? not the common man obviously and it is slowly draining away, not just from the UK, the West is slowly, very slowly, losing influence and grip or rather those that own real money are diverging to Asia and elsewhere, globalisation wasn't a working mans aspiration, he would rather give a few pounds to Oxfam at Christmas. Finance, or rather those that really control finance (not the finance ministers) wanted and got globalisation, it increased their profit no end and the higher Asia goes with all its consumer goods starved populations the richer they will become, a happy bunch of Americans, British, German, French, Chinese, Indians etc. all without regard for their country of origin, they know each other, a family without borders. They won't let the West be impoverished, they need customers there as well but 'we' won't have any weight to throw around, it's unstoppable. Arguing about brexit is meaningless. 

[The Renegade]

14 minutes ago, nauseus said:

No certification at all, that might be Grouse's passport! ?

Sh!t, you caught me ?

[candide]

10 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Try checking the EU's own membership rules.

The relation is not symmetrical. A country belonging to the EU has to be in the SM and CU. However, not being part of the EU does not prevent participating in the SM and CU. Norway is in the SM and also quasi-integrated in the CU.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 minute ago, candide said:

The relation is not symmetrical. A country belonging to the EU has to be in the SM and CU. However, not being part of the EU does not prevent participating in the SM and CU. Norway is in the SM and also quasi-integrated in the CU.

Correct.

 

And Norway pays for its SM and CU access privileges, is subject to EU laws and regulations and has no say at all in what laws and regulations the EU enacts.

 

[The Renegade]

1 minute ago, soalbundy said:

and who owns all this money? not the common man obviously and it is slowly draining away,

Well, put world globalisation to the side for a moment and focus on the EU.

 

The EU drains money from richer EU Countries to feed to poorer EU Countries.

 

Whilst this might be a noble cause, all it does is reduce the standards of the richer Countries and raises the standards of the poorer Countries until an equilibrium is reached.

 

3 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

not the common man obviously

This is money that should be going to the '' Common man '' or '' Poorer Man '' within those richer Countries.

[The Renegade]

5 minutes ago, candide said:

The relation is not symmetrical. A country belonging to the EU has to be in the SM and CU. However, not being part of the EU does not prevent participating in the SM and CU. Norway is in the SM and also quasi-integrated in the CU.

And as such is subject to :

 

The 4 EU pillars

 

Under the thumb of Brussels and the ECJ.

 

The UK, by agreeing to any of that, no matter how you try and spin it, is not leaving the EU.

 

 

[soalbundy]

10 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

Well, put world globalisation to the side for a moment and focus on the EU.

 

The EU drains money from richer EU Countries to feed to poorer EU Countries.

 

Whilst this might be a noble cause, all it does is reduce the standards of the richer Countries and raises the standards of the poorer Countries until an equilibrium is reached.

 

This is money that should be going to the '' Common man '' or '' Poorer Man '' within those richer Countries.

yes I agree but 'we' don't get to decide anywhere. The EU idea was that you can't have peace and stability in Europe with poverty on your borders so spread it out a bit.

[Chomper Higgot]

13 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

And as such is subject to :

 

The 4 EU pillars

 

Under the thumb of Brussels and the ECJ.

 

The UK, by agreeing to any of that, no matter how you try and spin it, is not leaving the EU.

 

 

Put a bookmark on that, we’ll come back to it.

[sandyf]

32 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

There is no distorted response.

 

There was a simple question on the Referendum paper.

 

There was no soft or hard Brexit, no should we leave the CU and SM on the ballot paper.

 

These are all the distortions that remainers have come up with since the Referendum.

 

Leave means leave, warts and all.

 

£9 million remain propaganda leaflet.

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/515068/why-the-government-believes-that-voting-to-remain-in-the-european-union-is-the-best-decision-for-the-uk.pdf

 

Ohhhhh Betty.  

 

What could that mean ? Does that mean if we vote to leave we will also leave the Single Market ? Or leave bits of the SM ?

 

What it states in black and white is that the only way to retain full SM access is to vote remain.

 

Yet strangely, people still voted to leave.

Since when did opinion documents become legislation.

[The Renegade]

3 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

yes I agree but 'we' don't get to decide anywhere. The EU idea was that you can't have peace and stability in Europe with poverty on your borders so spread it out a bit.

How bizarre

 

I was under the impression that all those stabbings and shootings in London, was a result of poverty

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

How bizarre

 

I was under the impression that all those stabbings and shootings in London, was a result of poverty

They’ve got more to do with Theresa May removing over 20,000 police officers. (Despite having been warned of the consequences of doing so).

[The Renegade]

8 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Since when did opinion documents become legislation.

Remind me where and when I said that ?

 

This is what I posted, taken directly from the UK Governments £9 Million Referendum leaflet

 

Quote

The EU is by far the UK’s biggest trading partner. EU countries buy 44% of everything we sell abroad, from cars to insurance. Remaining inside the EU guarantees our full access to its Single Market. By contrast, leaving creates uncertainty and risk.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/515068/why-the-government-believes-that-voting-to-remain-in-the-european-union-is-the-best-decision-for-the-uk.pdf

 

Why are you lying ?

 

Or are you just another remainer that has problems reading and understanding plain English ? 

Edited June 17, 2018 by The Renegade

[transam]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

They’ve got more to do with Theresa May removing over 20,000 police officers. (Despite having been warned of the consequences of doing so).

Rubbish, the UK could have a zillion cops out there but societies human waste of space   will always be there..

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, soalbundy said:

Schadenfreude.

Thank you soulbundy. Always good to have a personal spell checker ?

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, transam said:

Rubbish, the UK could have a zillion cops out there but societies human waste of space   will always be there..

Your opinion is noted.

So is that of this guy, though Theresa May chose to ignore him.

 

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

You clearly mean the press that are only concerned about the wealthy....

Deary me!

[soalbundy]

7 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

How bizarre

 

I was under the impression that all those stabbings and shootings in London, was a result of poverty

possibly, there seems to be more of it in the UK than elsewhere in the EU but the UK governments have never really cared much about their people. I haven't been back to Germany for 13 years so I can't say what its like now, certainly not the level of violence shown in the UK according to German newspapers that I read. I think it is more to do with lack of prospects amongst the young and drugs of course.

[soalbundy]

5 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Thank you soulbundy. Always good to have a personal spell checker ?

mein Vergnuegen.

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

Ha ha Grouse, your German language skills are as bad as your French, stick to English old bean

 

schadenfreude ??

I recommend that you read the rules of this forum. Spelling police are not wanted.

[sandyf]

21 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Do they do anything worth replicating?

Obviously not to many or they would give the matter more serious consideration.

There are agencies that cannot be replicated and post brexit business will have to deal with agencies in the EU. Of course when that comes into effect and prices rise it will all be blamed on the EU.

[The Renegade]

10 minutes ago, transam said:

Rubbish, the UK could have a zillion cops out there but societies human waste of space   will always be there..

Quote

The report said the availability of smartphones has “created an almost unlimited opportunity for rivals to antagonise each other, and for those taunts to be viewed by a much larger audience for a much longer time period”, sparking cycles of tit-for-tat violence.

 

Social media is also used for drug dealing and recruiting runners by depicting lavish lifestyles perceived as unattainable through legal means.

 

The growing phenomenon of “county lines” drug gangs, which supply from cities into rural areas, was also cited in the report as a driver of violence because of bloody turf wars between rivals.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/violent-knife-crime-rise-stabbing-murders-reasons-increase-london-why-a8326171.html

 

Falling police numbers will play a small part, but only a small part.

 

There is a much bigger issue that NO AMOUNT of police are going to eradicate.

[vogie]

3 minutes ago, Grouse said:

I recommend that you read the rules of this forum. Spelling police are not wanted.

I think you should read the forum rules as well, only english is allowed except for the thai language forum.

[Ron19]

A post against forum rules has been removed.

 

7) You will respect fellow members and post in a civil manner. No personal attacks, hateful or insulting towards other members, (flaming) Stalking of members on either the forum or via PM will not be allowed.

 

 

[aright]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

 

'A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush'.

 

Try getting the proverb right.

"A bird in the hand is worth two in Kate Bush"

?

[sandyf]

6 hours ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

When are "remainers" going to face up to the fact that the EU is in terminal decline, as more and more voters in individual countries turn their backs on the ‘Federal  State of Europe’ dream, because they can see that free movement and fiscal union are insuperable obstacles.. 

Yet the reality is that there are more membership applications than applications to leave.

 

This "terminal decline" theory has been around for as long and has as much validity as the so called project fear.

[soalbundy]

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

OK so you don't want to refer to a 'Brexit Dividend'.

 

Let's use the exact words you used above and apply the same argument:

 

"The UK's contribution to the EU budget currently stands at a Net £8 Billion a year.

That will stop being passed to Brussels when the UK leaves the EU."

 

On what basis can yo claim that the UK will stop sending £8Billion a year to the EU on leaving the EU?

 

Neither the government nor Brexit supporters know what the final deal is going to be.

 

The government can't allocate money that the government does not have and has no means of being sure it will have.

 

It's another example of one of those British proverbs Brexiteers seem eager to forget.

 

'Don't count your chickens before they hatch'.

 

 

 

 

 

 

May has said that in order to give the NHS more money taxation must rise, so now we know, not from the nonexisting savings.

[Grouse]

11 minutes ago, vogie said:

I think you should read the forum rules as well, only english is allowed except for the thai language forum.

There is no direct translation of schadenfreude. Trying to avoid the usage of words borrowed from other languages is a fool's errand. Was it Trump or George W that said the French don't understand the word entrepreneur?