Brexit has created chaos in Britain – nobody voted for this

[Kieran00001]

2 hours ago, The Renegade said:

 

 

What is the EU wide unemployment rate for people under 30 ?

 

Somewhere in the region of 15%.

 

 

 

The UK's youth unemployment is 10%, but in Germany it is 6% and in Holland 7%, the EU average includes the likes of Greece's 42% youth unemployment and does nothing to explain why British youths don't take advantage of the job opportunities in Germany or Holland.

[Kieran00001]

49 minutes ago, HAKAPALITA said:

Banish the Myth.?.To most off us there too many waffling social arti farties, digital nomads and assorted useless academics.What we lack is Producers skilled in Technology, not Ideology.


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

If there actually were too many social studies graduates they would not have the highest rate of employment, and if we really did need more producers skilled in technology we would not see a lower rate of employment of engineering graduates. 

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

The UK's youth unemployment is 10%, but in Germany it is 6% and in Holland 7%, the EU average includes the likes of Greece's 42% youth unemployment and does nothing to explain why British youths don't take advantage of the job opportunities in Germany or Holland.

Maybe the wage differential is insignificant or not attractive enough, unlike that for SE Europeans movIng N and W?

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

The UK's youth unemployment is 10%, but in Germany it is 6% and in Holland 7%, the EU average includes the likes of Greece's 42% youth unemployment and does nothing to explain why British youths don't take advantage of the job opportunities in Germany or Holland.

I posted full analyses above

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

The UK's youth unemployment is 10%, but in Germany it is 6% and in Holland 7%, the EU average includes the likes of Greece's 42% youth unemployment and does nothing to explain why British youths don't take advantage of the job opportunities in Germany or Holland.

I think we know though don't we ?

[Grouse]

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/articles/2018-06-21/sweden-nationalists-dream-of-swexit-that-almost-no-one-wants

 

This is worth a read

 

Tomorrow I will give you some info about Sweden. They have huge amounts of space but Muslims just don't fit.

[Grouse]

Now this

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-44582831

 

?

[aright]

55 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Now this

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-44582831

 

?

Now this.

 

Minister warns Airbus it will lose huge defence contracts if it pulls out of UK over Brexit 

Ministers have warned the aircraft manufacturer Airbus that it risks losing vital defence contracts if it goes ahead with its threat to pull out of Britain in the event of a “no deal” Brexit.

Ben Wallace, the security minister, reminded the firm that without the support of Britain it would not have been able to cover its budget overruns on the A400m transporter aircraft, of which the RAF has 14.

Last year the MoD signed a £410m maintenance contract with Airbus Defence and Space for its A400m fleet, and the year before it agreed a £500m deal for 30 Airbus helicopters.

“Airbus have used these heavy handed tactics before. They threatened to leave the UK if we didn’t join the Euro...during the Referendum they tried to interfere in the democratic process by writing letters to their employees instructing them how to vote.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/06/22/airbus-accused-reigniting-project-fear-issuing-brexit-threat/

The UK has the largest commercial aircraft fleet in Europe which need to be replaced on a regular basis. Airbus need to think this through. Boeing make good aircraft as well.

 

Edited June 22, 2018 by aright

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, aright said:

Now this.

 

Minister warns Airbus it will lose huge defence contracts if it pulls out of UK over Brexit 

Ministers have warned the aircraft manufacturer Airbus that it risks losing vital defence contracts if it goes ahead with its threat to pull out of Britain in the event of a “no deal” Brexit.

Ben Wallace, the security minister, reminded the firm that without the support of Britain it would not have been able to cover its budget overruns on the A400m transporter aircraft, of which the RAF has 14.

Last year the MoD signed a £410m maintenance contract with Airbus Defence and Space for its A400m fleet, and the year before it agreed a £500m deal for 30 Airbus helicopters.

“Airbus have used these heavy handed tactics before. They threatened to leave the UK if we didn’t join the Euro...during the Referendum they tried to interfere in the democratic process by writing letters to their employees instructing them how to vote.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/06/22/airbus-accused-reigniting-project-fear-issuing-brexit-threat/

The UK has the largest commercial aircraft fleet in Europe which need to be replaced on a regular basis. Airbus need to think this through. Boeing make good aircraft as well.

 

Pity we don't have the intestinal fortitude to stand up to Trump and stop buying the over priced, under performing F35.

 

By the way, commercially, Airbus would be better off manufacturing wings in China. The growth is in the Far East 

 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/262971/aircraft-fleets-by-region-worldwide/

 

My son is an Airbus driver in East Asia and the demand for aircraft and experienced captains is growing exponentially 

Edited June 22, 2018 by Grouse

[tebee]

More companies join Airbus lead on hard Brexit warning

 

https://www.ft.com/content/ee84acd0-7631-11e8-a8c4-408cfba4327c

[vogie]

15 minutes ago, tebee said:

More companies join Airbus lead on hard Brexit warning

 

https://www.ft.com/content/ee84acd0-7631-11e8-a8c4-408cfba4327c

 

[tebee]

[RuamRudy]

14 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

But that O'Brien analogy (like most of his smug analogies) does not work. One would be paying the 20 quid a week, and not be allowed to sell at any other boot sales, following restrictive rules, thus constraining the ability to increase profits beyond 200 quid. And to make it worse you'd have to let everyone share your house.

He's not as clever as he is in his imagination.

Is it your blinkers that are preventing you from seeing, and thus understanding his point, or is it simply too complicated for some?

 

Rees Mogg talks about the savings from our EU contributions as being the Brexit financial dividend. This seems to be fooling many into thinking that we will be net positive following Brexit.

 

As has been demonstrated amply, Rees Mogg is not a decent, honest, trustworthy man, and thus has neglected to point out that the net gains from the EU exceed the contributions, and that financially, we will be poorer than now.

 

While you may have valid points in your rant, they are 100% unrelated to the very accurate, pertinent and succinct point that O'Brien was making. His analogy was correct - your interpretation was wrong.

[The Renegade]

1 hour ago, RuamRudy said:

Rees Mogg talks about the savings from our EU contributions as being the Brexit financial dividend. This seems to be fooling many into thinking that we will be net positive following Brexit.

You might have a point when you only consider EU Budget contributions.

 

Nobody, but nobody is talking about all the other £ Billions that are also sent to the EU to fund other EU agencies.

 

Medicine

Space

Education

Various Development funds

Aid for non-EU Countries.

Frontex

Europol

 

The list is endless.

[The Renegade]

Quote

Almost three quarters of British adults support Theresa May’s policy to cut immigration, according to a Deltapoll survey published by Channel 4 News Friday.

Quote

Voters from across the political spectrum expressed similar views, with 86 percent of Conservative voters and two thirds of Labour voters supporting reducing EU immigration.

https://www.politico.eu/article/poll-three-quarters-of-brits-back-dramatic-fall-in-immigration/

 

For those that seem to have difficulty in understanding the EU's stance of '' Free movement of people '' is non negotiable, the only way to to achieve a reduction in EU immigration is to leave the EU in its entirety, no SM, no CU, no EFTA and no EEA.

[Eloquent pilgrim]

2 hours ago, RuamRudy said:

Is it your blinkers that are preventing you from seeing, and thus understanding his point, or is it simply too complicated for some?

 

Rees Mogg talks about the savings from our EU contributions as being the Brexit financial dividend. This seems to be fooling many into thinking that we will be net positive following Brexit.

 

As has been demonstrated amply, Rees Mogg is not a decent, honest, trustworthy man, and thus has neglected to point out that the net gains from the EU exceed the contributions, and that financially, we will be poorer than now.

 

While you may have valid points in your rant, they are 100% unrelated to the very accurate, pertinent and succinct point that O'Brien was making. His analogy was correct - your interpretation was wrong.

For any of you that may have missed “the very accurate, pertinent and succinct point that O'Brien was making”

 

This is the tweet that the literary wizard James O’Brien made, that is being referred to here

 

**** Yup. If you stop paying £20 for your pitch at the car boot sale where you make a profit of £200 every week, then you are obviously £20 a week better off ****

 

Higher education for the millions of less well educated remainers that failed kindergarten maths; what a genius the man is.

[RuamRudy]

8 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

You might have a point when you only consider EU Budget contributions.

 

Nobody, but nobody is talking about all the other £ Billions that are also sent to the EU to fund other EU agencies.

 

Medicine

Space

Education

Various Development funds

Aid for non-EU Countries.

Frontex

Europol

 

The list is endless.

And we do not benefit from membership of these agencies?

[RuamRudy]

1 minute ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

For any of you that may have missed “the very accurate, pertinent and succinct point that O'Brien was making”

 

This is the tweet that the literary wizard James O’Brien made, that is being referred to here

 

**** Yup. If you stop paying £20 for your pitch at the car boot sale where you make a profit of £200 every week, then you are obviously £20 a week better off ****

 

Higher education for the millions of less well educated remainers that failed kindergarten maths; what a genius the man is.

Are you being obtuse? I refuse to believe that you are incapable of understanding the point he was making - but in case that is so, he is highlighting the sophistry of the language that, once again, the Brexiteers are trying to seduce the country with. 

 

The Big Red Brexit Bus of Lies was one example - the Brexit Dividend is another. Rees Mogg knows that the only winners from Brexit will be him and his tax avoiding clients. He knows that we will suffer a net loss from Brexit - he only gives half the picture, and you seem to refuse to accept the other half.

[The Renegade]

2 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

And we do not benefit from membership of these agencies?

I never mentioned the benefits or non benefits.

 

I said the UK was pouring £Billions into the EU to fund them over and above the UK's annual EU budget contributions.

 

Quote

Rees Mogg talks about the savings from our EU contributions as being the Brexit financial dividend.

The focus is always on the EU budget contributions and never the total  amount of money that the UK sends to the EU.

 

I believe these figures are deliberately kept quiet throughout most EU Countries as it could well be a source of outrage if people new just how much the EU is actually costing.

[The Renegade]

Read into this what you will

 

Quote

Almost half of Germans want Merkel to resign as Italy warns survival of EU is at stake over migration crisis 

Silvani says

 

Quote

Within a year it will be decided whether there will still be a united Europe or not," he told Der Spiegel.

As the EU prepares for budget talks and next year’s European Parliament elections, it would become clear "whether the whole thing has become meaningless", he said.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/06/22/italy-heading-new-showdown-mediterranean-ngo-ship-rescues-220/

 

Silvani may well be correct.

 

3 things that could potentially destroy the EU are coming together like gathering storm clouds.

 

Immigration.

Budgets

European Parliament Elections.

[tebee]

37 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

You might have a point when you only consider EU Budget contributions.

 

Nobody, but nobody is talking about all the other £ Billions that are also sent to the EU to fund other EU agencies.

 

Medicine

Space

Education

Various Development funds

Aid for non-EU Countries.

Frontex

Europol

 

The list is endless.

 

28 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

And we do not benefit from membership of these agencies?

Those agencies are funded out of our budget contribution - it's one of the main things it does! So they are a net benefit. Post-brexit one of the things that will need to paid for out of the already negative brexit benefit are our own replacements for them and many more similar ones.

 

It's more efficient   to have these things   done at a European level, than for each country to duplicate the effort.

[The Renegade]

4 minutes ago, tebee said:

 

Those agencies are funded out of our budget contribution - it's one of the main things it does! So they are a net benefit. Post-brexit one of the things that will need to paid for out of the already negative brexit benefit are our own replacements for them and many more similar ones.

 

It's more efficient   to have these things   done at a European level, than for each country to duplicate the effort.

Wrong again tebee ??

 

EU Budget

 

Quote

Currently the largest share goes on creating growth and jobs and reducing economic gaps between the EU's various regions. Agriculture, rural development, fisheries and environmental protection also account for a major share. Other areas of expenditure include combating terrorism, organised crime and illegal immigration.

https://europa.eu/european-union/about-eu/money/expenditure_en

 

I will pick just one and then let you do your own research

 

The ESA 

 

Quote

All Member States contribute to these programmes on a scale based on their Gross Domestic Product (GDP).

https://www.esa.int/About_Us/Welcome_to_ESA/Funding

[tebee]

13 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

Wrong again tebee ??

 

EU Budget

 

https://europa.eu/european-union/about-eu/money/expenditure_en

 

I will pick just one and then let you do your own research

 

The ESA 

 

https://www.esa.int/About_Us/Welcome_to_ESA/Funding

But the ESA money for instance, is paid as part of the headline £13b EU gross contribution not as a separate extra sum and we get some of it back anyway as some of the ESAs spending in in the UK.

 

Agriculture is the same - I think the all are in fact.

[The Renegade]

12 minutes ago, tebee said:

But the ESA money for instance, is paid as part of the headline £13b EU gross contribution not as a separate extra sum and we get some of it back anyway as some of the ESAs spending in in the UK.

 

Agriculture is the same - I think the all are in fact.

tebee

 

1. English is obviously not your 1st language or your Dyslexia is the least of your problems.

 

2. Or you are being paid to *roll

 

3. Or you are really killing the myth that remainers are educated, never mind highly educated.

 

The ESA

 

https://www.esa.int/About_Us/Welcome_to_ESA/Funding

 

Note the date 

 

Quote

Last update: 17 January 2018

UK Contribution for 2018 to the ESA is €334.8 million.

 

This does not include OPTIONAL Programmes under ESA such as

 

Quote

Optional programmes cover areas such as Earth observation, telecommunications, satellite navigation and space transportation. Similarly, the International Space Station and microgravity research are financed by optional contributions.

As the UK has asked for £1 Billion to be returned for Galileo, it can reasonably assumed that the UK is also paying into these OPTIONAL Programmes

 

These are not part of the UK's EU Budget Contributions.

[tebee]

16 hours ago, nauseus said:

 

- Ability to strike trade deals with other nations

- No EU laws forced upon us

- Reclaim fishing waters

- Come out of the CAP

- No ECJ jurisdiction

- No contributions to the EU budget

- No free movement of people

 

The above points from CG1 Blue are all reasons for the out vote. The order of priority may change according to individual but we would like for all of these to happen. Some of us happen to think that they combine to become more important than the near-term economy.  

OK but many of that list are incompatible with single market membership. Much of the current British economy  is dependent on us being a single market member. It's something that's not been questioned n the last 40 years.  

 

Dropping out suddenly will cause firms to close or relocate to the rest of the EU. Airbus employees 17,000 people in the UK , with an estimated 110,000 people in support industries (including myself at one point in the past) It will be a major shock to the economy and we will take years to recover. Many of those jobs will never come back because some modern hi-tech  just can't exist in an economy as small as us on our own. Even leavers are now talking about possible Brexit benefits, but only in 30 years time. Is it worth it  ? you and I will probably be dead by then having survived our last years on much reduced pensions.

[tebee]

1 hour ago, The Renegade said:

tebee

 

1. English is obviously not your 1st language or your Dyslexia is the least of your problems.

 

2. Or you are being paid to *roll

 

3. Or you are really killing the myth that remainers are educated, never mind highly educated.

 

The ESA

 

https://www.esa.int/About_Us/Welcome_to_ESA/Funding

 

Note the date 

 

UK Contribution for 2018 to the ESA is €334.8 million.

 

This does not include OPTIONAL Programmes under ESA such as

 

As the UK has asked for £1 Billion to be returned for Galileo, it can reasonably assumed that the UK is also paying into these OPTIONAL Programmes

 

These are not part of the UK's EU Budget Contributions.

I'm sure if I was being paid they have found someone who could spell instead !

 

I'm a fairly crap typist too, so I often mistype and my dyslexia means that I don't always notice it.

 

We presumably make  contributions  to optional programs because we see defined benefits from them - both in terms of the results of the programs being of use and the money coming back to the UK anyway through the programs spending. I know in the Galileo program, much of the research was being done by British universities and British Aerospace were expected to get the bulk of the construction work. 

[HAKAPALITA]

All these people loosing their job.Who replace them. Economic Asylum seekers can piss of home then.!!...We got millions in Scandinavia the EU can have.

[The Renegade]

17 minutes ago, tebee said:

We presumably make  contributions  to optional programs because we see defined benefits from them -

Whether there is defined benefits is neither here nor there to the point I was making.

 

Being a member of the EU costs the UK a lot more than the EU Budget Contribution of around, after rebate  £8 Billion a year.

 

Contrary to what you thought, and argued, all these other funds are not funded from the EU's annual Budget and are funded by EU Member States, over and above EU Budget Contributions.

[The Renegade]

1 hour ago, tebee said:

you and I will probably be dead by then having survived our last years on much reduced pensions.

tebee

 

How long has the UK been a member of the EU ?

 

Why does the UK have one of the lowest State Pensions of EU Members ?

 

Might it be that UK State Pensions are nothing to do with the EU and leaving or remaining in the EU will not change the fact that the UK has a sh!t State Pension.

 

[tebee]

Quote from an FT comment 

 

 When will the PM actually understand that the Brexit process is a business process not a political whim process? When will the PM actually understand that political whims pay no bills? Her stubbornness (not to be confused with resilience and determination) is selling the economic well being of this country's children down the river. There will be no deal with the EU. They do not need us, even less as the deadline approaches. We are as the value of an out of the money traded option as the date of expiry nears. End of March 2019 with no deal secured we will have lost all clout and have no underlying value. Quite an achievement for Mr Farage who has secured his own future in journalism.