Brexit has created chaos in Britain – nobody voted for this

[RuamRudy]

9 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

Odd that the in the topic in hand ie BREXT - that is exactly what you criticise UK Brexiteers of doing.

Nope, I am not with you - care to elaborate?

[billd766]

2 hours ago, oilinki said:

Nope. The parliament decisions for Scotland and Northern Ireland are made in foreign country, England, by absolute majority of English MP's and unelected Lords. Therefore it's just fair and reasonable that Scotland and Northern Ireland can be free and define their own laws. 

 

Freedom for the people of Scotland and Northern Ireland, supporting the real Brexit.

 

Sounds similar to the other Brexit?

 

 

 

Would that mean that they have to pay all their own bills including for defence and that they should have to pay for all the facilities built by the UK over the years, less a discount of course? It may also mean that the English would remove all of their armed forces back to England taking all the jobs with them.

 

Taxes in Scotland would have to rise to high amounts just to pay for that alone.

 

All Scottish MPs who currently sit in the House of Commons would lose their jobs unless the Scottish parliament want to pay for them. There are NO English MPs in the Scottish parliament at all but currently Scottish MPs can vote on subjects directly affecting England but NOT the other way around.

 

You like many other posters are making the assumption that Scotland and Northern Ireland will leave the UK mostly based on what has been said on the news but not been tested yet. What would you think if the Scottish people ignored all the advice from the SNP etc and voted to remain in the UK.

 

Would you then say that the Remainers are stupid and have no idea what they are voting for and another election and more perhaps MUST be given until the results are what Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP want?

[billd766]

32 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

Hmmm - I am not sure that you should be the one to set the terms on what Scots may or may not do in regards to their own future, but thanks for another example of unwanted, outside interference.

 

Thank you for your comment.

 

Can you point out where I decided to set the terms on what the Scots may or may not do?

 

However, you like me and most of the other posters will have NO input on how a referendum is set up, and nor should we. That is what MPs are paid to do.

 

We can make suggestions but they will most likely be totally ignored anyway

[billd766]

27 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

No, I have access to Google - you should try using it sometimes; maybe this will help reduce the number of times you need to be corrected.

 

Cameron's Plea to Putin: Help Me Stop Salmond

 

So, having put you right on the Russians, anything else you want me to enlighten you upon, or are you willing to accept that the rest is fact too?

 

 

 

 

AFAIR David Cameron is no longer PM or even an MP.

 

The report you quoted was from 4 years ago and is no longer relevant.

 

Oddly enough Salmond was NOT re-elected as an MP either so what you mention is totally irrelevant.

 

BTW do you always believe what the Russian press says?

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

Would that mean that they have to pay all their own bills including for defence and that they should have to pay for all the facilities built by the UK over the years, less a discount of course? It may also mean that the English would remove all of their armed forces back to England taking all the jobs with them.

 

Taxes in Scotland would have to rise to high amounts just to pay for that alone.

 

All Scottish MPs who currently sit in the House of Commons would lose their jobs unless the Scottish parliament want to pay for them. There are NO English MPs in the Scottish parliament at all but currently Scottish MPs can vote on subjects directly affecting England but NOT the other way around.

 

You like many other posters are making the assumption that Scotland and Northern Ireland will leave the UK mostly based on what has been said on the news but not been tested yet. What would you think if the Scottish people ignored all the advice from the SNP etc and voted to remain in the UK.

 

Would you then say that the Remainers are stupid and have no idea what they are voting for and another election and more perhaps MUST be given until the results are what Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP want?

Of course Scotland and Northern Ireland will pay their own fees, like every other independent country does. They will also gain full rights, like independent countries have. This include fishing rights and rights to the natural resources. 

 

After the formation of independent, free countries, there is no reason for them to be part of any legal entity of former United Kingdom.  After all, the free will of the people of Northern Ireland and Scotland should be respected.

 

If they join the European Union, they might be helped by the EU at the start to get them to the way to prosperity. That's what EU does anyway. At the end of the day it benefits all of us who are part of the EU. 

 

 

[dick dasterdly]

2 hours ago, sandyf said:

I take it you mean the folk that are looking for someone to blame as their standard of living goes further down the pan.

The UK will not leave the single market until Dec 2020, by the time that comes to fruition the folk that you refer to may well have changed their minds, unless of course you would deny them that right.

'FURTHER down the pan' pretty much sums up why so many voted bexit....

[dick dasterdly]

14 hours ago, Grouse said:

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/finland-happiest-country-world-180968510/

 

There you go Vogie!

It also always features in 'top suicide' country listings...

Edited March 20, 2018 by dick dasterdly

[transam]

7 minutes ago, oilinki said:

Of course Scotland and Northern Ireland will pay their own fees, like every other independent country does. They will also gain full rights, like independent countries have. This include fishing rights and rights to the natural resources. 

 

After the formation of independent, free countries, there is no reason for them to be part of any legal entity of former United Kingdom.  After all, the free will of the people of Northern Ireland and Scotland should be respected.

 

If they join the European Union, they might be helped by the EU at the start to get them to the way to prosperity. That's what EU does anyway. At the end of the day it benefits all of us who are part of the EU. 

 

 

So the EU will fund another skint country.....Well at least the remaining UK will not have to fund it...Yep, I can see tears in the EU....

[RuamRudy]

14 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

AFAIR David Cameron is no longer PM or even an MP.

 

The report you quoted was from 4 years ago and is no longer relevant.

 

Oddly enough Salmond was NOT re-elected as an MP either so what you mention is totally irrelevant.

 

BTW do you always believe what the Russian press says?

Maybe read the context of the thread before jumping in and making an irrelevant comment?

[RuamRudy]

1 minute ago, transam said:

So the EU will fund another skint country.....Well at least the remaining UK will not have to fund it...Yep, I can see tears in the EU....

With the exception of the City of London and the SE of England, Scotland's contribution to the exchequer exceeds that of each and every other area of the UK. Unless you live in the first 2 regions, you are living off the generosity of the Scottish people. No need to thank us, we are nice like that.

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, transam said:

So the EU will fund another skint country.....Well at least the remaining UK will not have to fund it...Yep, I can see tears in the EU....

Yup. We call that investment for the future. Kind of like education on healthcare are beneficial for all if shared by the large number of people. 

 

At some point Scotland and Northern Ireland will pay the investments back, after they are standing strongly on their own feet. 

 

The funny part of this is that after the separation, Scotland and Northern Ireland are closer to the EU nations, than to former United Kingdom. There can be the hard border at the middle of Great Britain.  

[transam]

5 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

With the exception of the City of London and the SE of England, Scotland's contribution to the exchequer exceeds that of each and every other area of the UK. Unless you live in the first 2 regions, you are living off the generosity of the Scottish people. No need to thank us, we are nice like that.

OIL...And you think that will last for ever....

[dick dasterdly]

49 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

No, I have access to Google - you should try using it sometimes; maybe this will help reduce the number of times you need to be corrected.

 

Cameron's Plea to Putin: Help Me Stop Salmond

 

So, having put you right on the Russians, anything else you want me to enlighten you upon, or are you willing to accept that the rest is fact too?

 

 

 

Bloody hell - some people will believe any fodder they are fed, if it supports their cause .

[nauseus]

3 hours ago, Orac said:

 

Your comprehension skills seem to be a bit lacking since I clearly have said it was a quote from him. It was from an interview he did with Piers Morgan on Good Morning Britain but I will not lower myself to posting a video of the obnoxious toad.


Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

You said: Doubtful, unless he was psychic as well, since that quote is from 2004. A more up to date quote about Brexit from him would be

“By remaining in the E.U., we would have given ourselves more influence in the world, and we would provide future opportunities for young people,"

 

Without reference this implies that you composed the quote yourself. Don't give out lectures on comprehension when your composition is so slack. No VDO required to explain this properly.

[RuamRudy]

26 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

Would that mean that they have to pay all their own bills including for defence and that they should have to pay for all the facilities built by the UK over the years, less a discount of course? It may also mean that the English would remove all of their armed forces back to England taking all the jobs with them.

Well, we can take that route - but the converse is also true in that Scotland would be entitled to ~10% of al UK government assets regardless of where they lie.

As for the much to be expected but very incorrect reference to England's armed forces, I think you mean the UK's armed forces? I am not sure about these English jobs you mention - what would they be?

 

28 minutes ago, billd766 said:

Taxes in Scotland would have to rise to high amounts just to pay for that alone.

And you know this because... how?

 

29 minutes ago, billd766 said:

All Scottish MPs who currently sit in the House of Commons would lose their jobs unless the Scottish parliament want to pay for them. There are NO English MPs in the Scottish parliament at all but currently Scottish MPs can vote on subjects directly affecting England but NOT the other way around.

So much misunderstanding here...

 

The goal of independence is to escape Westminster. Of course there would be no MPs representing Scottish constituencies because Westminster would not represent Scotland. However, we really don't want back either Gove or Fox. Please keep them.

 

There are no Scottish MPs in the Scottish Parliament either, but there are Scottish and English MSPs in the parliament, plus a couple of Europeans - all representing Scottish constituencies.

 

EVEL (English Votes for English Laws) was introduced after the Indyref - Scottish MPs may vote on English only matters should they choose to, but their votes will not be counted. See last week when our shameless bunch of 13 Tory MPs voted to remove free school meals from 1 million disadvantaged English primary school children. They showed their true colours but their votes were discounted from the tally. If I had voted for any of the, I would offer my apologies nonetheless.

 

35 minutes ago, billd766 said:

You like many other posters are making the assumption that Scotland and Northern Ireland will leave the UK mostly based on what has been said on the news but not been tested yet. What would you think if the Scottish people ignored all the advice from the SNP etc and voted to remain in the UK.

 

Last week's Ipso Mori poll showed support for independence at 48% - and no campaigning underway. Once it kicks off, it will be like pushing at an open door.

 

 

[RuamRudy]

4 minutes ago, transam said:

OIL...And you think that will last for ever....

Seriously, you should look at the diversity of the Scottish economy. I think you will be surprised.

 

As for oil, it is not attributed to any region but allocated to the UK as a whole, so the data I am referring to is actually without oil.

[RuamRudy]

4 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

Bloody hell - some people will believe any fodder they are fed, if it supports their cause .

What do you suggest - maybe I should consult you before I come to a decision about the veracity of any particular issue?

[Orac]

You said: Doubtful, unless he was psychic as well, since that quote is from 2004. A more up to date quote about Brexit from him would be

“By remaining in the E.U., we would have given ourselves more influence in the world, and we would provide future opportunities for young people,"
 
Without reference this implies that you composed the quote yourself. Don't give out lectures on comprehension when your composition is so slack. No VDO required to explain this properly.

Outstanding pedantry - the meaning as perfectly clear. I can explain it to you but cannot understand it for you.


Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[transam]

8 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

Seriously, you should look at the diversity of the Scottish economy. I think you will be surprised.

 

As for oil, it is not attributed to any region but allocated to the UK as a whole, so the data I am referring to is actually without oil.

Post it here...Your insider info maybe an eye opener for me...But insure to quote NHS, Royal Mail etc which l reckon the UK as a whole bolsters... ..

[dick dasterdly]

1 hour ago, RuamRudy said:

No, I have access to Google - you should try using it sometimes; maybe this will help reduce the number of times you need to be corrected.

 

Cameron's Plea to Putin: Help Me Stop Salmond

 

So, having put you right on the Russians, anything else you want me to enlighten you upon, or are you willing to accept that the rest is fact too?

 

 

 

 

5 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

Bloody hell - some people will believe any fodder they are fed, if it supports their cause .

 

Just now, RuamRudy said:

What do you suggest - maybe I should consult you before I come to a decision about the veracity of any particular issue?

Of  course not - I was just pointing out the ridiculous nature of your comment that suggested russia was involved in the scots' elections/referendums !

[RuamRudy]

Just now, dick dasterdly said:

 

 

Of  course not - I was just pointing out the ridiculous nature of your comment that suggested russia was involved in the scots' elections/referendums !

It wasn't a comment but a story widely reported in the British press - why would you suggest it was not correct? Should we only accept as truthful that which bolsters your opinion, and discount anything that goes against it?

[transam]

4 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

It wasn't a comment but a story widely reported in the British press - why would you suggest it was not correct? Should we only accept as truthful that which bolsters your opinion, and discount anything that goes against it?

The British press......

[RuamRudy]

3 minutes ago, transam said:

Post it here...Your insider info maybe an eye opener for me...But insure to quote NHS, Royal Mail etc which l reckon the UK as a whole bolsters... ..

You keep referring to some source of secret knowedge, when the reality is that everything I refer to has been widely reported in the press. Really, you should try Google.

 

I am not sure what you mean about the NHS and Royal Mail, especially as the last one is a private company, Gideon having given it away to his friends. If you are referring to EXPENDITURE rather than contributions, that is a wholly different matter.

 

[nauseus]

49 minutes ago, Orac said:

 

Outstanding pedantry - the meaning as perfectly clear. I can explain it to you but cannot understand it for you.


Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

The meaning is clear but the origin of the words is not. Quotes a valid reference but you don't understand that. 

[vogie]

2 hours ago, RuamRudy said:

No, I have access to Google - you should try using it sometimes; maybe this will help reduce the number of times you need to be corrected.

 

Cameron's Plea to Putin: Help Me Stop Salmond

 

So, having put you right on the Russians, anything else you want me to enlighten you upon, or are you willing to accept that the rest is fact too?

 

 

 

 

[Orac]

31 minutes ago, nauseus said:

The meaning is clear but the origin of the words is not. Quotes a valid reference but you don't understand that. 

 

 

Since  both of us seem to have problems with grammar maybe we should end this now unless you want to address the Stephen Hawkings quote I have now given the source of:

 

“By remaining in the E.U., we would have given ourselves more influence in the world, and we would provide future opportunities for young people,"
 

[CG1 Blue]

3 hours ago, oilinki said:

If they join the European Union, they might be helped by the EU at the start to get them to the way to prosperity. That's what EU does anyway. At the end of the day it benefits all of us who are part of the EU.

Tell that to the Greeks.

[CG1 Blue]

3 hours ago, oilinki said:

Yup. We call that investment for the future. Kind of like education on healthcare are beneficial for all if shared by the large number of people. 

 

At some point Scotland and Northern Ireland will pay the investments back, after they are standing strongly on their own feet. 

 

The funny part of this is that after the separation, Scotland and Northern Ireland are closer to the EU nations, than to former United Kingdom. There can be the hard border at the middle of Great Britain.  

I'm surprised you're so keen to push your opinions on matters in the UK.  These things are very personal for us Brits.

 

By the way, I think Aland should have it's independence. And is Finland still part of Russia?

[nauseus]

45 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

Tell that to the Greeks.

Precisely!

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, Orac said:

 

 

Since  both of us seem to have problems with grammar maybe we should end this now unless you want to address the Stephen Hawkings quote I have now given the source of:

 

“By remaining in the E.U., we would have given ourselves more influence in the world, and we would provide future opportunities for young people,"
 

Ok. I found the quote and I missed a word before. Thanks.

 

I don't agree with Stephen Hawking on this one but I can agree to end this here. At least he managed to run over Prince Charles with his wheelchair before he passed. RIP.