Brexit has created chaos in Britain – nobody voted for this

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, nauseus said:

 

“They must go on voting until they get it right.” Jose Manuel Grouse.

Be assured that I, and MANY like me, will fight to the bitter end to avoid this catastrophically foolish Brexit nonsense.

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, aright said:

On the economic front have you got responsible links to your predictions? The worlds sixth largest economy in goods and services is going to stop trading in a years time is it?

 

On the political front many of us rejected an elitist, unrepresentative system which is incapable  

refuses  to listen to the needs of the electorate as evidenced by the results of the recent European elections.

Project EU is more important than anything for the Brussels Cabal and presumably Remainers 

I think India's trade will continue uninterrupted 

 

https://www.pwc.com/gx/en/world-2050/assets/pwc-world-in-2050-summary-report-feb-2017.pdf

 

To me, in a rapidly changing world, the civilised countries should stick together and negotiate from strength. If we continue down this wrong turn we will end up swamped by all manner of hideous cultures. I don't want to be forced to live like Chinese, Indian, Indonesian or Nigerian peasants. Time to look at the global picture and stop being so bloody parochial 

Edited March 22, 2018 by Grouse

[Johnniey]

On 2/28/2018 at 4:47 AM, cooked said:

maybe there is a housing shortage due to the impossibility of planning for an economy that allows hundreds of thousands of immigrants in every year? 

Dunno, that;s probably racist.

it is racist

 

what do you suggest, build a wall and let people die?

[aright]

1 hour ago, tebee said:

 If the UK does any sort of meaningful Brexit I.E. it leaves the SM and CU,  customs facilities will be needed at Dover and all other crossings that don't exist now. One year is certainly not enough time to have planning enquiries, compulsory purchase the needed land, build and equip the facilities and train the required staff. The electronic and computer systems to process this will take a minimum of 4 years and more likely 6-8 years to procure and develop and we are not even going to know what is needed until sometime in the transition phase as negotiations have been pushed back until then.

 

So we have physical imports and exports in and out of the UK at a standstill or near standstill. I doubt either us or the EU will even have updated the regulatory regime to allow them by then.

 

This chaos will kill all advanced manufacturing in the UK stone dead. Services will not be able to rescue us as many will no longer be allowed to trade in the EU. We may even end up with food shortages.

 

The only thing that will save us ( and coincidentally solve the NI problem ) is a brexit in name only where we remain in the SM and CU but lose all out influence. This is more and more where we are heading too as there is just not time to negotiate anything else.  All of the disadvantages with none of the advantages. 

 

       

Are you part of Project Fear because you seem to have  forgotten the two questions?

 

On the economic front have you got responsible links to your predictions? The worlds sixth largest economy in goods and services is going to stop trading in a years time is it?

No comment on the unelected ,unaccountable Cabal in Brussels. So we can assume Democracy is not your bag then? 

[Khun Han]

1 hour ago, tebee said:

 If the UK does any sort of meaningful Brexit I.E. it leaves the SM and CU,  customs facilities will be needed at Dover and all other crossings that don't exist now. One year is certainly not enough time to have planning enquiries, compulsory purchase the needed land, build and equip the facilities and train the required staff. The electronic and computer systems to process this will take a minimum of 4 years and more likely 6-8 years to procure and develop and we are not even going to know what is needed until sometime in the transition phase as negotiations have been pushed back until then.

 

So we have physical imports and exports in and out of the UK at a standstill or near standstill. I doubt either us or the EU will even have updated the regulatory regime to allow them by then.

 

This chaos will kill all advanced manufacturing in the UK stone dead. Services will not be able to rescue us as many will no longer be allowed to trade in the EU. We may even end up with food shortages.

 

The only thing that will save us ( and coincidentally solve the NI problem ) is a brexit in name only where we remain in the SM and CU but lose all out influence. This is more and more where we are heading too as there is just not time to negotiate anything else.  All of the disadvantages with none of the advantages. 

 

       

 

So the picture that Nontabury likes to post is correct!

 

 

[tebee]

2 minutes ago, aright said:

Are you part of Project Fear because you seem to have  forgotten the two questions?

 

On the economic front have you got responsible links to your predictions? The worlds sixth largest economy in goods and services is going to stop trading in a years time is it?

No comment on the unelected ,unaccountable Cabal in Brussels. So we can assume Democracy is not your bag then? 

http://www.eureferendum.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=86795

 

[aright]

3 minutes ago, tebee said:

http://www.eureferendum.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=86795

 

 

I said responsible links not a journalists opinion which strangely mirrors yours. Without facts its just another opinion which really helps the Project Fear cause. The clue is Blogview

Still no comment on the Brussels Cabal. Didn't Mr North cover that in his article?

[metisdead]

An inflammatory post and the reply has been removed.

[aright]

1 hour ago, Grouse said:

 Time to look at the global picture and stop being so bloody parochial 

At last! All of a sudden you recognise what Brexit is all about! Well done!

[tebee]

34 minutes ago, aright said:

Are you part of Project Fear because you seem to have  forgotten the two questions?

 

On the economic front have you got responsible links to your predictions? The worlds sixth largest economy in goods and services is going to stop trading in a years time is it?

No comment on the unelected ,unaccountable Cabal in Brussels. So we can assume Democracy is not your bag then? 

By unelected ,unaccountable Cabal in Brussels  I assume you mean the European Commission? Yes they are unelected, but then so is the British civil service, who have roughly the same role, EG. drafting legislation .

 

https://fullfact.org/europe/eu-facts-behind-claims-brussels-bureaucrats/

 

 

[evadgib]

1 hour ago, Grouse said:

I think India's trade will continue uninterrupted 

 

https://www.pwc.com/gx/en/world-2050/assets/pwc-world-in-2050-summary-report-feb-2017.pdf

 

To me, in a rapidly changing world, the civilised countries should stick together and negotiate from strength. If we continue down this wrong turn we will end up swamped by all manner of hideous cultures. I don't want to be forced to live like Chinese, Indian, Indonesian or Nigerian peasants. Time to look at the global picture and stop being so bloody parochial 

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/foreign-secretary-announces-250-new-diplomatic-roles-and-ten-new-sovereign-missions-overseas

[evadgib]

11 minutes ago, tebee said:

By unelected ,unaccountable Cabal in Brussels  I assume you mean the European Commission? Yes they are unelected, but then so is the British civil service, who have roughly the same role, EG. drafting legislation .

 

https://fullfact.org/europe/eu-facts-behind-claims-brussels-bureaucrats/

 

 

The civil service can be fired and their accounts are auditable.

[oldlakey]

1 hour ago, Grouse said:

I think India's trade will continue uninterrupted 

 

https://www.pwc.com/gx/en/world-2050/assets/pwc-world-in-2050-summary-report-feb-2017.pdf

 

To me, in a rapidly changing world, the civilised countries should stick together and negotiate from strength. If we continue down this wrong turn we will end up swamped by all manner of hideous cultures. I don't want to be forced to live like Chinese, Indian, Indonesian or Nigerian peasants. Time to look at the global picture and stop being so bloody parochial 

Then live like their Billionaires 

[simoh1490]

The following link is a good read for those interested in economics, it's quite complicated with some long words so not for everyone of course, but there are some pictures so all is not completely lost:

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2018/03/21/next-global-recession-will-entirely-reshape-brexit-debate/

[aright]

12 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

The following link is a good read for those interested in economics, it's quite complicated with some long words so not for everyone of course, but there are some pictures so all is not completely lost:

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2018/03/21/next-global-recession-will-entirely-reshape-brexit-debate/

It was obviously written for a man like yourself .

[simoh1490]

1 minute ago, aright said:

It was obviously written for a man like yourself .

I enjoy reading Ambrose, he's a got great mind although he can be overly pessimistic at times. But that's what an education at Trinity, Malvern and the Sorbonne will do for you plus 30 years of covering global economics, you should read him rather than The Express, he's far better value.

[cooked]

2 hours ago, Johnniey said:

it is racist

 

what do you suggest, build a wall and let people die?

I suggest we take some of the 700 000 Christian refugees that were forced out of Iraq for a start.

I also suggest that we make sure that the UK has no people sleeping on the streets before letting in hundreds of thousands of immigrants many of whom are not poor at all and have no intention of integrating.

My remarks concern uncontrolled immigration which makes planning and organisation impossible. 

Following your suggestion, the whole population of sub-Saharan Africa should be allowed in to the UK or do you maybe see a flaw in that? 

 

[aright]

4 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

I enjoy reading Ambrose, he's a got great mind although he can be overly pessimistic at times. But that's what an education at Trinity, Malvern and the Sorbonne will do for you plus 30 years of covering global economics, you should read him rather than The Express, he's far better value.

I enjoy reading him as well, the DT is my first source of reading.

I  too place a great deal of importance in education but as you continue to show you can't conflate knowledge and education. I pointed out in a previous post some of our best educated people are in the lower house and look what a mess its in.

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, evadgib said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/foreign-secretary-announces-250-new-diplomatic-roles-and-ten-new-sovereign-missions-overseas

Today’s announcement comes on the day that the UK opened a new diplomatic office in Chad’s capital, N’Djamena

 

Hurrah! We're saved!

[simoh1490]

3 minutes ago, aright said:

I enjoy reading him as well, the DT is my first source of reading.

I  too place a great deal of importance in education but as you continue to show you can't conflate knowledge and education. I pointed out in a previous post some of our best educated people are in the lower house and look what a mess its in.

One of the perils of democracy I'm afraid, the constant tooing and froing between the haves and have-nots - democracy doesn't work well in every society and not everyone is best suited to it. So the problem is not so much the people as it is the system, and now in the internet age everyone wants a say in everything and people who hitherto could barely form an opinion on any subject in the past, now have massive convictions about every thing, case in point, Brexit.

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, oldlakey said:

Then live like their Billionaires 

Do you know what a Gini coefficient is?

[oldlakey]

1 minute ago, Grouse said:

Do you know what a Gini coefficient is?

I dont need to as I know you are just peeing yourself to tell me

Now I want a full explanation in simple plain English please

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, simoh1490 said:

The following link is a good read for those interested in economics, it's quite complicated with some long words so not for everyone of course, but there are some pictures so all is not completely lost:

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2018/03/21/next-global-recession-will-entirely-reshape-brexit-debate/

Interesting and worrying ?

[CG1 Blue]

8 hours ago, tebee said:

 

 

 

 

Ah ! so your original post on this was from an environmental viewpoint and comparing Farage's dumping of fish as being as bad as the EU's policy of allowing bycach to be dumped . Sorry, I didn't realize you were so anti Farage's actions.

Much better the bycatch being returned to shore and processed into food for farmed fish or fertilizer, I agree

The problem arises with fishing in mixed-fishery areas of the North Sea (British waters by the way).

 

The EU's quota system dictates precisely which species of fish, and how many fishermen are allowed to catch. When, unavoidably, their nets come up full of fish for which they have no quota, it is a criminal offence to bring the fish to land. Hence they must be dumped back in the sea.

 

I believe UK waters contain something like 80% of all Europe’s fish. Fishing should be a major industry for the UK, and hopefully will be again one day.

 

 

 

[Grouse]

50 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

I enjoy reading Ambrose, he's a got great mind although he can be overly pessimistic at times. But that's what an education at Trinity, Malvern and the Sorbonne will do for you plus 30 years of covering global economics, you should read him rather than The Express, he's far better value.

Indeed! Rather over the head of the average Brexiter! From the comments, they clearly did not understand the points. Depressing really. ?

[Grouse]

41 minutes ago, cooked said:

I suggest we take some of the 700 000 Christian refugees that were forced out of Iraq for a start.

I also suggest that we make sure that the UK has no people sleeping on the streets before letting in hundreds of thousands of immigrants many of whom are not poor at all and have no intention of integrating.

My remarks concern uncontrolled immigration which makes planning and organisation impossible. 

Following your suggestion, the whole population of sub-Saharan Africa should be allowed in to the UK or do you maybe see a flaw in that? 

 

What has religion got to do with the price of cheese?

 

For info, we already control our borders or rather the government does.

[Grouse]

42 minutes ago, oldlakey said:

I dont need to as I know you are just peeing yourself to tell me

Now I want a full explanation in simple plain English please

Look it up

 

It is a measure of equality

 

I live well, but I am unhappy at the poverty around me.

 

I guess ones view of this depends on where one is on Maslov's hierarchy!

 

I've never thought that loutish behaviour is clever.

Edited March 22, 2018 by Grouse

[tebee]

9 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

The problem arises with fishing in mixed-fishery areas of the North Sea (British waters by the way).

 

The EU's quota system dictates precisely which species of fish, and how many fishermen are allowed to catch. When, unavoidably, their nets come up full of fish for which they have no quota, it is a criminal offence to bring the fish to land. Hence they must be dumped back in the sea.

 

I believe UK waters contain something like 80% of all Europe’s fish. Fishing should be a major industry for the UK, and hopefully will be again one day.

 

 

 

My point is this is out of date information.  The common fisheries policy was reformed in 2013 and there is now a landing obligation to bring ashore all species  even if there is no quota for it.

 

See  https://ec.europa.eu/fisheries/cfp/fishing_rules/discards_en

[oldlakey]

4 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Look it up

 

It is a measure of equality

 

I live well, but I am unhappy at the poverty around me.

 

I guess Ines view of this depends on where one is on Maslov's hierarchy!

 

I've never thought that loutish behaviour is clever.

I will take your word for it me old

Actually I think rather the same as you on education, it is certainly important but where I digress is that I think beer is importanter 

I wish it was but not one of mine

[Kieran00001]

2 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

The problem arises with fishing in mixed-fishery areas of the North Sea (British waters by the way).

 

The EU's quota system dictates precisely which species of fish, and how many fishermen are allowed to catch. When, unavoidably, their nets come up full of fish for which they have no quota, it is a criminal offence to bring the fish to land. Hence they must be dumped back in the sea.

 

I believe UK waters contain something like 80% of all Europe’s fish. Fishing should be a major industry for the UK, and hopefully will be again one day.

 

 

 

 

You're making things up.  The EU discard ban was passed in 2015 and is being phased in by species up till next year by which point it will be illegal NOT to land all catch.

 

The main reason for discard has always been profit, a lot unscrupulous fishermen practice high grading, where they throw away low value catch to allow room for higher value, they don't do that because it's illegal to land what they've caught, but because they will make more money if they fill their boat with expensive fish.

 

And by the way, the UK fishing industry has the highest profit and also profit margin in the EU, and it also sees the highest rate of investment in the EU.  Let's see if they keep that place post Brexit.