Big Change in Penang

[juice777]

I have always considered ticket rental services to be a kind of fraud. However, they become very tempting when you need a ticket to home country in order to apply for a tourist visa. I wonder if Kuala Lumpur and Kota Bharu are going to implement similar conditions.

I don't think you can choose the destination

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[BritTim]

1 hour ago, sanemax said:

1 hour ago, BritTim said:

That is possibly true on the average. However, entering some countries (especially as tourists) has become much easier over that period. Within this region, Vietnam and Myanmar are examples.

Yes, but those were previously "closed" Countries

I visited both countries 20 years ago (neither was like North Korea at that time) but it is much easier today.

[BritTim]

18 minutes ago, juice777 said:

On 3/6/2018 at 2:26 AM, BritTim said:

I have always considered ticket rental services to be a kind of fraud. However, they become very tempting when you need a ticket to home country in order to apply for a tourist visa. I wonder if Kuala Lumpur and Kota Bharu are going to implement similar conditions.

I don't think you can choose the destination

I have answered this in earlier posts. You cannot choose the destination with the cheaper ticket rental services, but some more expensive services do allow it. Also, a little less conveniently, travel agents can arrange confirmed reservations with free cancellation within 48 hours (similar to the ticket rental services). You will not be popular taking advantage of this unless willing to pay the travel agent a service fee.

[Lovethailandelite]

14 hours ago, lkv said:

You sound quite excited about all these crackdowns. 

 

Are you expecting an increase in the number of applicants for Elite there at the office?

 

Generally, people going on ME nonB were people working for companies that could not meet Immigration requirements for annual extensions.

 

Those people will now either opt for visa runs every 3 months for single entry non Bs or just leave Thailand.

 

I really don't see them joining Elite, which provides a tourist visa, where if you want to work legally you need to convert to nonB, and you enter the same catch 22 loop. Never mind the fact you cannot go back to your PE visa (unless you pay again).Or so I have heard.

 

It baffles me why you find joy in some people's misery really.

Your nonsense post aside, full of innuendos regarding who i represent in my mythical office, you seem very aggrieved and agitated at someone who posts information which may save people a wasted journey if they haven't got the correct documentation. Of course it could be that you don't want to believe that your simply not untouchable and can carry on regardless in the fashion that you choose to obtain visas, as, when and where you wish and no questions should arise.
On the other hand, and I can understand it, your simply agitated that you see, and perhaps in the not too distant future, your life here living on Tourist visas perpetually, not being possible anymore.

[overherebc]

1 hour ago, Lovethailandelite said:

Your nonsense post aside, full of innuendos regarding who i represent in my mythical office, you seem very aggrieved and agitated at someone who posts information which may save people a wasted journey if they haven't got the correct documentation. Of course it could be that you don't want to believe that your simply not untouchable and can carry on regardless in the fashion that you choose to obtain visas, as, when and where you wish and no questions should arise.
On the other hand, and I can understand it, your simply agitated that you see, and perhaps in the not too distant future, your life here living on Tourist visas perpetually, not being possible anymore.

I agree it is coming slowly but surely.

Elite visa wouldn't suit me/us as we travel quite a bit and end up not having to do 90 day reports because I use a multi 0.

Even if I change to an extension based on being married we travel often so 90 day reports would be minimal, if any. Financially the elite for me would be a waste of 100,000 baht a year, covers a couple of flights a year.

Back to back exempts are being clamped down on and it's a very small step to back to back tourist visas.

The vast majority of Thai people wjo go outside Thailand do so for much shorter breaks than us lot from UK EU and USA so their understanding of a holiday is much different. It doesn't take much of leap in imagination to see why they look at 2 years or whatever on tourist visas with suspicion of working. The METV covers that situation because it fits with visas for UK and Schengken visas.

8,9 or 10 back to back tourist visas from neighbouring countries will, if not already start to raise eyebrows.

Yes, we all know there is no rule to say you can't do it, but??

[lkv]

1 hour ago, Lovethailandelite said:

Your nonsense post aside, full of innuendos regarding who i represent in my mythical office, you seem very aggrieved and agitated at someone who posts information which may save people a wasted journey if they haven't got the correct documentation. Of course it could be that you don't want to believe that your simply not untouchable and can carry on regardless in the fashion that you choose to obtain visas, as, when and where you wish and no questions should arise.
On the other hand, and I can understand it, your simply agitated that you see, and perhaps in the not too distant future, your life here living on Tourist visas perpetually, not being possible anymore.

My aggitation in regards to Thailand and how i choose to stay here and you finding joy in people that are hired by companies that are unable or unwilling to support them for annual extensions, and now their life became more complicated, are two different things. So don't mix them up.

 

Ed visa extensions cost 1900 + 1500 per three months. I am not going to comment what the 1,500 is for and where that goes.

 

So you see, there is a plan B and a plan C. It's just becoming a bit annoying but don't worry for me, I can manage. If i decide I wanna continue staying here. Which is a 50-50 for other reasons also.

 

[Kaalle]

Why pretend like Thailand would benifit from stopping people staying on tourist visas? Its a country with a myriad of problems, terrorism, corruption, slavery, road safety etc etc etc. People staying longer and spending a bit of money isnt hurting any one. And if it is in a minority of cases then thats like worrying about ugly wallpaper in a house you havent even built yet. 

Edited March 8, 2018 by Kaalle

[elviajero]

20 minutes ago, Kaalle said:

Why pretend like Thailand would benifit from stopping people staying on tourist visas? Its a country with a myriad of problems, terrorism, corruption, slavery, road safety etc etc etc. People staying longer and spending a bit of money isnt hurting any one.

Immigration control isn’t just about money, and just because someone has money doesn’t give them entitlement.

 

Most countries want ‘tourists’ to visit for short holidays, spend their money, and go home. Most countries want long term visitors to be working, or prove they have the means to support their stay. People staying long term as ‘tourists’ using tourist visas don’t meet either condition.

[lkv]

5 minutes ago, elviajero said:

Immigration control isn’t just about money, and just because someone has money doesn’t give them entitlement.

In Thailand it does, if you are willing to spend amounts starting at 500K.

 

So it's all about the money. And it does give you entitlement. To "live like a Thai citizen" and be "resident" of Thailand.

 

Well, not actually resident but more like long time visitor. One should not believe the advertisments too much.

Edited March 8, 2018 by lkv

[darrendsd]

Error

Edited March 8, 2018 by darrendsd
Deleted

[KiChakayan]

On 06/03/2018 at 2:49 PM, overherebc said:

Sort of add on to last post.

I feel a slow but steady change is happening on the issue of tourist visas for Thailand.

In the not too distant future I reckon visa free entry and visa on arrival will both be phased out to be replaced by a visa issued in your own country prior to arrival in Thailand.

In truth that's what a lot of tourists get now and will soon be the norm.

A multi entry with 3 or 6 months validity for all but only issued in your own country.

Wouldn't this make perfect sense?

[Kaalle]

1 hour ago, elviajero said:

Immigration control isn’t just about money, and just because someone has money doesn’t give them entitlement.

 

Most countries want ‘tourists’ to visit for short holidays, spend their money, and go home. Most countries want long term visitors to be working, or prove they have the means to support their stay. People staying long term as ‘tourists’ using tourist visas don’t meet either condition.

Didnt say it was, my whole point was that people staying here doesnt hurt any one. You didnt really refute this at all. 

[lkv]

Deleted.

Edited March 8, 2018 by lkv

[sanemax]

8 minutes ago, Kaalle said:

Didnt say it was, my whole point was that people staying here doesnt hurt any one. You didnt really refute this at all. 

It does, it hurts the whole Country . Most Westerners here are miserable and depressed and moan all the time about everything and it makes Thailand a miserable place with all these saddoes moaping about 

[Kaalle]

2 minutes ago, sanemax said:

It does, it hurts the whole Country . Most Westerners here are miserable and depressed and moan all the time about everything and it makes Thailand a miserable place with all these saddoes moaping about 

This speaks to my point. People walking around being grumpy is a bit of a minor issue compared to roadside IED´s and a police force that is an organized mafia.  

[sanemax]

1 minute ago, Kaalle said:

This speaks to my point. People walking around being grumpy is a bit of a minor issue compared to roadside IED´s and a police force that is an organized mafia.  

IED's and corrupt Police generally do not effect tourists . But thousands of fat red faced miseries, sitting in bars on their own at midday nursing a large Chang , peering out from bars and just watching people walk by , could make tourists feel uncomfortable

[Kaalle]

Just now, sanemax said:

IED's and corrupt Police generally do not effect tourists . But thousands of fat red faced miseries, sitting in bars on their own at midday nursing a large Chang , peering out from bars and just watching people walk by , could make tourists feel uncomfortable

Ok so people staying permanently on tourist visas are bad for tourism and therefore bad for Thailand? The chinese are bummed out by the chang drinking depressed expats? I get your point now, really hope they clamp down hard, lives are at stake! 

[elviajero]

6 hours ago, lkv said:

6 hours ago, elviajero said:

Immigration control isn’t just about money, and just because someone has money doesn’t give them entitlement.

In Thailand it does, if you are willing to spend amounts starting at 500K.

 

So it's all about the money. And it does give you entitlement. To "live like a Thai citizen" and be "resident" of Thailand.

 

Well, not actually resident but more like long time visitor. One should not believe the advertisments too much.

I said "isn't just" about the money.

 

Immigration policy in Thailand is mostly about controlling numbers, That's why, for example, they have a min age of 50 for "retirement visas". If they wanted to make more money they could easily by relaxing visa/permit conditions and opening the door to all ages, OR not clamp down on ED visas, Tourist Visas, Visa Exempt Entries, etc ...

 

Thailand Elite doesn't reflect immigration policy. It is a way of making money, but it's few thousand members have little impact on the visitor numbers overall. And I suspect many of their members don't actually live in the country. I'm sure you are aware of who was in power when it was first introduced, and the actual reason they made it easy for certain people to get an easy access visa.

 

I only believe what I know, see and experience myself. TE's marketing slogans are misleading!

Edited March 8, 2018 by elviajero

[overherebc]

9 hours ago, KiChakayan said:

Wouldn't this make perfect sense?

I agree.  For some it wouldn't. For some, continual back to back TV's are the only choice they have while, dare I say it, working illegaly in low paid jobs but that's not part of what I'm saying.

At the moment it's just the way it is and 'I' don't see it lasting forever.

I have worked and lazed on Multi Non O's for years but  I am already thinking that each one may be the last and I will be pushed into an extension based on retirement.

 

[lkv]

7 hours ago, elviajero said:

I said "isn't just" about the money.

 

Immigration policy in Thailand is mostly about controlling numbers, That's why, for example, they have a min age of 50 for "retirement visas". If they wanted to make more money they could easily by relaxing visa/permit conditions and opening the door to all ages, OR not clamp down on ED visas, Tourist Visas, Visa Exempt Entries, etc ...

 

Thailand Elite doesn't reflect immigration policy. It is a way of making money, but it's few thousand members have little impact on the visitor numbers overall. And I suspect many of their members don't actually live in the country. I'm sure you are aware of who was in power when it was first introduced, and the actual reason they made it easy for certain people to get an easy access visa.

 

I only believe what I know, see and experience myself. TE's marketing slogans are misleading!

I agree with part of what you are saying.

 

I am still of the opinion that it's all about the money. It's just that the money made out of regular visas is peanuts in their definition, compared to TE.

 

Thaksin had a vision of 1 million members when this was introduced initially. So he wasn't too bothered about controlling numbers. The more, the better, as long as they paid.

 

What is the actual reason they made it easy for certain people to get an easy access visa in your opinion?

Edited March 9, 2018 by lkv

[JackThompson]

On 3/6/2018 at 9:25 PM, darrendsd said:

It took me 20 seconds to find one that can add your required destination if you want them to

Yes, and this will likely be available via the "van nearby the embassy" (per other's reports) and from other "visa-help" service-providers - supplying tickets, hotel-reservations, and such on-the-fly.  I suppose Jim doesn't want to get into that part of the business. 

 

If this service did not already exist, it would in short-order.  But the Penang consul will be able to tell his higher-ups that he is "doing all he can" to stem that heavy flow of Westerners who come to Thailand to work for a fraction of what they could earn at home. 

 

Lord knows, if those darn English teachers are not stopped, no one in the country will ever be able to earn a decent wage, again.  After all, cracking down on the hiring-schools that won't give English teachers the proper paperwork would just be too hard, compared to the relatively simple task of identifying every illegal-teacher these schools hire, by differentiating them from the 'real tourists' with clever immigration 'imaginary-rules' and consulate 'requirement' schemes.

 

On 3/7/2018 at 10:38 AM, lkv said:

(if/when a limit on Tourist-Visa use) ...

Some will stay, some will study French or self defence, some will go just because they had enough of it, and a very small minority will bite into Elite.

... and many will split their time between Vietnam or Cambodia - or just move there. 

 

Of course, those benefiting from the Elite sales won't care about all the Thai citizens who lose their livelihoods, as a direct result of this decision.  No doubt they have been pushing for it.  They (or someone) even have the airport IOs already citing a non-existent rule which could net them a few more sales this year. 

 

That new car someone's "official salary" could never finance, is just a few hundred more "out of business" mom/pop thai-restaurants away, via a bit more "crackdown" action on those pesky long-term Tourists who stubbornly refuse to just "pay up."

Edited March 9, 2018 by JackThompson

[lkv]

18 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

... and many will split their time between Vietnam or Cambodia - or just move there. 

 

Too bad I'm a city guy. If I was an island guy I'd be typing from Bali already.

 

300 something dollars gets you a 12 month multi entry business visa with 60 days permission of stay per entry. 

Edited March 9, 2018 by lkv

[Kaalle]

Any one actually been to Penang to secure a tourist visa lately who can confirm 100% ?

[lkv]

1 hour ago, Kaalle said:

Any one actually been to Penang to secure a tourist visa lately who can confirm 100% ?

Confirm what. That they give a tourist visa no matter how many previous visas you had? 

 

Nobody can confirm 100%. Things are changing every day. One's experience today does not reflect another one's tomorrow.

 

Penang seems to be changing. Developing story.

 

Personally, I would focus on Vientiane, Savannakhet, HCMC, Hanoi, Yangon, Hong Kong, Bali as being a safe bet.

 

Would not try KL despite some good reports.

 

Phnom Penh is a maybe with a relatively clear passport but not sure it would be my cup of tea. And it takes too long.

 

If I forgot any, others can add.

Edited March 11, 2018 by lkv

[Kaalle]

32 minutes ago, lkv said:

Confirm what. That they give a tourist visa no matter how many previous visas you had? 

 

Nobody can confirm 100%. Things are changing every day. One's experience today does not reflect another one's tomorrow.

 

Penang seems to be changing. Developing story.

 

Personally, I would focus on Vientiane, Savannakhet, HCMC, Hanoi, Yangon, Hong Kong, Bali as being a safe bet.

 

Would not try KL despite some good reports.

 

Phnom Penh is a maybe with a relatively clear passport but not sure it would be my cup of tea. And it takes too long.

 

If I forgot any, others can add.

Eeeh, confirm wether or not you need a ticket to your home country or not, the topic of the thread my friend. 

[lkv]

1 hour ago, Kaalle said:

Eeeh, confirm wether or not you need a ticket to your home country or not, the topic of the thread my friend. 

You're right. My head is so full now on nonBs nonOs TR's Penang Ho Chi Min, redstamp no redstamp third one first one fourth one, that I actually forgot what this thread was about ?

 

 

Edited March 11, 2018 by lkv

[Number 6]

I've not done this runner in years but last time I did, was asked for a bank book or proof of acct in Thailand.

 

Ironic no? Applying for a TR but have an account? Sounds like a trap. Didn't have my book anyway.

[SicTransit]

I've not done this runner in years but last time I did, was asked for a bank book or proof of acct in Thailand.
 
Ironic no? Applying for a TR but have an account? Sounds like a trap. Didn't have my book anyway.

Just to be clear, they asked you for financial proof at the consulate in Penang? That would be a first.

[Number 6]

6 minutes ago, SicTransit said:

 

Just to be clear, they asked you for financial proof at the consulate in Penang? That would be a first.

Absolutely. Ten

years back. Not proof of anything, just wanted to see a book. Might have been polite way to move me on. Who carries a book on a visa run?

 

For perspective at this time I was living on TRs and spending 3-9 mos a year in Thailand.

[ubonjoe]

9 hours ago, Number 6 said:

Ironic no? Applying for a TR but have an account? Sounds like a trap. Didn't have my book anyway.

It does not have to be a Thai bank account. They will accept a statement from a bank located  anywhere.