Offhsore banking for a British expat

[Guderian]

I’ve been living in Thailand since 2004 and banking offshore with Barclays in Jersey. For the first few years they were great, couldn't do enough for you, and even after 2008 they seemed generally helpful. My main complaint in that period was a rapid turnover of staff so you often had no idea who your Relationship Manager was.

 

In the last two years, though, Barclays International as they now label themselves has become truly lousy in terms of its service. Over the years investment advice has been provided by Barclays in Dubai, with one of their bankers regularly visiting Thailand and being willing to meet up with you for a chat about your finances. They confided to me early last year that Barclays in Jersey has become something of a standing joke in the Barclays world. Apparently they’re caught between the UK regulators and those in Jersey itself who have become much more active and proactive. The result is akin to a headless chicken trying to jump through hoops, and they told me that it’s become very difficult even for them, another part of the Barclays empire, to work with Barclays in Jersey.

 

Two weeks ago I needed some advice off my Relationship Manager so we scheduled a phone call. In the past you could just call them any time and they would fit you in ASAP, but these days you have to book a slot a week or two ahead. Anyway, even after them calling me three times the line quality was so poor that neither side could understand what the other was saying half the time. I can’t conduct my financial affairs like that so I’m looking for an alternative offshore bank.

 

Does anybody have any recommendations for an offshore bank that provides excellent service to British citizens living overseas? And how do you go about opening an account with them? When I first opened the Jersey account with Barclays I was living in the UK and banking with Barclays there so it was all seamless and simple. They knew who I was and I knew who they were and money was simply transferred from one Barclays account to another. Now I live in Thailand and it’s probably not so simple to open an offshore account with a bank that I have no history of dealing with.

 

Grateful for any advice or recommendations, I don’t see Barclays International improving any time soon so I’d like to have another option available.

[manchega]

I'm sure you know this, and are more affluential than most tvers.  banks really don't care much now a days.  However, if you are in the UK 10 mill gbp to invest or so, then Singapore is the best bet.  they will come visit you where you live.

[Guderian]

43 minutes ago, manchega said:

I'm sure you know this, and are more affluential than most tvers.  banks really don't care much now a days.  However, if you are in the UK 10 mill gbp to invest or so, then Singapore is the best bet.  they will come visit you where you live.

 

I was quite happy with the service from Barclays in Dubai, but they require at least a million pounds to open an account. A bit more than my modest pension will run too, I'm afraid.

 

I was thinking more of the likes of HSBC, or even a non-British bank like Citi based in Singapore.

[trd]

The international personal account with Citibank based in Singapore used to be a minimum balance of $20,000. It has now being raised to a minimum of $200,000.

[Halfaboy]

Are these Singapore Dollars ?

[trd]

Are these Singapore Dollars ?

USD

[topt]

3 hours ago, Guderian said:

 

I was quite happy with the service from Barclays in Dubai, but they require at least a million pounds to open an account. A bit more than my modest pension will run too, I'm afraid.

 

I was thinking more of the likes of HSBC, or even a non-British bank like Citi based in Singapore.

Not sure that they are any better but I have been with Lloyds International based out of Jersey for a few years now. With a history with Barclays you may find it not too hard to open an account with them and worth looking up the various options online first to see of they are suitable or not.

 

They do have relationship managers and are generally quick to respond to queries. However I try to avoid asking them anything other than to do with running my account.

[lungbing]

You'll need to be fluent in Hindi to use HSBC's advisors. The past three times I have rung them I have spoken to a woman with a strong Indian accent.

[AJBangkok]

Opening an offshore account isn’t easy these days. My friend was able to open an account with Citibank Singapore recently as they are beefing up their private client business so you may want to check them out. 

[helloagain]

1 hour ago, AJBangkok said:

Opening an offshore account isn’t easy these days. My friend was able to open an account with Citibank Singapore recently as they are beefing up their private client business so you may want to check them out. 

Its easy to open an account on UK's 3 main islands, you give them what they want proof of funds etc, I even have it as a joint account with my Thai Wife then each account is up to their 100,000 pounds compensation limits. Flaming UK I can't have a joint account with Wife & she will have to get probate cos Halifax sets limit at 25,000. Nationwide limit is 30,000 & premium bonds limit is 5,000. you have 1 pound over this limit then she has to get probate from 7,000 miles away.

[trd]

Its easy to open an account on UK's 3 main islands, you give them what they want proof of funds etc, I even have it as a joint account with my Thai Wife then each account is up to their 100,000 pounds compensation limits. Flaming UK I can't have a joint account with Wife & she will have to get probate cos Halifax sets limit at 25,000. Nationwide limit is 30,000 & premium bonds limit is 5,000. you have 1 pound over this limit then she has to get probate from 7,000 miles away.

Nationwide International closed last year and I had to move my account. BTW, I had a real fight to get them to accept my Thai wife's name on the account because they perceived Thailand as a risk.

[ruddick]

I used to be with NATWEST Jersey but after over 30 years they basically told me they were did not want any clients from Thailand. After a search on the Internet I found Standard Bank (IOM) and I could open an account with a minimum balance of 4,000 GBP. They have many different types of accounts. They also DHL my debit card to my home in Thailand. Something which NATWEST would not do.

The only problem I had was providing all the requested paperwork, In the end it was easy as I found a certified Notary in Bangkok who came to my house and helped me sort everything out at a very reasonable cost.

 

[Mburo]

I agree with the OP. Barclays has become useless. Like me, ur likely now chatting to somebody in London who sounds like a Chinese exchange student. She’s even called me at 10pm here.

I’ve contacted CitiBank Singapore and it’s relatively easy to open an account with them. Min. Balance as another poster has said is $200,000.

I have been Barclays for 45 years. It’s gone from 10/10 to -1/10. 

 

 

 

 

[Superlight]

As someone who has worked offshore as an OFA I would say the following.  Offshore banking has changed dramatically and the hoops and fences are not worth bothering with. Assuming your money is legit - and if it is in your bank account it is. Why bother.... Use a local vehicle such as SCB, you will be astounded at the level and excellence of service.

[Baerboxer]

13 hours ago, lungbing said:

You'll need to be fluent in Hindi to use HSBC's advisors. The past three times I have rung them I have spoken to a woman with a strong Indian accent.

 

That's not true. I bank with both HSBC Expat and HSBC UK, both Premier, and I usually talk to someone in Jersey, Scotland or Wales when I telephone their call centers.

If I use the 'live chat" facility then on the internet banking then it seems to be someone somewhere in the Indian sub-continent judging by the names and expressions used. Asking them a question, which they normally can't answer, or relying on them to get something done is a waste of time. Not knowledgeable or reliable IME.

 

Relationship Managers are very good and usually easy to get old of.

 

Hindi btw is not actually nationally spoken in India. A lot of call centers are in Hyderabad, Bangalore, Mumbai, and Chennai where they don't speak Hindi and won't appreciate it if you try!

[Baerboxer]

28 minutes ago, Superlight said:

As someone who has worked offshore as an OFA I would say the following.  Offshore banking has changed dramatically and the hoops and fences are not worth bothering with. Assuming your money is legit - and if it is in your bank account it is. Why bother.... Use a local vehicle such as SCB, you will be astounded at the level and excellence of service.

 

Agree with that. Jersey based banks have become bureaucratic nightmares as the struggle with the paranoid Regulators who are bending over backwards to keep the UK and EU member states tax authorities at bay. More and more forms to fill in that haven't been particularly well thought out or designed by anyone with expat living experiences.

 

The UK "ring fencing" seems to be suck it and see as I had to tell my relationship manager about some short comings on the "information website" which he didn't know about! Again they also are rushing to tighten up their due diligence on ID and source of funds documentation with forms designed for people living in the UK. Different parts of HSBC are now inconsistent in what they will and won't accept on documentation. I asked one why they wanted me to prove my identity on a current account I had opened in 1974 and used, still, for the last 43 years! His only answer was "it's the system".

 

Prior to the 2008 crash banks had become much more customer focused IMO. Now they are rapidly returning to the 70's mentality when they considered allowing you to have an account was doing you a favor!

[Jip99]

11 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Agree with that. Jersey based banks have become bureaucratic nightmares as the struggle with the paranoid Regulators who are bending over backwards to keep the UK and EU member states tax authorities at bay. More and more forms to fill in that haven't been particularly well thought out or designed by anyone with expat living experiences.

 

 

 

Prior to the 2008 crash banks had become much more customer focused IMO. Now they are rapidly returning to the 70's mentality when they considered allowing you to have an account was doing you a favor!

 

 

If you think Jersey banks are a nightmare...... just wait until you die.......... they can be b4stards to deal with.

 

 

100% correct with your final statement. Money Laundering Rules was one of the turning points..."MLR says we have to do this"...... no MLR didn't, it said you had to identify and confirm the address of each customer..  The Crash was another event that allowed retrenchment,

[Baerboxer]

1 minute ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

If you think Jersey banks are a nightmare...... just wait until you die.......... they can be b4stards to deal with.

 

 

100% correct with your final statement. Money Laundering Rules was one of the turning points..."MLR says we have to do this"...... no MLR didn't, it said you had to identify and confirm the address of each customer..  The Crash was another event that allowed retrenchment,

 

Several years ago, when I had a brilliant Jersey RM, a lady Jersey born and bred, she warned me of the arduous Jersey probate rules. From memory, the person claiming inheritance must appear at the court in person; as well as the procedures being lengthy and bureaucratic, requiring a Jersey solicitor. She recommended making changing my accounts to dual accounts which we did, to avoid all these issues.

 

I now have to deal with all the ID, tax residency, source of funds etc crap for two people now, but it's apparently better than keeping them sole accounts and having by heirs trying to sort out.

[verticalift]

As a Canadian Expat I have lived in T’land for the past 20 years and hold accounts with HSBC in Jersey and Abu Dhabi, as well as Standard Chartered Bank (SCB) in Abu Dhabi and United Overseas Bank (UOB) in T’land.

 

12+ years ago HSBC - Jersey was excellent. Now they’re bloody awful. HSBC Abu Dhabi is very good, but you need a UAE residence permit to hold an account there. Standard Charterted in Abu Dhabi is ok and you can get a “Non-Reaident” Account with them.

SCB also have branches throughout SE Asia.

 

Several years ago when HSBC Bangkok shut down their Retail Operations in BKK on Rama Rd, I was forced to get an account with another bank. After much DD, I opted for UOB for my local Thai banking needs. UOB also have branches located throughout SE Asia. The Thai Yellow Bank, Green Bank, Purple Banks were all just so incredibly bad.

 

I tried several years ago to open an account with HSBC in S’pore, but even with the assistance of HSBC Jersey, my account application was denied as I do not maintain sufficient ties to S’pore to warrant an account. 

 

Note on HSBC Premier Banking in Jersey..... With an account there, you’ll have access to “HSBC Invest Direct” for trading on the New York and London Stock Exchanges.

 

Good Luck.....

 

 

 

 

 

[LivinLOS]

I have been with Barclays Jersey since early 90s.. 

 

Your initial post precisely mirrors my experience, they have become a total nightmare over the last 5 years especially.. Through the 90s and early oughts it was really professional service. They also used to give me plenty of perks (airport priority pass lounges etc) and be exactly what I needed, my manager on the phone at almost any time and my manager having a good professional secretary who could also action and assist.  After 20 something years with them I am very used to the online / mobile / high value transfer options, who to call, how to handle them and moving caused stress.

 

I am currently testing a few (feel free to PM me) AIB Private banking (very Irish !! Not really as internationally minded as I need, lots of things they seem unable to do without written posted instructions in 2018 !!!) as I have an Irish address and corporation, a Luxembourg solution (seems professional and old school.. I have a good feeling here but a bit lacking in mobile etc banking) as I have contracts on the continent, and lastly lloyds jersey. 

 

Lloyds feels the most like Barclays in it has advanced mobile and web banking, but a little impersonal and call centerish.. I have a relationship manager but they havent been properly 'tested yet' as its a new relationship and I have no idea of the duration. 

 

I actually like the old school vibe I get from the Luxembourg one the most. But I pair that with a selection of these challenger banks (monzo, starling for GBP and N26 for EUR) for my spending and plastic. These new banks are amazing on a customer service front and on how a mobile only bank can be in the future, but I just put a couple of grand in each of them and use the plastic as my spending systems, while keeping real assets in a more established solution. Its like a separation of holding assets, and spending money.  

[Guderian]

22 hours ago, trd said:

The international personal account with Citibank based in Singapore used to be a minimum balance of $20,000. It has now being raised to a minimum of $200,000.

That's doable, whether it's USD or SGD. Any idea how customer-friendly they are, and how easy it is to open an account with them? What proof of identity and source of funds do they want, etc.?

[khunPer]

22 hours ago, trd said:

The international personal account with Citibank based in Singapore used to be a minimum balance of $20,000. It has now being raised to a minimum of $200,000.

Most off-shore private banking require a higher minimum today, that about a decade ago, making it difficult to use them, if you don't have a certain level of funds to invest; many European banks now has a minimum of 300,000 €.

 

Furthermore all banks, both off-shore and national, require an increased information level; as another poster said "it's the system", due to white washing and like.

 

You could try to take a look at Saxo Bank, they are fairly easy to open a foreign resident account with, and they have branches all over, including Singapore, and furthermore an award winning on-line trading platform.

[Pdavies99]

5 hours ago, helloagain said:

Its easy to open an account on UK's 3 main islands, you give them what they want proof of funds etc, I even have it as a joint account with my Thai Wife then each account is up to their 100,000 pounds compensation limits. Flaming UK I can't have a joint account with Wife & she will have to get probate cos Halifax sets limit at 25,000. Nationwide limit is 30,000 & premium bonds limit is 5,000. you have 1 pound over this limit then she has to get probate from 7,000 miles away.

Nationwide international closed several years ago!

 

I have most offshore accounts, the only one that will even answer on an email is Lloyd's bank International (without discussing account details) and for personal banking info it HAS to be by telephone. Santander is useless.

[Pdavies99]

5 hours ago, trd said:

5 hours ago, helloagain said:

Its easy to open an account on UK's 3 main islands, you give them what they want proof of funds etc, I even have it as a joint account with my Thai Wife then each account is up to their 100,000 pounds compensation limits. Flaming UK I can't have a joint account with Wife & she will have to get probate cos Halifax sets limit at 25,000. Nationwide limit is 30,000 & premium bonds limit is 5,000. you have 1 pound over this limit then she has to get probate from 7,000 miles away.

Nationwide International closed last year and I had to move my account. BTW, I had a real fight to get them to accept my Thai wife's name on the account because they perceived Thailand as a risk.

 

5 hours ago, trd said:

5 hours ago, helloagain said:

Its easy to open an account on UK's 3 main islands, you give them what they want proof of funds etc, I even have it as a joint account with my Thai Wife then each account is up to their 100,000 pounds compensation limits. Flaming UK I can't have a joint account with Wife & she will have to get probate cos Halifax sets limit at 25,000. Nationwide limit is 30,000 & premium bonds limit is 5,000. you have 1 pound over this limit then she has to get probate from 7,000 miles away.

Nationwide International closed last year and I had to move my account. BTW, I had a real fight to get them to accept my Thai wife's name on the account because they perceived Thailand as a risk.

Barclays require a minimum balance on current account of £25,000 at all times.

Lloyd's £5000

Many other little known and also popular non UK banks have no savings protection, or require money in US dollars costing a further exchange rate  and if they go bust you lose your money!

[Cranky]

It all depends what you want - be careful not to mix retail banking services with investment advice.  

 

HSBC, Barclays, Lloyds et al pass information from their retail arm to the investment 'advisors' who in reality are commission driven sales people armed with your personal info.  The likelihood of the 'best' retail bank giving the 'best' investment advice is zero.  Shop around for each.

[Jen65]

Try Standard Bank IOM  !!!!   

[Tofer]

On 16 March 2018 at 2:53 PM, Guderian said:

 

I was quite happy with the service from Barclays in Dubai, but they require at least a million pounds to open an account. A bit more than my modest pension will run too, I'm afraid.

 

I was thinking more of the likes of HSBC, or even a non-British bank like Citi based in Singapore.

I had dealings with HSBC in Silom HQ, at first very helpful when I needed emergency cash from a late transfer from a Philippine HSBC account, then a few years later they refused to provide a certified bank statement  related to my UK account. So I would not recommend them.

 

Previously I held accounts with Standard Chartered in Jersey and Phuket and was always very satisfied with their service. The Phuket branch manager even arranged a chequebook account on a personal account with BBK when they closed their local branch.

[manchega]

On 3/17/2018 at 2:59 PM, khunPer said:

Most off-shore private banking require a higher minimum today, that about a decade ago, making it difficult to use them, if you don't have a certain level of funds to invest; many European banks now has a minimum of 300,000 €.

 

Furthermore all banks, both off-shore and national, require an increased information level; as another poster said "it's the system", due to white washing and like.

 

You could try to take a look at Saxo Bank, they are fairly easy to open a foreign resident account with, and they have branches all over, including Singapore, and furthermore an award winning on-line trading platform.

Hi Kunper,  could you provide a little more informaiton on Saxo bank? I have never come across them before?  Do any other posters have info on Saxo bank?

[jackdd]

Why don't you just open a bank account in your home country?

Is there any legal reason why somebody would have an off shore bank account?

[khunPer]

1 hour ago, manchega said:

Hi Kunper,  could you provide a little more informaiton on Saxo bank? I have never come across them before?  Do any other posters have info on Saxo bank?

I provided you with a link (the bold Saxo Bank) to their home page. You can read more about them at Wikipedia...