Condo rental to tourists

[SaraHolton]

Renting out my apartments via airbnb.

How, what, where?

Which licenses do I need and which taxes should I pay if I rent out my 2 condos via airbnb. Can I do this as foreigner?I want to do everything 100% legally, which agencies should I contact? Who can give me correct advice? Thanks in advance. Sara 

Edited March 16, 2018 by metisdead
Oversize font reset to normal.

[Peterw42]

Its illegal. Short term rental, under a month is illegal unless you are a hotel. 

A widely discussed topic on Thai Visa but at the end of the day its illegal under the Hotel Act, the immigration Act and the Condominium Act.

 

It still goes on but lots of Condo Blocks are actively stopping illegal short term rentals. Rentals over a month are legal. A single Condo does not usually need a work permit but more than 1 may be seen as running a business. You would be responsible for reporting your tenants (non-Thai) to immigration.

 

AirBnB is running a business, you our someone you pay, needs to be available 24 hours a day to meet, greet and hand out keys etc, or respond to problems, The condo office or security etc is not there to respond to issues within your Condo, fresh towels, tv not working, room is not clean etc.

You, or someone you pay, needs to inspect, check inventory, clean, change linen etc between guests.

Guests can run air-conn and internet downloads etc, 24 hours a day and run up big bills.

 

Edited March 16, 2018 by Peterw42

[cheeryble]

I don't have anything to do with Airbnb or others and I may be corrected, but pretty sure short rentals are only illegal if it's more then four units.

 

[scubascuba3]

I don't have anything to do with Airbnb or others and I may be corrected, but pretty sure short rentals are only illegal if it's more then four units.
 

Nah, its any rentals less than 30 days

[Maestro]

On 16/03/2018 at 11:27 AM, SaraHolton said:

Which licenses do I need and which taxes should I pay if I rent out my 2 condos via airbnb. Can I do this as foreigner?I want to do everything 100% legally, which agencies should I contact?

 

Yes, you can rent out your two condominium units as a foreigner, but only for periods of 30 days or longer.

 

For rentals of less than 30 days the Condominium Juristic Person would need a hotel licence but because of the legal structure of a Condominium Juristic Person, such licence cannot be applied for.

 

The basis for the above rules is the definition of "Hotel" in Section 4 of the Hotel Act and a Ministerial Regulation issued under the authority of this Act.

[Maestro]

The revenue from the rental of the condo units counts as income and should be declared as such to the Revenue Office on the annual tax return form.

[KittenKong]

For rentals of less than 30 days the Condominium Juristic Person would need a hotel licence but because of the legal structure of a Condominium Juristic Person, such licence cannot be applied for.

I dont think that this is the responsibility of the JP as the JP does not own the units being rented out, nor is the JP in any way engaging in any sort of commercial transaction in connection with the rentals. I think it is the responsibility of the individual unit owners to register and/or be licenced under the Hotel Act, depending on how many units they are making available as hotel rooms.

The JP may also have specific rules relating to any such activity, but it is still not responsible for it, any more than the JP would be responsible for, say, smoke and fumes emanating from a restaurant operating in the commercial area of the building, or a bar operating without a licence and being noisy. Of course not being responsible doesnt prevent management from wanting to prevent such things from happening, and I would expect any decent building management to do so, as some indeed do regarding short term rentals.

[AJBangkok]

There is nothing in the condominium act that prevents you from renting out your unit for less than 30 days.

 

There is an exemption in the hotel act if you own less than 5 rooms in the condominium. If you don’t own 5 rooms you are exempt.

 

You are not running a business FROM the condominium unit you are renting out. You may be doing business WITH your condominium unit, and the condominium act specifically allows that as if it did not then nobody could rent out their unit be it for 1 day, one month or 1 year.

 

You would be subject to taxation on rental income but that holds true whether you rent for 1 day, 1 month or 1 year.

 

The law is abosolutly clear on the above points. That’s why there has never been a prosecution over an AirBnB rental of a condo in Thailand.

 

The only part of the law that is unclear is that if 51% of the owners of a condominium vote to change the rules of the condominium to ban rentals under 30 days then that may be potentially enforceable however this could be challenged in a court as it is in conflict with other areas of the condominium act .

 

Many condos do “ban” short term rentals but they do it by making false threats without correct legal justification. There is nothing you can really do about that except to sue your condominium juristic person.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 22, 2018 by AJBangkok

[KittenKong]

There is an exemption in the hotel act if you own less than 5 rooms in the condominium. If you don’t own 5 rooms you are exempt.

If you have several rooms rented on a short-term basis you have to register and be licenced. If you have few rooms you have to register but dont have to be licenced.

Either way you have to register, and few condo landlords do.

[KittenKong]

The only part of the law that is unclear is that if 51% of the owners of a condominium vote to change the rules of the condominium to ban rentals under 30 days then that may be potentially enforceable however this could be challenged in a court as it is in conflict with other areas of the condominium act .

I see no conflict.

[AJBangkok]

There is a slight one. The condominium act allows 51% of the owners of a condominium project to set the rules of the condominium. This entitles them to create a rule that short term rentals are not allowed. However If they did that they may be seen to be in conflict with the Thai civil and commercial code of Thailand which states the condominium owner is entitled to the fruits of his ownership of the condominium so long as he does not disturb other co owners .

 

The civil and commercial code undermines the condominium act but to what extent either would be enforceable I have no idea. I have seen advice that each trumps the other.  At the end of the day the one that would win is probably the one that benefits rich Thai people the most.

[Sumarianson]

Renting out my apartments via airbnb.

How, what, where?

Which licenses do I need and which taxes should I pay if I rent out my 2 condos via airbnb. Can I do this as foreigner?I want to do everything 100% legally, which agencies should I contact? Who can give me correct advice? Thanks in advance. Sara 

If you are required by law to pay tax, then you are considered as working as you are earning. Therefore you have to have the correct visa and work permit. Though nobody does this if cought you could be deported.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[BigT73]

You would also need to report a tm30 for all your renters. If you have less then 10 rooms you cant do it online.   My partner worked in a hotel, they were reporting way before tm30 was a prerequisite, hence why you need to show your passport.

[AJBangkok]

2 hours ago, Sumarianson said:

If you are required by law to pay tax, then you are considered as working as you are earning. Therefore you have to have the correct visa and work permit. Though nobody does this if cought you could be deported.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

That’s not quite correct. No work permit is required for renting out your condo, house or commercial property owned in your own name .

[jippytum]

On ‎3‎/‎19‎/‎2018 at 10:41 AM, KittenKong said:

I dont think that this is the responsibility of the JP as the JP does not own the units being rented out, nor is the JP in any way engaging in any sort of commercial transaction in connection with the rentals. I think it is the responsibility of the individual unit owners to register and/or be licenced under the Hotel Act, depending on how many units they are making available as hotel rooms.

The JP may also have specific rules relating to any such activity, but it is still not responsible for it, any more than the JP would be responsible for, say, smoke and fumes emanating from a restaurant operating in the commercial area of the building, or a bar operating without a licence and being noisy. Of course not being responsible doesnt prevent management from wanting to prevent such things from happening, and I would expect any decent building management to do so, as some indeed do regarding short term rentals.

Not correct .Individual owners can not licence their units at a registered condo  under the hotel act to rent rooms for less than thirty days. If there was enough support from co owners the entire condo could be reregistered but this thankfully  would be almost impossible to achieve

[Gilliams]

I think Sara is still hungry.

All these advice are very confusing.

Condo owners have the inclination to follow the positive advice of AJBangkok.

But who can prove in black and white what the right advice is?????

[KittenKong]

Not correct .Individual owners can not licence their units at a registered condo under the hotel act to rent rooms for less than thirty days. If there was enough support from co owners the entire condo could be reregistered but this thankfully would be almost impossible to achieve

A condo building is not a business, and in fact its juristic structure specifically prohibits it from doing things like this.

Edited March 23, 2018 by KittenKong

[KittenKong]

There is a slight one. The condominium act allows 51% of the owners of a condominium project to set the rules of the condominium. This entitles them to create a rule that short term rentals are not allowed. However If they did that they may be seen to be in conflict with the Thai civil and commercial code of Thailand which states the condominium owner is entitled to the fruits of his ownership of the condominium so long as he does not disturb other co owners .

I dont see that as a conflict. There can be no question that short rentals are highly detrimental to the "peaceful enjoyment" of other co-owners of their property. They are also highly detrimental to the building infrastructure. So as far as I can see there is no way they could ever be correctly authorised to happen in any building.

[Gilliams]

44 minutes ago, KittenKong said:

I dont see that as a conflict. There can be no question that short rentals are highly detrimental to the "peaceful enjoyment" of other co-owners of their property. They are also highly detrimental to the building infrastructure. So as far as I can see there is no way they could ever be correctly authorised to happen in any building.

I do not see why a rent of 3 weeks is more harmful than a rent of 1 month or longer.

[Gilliams]

44 minutes ago, KittenKong said:

I dont see that as a conflict. There can be no question that short rentals are highly detrimental to the "peaceful enjoyment" of other co-owners of their property. They are also highly detrimental to the building infrastructure. So as far as I can see there is no way they could ever be correctly authorised to happen in any building.

I do not see why a rent of 3 weeks is more harmful than a rent of 1 month or longer.

[Gilliams]

There are people who give advice on rumors, without having any knowledge of the context of these rules.

Is there a legal person or lawyer who can provide reliable advice?

[newnative]

On ‎3‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 12:20 AM, cheeryble said:

I don't have anything to do with Airbnb or others and I may be corrected, but pretty sure short rentals are only illegal if it's more then four units.

 

Short-term condo rentals are illegal regardless of the number of units.  

[newnative]

On ‎3‎/‎22‎/‎2018 at 5:45 PM, AJBangkok said:

There is a slight one. The condominium act allows 51% of the owners of a condominium project to set the rules of the condominium. This entitles them to create a rule that short term rentals are not allowed. However If they did that they may be seen to be in conflict with the Thai civil and commercial code of Thailand which states the condominium owner is entitled to the fruits of his ownership of the condominium so long as he does not disturb other co owners .

 

The civil and commercial code undermines the condominium act but to what extent either would be enforceable I have no idea. I have seen advice that each trumps the other.  At the end of the day the one that would win is probably the one that benefits rich Thai people the most.

A condominium cannot set rules that are in conflict with Thai law. Thai Law prohibits short-term condo rentals. 

[newnative]

41 minutes ago, Gilliams said:

I do not see why a rent of 3 weeks is more harmful than a rent of 1 month or longer.

Most short-term rentals are not for 3 weeks.  Lots are for 3 DAYS.  So, instead of 12 strangers living next to you during a year,  (12 rentals of 1 month), you could potentially have a hundred or more--and most of these people, who should be in a hotel, have not been vetted as well as a long-term renter likely would be.  

[xylophone]

5 minutes ago, newnative said:

A condominium cannot set rules that are in conflict with Thai law. Thai Law prohibits short-term condo rentals. 

 

13 minutes ago, newnative said:

Short-term condo rentals are illegal regardless of the number of units

Wanted to quote other posts but lost them!!.............Basically opposing viewpoints with AJBangkok saying its ok and others that it is not.

 

So what is it then? Are short term rentals of condo units illegal or not? 

[newnative]

32 minutes ago, xylophone said:

 

Wanted to quote other posts but lost them!!.............Basically opposing viewpoints with AJBangkok saying its ok and others that it is not.

 

So what is it then? Are short term rentals of condo units illegal or not? 

Illegal.

[KittenKong]

I do not see why a rent of 3 weeks is more harmful than a rent of 1 month or longer.

Clearly the difference between 3 weeks and 4 weeks would not be great. But you do have to draw the line somewhere and for better or worse Thai law has drawn it at 30 days. Personally I think that condo rentals should be for a minimum of 6 months as anything less just causes far too much commotion. In fact I can see a good argument for banning all rentals and only allowing owner--occupiers.
Anyone wanting somewhere for less than 6 months should be in an apartment building or a hotel, both of which are specifically designed for shorter duration rentals.

[Gilliams]

51 minutes ago, KittenKong said:

Clearly the difference between 3 weeks and 4 weeks would not be great. But you do have to draw the line somewhere and for better or worse Thai law has drawn it at 30 days. Personally I think that condo rentals should be for a minimum of 6 months as anything less just causes far too much commotion. In fact I can see a good argument for banning all rentals and only allowing owner--occupiers.
Anyone wanting somewhere for less than 6 months should be in an apartment building or a hotel, both of which are specifically designed for shorter duration rentals.

“Thai law has drawn it at 30 days”

Can you show me that law? and in what context this law is written down?

Thanks in advance

[Wake Up]

My condo does not allow short term rentals less than 30 days per condominium bylaws.  It is strictly enforced and I rent here because of the enforcement. No long term tenants want Air BNB tourists. 

[Wake Up]

4 hours ago, Gilliams said:

I do not see why a rent of 3 weeks is more harmful than a rent of 1 month or longer.

I do and I am glad my building security stops everyone they do not know with a suitcase and does not take bribes from owners that want to rent to Air BNB.