Survivors of Vietnam's My Lai massacre remember 'darkness and silence'

[Jonathan Fairfield]

Survivors of Vietnam's My Lai massacre remember 'darkness and silence'

 

 

QUANG NGAI, Vietnam (Reuters) - It took Pham Thi Thuan a while before she could muster the courage to fetch water from across the ditch where 170 of her neighbours, most of them women and children, were killed by U.S. troops during the Vietnam War.

 

"When I heard cats mewing at night, it sounded like those babies were still crying," said Thuan.

 

On March 16, 1968, 504 people were killed by American soldiers in Son My, a collection of hamlets between the central Vietnamese coast and a ridge of misty mountains, in an incident known in the West as the My Lai Massacre.

 

It was the worst recorded U.S. war crime committed in Vietnam, but preparations for a 50th anniversary ceremony at the site, now a memorial to the victims, are low key.

 

The ceremony falls just one week after a landmark visit by a U.S. aircraft carrier to the nearby port city of Danang, testament to warming ties between the former foes.

 

Because of those better relations, Vietnam is not dwelling on the pain of the past, a senior Vietnamese government official told Reuters.

 

"Vietnam wants to close the door to the past and look to the future," said the official, who declined to be identified, citing the sensitivity of the issue.

 

Dang Ngoc Dung, deputy chairman of the Quang Ngai Province People's Committee, said Vietnam wanted to "befriend everyone now".

 

"We won't let anyone harm us again," said Dung.

 

DARKNESS, SILENCE

 

Vo Cao Loi was 16 when he saw American helicopters buzz low over his family's house on the clear, sunny morning of the massacre.

 

That was not unusual, Loi said. American troops often passed through the area in then U.S.-backed South Vietnam.

 

"We were used to it," said Loi. "But we didn't expect them to kill everybody."

 

Loi's mother gave him a bag filled with rice and spare clothes and told him to hide.

 

He hid beneath coconut trees by a river as U.S. troops dragged women and children out of their houses and shot them.

 

"I could usually see my house from where I was hiding, but there was smoke everywhere. All I could hear were explosions, and the ground was shaking," said Loi, who worried that U.S. soldiers were throwing grenades into village shelters.

 

"I was hoping I was wrong, but it turned out I was right".

 

Loi's mother, older sister and her five-month-old son were killed by a grenade tossed into their shelter.

 

It was not until 3 p.m. that day that the shooting stopped.

 

"Only then did the survivors start crying and wailing," said Loi, who lost 18 relatives in the massacre.

 

There were not enough people left to take the dead to the cemetery, Loi said, so Vietnamese guerrillas helped him bury his family in the grounds of their home.

 

"Everything happened in darkness and silence in fear the Americans would come back".

 

Loi joined the Viet Cong guerrillas after the massacre and fought until the end of the war in 1975.

 

He and his wife now run a coffee shop in a leafy courtyard in Danang filled with photos of trips to France with his children, and a book documenting former U.S. president Barack Obama's trip to Vietnam in 2015.

 

"Vietnam and the U.S. have become partners that trust each other," said Loi.

 

"Nobody wants war."

 

(Additional reporting by Kham Nguyen, Thinh Nguyen and the Hanoi Newsroom; Editing by Robert Birsel)

 

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2018-03-17

[Baerboxer]

And there has never been any justice for the victims nor will there be.

 

 

[punchjudy]

and still going on today on a smaller scale

[Thongkorn]

2 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

And there has never been any justice for the victims nor will there be.

 

 

What about the atrocities of Lowe .thats even more low key 

[ballpoint]

 

[MrMuddle]

No one from the US government, was ever convicted of war crimes, for any of the multitude of atrocities committed in Vietnam, such as Agent Orange, from which victims are still suffering today. 

[ThaiFelix]

The last time I looked up "Vietnam War" on Wikipedia, the first paragraph stated the the US won the war because the North Vietnamese surrendered at the Paris Peace Accords???  So all those videos showing the US running away up the stairs above the embassy to helicopters and then dumping them in the sea off carriers was all about the joy of victory was it??  The lie goes on........

[Grumpy Duck]

I read an article about a couple of helicopter pilots that were unsung heroes actually firing on the offending American troops. They were accredited with the reporting of the incident to congress.

 

Vietnam was the only war in which modern mass media was allowed which caused the enormous amount of anti war sentiment. Since then the military has seriously curtailed media coverage such as in Desert Storm & recent conflicts only allowing friendly news releases or photo ops. Turning media outlets into a “ministry of propaganda”

[ThaiFelix]

7 minutes ago, Grumpy Duck said:

I read an article about a couple of helicopter pilots that were unsung heroes actually firing on the offending American troops. They were accredited with the reporting of the incident to congress.

Yes, I have read they went so far as to fly some of the villagers out to safety away from the US troops who were there "saving the world" from these murderous women and children.

 

On a lighter note I was visiting the war museum in Ho Chi Minh city (Saigon) a few years ago and a 18 to 19 yo girl approached me and asked me what I thought of the museum.  Although being keenly interested in the war since my school days and have read just about every book and seen most documentaries on the subject I was still quite horrified by the photos and displays shown there.  I answered her by saying that I felt a lot of shame because my country fought alongside the US and so was also responsible for the atrocities.  She stunned me to this day by replying that it was all in the past and it was all forgiven.  I doubt I would have felt that way if our roles were reversed.

[Ahab]

1 hour ago, ThaiFelix said:

The last time I looked up "Vietnam War" on Wikipedia, the first paragraph stated the the US won the war because the North Vietnamese surrendered at the Paris Peace Accords???  So all those videos showing the US running away up the stairs above the embassy to helicopters and then dumping them in the sea off carriers was all about the joy of victory was it??  The lie goes on........

Don't think we won the war, but we did pull our military out and then the US congress pulled funding for South Vietnam. Shortly after that South Vietnam fell to the North. The US did evacuate the embassy (those are the famous scenes). however, US helicopters were not dumped into the sea (I always thought that was the case but) the pictures of helicopters being dumped at sea were south Vietnamese pilots that were escaping the Viet Cong. They packed up family and friends and flew out to sea hoping to find a US warship that they could land on. Many more left of boats following the fall. There was no room for the extra aircraft so they were pushed into the sea. Many Vietnamese eventually emigrated to the USA. My barber in Haleiwa Hawaii (Ken) was a Vietnamese boat person/refugee when he was 7 years old, they eventually ended up in a refugee camp in the Philippines and were allowed to come to the USA.

Edited March 17, 2018 by Ahab

[faraday]

And William Calley is still alive.

[Grumpy Duck]

2 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Don't think we won the war, but we did pull our military out and then the US congress pulled funding for South Vietnam. Shortly after that South Vietnam fell to the North. The US did evacuate the embassy (those are the famous scenes). however, US helicopters were not dumped into the sea (I always thought that was the case but) the pictures of helicopters being dumped at sea were south Vietnamese pilots that were escaping the Viet Cong. They packed up family and friends and flew out to sea hoping to find a US warship that they could land on. Many more left of boats following the fall. There was no room for the extra aircraft so they were pushed into the sea. Many Vietnamese eeventually emigrated to the USA. My barber in Haleiwa Hawaii (Ken) was a Vietnamese boat person/refugee when he was 7 years old, they eventually ended up in a refugee camp in the Philippines and were allowed to come to the USA.

I once dated a girl that escaped Vietnam by boat to Thailand. Her father worked for the French Embassy. He had to stay a year or so after the fall so he could collect retirement. 

[Ahab]

2 hours ago, MrMuddle said:

No one from the US government, was ever convicted of war crimes, for any of the multitude of atrocities committed in Vietnam, such as Agent Orange, from which victims are still suffering today. 

Not true, several officers were brought to trial for this incident and the Lt in charge of the massacre was put on trial and convicted in 1971. He served prison time and eventually was released. The Army tried to cover the entire thing up.

 

[sirineou]

 I can't even look at pictures from that Era, I kept thinking of my lovely wife having to go through something like this and it makes me sick to my stomach. 

[Grumpy Duck]

4 minutes ago, faraday said:

And William Calley is still alive.

Yes, he appealed his conviction and for numerous reasons after several years of house arrest he was released. He is a gemologist now. 

[thaiguzzi]

1 hour ago, Ahab said:

Not true, several officers were brought to trial for this incident and the Lt in charge of the massacre was put on trial and convicted in 1971. He served prison time and eventually was released. The Army tried to cover the entire thing up.

 

He was given a life sentence and served THREE DAYS, before Trickie Dickie got him off the hook. He then served 2-3 years "house arrest"...

[ThaiFelix]

A friend of mine was a refugee after the war.  He had to spend some months in a re-education camp before escaping with his family to Malaysia and then Australia.  As "boat people" he told me the worst part of the ordeal was trying to evade the Thai pirates who posed as fishermen.  They would prey on the boat people killing the men and abducting the women as sex slaves.  As a Chinese Vietnamese businessman he lost nearly everything back there but did manage to hide some gold during the war which he lent/gave to family and friends to help them escape after the war.   Over the years his family and friends, who ended up in Canada, the US and Europe paid back the loans and he ended up a wealthy man. He worked for me for a number of years before starting his own business.  He was a very admirable fellow, honest and very hardworking.

[katana]

I read that Mai Lai-type massacres were fairly common at the time in Vietnam. It's just that Mai Lai was one of the few that made it to the press.

[ballpoint]

"I was here in 1974 and people were still afraid to talk to anyone resembling Calley and his murderers. What I had not realised at the time was that the Americans had declared most of Quang Ngai province a 'free fire zone' and that 70 per cent of the villages had been razed. When it was My Lai's turn civilians were being killed at a rate of 50,000 a year. This was known as 'collateral damage'."

 

http://johnpilger.com/articles/vietnam-nbsp-now

 

[ballpoint]

4 hours ago, Ahab said:

Don't think we won the war, but we did pull our military out and then the US congress pulled funding for South Vietnam. Shortly after that South Vietnam fell to the North. The US did evacuate the embassy (those are the famous scenes). however, US helicopters were not dumped into the sea (I always thought that was the case but) the pictures of helicopters being dumped at sea were south Vietnamese pilots that were escaping the Viet Cong. They packed up family and friends and flew out to sea hoping to find a US warship that they could land on. Many more left of boats following the fall. There was no room for the extra aircraft so they were pushed into the sea. Many Vietnamese eventually emigrated to the USA. My barber in Haleiwa Hawaii (Ken) was a Vietnamese boat person/refugee when he was 7 years old, they eventually ended up in a refugee camp in the Philippines and were allowed to come to the USA.

"Some 45 UH-1 Hueys and at least one CH-47 Chinook were pushed overboard to make room for more helicopters to land. Other helicopters dropped off their passengers and were then ditched into the sea by their pilots, close to the ships, their pilots bailing out at the last moment to be picked up by rescue boats".

http://enacademic.com/dic.nsf/enwiki/758518

 

 

 

Edited March 17, 2018 by ballpoint

[Ahab]

4 hours ago, ballpoint said:

"Some 45 UH-1 Hueys and at least one CH-47 Chinook were pushed overboard to make room for more helicopters to land. Other helicopters dropped off their passengers and were then ditched into the sea by their pilots, close to the ships, their pilots bailing out at the last moment to be picked up by rescue boats".

http://enacademic.com/dic.nsf/enwiki/758518

 

 

 

USA made helicopters, operated and owned by the South Vietnamese armed forces. The insignia on the color picture is not US Army (or Air Force), but was from the VNAF. According to Wikipedia about 30 Bell UH-1's were flown to US warships in the Gulf of Tonkin. Various other types of fixed and rotary wing aircraft were flown to Thailand after the fall of South Vietnam in 1975.

[Ahab]

7 hours ago, thaiguzzi said:

He was given a life sentence and served THREE DAYS, before Trickie Dickie got him off the hook. He then served 2-3 years "house arrest"...

I stand corrected.

[Ahab]

A good documentary on the topic 

 

[Carib]

16 minutes ago, Ahab said:

A good documentary on the topic 

 

Not so the topic is : On March 16, 1968, 504 people were killed by American soldiers in Son My, a collection of hamlets between the central Vietnamese coast and a ridge of misty mountains, in an incident known in the West as the My Lai Massacre, and how some of the survivors remember it.

Edited March 17, 2018 by Carib

[StraightTalk]

And if you are really interested - enter 'pentagon papers' into your favorite search engine.

[MrMuddle]

11 hours ago, Ahab said:

Not true, several officers were brought to trial for this incident and the Lt in charge of the massacre was put on trial and convicted in 1971. He served prison time and eventually was released. The Army tried to cover the entire thing up.

 

No one from the US government, was ever convicted of war crimes, for any of the multitude of atrocities committed in Vietnam, such as Agent Orange, from which victims are still suffering today. 

What part of "No one from the US GOVERNMENT was ever brought to trial for war crimes", did you not understand. Try READING other people's posts before wrongly trying to "correct" them.

[MrMuddle]

Interesting, the way a lot of people are posting photos of Helicopters, to try and muddle the issue. The topic is about the US atrocities committed at My Lai.

[StraightTalk]

William Laws Calley Jr. a former United States Army officer convicted by court-martial of murdering 22 unarmed South Vietnamese civilians in the My Lai Massacre.
After three and a half years of house arrest, Calley was released pursuant to a ruling by federal judge.
This sounds like an appropriate sentence fitting the crime...

[Cadbury]

11 hours ago, Ahab said:

Not true, several officers were brought to trial for this incident and the Lt in charge of the massacre was put on trial and convicted in 1971. He served prison time and eventually was released. The Army tried to cover the entire thing up.

 

Only one person was convicted of these murders.... Lt Calley. He was sentenced to life imprisonment with hard labour. Within three days he was out of prison, pending appeal, on the personal instructions of President Richard Nixon.

He spent the next three years under house arrest at Fort Benning in Georgia. Freed on bail in 1974 his sentence was then cut to 10 years. Later that year he was paroled after completing one third of his sentence.

[Carib]

7 minutes ago, SouthernDelight said:

William Laws Calley Jr. a former United States Army officer convicted by court-martial of murdering 22 unarmed South Vietnamese civilians in the My Lai Massacre.
After three and a half years of house arrest, Calley was released pursuant to a ruling by federal judge.
This sounds like an appropriate sentence fitting the crime...

So, if the latest school shooter gets less, it would be ok too following your reasoning? 

You cannot be serious to think this was an appropriate sentence, the original sentence was the appropriate one.