Thai Wagyu Beef in Kap Choeng/Surin.

[khwaibah]

My wife has been involved and I guess I have too in a major project that kicked off back in January and the grand finally stared about 5:30 am this morning with the arrival of 50 head of Thai Wagyu Beef from a farm in Saraburi. Two 10 wheel trucks with extensions, 25 cows per truck. All cows are female. This project was funded by the local government, Surin Livestock Breeding and Research Center Na Bua Surin Thailand, Thai Army and the Surin Agriculture and Livestock Center in Kap Choeng. The residents signed up on first come first serve for their number my wife got number 2 main reason is her involvement in this project and her contacts in the agricultural network. There has been a barn built in the southwest corner of her land on about 2 rai which btw she gets rent for. This barn is about 100 foot long by 60 foot wide. The labor was provided by the locals and took about 4 weeks to construct. A 6 inch well was also provided. The locals have been guaranteed a minimum of 25,000 baht per head by the Wagyu Beef Industry. For info these cattle are not your Thai beef, They are Thai Wagyu Beef  http://bk.asia-city.com/restaurants/news/thai-wagyu-beef-bangkok  I have inclosed some photos and I'm sure there will be more.

 

List of the new owners.

 

 

Looking at the inside of the barn.

 

Arrival

 

 

All cattle are tagged and registered.

 

 

It was long trip and they were tired.

 

 

[ChiangMaiLightning2143]

One look at those calves they are dominant Brahmin cross and surely can take the heat.

Proofs is in the eatin’. Good luck!

[meatboy]

I have been a customer with the PON YANG KHAM livestock co-op for many yrs.so this seems to be on the same wave length where the locals look after the cattle.

where's the bull or is it serum from japan?

[khwaibah]

3 minutes ago, meatboy said:

I have been a customer with the PON YANG KHAM livestock co-op for many yrs.so this seems to be on the same wave length where the locals look after the cattle.

where's the bull or is it serum from japan?

 

The locals have been to numerous seminars 8 hour seasons and even I attended one. The wife has been to been to 3 more and that does not count the local meeting on this subject. There is no bull. It is done by selective insemination.

[kickstart]

As ChiangMaiLightnig said those cattle look like being dominantly Brahman, and that brown calf has some Indo Brazil blood in it .

Typing Wagyu cattle into Google .and looking at the cattle most are black, they are some natural red Wagyu (like Angus),in Australia, they are crossbreeds with a fawn color,in breeding black is a dominant color.so where the white comes from I do not know,not in the Wagyu breed 

What percent Are Wagyu blood these cattle? they is still a lot of Bos Indicus blood in them, Wagye is Bos Taurus breed,  (Indicus breeds have the hump on the shoulders), ears are long, like that brown calf, and that head does not look right.

At a guess, I would say 20% Wagyu?(if that)

Looking at some of those cattle I would say some will we be  2 years old, they will need a lot of feeding to get them fat, they should have been a lot younger if you want to get any condition on them .

 Looking at that shed I hope you will be feeding some form of concentrate those wooden slated troughs will only hold forage, I did notice the blue plastic cut down drums on the floor, are they for a concentrate feed, and what forage will you be feeding. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[khwaibah]

1 hour ago, kickstart said:

As ChiangMaiLightnig said those cattle look like being dominantly Brahman, and that brown calf has some Indo Brazil blood in it .

Typing Wagyu cattle into Google .and looking at the cattle most are black, they are some natural red Wagyu (like Angus),in Australia, they are crossbreeds with a fawn color,in breeding black is a dominant color.so where the white comes from I do not know,not in the Wagyu breed 

What percent Are Wagyu blood these cattle? they is still a lot of Bos Indicus blood in them, Wagye is Bos Taurus breed,  (Indicus breeds have the hump on the shoulders), ears are long, like that brown calf, and that head does not look right.

At a guess, I would say 20% Wagyu?(if that)

Looking at some of those cattle I would say some will we be  2 years old, they will need a lot of feeding to get them fat, they should have been a lot younger if you want to get any condition on them .

 Looking at that shed I hope you will be feeding some form of concentrate those wooden slated troughs will only hold forage, I did notice the blue plastic cut down drums on the floor, are they for a concentrate feed, and what forage will you be feeding. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I have nothing to do or say about this project but only can support the wife in it. This project is strictly between the Surin Livestock Breeding and Research Center and Kap Choeng. All cattle, material and labor have been donated and I have not invested 1 satang into this project. As for the feed the community has about 20 rai of a tropical grass for cattle feed, the photo is of the plantings.. The wife is feeding her cows extra bananas , mangos and and soybean curd. She is getting about 200 lbs of curd a week and another 200 lbs of bananas along with the grass. She has another 7 separate personal cows that she has been feeding this diet to and they all have put on serous weight. This diet I'm am told was suggested by the Surin Livestock and Breading Center. All the female cows will need one to two more years of putting on weight before selective insemination and the locals are aware of this. 

 

The grass plantings. The wife did another rai today.

 

[khwaibah]

18 minutes ago, khwaibah said:

I have nothing to do or say about this project but only can support the wife in it. This project is strictly between the Surin Livestock Breeding and Research Center and Kap Choeng. All cattle, material and labor have been donated and I have not invested 1 satang into this project. As for the feed the community has about 20 rai of a tropical grass for cattle feed, the photo is of the plantings.. The wife is feeding her cows extra bananas , mangos and and soybean curd. She is getting about 200 lbs of curd a week and another 200 lbs of bananas along with the grass. She has another 7 separate personal cows that she has been feeding this diet to and they all have put on serous weight. This diet I'm am told was suggested by the Surin Livestock and Breading Center. All the female cows will need one to two more years of putting on weight before selective insemination and the locals are aware of this. 

 

The grass plantings. The wife did another rai today.

 

 

 

This above grass stock comes from Kalasan

[khwaibah]

This seed was supplied by the Surin Livestock & Breading.

 

[kickstart]

Those grass stems are Nappier, well old probaly Nappier Pacchon II, a popular grass now being promoted by the DLD, Department of Livstock Development,

We grow some, different verity, it is all right but it needs a lot of urea fertilizer to grow well and must be cut at no more than 50 days old, after that the protein value soon drops, stems get hard and cattal will not waist more than they eat 

Purple Guinea not a bad grass again needs feeding ,does not like a lot of water, ie growing in ex-rice paddies, needs cutting regularly soon gets old and protein drops.

But,they will have to feed some form of concentrate to those cattle, they will not get fat on grass alone, just grow a bit, and no serious buyer will look at them, or will offer a very low price,  but heifers do tend to flatten just a bit quicker than bulls. 

Interesting diet your wife is feeding her cattle, bananas, well this year they are as cheap as they have ever been, and not a bad feed ,that soybean curd ,would that be Gut-Toare,in Thai .the bi-product from the Lactasoy milk factory, it is feed to dairy cows around here, been trying to find out the feed value, it has milk powder in the mix .protein is about 18% ? but has a low DM dry matter, or it has a lot of water in it .

 Can not understand why your local DLD says it will be another 2 years before you can serve your heifers ,(you call them cows, I take it they are heifers ), we have reared heifers and when they are 18 months old  they are in calf ,we have one now, if they weigh about 250 kg and come on heat ,get them served ,in 2 years how old  will they be then ,how much  will you have invested in them before you get a calf back .

 

 

 

 

[khwaibah]

10 hours ago, kickstart said:

Those grass stems are Nappier, well old probaly Nappier Pacchon II, a popular grass now being promoted by the DLD, Department of Livstock Development,

We grow some, different verity, it is all right but it needs a lot of urea fertilizer to grow well and must be cut at no more than 50 days old, after that the protein value soon drops, stems get hard and cattal will not waist more than they eat 

Purple Guinea not a bad grass again needs feeding ,does not like a lot of water, ie growing in ex-rice paddies, needs cutting regularly soon gets old and protein drops.

But,they will have to feed some form of concentrate to those cattle, they will not get fat on grass alone, just grow a bit, and no serious buyer will look at them, or will offer a very low price,  but heifers do tend to flatten just a bit quicker than bulls. 

Interesting diet your wife is feeding her cattle, bananas, well this year they are as cheap as they have ever been, and not a bad feed ,that soybean curd ,would that be Gut-Toare,in Thai .the bi-product from the Lactasoy milk factory, it is feed to dairy cows around here, been trying to find out the feed value, it has milk powder in the mix .protein is about 18% ? but has a low DM dry matter, or it has a lot of water in it .

 Can not understand why your local DLD says it will be another 2 years before you can serve your heifers ,(you call them cows, I take it they are heifers ), we have reared heifers and when they are 18 months old  they are in calf ,we have one now, if they weigh about 250 kg and come on heat ,get them served ,in 2 years how old  will they be then ,how much  will you have invested in them before you get a calf back .

 

 

 

 

To my knowledge the only fertilized that is being used is from the cows wet brings up the point the my wife goes organic. Just to the was side of the barn is a compost area which is well under way which my wife will get first dibs on but most will be sold. The soya Curd is coming for a friend she has at the Chom Chong Market who has a very large soya milk distribution. She is getting this curd as it is produced. When the wife is mixing the curd with other items the fermentation of the curd will get your attention, those are some happy girls. The Surin DLS Is to supply a commercial grass cutter/shredder a mixer and a feed pellet machine at which point all ingredients will be introduced then sacked used and extra sold. All of the participants of this project have all ready taken 5 each 50 kilo bags per cow from the Surin DLS to get started. The below photos I took at the Surin DLS seminar I went to and their operation in Surin The wife went to two more at this location. At this location they have about 50 as you say heifer a feed process facility and they do sell processed Wagyu beef, there are at least 6 restaurants and out lets in Surin alone that is selling the beef, the larger market being Bangkok.

 

Compost.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Bagged feed

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

My group

 

 

 

 

 

and LUNCH.

 

[khwaibah]

15 minutes ago, khwaibah said:

To my knowledge the only fertilized that is being used is from the cows. WBTW brings up the point the my wife goes organic. Just to the east side of the barn is a compost area which is well under way where my wife will get first dibs on but most will be sold. The soya Curd is coming from a friend she has at the Chom Chong Market who has a very large soya milk distribution. She is getting this curd as it is produced. When the wife is mixing the curd with other items the fermentation of the curd will get your attention, those are some happy girls. The Surin DLS Is to supply a commercial grass cutter/shredder a mixer and a feed pellet machine at which point all ingredients will be introduced then sacked used and extra sold. All of the participants of this project have all ready taken 5 each 50 kilo bags per cow from the Surin DLS to get started. The below photos I took at the Surin DLS seminar I went to and their operation in Surin The wife went to two more at this location. At this location they have about 50 as you say heifer a feed process facility and they do sell processed Wagyu beef, there are at least 6 restaurants and out lets in Surin alone that is selling the beef, the larger market being Bangkok. The wife make a trip to the Chong Chom market area about every other day and bring back from 200 to 300 kilos of bananas/mangos/curd and anything else she can get . She has vendors that call her.  The GPS of the Surin operation.. 14.8379578564, 103.581502375

Compost.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Bagged feed

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

My group

 

 

 

 

 

and LUNCH.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[kickstart]

A good idea going organic, but for the hassle involved you would want a premium price for the meat, and the main problem  would be finding a market, for organic beef.

A Thai frind of mine tryed organic milk, with ordenry milk farm a  gate price of 18-19 baht/ Kg, organic milk 25 baht/Kg, well worth doing, but he had a problem, the milk buyer riped him off, and trying to  sause  organic feeds, not easy ,he found a supplyer of organic rice bran , expencive ,but he found his cows diet was shot of enagey, and he had an infertilty problem, he was lucky in that he had some land and could grow some grass, a lot of Nappier, but he still had that infertilty problem.

If you misses went organic, could she feed that soya waste, growing soy is hardly what you call organic, guy end of our soi grows soya bean and the chemicals he uses........ , you could have the same problem with beef cattle, not finding good quality feeds  you would not  have enough energy or protein in the diet you will have  slow growth rates.

Growing grass without chemical fertilizer, not easy you will need all that compost you have plus more on 1-2 rie ,for the grass to grow, and then the grass quality will not be the same.

Any idea what price the farmers are getting for there  Wagyu beef, the average market price for ordinary beef is about 100-110 baht/Kg .  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[khwaibah]

1 hour ago, kickstart said:

A good idea going organic, but for the hassle involved you would want a premium price for the meat, and the main problem  would be finding a market, for organic beef.

 

They have  already been contracted out for 25,000 baht minimum. As I said in another post there are at least 6 restaurants and shops in Surin and a heck of a lot more in Bangkok. The demand is there and thats one reason the main operation in Surin has set up shop in Kap Choeng. They need more Thai Wagyu Beef. Btw I was some what off on the time frame of insemination. 3 of the heifers got the trick done to them today by the SDLS.

 

 

[CLW]

I followed this thread for a while and was waiting for reply from some experienced members, all ahead kickstart.

I have my own opinion about the whole project. I looks all too much "Thai" for me.
I'm an optimistic person but I don't think it will have much success but wish your wife good luck.

It starts with the structure and implement of the barn. Was there no money to erect a proper structure without wood and improved plastic bins. You can get stuff at reasonable quality now from China.

The genetic traits of your cows may not be optimal. As already mentioned wagyu crossbreeds so far have done with Angus or even Fleckvieh or Brown Swiss.
Therefore the meat quality and marbling score could be disappointing.
That leads me to the next point, your sales potential. Yes they have a contract for a certain amount and time. But as I foresee the meat quality is not satisfying the buyer will look for other suppliers.
To enhance and build marbled meat one must follow a strict and special diet that varies with the age of your cattle.
I'm not sure if they can supply this to the cows.
What you describe as feed sounds unconventional but could work to a certain extent.
Please see my comment not as criticism.
More as suggestions for improvement.

However unfortunately I give this project two years and then it will be forgotten.

[khwaibah]

11 hours ago, CLW said:

Yes they have a contract for a certain amount and time.

 

They do I don't. Just saying. And remember all the heifers are not my wife there are 49 other owners that are being supported by the SDLS and Thai Wagyu Beef has been raised and sold for 6 years now.

 

The Breed

The so-called “Thai wagyu” is a crossbreed between Australian or Japanese wagyu and Charolais, Brahman or Holstein cattle. “I’m the one who named it ‘Thai wagyu,’” says Thanabodee Ratchana, the man behind Best Country Beef butcher shop (see below). “About six years ago, some big people in Surin happened to import a wagyu bull. They let Suranari University keep its sperm and distribute it to local farmers. From there on, the wagyu-cross cattle has spread to many more farms in Buriram, Mukdahan, Nakhon Ratchasima and throughout Isaan.” 

[khwaibah]

Yesterdays 3 heifers were done by Red Brahman insemination. 

[kickstart]

CWL

16 hours ago, CLW said:

To enhance and build marbled meat one must follow a strict and special diet that varies with the age of your cattle.
I'm not sure if they can supply this to the cows.

 

      I could not agree with you more, that  diet has to be sorted out, but this being Thailand, the owners are thinking about money, a guaranted minimin  price of 25 000 baht the owners are thinking feed cheep grass only will help keep the profit margins high, but it will not work ,some concentrat will have to be feed ,which at say 7-9 baht/ kg will eat in the they profit margin, that photo of that brown calf /young heiffer, that will have to be fed some concentrat feed, the owner of that one will be lucky to make any money ,some are so thin it will take most of they 25k to get any condition on them. 

The diet the op's wife is feeding made me smile, but I would be worred about digestive problems, at the worse rumen acidosis, some bicarbanat of soda in the feed would help with digestion.

As for the shed  I do not agree, it will be good enough for the job, and as the op said labour was donated, I have seen many farms with this type of  shed, and they  use the blue plastic drums as feed troughs ,our own place included ,they work well ,does help to keep costs down ,maybe in a few years if the job takes off build a better shed  .  

Back to the breeds ,I think, re think they got riped off, if that  brown  calf /heifer has any Wagyu  blood in  it I would be supprised, Google Wagyu beef /crossbreeds  and look at the images, keep an image, a flick backwards and forwards and compair them ,to the  op's photos ,I do not think they is a lot of Wagyu blood in they  ,do you see any brown specked  stock or white stock,  as you said if the quality is not they buyers will look else where .

The op said they have have been going for 6 years, using your own local stock, like the black heifers in the photos, they should do well, but this lot from Saraburi, can not see it 

 

The Best Country Beef said  the Holstine is a native breed,the Holstein breed is the Holstine Freisaian  an extreme dairy breed originating from the USA a lot of Thai dairy cows have some Holstein blood in them, some crossbreed Holstein  blood in a Wagyu would  work you would have a bigger animal but they must be feed very  well to produce any quality meat  .an Angus cross would be the better choice, smaller animale easier to rear 

[khwaibah]

Good morning.

 

[khwaibah]

Amphur is kicking in kit with more to come.

 

New feed shredder.

 

 

 

[khwaibah]

The Wagyu Beef is going full boar and for that matter we were informed last night that another heard of 28 heifers are coming are way. This info is provided by the Kap Choeng Department of Livestock Development. This will bring the operation to 78 head. An extension of the existing facility is underway.  More product is being used for the their diet.

 

 

 

[CLW]

The Wagyu Beef is going full boar and for that matter we were informed last night that another heard of 28 heifers are coming are way. This info is provided by the Kap Choeng Department of Livestock Development. This will bring the operation to 78 head. An extension of the existing facility is underway.  More product is being used for the their diet.
 

 
 

I guess the new feed is only the left bag because the right one is labelled broiler starter for chicken. Or did they refill the bags?

[khwaibah]

Refill.

[khwaibah]

5 minutes ago, CLW said:

26 minutes ago, khwaibah said:

The Wagyu Beef is going full boar and for that matter we were informed last night that another heard of 28 heifers are coming are way. This info is provided by the Kap Choeng Department of Livestock Development. This will bring the operation to 78 head. An extension of the existing facility is underway.  More product is being used for the their diet.
 

 
 

I guess the new feed is only the left bag because the right one is labelled broiler starter for chicken. Or did they refill the bags?

 

The boss still has some KFC on the payroll.

[khwaibah]

Wednesday 60 from Kap Choeng payed a visit this morning to the Surin Livestock Breeding and Research Center Na Bua Surin Thailand on the 241 highway. The occasion was an observance of the upcoming Royal Ploughing Ceremony May 14. The Governor of Surin was the main speaker along with others. There were about 1000 people in attendance. This exhibit is a one day only advent and unless your Thai partner is involved as mine is doubt seriously you would of known. This was very well put to gather, it would rival the Surin Age fair that was held a few months back. The main attraction were the BUFFLO'S and I am talking the 1.4 million baht kind. There were educational booths staffed by some serious good looking uni eye candy that spoke very good english, Kasetsart University. There was very large display of new farm equipment AND there is 3 rai section that is smack on the 214 that is on their property, it is planted with corn and napier grass. The did demonstration with some of the equipment for harvesting and feed preparation. They had very willing subjects to taste it. The SLBRC is turning their site into a must stop and see. They have set up on the highway about 8 rai of demonstration area for buffalo and cows. When you come don to SI the SLBRC is on your left and just before the Hanes Panty Hose Factory. BTW the Wagyu Beef farm in Surin had a booth set up selling Wagyu Beef and giving CRU a plug. SWMBO bought a 16oz steak for me to try out tonight. 400 baht.

 

Star of the show. 1.4M baht.

 

 

Cheap Charlie at 250K

 

 

Educational.

[CLW]

Nice pictures and background information.
Though I will never understand this bull keeping thing for prestige.
Probably a Thai thing, same as fighting cocks.
Did you notice from which campus the Kasetsart University came from?

[CLW]

For those who want to dive deeper into the scientific of cow keeping I might introduce two of my professors in this field

Associate Prof. Somkiert Prasanpanich

https://anscku.wordpress.com/somkiert/


Assist.Prof.Dr. Panwadee Sopannarath

e-mail:[email protected]

[VocalNeal]

I went to a place in Khon Kaen that purported to raise Kobe Beef in Thailand. Although in fairness the guy looked more Yakuza than farmer.

[khwaibah]

1 hour ago, CLW said:

Nice pictures and background information.
Though I will never understand this bull keeping thing for prestige.
Probably a Thai thing, same as fighting cocks.
Did you notice from which campus the Kasetsart University came from?

 

To my knowledge. 

Kasetsart University Kamphaeng Saen Campus - University

1 Malaiman Rd

Kamphaeng Saen, Amphoe Kamphaeng Saen

Chang Wat Nakhon Pathom 73140

Thailand

 

 

 

+66 34 281 053

 

kps.ku.ac.th

[khwaibah]

1 hour ago, CLW said:

Nice pictures and background information.
Though I will never understand this bull keeping thing for prestige.
Probably a Thai thing, same as fighting cocks.
Did you notice from which campus the Kasetsart University came from?

 

http://kukr.lib.ku.ac.th/db/kukr/   This is from a flyer they gave me.

[khwaibah]

Buffalo Database that they gave out. http://agkb.lib.ku.ac.th/buffalo