Almost 40% Of Workers Say Minimum Wage Not Enough: Poll

[Happyman58]

I dont believe this survey about 40% of workers in Thailand think the minimum wage is to low? Why? Because you would be flat out finding 40% of the population who do actually have a job in Thailand judging by the amount of men i see in Ubon walking around  doing nothing. I may be wrong and they might be nightshifters but somehow i doubt it.

[digger70]

19 hours ago, midas said:

But spare a thought for the poor old businessman who has invested his fortune in this country (duped because he thought it was cheap labour but he wasn't warned about the gross inefficiencies although that's a different story)

you can't expect an even higher  minimum wage which in 2011 inexplicably suddenly shot up from 215 to 300 a day in one day and when compared to neighbouring countries Thailand has already priced itself out of the market particularly when you consider all the public holidays they have here. Labour costs in countries such as Cambodia, Vietnam, Laos and Myanmar is already a much better deal, not only in terms of the daily minimum wage but the added benefits of a much better worker attitude than in Thailand and far superior English speaking skills.

 

 

Minimum wage might be THB 300 +   Somewhere    But most Labourers down here only get THB200/250 per Day In some cases LESS,,,,   They should get payed on Performance,, Than Maybe  some Can Earn THB 300,,

Some maybe THB 100. 

[smutcakes]

19 hours ago, midas said:

But spare a thought for the poor old businessman who has invested his fortune in this country (duped because he thought it was cheap labour but he wasn't warned about the gross inefficiencies although that's a different story)

you can't expect an even higher  minimum wage which in 2011 inexplicably suddenly shot up from 215 to 300 a day in one day and when compared to neighbouring countries Thailand has already priced itself out of the market particularly when you consider all the public holidays they have here. Labour costs in countries such as Cambodia, Vietnam, Laos and Myanmar is already a much better deal, not only in terms of the daily minimum wage but the added benefits of a much better worker attitude than in Thailand and far superior English speaking skills.

 

 

You are clearly speaking as someone with zero experience of working in Cambodia, Vietnam Laos or Myanmar. Yes the labor rate is higher than those countries, but all of them have their own structural problems which still make Thailand a very competitive package for manufacturers. All of those are incredibly difficult to get started in business and make Thailand look great when it comes to bureaucracy. Vietnam is getting their but the infrastructure is shocking. Laos and Cambodia are tiny insignificant markets, landlocked, having limited utility capacity and high utility costs, and Myanmar is miles behind again.

 

Yes Thailand has its problems, but whilst the labour cost is higher than competitors, there are many other factors in decision making and overall Thailand still has a good package to offer.

[selftaopath]

24 minutes ago, Happyman58 said:

I dont believe this survey about 40% of workers in Thailand think the minimum wage is to low? Why? Because you would be flat out finding 40% of the population who do actually have a job in Thailand judging by the amount of men i see in Ubon walking around  doing nothing. I may be wrong and they might be nightshifters but somehow i doubt it.

Same thing here. We have many many able bodied men in our village and surrounding ones basically talking/swinging on hammocks/ fighting chickens/and of course taking a nap. Women see very industrious however. 

[kannot]

8 hours ago, selftaopath said:

Is there... I suspect... a different mind set and work ethic in Thailand compared to other countries?  I've been confused by reactions when I offered work...told unemployed to tell me how much they wanted for said job.... only to be told "no thanks." They claimed the reason were: too hot/too heavy/too difficult/ too high/ to this to that... For people who are undoubtedly in poverty I can not understand turning down work; especially when I offered much more baht than the prevailing wage.

Nail on the head there mate...............I can rephrase it  all for you though "bone idle"

[Happyman58]

4 hours ago, selftaopath said:

Same thing here. We have many many able bodied men in our village and surrounding ones basically talking/swinging on hammocks/ fighting chickens/and of course taking a nap. Women see very industrious however. 

My friend and i will call you my friend you absolutely correct. In my village when i walk i see able bodied men at 9 in the morning sitting n the front of the house doing nothing I am talking about guys in there 20s and 30s able bodied men doing nothing. Its not the week-end i am talking about but week days. My step daughter and i love her dearly said to me the other day and raised my eyelids She said i have to admit i am very lazy and hate work I thought you are not the only Thai who thinks like that There are millions who think like that Its a worry  But you right Thai women seem to be the bread winners mostly

[Happyman58]

55 minutes ago, kannot said:

Nail on the head there mate...............I can rephrase it  all for you though "bone idle"

spot on   They would sooner starve than work Reason why there are over 1 million foreign workers in Thailand working on construction sites Bloody shame really

[mommysboy]

Certainly, we see a pattern in most countries of stagnant wages and an ever rising cost of living.  But I find many of us, perhaps including many expat retirees, have unrealistic expectations, so a lot of this is about people living beyond their means.  For instance, it may no longer be possible for newly weds to move out of the family house, let alone buy their own home.  As for getting a divorce later down the line and expecting the same amount of money to finance 2 households...dream on!

[mommysboy]

10 hours ago, selftaopath said:

Is there... I suspect... a different mind set and work ethic in Thailand compared to other countries?  I've been confused by reactions when I offered work...told unemployed to tell me how much they wanted for said job.... only to be told "no thanks." They claimed the reason were: too hot/too heavy/too difficult/ too high/ to this to that... For people who are undoubtedly in poverty I can not understand turning down work; especially when I offered much more baht than the prevailing wage.

Hmm... I see it from both angles.  There's a great deal of truth in what you say.  It is, however, a very hot country to be going about work in the same way as we do in the west.  I've done a couple of spells of very hard work in my life, and it took its toll in terms of physical and mental well-being.  It's not a banana skin I'd want to slip on again.  

[djayz]

What do they expect? Most of them put very little, if any, effort, dedication or thought into their jobs. They have practically zero skills or knowledge of what they're selling. They're usually heads down in their phones, looking at themselves in mirrors, hiding around corners, feeling eachers' bottoms or picking their noses. If you ask them a simple question about a product (in Thai or English) you often get the usual "mai ruu" or "mai mee" answer.

Useless the most of them. 

Pay the diligent, skilled, dedicated employees a good, fair salary/wage and sack the rest of them. 

 

[Eligius]

22 minutes ago, djayz said:

What do they expect? Most of them put very little, if any, effort, dedication or thought into their jobs. They have practically zero skills or knowledge of what they're selling. They're usually heads down in their phones, looking at themselves in mirrors, hiding around corners, feeling eachers' bottoms or picking their noses. If you ask them a simple question about a product (in Thai or English) you often get the usual "mai ruu" or "mai mee" answer.

Useless the most of them. 

Pay the diligent, skilled, dedicated employees a good, fair salary/wage and sack the rest of them. 

 

I had to laugh at what you wrote (above), Djayz - as I recognised so much of it as very, very true, from my own experience. Generally I make it a rule not to bother to ask a Thai shop 'assistant' in a supermarket or store if they have a particular product, as they are worse than useless - frequently saying 'mai mee' (no have) when there is a whole stack or shelf full of the product right behind them!

 

However, the lack of interest in the job and lack of effort in the workplace is a real chicken-and-egg situation: perhaps if workers were paid a LIVABLE wage, they would have more incentive to work harder and with a keener desire to expand their knowledge of the job and all it entails.

 

I know that I would not be inclined to work particularly hard if I were paid the appalling wages that many Thais are given - and this even applies to young and youngish Thais with Master's degrees, teaching at universities: street vendors and taxi drivers earn more than they do! I don't know that I would be inclined - if I were born in Thailand - to study really hard when I end up being paid less than a street vendor is able to earn (and I am not saying that street vendors earn a fortune, either!). 

 

Edited May 2, 2018 by Eligius

[metisdead]

A post in which the quoted content had been translated into French language has been removed as well as a reply. 

[djayz]

8 minutes ago, Eligius said:

I had to laugh at what you wrote (above), Djayz - as I recognised so much of it as very, very true, from my own experience. Generally I make it a rule not to bother to ask a Thai shop 'assistant' in a supermarket or store if they have a particular product, as they are worse than useless - frequently saying 'mai mee' (no have) when there is a whole stack or shelf full of the product right behind them!

 

However, the lack of interest in the job and lack of effort in the workplace is a real chicken-and-egg situation: perhaps if workers were paid a LIVABLE wage, they would have more incentive to work harder and with a keener desire to expand their knowledge of the job and all it entails.

 

I know that I would not be inclined to work particularly hard if I were paid the appalling wages that many Thais are given - and this even applies to young and youngish Thais with Master's degrees, teaching at universities: street vendors and taxi drivers earn more than they do! I don't know that I would be inclined - if I were born in Thailand - to study really hard when I end up being paid less than a street vendor is able to earn (and I am not saying that she/ he earns a fortune, either!). 

 

That's why I strongly believe that good employees should earn more/a decent income. 

[kannot]

2 hours ago, mommysboy said:

Hmm... I see it from both angles.  There's a great deal of truth in what you say.  It is, however, a very hot country to be going about work in the same way as we do in the west.  I've done a couple of spells of very hard work in my life, and it took its toll in terms of physical and mental well-being.  It's not a banana skin I'd want to slip on again.  

Its  actually  easy to mitigate it  all, you start as  soon as its  light, 6am, you stop at 10.30 am and do nothing until about 3-4pm then work until dark, Ive done this the last 5  years when temps often exceeded 38c on my land.

Laying concrete, digging, shovelling stone by the ton, etc etc If you do this you can get in at least 7  hours  full work in a day.

[kannot]

1 hour ago, Eligius said:

I had to laugh at what you wrote (above), Djayz - as I recognised so much of it as very, very true, from my own experience. Generally I make it a rule not to bother to ask a Thai shop 'assistant' in a supermarket or store if they have a particular product, as they are worse than useless - frequently saying 'mai mee' (no have) when there is a whole stack or shelf full of the product right behind them!

 

However, the lack of interest in the job and lack of effort in the workplace is a real chicken-and-egg situation: perhaps if workers were paid a LIVABLE wage, they would have more incentive to work harder and with a keener desire to expand their knowledge of the job and all it entails.

 

I know that I would not be inclined to work particularly hard if I were paid the appalling wages that many Thais are given - and this even applies to young and youngish Thais with Master's degrees, teaching at universities: street vendors and taxi drivers earn more than they do! I don't know that I would be inclined - if I were born in Thailand - to study really hard when I end up being paid less than a street vendor is able to earn (and I am not saying that street vendors earn a fortune, either!). 

 

Ive tried every conceivable way to get them to work well and NOTHING has yet done that, 800 baht a  day, 5  day week still get crap workers, most unwilling or unable to think and certainly unable/unwilling to change their lifetime of bad habits. This is working on the land.

When very hot hours changed to 6.30am to 10.30 am then 3 till 6pm that 4.5  hours for lunch, nope no joy at all.

[Eligius]

2 minutes ago, kannot said:

Ive tried every conceivable way to get them to work well and NOTHING has yet done that, 800 baht a  day, 5  day week still get crap workers, most unwilling or unable to think and certainly unable/unwilling to change their lifetime of bad habits. This is working on the land.

When very hot hours changed to 6.30am to 10.30 am then 3 till 6pm that 4.5  hours for lunch, nope no joy at all.

Interesting, but depressing and disheartening to read the above, Kannot ...

It may be that Thailand needs a bit more of the 'Protestant work ethic' (OK - a lot more!).

 

However, I do know Thais who work hard - and get paid peanuts for doing so. I really pity them. I would not like to be in their position.

[Bangkokazy]

Asian blue labor has wage for effort and therefore salary is low.
It does matter how many hours they are at work when they are only efective 20 to 30 minutes a day

[bangrak]

IMHO, the issue lies somewhere else: are the majority of Thai employed persons ready to work as hard as the Burmese and Cambodians? Erm ... As my, Thai, wife often repeats: all Thais want to have a job, notmany want to work for the money.

[bangrak]

9 hours ago, smutcakes said:

You are clearly speaking as someone with zero experience of working in Cambodia, Vietnam Laos or Myanmar. Yes the labor rate is higher than those countries, but all of them have their own structural problems which still make Thailand a very competitive package for manufacturers. All of those are incredibly difficult to get started in business and make Thailand look great when it comes to bureaucracy. Vietnam is getting their but the infrastructure is shocking. Laos and Cambodia are tiny insignificant markets, landlocked, having limited utility capacity and high utility costs, and Myanmar is miles behind again.

 

Yes Thailand has its problems, but whilst the labour cost is higher than competitors, there are many other factors in decision making and overall Thailand still has a good package to offer.

'...still a good package...', seen at the size of a large enterprise, wherein the Burmese and so will do all of the hard work, with a mass of Thais attempting by all means to escape to as much as possible of the workload, ...not to speak about the inept, lazy, racistic, brutal foremen abusing of them!

[bangrak]

16 hours ago, starky said:

Yeah except Aussies love a whinge and just happen to have the luxury of the highest minimum wage payment in the world at near 18 dollars and hour imagine how they would be carrying on if the were taking home 12 dollars a day. Poor Thais are getting screwed an they receive nothing even resembling a "living" wage.

Nobody stops you from raising the salary of your Thai workers at the Aus level, but let me guess: you don't have any, making you one of those stearmen sitting on the pier. I come from a, generations long, deeply involved, socialist family. But as my great' grandfather, himself an industrial enterpreneur, fighting for the wellbeing of the workers, I stand by the principle that a worker, any worker, acquires, and deserves the respect of employers and society first and main by the work he delivers. 

[bangrak]

On 1-5-2018 at 3:21 PM, worgeordie said:

Having people working 6 days a week is beyond the pale,when I started

work (just after the industrial revolution)many ,many years ago,you had

to work 5.5 days a week,I don't know what the average working week is

in the UK now,?, I suppose the employers look at it,why would they need

more time off,they are not earning enough to go anywhere or do anything !

 

It seems to me the workers here are living to work,not working for a living.

the 1 % are doing very well off the backs of the workers,I am not a communist

or a socialist, been a businessman,company owner all my working life,Its

just that Thailand needs to desperately improve conditions and pay for its

working population,some will say its got to be this way to compete with

other countries in the area,well I say what about giving some of the profits

back to the workers,instead of the already wealthy owners and shareholders.

Then some will say Thais are lazy,they deserve what they get,I would not give

my best effort either for the long hours and pitance offered.

regards worgeordie

Not a centenary, far off, I remember very well working 6 days a week, in Belgium... Thought the British had it better then at 5 1/2 days a week, already 'elsewhere' on Frifay afternoons, often drunk as skunks on Saturday mornings, waiting for the noon clock to run back to the pubs, ...already preparing for the awfull quality glitches on Monday (morning?). Been there, seen that. Outside of Ireland, among other 'temperate' countries, I've seen only worse in Poland!

Edited May 2, 2018 by bangrak

[greeneking]

60% think it's enough?

[bangrak]

On 1-5-2018 at 3:21 PM, worgeordie said:

Having people working 6 days a week is beyond the pale,when I started

work (just after the industrial revolution)many ,many years ago,you had

to work 5.5 days a week,I don't know what the average working week is

in the UK now,?, I suppose the employers look at it,why would they need

more time off,they are not earning enough to go anywhere or do anything !

 

It seems to me the workers here are living to work,not working for a living.

the 1 % are doing very well off the backs of the workers,I am not a communist

or a socialist, been a businessman,company owner all my working life,Its

just that Thailand needs to desperately improve conditions and pay for its

working population,some will say its got to be this way to compete with

other countries in the area,well I say what about giving some of the profits

back to the workers,instead of the already wealthy owners and shareholders.

Then some will say Thais are lazy,they deserve what they get,I would not give

my best effort either for the long hours and pitance offered.

regards worgeordie

Come on, Thais 'living for working'? LOL

[bangrak]

8 minutes ago, greeneking said:

60% think it's enough?

Could it be these 60% do realise they already don't earn(deserve) the money they get today?

Would be a shock to me they'd have that clarity of mind, but hey, who knows? 

[kannot]

1 hour ago, Eligius said:

Interesting, but depressing and disheartening to read the above, Kannot ...

It may be that Thailand needs a bit more of the 'Protestant work ethic' (OK - a lot more!).

 

However, I do know Thais who work hard - and get paid peanuts for doing so. I really pity them. I would not like to be in their position.

5 years and  still havent found the right person, yeah it IS depressing, getting close to selling up the land and houses that I worked damned hard to build. Still find it hard to believe that there isnt a Thai who wouldnt want this  job. The first 3-4 years were real hard  work as time goes by the real work gets less and less and is  now  getting close to completion  which means the last person to work here actually has the easiest job with the highest pay.

[kannot]

1 hour ago, Eligius said:

Interesting, but depressing and disheartening to read the above, Kannot ...

It may be that Thailand needs a bit more of the 'Protestant work ethic' (OK - a lot more!).

 

However, I do know Thais who work hard - and get paid peanuts for doing so. I really pity them. I would not like to be in their position.

Send em to me.....really!!!

[the guest]

Probably to do with the debt that Thais have got themselves into. Mortgage, car finance payments, credit cards etc... Before the government relaxed lending, Thais were doing ok, now they are up to their eyeballs in debt.

[bangrak]

10 minutes ago, the guest said:

Probably to do with the debt that Thais have got themselves into. Mortgage, car finance payments, credit cards etc... Before the government relaxed lending, Thais were doing ok, now they are up to their eyeballs in debt.

No credit cards, debit cards, same-same but, very, different, especially for bankers...

By the way, it was published in 'the other paper' the average debt per head in Thailand is now at 10 months of salary... 

[mommysboy]

1 hour ago, kannot said:

5 years and  still havent found the right person, yeah it IS depressing, getting close to selling up the land and houses that I worked damned hard to build. Still find it hard to believe that there isnt a Thai who wouldnt want this  job. The first 3-4 years were real hard  work as time goes by the real work gets less and less and is  now  getting close to completion  which means the last person to work here actually has the easiest job with the highest pay.

Have you thought about lowering the wage and not expecting them to do much?  Then offering them extra if they put in a bit of effort.  In this way, you might get what you want out of them. Thais love to feel they are putting one over on you.

[kannot]

5 hours ago, mommysboy said:

Have you thought about lowering the wage and not expecting them to do much?  Then offering them extra if they put in a bit of effort.  In this way, you might get what you want out of them. Thais love to feel they are putting one over on you.

Tried that, start at 10k and increase every year by 2k a  month if they stay and work ok, last Burma kid was the best but "went  off" after  about 20  months, He was a mad  football fan, even bought him a signed shirt from the UK of Terry?? someone, Team Captain of Chelsea or  summat and told him if  he stayed 4  years i would fly  him to the UK for a trip so he could go see "his team" for real. He  would mention it every so often and i confirmed I would do it. Then after 20  months he  started "being sick" and after 3  days "sick" said he would be working the next day. The next day he walked up and said he was going..

As for "not doing much" well these  days there really isnt much to do at all, ive done it for a a  few  months and keeping everything tidy can be done with 3  hours  work a  day and thats it.