Trump cancels summit with North Korea's Kim, warns that military ready

[AsiaHand]

9 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Kim wins. Now nations are going to ease on the sanctions blaming "trump" for the failure in diplomacy. Art of the schlemiel.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

You will see no easing of any of the sanctions except for Iran,China.Syria and a few others that are already supplying him.The other nations do not want any sanctions on themselves from The US.Little "Rocket Man" had no intention of giving up hie 20-30 atomic warheads,the test site being eliminated was a no brainier as it was no longer useful,so Kim has nothing to trade .Why meet him for nothing?  .Now tell us something to clarify your statement or are you just chiming in ?

[Jonnapat]

Did anyone seriously think that this was ever going to happen?

We're not all fools

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, Jonnapat said:

Did anyone seriously think that this was ever going to happen?

We're not all fools

I thought it was possible. I never thought instant "de-nuclearization" was possible though. Not even close.  "trump" had a lot to gain by at least putting on a superficial show that might be at least seen as Nobel Prize worthy by his hard core base that buys anything he says. 

[sirineou]

4 hours ago, lannarebirth said:

 

Despite the agreements in place which were only used to legitimise large multinational corporations doing big business with Iran, we never left square one. Both countries are projecting malice to their neighboring countries at a greater level than before agreements were signed.

If you were a country and you faced an existential threat would you react with  "malice" toward that threat or will you be all rainbows and unicorns? If Iran had armed forces in Mexico or any other american continent country don't you  think the US would react with "malice"?

The US is complaining that Russia attempted to interfere in the US election, Didn't the US overthrow the democratically elected government in Iran and install Shah of Iran who with the help of the CIA and SAVAK brutally suppressed democracy in  Iran for decades?

Would NK need Nuclear weapons if it was allowed to  succeed or fail of it's merits rather than  subversion , existential threats and  sanctions designed to starve millions of people and topple the regime? 

Who is the Axis of evil?

 

[Morch]

5 minutes ago, sirineou said:

If you were a country and you faced an existential threat would you react with  "malice" toward that threat or will you be all rainbows and unicorns? If Iran had armed forces in Mexico or any other american continent country don't you  think the US would react with "malice"?

The US is complaining that Russia attempted to interfere in the US election, Didn't the US overthrow the democratically elected government in Iran and install Shah of Iran who with the help of the CIA and SAVAK brutally suppressed democracy in  Iran for decades?

Would NK need Nuclear weapons if it was allowed to  succeed or fail of it's merits rather than  subversion , existential threats and  sanctions designed to starve millions of people and topple the regime? 

Who is the Axis of evil?

 

 

Everything is the US's fault.

NK is just a little country trying to peacefully get by.

If it wasn't for  the US, NK would be on its best behavior.

Gotcha.

 

[Jingthing]

Just now, Morch said:

 

Everything is the US's fault.

NK is just a little country trying to peacefully get by.

If it wasn't for  the US, NK would be on its best behavior.

Gotcha.

 

Funny, but Kim's coup here is even without the meeting having "trump" put him on the same level as the USA (witness the bizarre coin from the white house) and he now gets to promote the idea that his regime is the more reasonable one. 

[sirineou]

7 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Everything is the US's fault.

NK is just a little country trying to peacefully get by.

If it wasn't for  the US, NK would be on its best behavior.

Gotcha.

 

 No not everything only the things that are  documented. Everything I said is undisputed fact.

The US (and I am American but not blind) is the biggest threat to democracy. We are the henry Ford of democracy , you can have any color car as long as it is black . You can choose to govern yourself anyway you want as long as you play ball with as.

Democracy is no Democracy when one has only one choice. It reminds me of this seen in the movie the Jerk.

 

[AsiaHand]

19 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Funny, but Kim's coup here is even without the meeting having "trump" put him on the same level as the USA (witness the bizarre coin from the white house) and he now gets to promote the idea that his regime is the more reasonable one. 

That "COIN" was a private speculation of someone trying to cahs in on a money gain .Neither The US or The White house authorized that "Coin" which has no value and did not cost The US one penny. So what "Coup".? 

[AsiaHand]

Hey jingthing,Answer # 91.

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, AsiaHand said:

Hey jingthing,Answer # 91.

Do not bait me again. 

[Chomper Higgot]

10 minutes ago, AsiaHand said:

Hey jingthing,Answer # 91.

You started #91 with your own speculation of an outcome.

 

#91 is not something to be answered other than by events as they occur.

 

The answer is therefore, let’s wait and see.

[bristolboy]

30 minutes ago, AsiaHand said:

That "COIN" was a private speculation of someone trying to cahs in on a money gain .Neither The US or The White house authorized that "Coin" which has no value and did not cost The US one penny. So what "Coup".? 

Where do you get your misinformation from? 

"Just a few days ago, it was revealed that the White House Communications Agency had commissioned special coins to be made to commemorate the upcoming historic event. The coins feature Trump and Kim looking at each other in front of their respective flags, divided by a jagged line vaguely reminiscent of the Demilitarized Zone, or DMZ — the heavily fortified border separating North and South Korea..."

https://www.vox.com/2018/5/24/17389836/trump-north-korea-kim-jong-un-coin-meeting

 

They are still for sale at the White House Gift Shop. No joke.

[stevenl]

43 minutes ago, AsiaHand said:

That "COIN" was a private speculation of someone trying to cahs in on a money gain .Neither The US or The White house authorized that "Coin" which has no value and did not cost The US one penny. So what "Coup".? 

Please don't spread nonsense.

[AsiaHand]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

Do not bait me again. 

So you have no idea of what you were talking about ? You might try to reading the news from many sources instead of relying on hearsay from people.Oh by the way what was the value minted on those coins ?

Edited May 25, 2018 by AsiaHand

[Morch]

@sirineou

 

No, not everything you said is fact. And those things which were factual are presented without context.  And the current rant isn't even of much relevance to the topic, really.

 

Edited May 25, 2018 by Morch

[tonbridgebrit]

8 hours ago, lannarebirth said:

 

The US has been the international partner of choice because its partners know that they will reap the same rewards but almost none of the risks and a disproportionately small portion of the cost of that partnership. The US has historically been willing to screw its citizens for the benefit of its partners. Good luck finding another international partner that stupid.

See, this is the exact delusion that Washington has exploited for decades.

The truth, Washington only helps countries if they benefit Washington. Actually, you're right about how Washington screws it's own citizens. But Washington also screws everybody else outside of America. And who benefits from all this ?  It's the big defence contractors in America, and other big American companies.

Surely, you don't believe that Washington fights wars, because it wants to spread freedom, democracy and prosperity, across planet earth ???

[tonbridgebrit]

1 hour ago, sirineou said:

 No not everything only the things that are  documented. Everything I said is undisputed fact.

The US (and I am American but not blind) is the biggest threat to democracy. We are the henry Ford of democracy , you can have any color car as long as it is black . You can choose to govern yourself anyway you want as long as you play ball with as.

Democracy is no Democracy when one has only one choice. It reminds me of this seen in the movie the Jerk.

 

Thanks. However, we've got to accept, that it is the US government that is causing the problem. It's Washington that's the problem. The people of America, the Americans themselves, they're okay people. Washington has convinced the people of America to support the government. It's being done by manipulating the media, and creating a false and non-accurate picture.

[Morch]

38 minutes ago, tonbridgebrit said:

See, this is the exact delusion that Washington has exploited for decades.

The truth, Washington only helps countries if they benefit Washington. Actually, you're right about how Washington screws it's own citizens. But Washington also screws everybody else outside of America. And who benefits from all this ?  It's the big defence contractors in America, and other big American companies.

Surely, you don't believe that Washington fights wars, because it wants to spread freedom, democracy and prosperity, across planet earth ???

 

I don't know that your too-obvious propaganda posts got a whole lot to do with truth, but do tell - which countries help other countries due to sheer altruism? The bit about "big defense contractors" etc. and their connection to government got to be a joke coming from someone habitually praising and defending China.

 

 

[Morch]

34 minutes ago, tonbridgebrit said:

Thanks. However, we've got to accept, that it is the US government that is causing the problem. It's Washington that's the problem. The people of America, the Americans themselves, they're okay people. Washington has convinced the people of America to support the government. It's being done by manipulating the media, and creating a false and non-accurate picture.

 

Thanks for making my standing point about your intentional propagandist usage of "Washington" and "America". As for "creating false and non-accurate picture" - I suppose you could come up with countries with much better governments? Preferably from the list of select ones your posts - China, Russia, Syria, Iran...?

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 hours ago, Enoon said:

NK is no more interested in talking about disarmament than it ever was.

 

What China is interested in is maneuvering the US (under Trump) into the position of being the problem.

 

US (Trump) the intransigent, US (Trump) the petulant, US (Trump) the untrustworthy, US (Trump) the insincere, US (Trump) the reneger.

 

US (Trump) the least likely to have the regions best interests at heart.

 

The best interests of the region are, of course, what China has as it's first priority.

 

Trump, for China, is a gift from the Gods.

I'd say that's a reasonably plausible analysis.

 

With the caveat that China may be telling OTHERS in the region that it has the region's best interests at heart, whereas of course, what China is focused on is its own best interests and expansionary goals. And it's pretty clear that at least a fair number of the other countries in the region are clear in understanding that.

 

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

3 hours ago, sirineou said:

Who is the Axis of evil?

 

 

North Korea has been getting by ever since it's creation, and has now had 60+ years post the Korean War during which, AFAIK, the U.S. has never made any military attack against the country. And until relatively recently, never attempted any kind of regime change there and certainly never contemplated any use of nukes.

 

The issue only became more dire in more recent years when NK began pursuing, and later apparently achieving, a nuclear weapons program with the stated objective of being able to strike the U.S. It's a bit hard to imagine anyone to expect the U.S. to simply sit still for that.

 

[Scouse123]

6 hours ago, Jingthing said:

"trump" basically wanted a big political win, a Nobel Prize, more ego glory to feed his bizarre narcissistic mentality. But he wasn't willing or able to put in the work to actually do what was possible in such a meeting, which was potentially something. Too boring. Too slow. Not "trump" enough. So weirdly it's probably for the best that he bailed. The result would not have been good. Either a blowup in Singapore instead of the abortion that happened, or "trump" caving to the much better prepared "Kim" for a B.S. deal that would have been a huge win for Kim but something "trump" could dishonestly brag about in the very short term. 

Kim's noises now that he still wants to talk are just a game. He is reinforcing his message that he is the sane one, and "trump" is the mad warmonger. Like I said before, this all may lead to actual war but it may also lead to everyone eases sanctions on NK and the previous status quo getting more so, and a final acceptance that NK is a nuclear power like it or not. Don't like it of course, but how to stop it now? 

 

 

I think there is no more to add and you have summed the situation up perfectly and with clarity, that is how  I see it as well.

 

Thanks.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

For those needing a bit of a humor break in this rather humorless situation, here's a bit more authoritative recap of the summit COINS and ornament issue, courtesy of the Wash Post:

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2018/05/25/white-house-gift-shop-deal-of-the-day-trump-kim-summit-souvenirs/

 

 

Quote

 

The summit ornament, which originally cost $89, is now available for $59. It features “elegant raised Icons & Historical Iconographs,” “Asian Design Motifs with Harmony as the Unifying Design Theme” and a 24-Karat gold finish. The description also notes that it’s “100% Made in America.” No picture was available so buyers will have to take the shop’s word for it.

Then there is the “post-summit” coin. Originally priced at $24.95, the “unique heirloom of political history” can now be yours for the low, low price of $19.95. It even comes with a black velvet case.

 

The post-summit version is not to be confused with the pre-summit coin, also known as the “challenge coin,” that you may have seen because the design was released earlier this week. (See below)

Less than a month to Trump-Kim summit, White House Communications Agency (WHCA) releases its “trip coin.”
This is #74 of 250 made. pic.twitter.com/UTEJg1GyWv

— Peter Alexander (@PeterAlexander) May 21, 2018

 

 

 

Quote

 

When the news about the summit being canceled broke, people gave the White House a hard time.

Photoshopped spoofs of the “trip coin” started to proliferate, one showing Kim giving Trump “the finger,” another showing a big crack in the coin, and yet another showing only half a coin.

 

 

[Jingthing]

Where do you get your misinformation from? 
"Just a few days ago, it was revealed that the White House Communications Agency had commissioned special coins to be made to commemorate the upcoming historic event. The coins feature Trump and Kim looking at each other in front of their respective flags, divided by a jagged line vaguely reminiscent of the Demilitarized Zone, or DMZ — the heavily fortified border separating North and South Korea..."
https://www.vox.com/2018/5/24/17389836/trump-north-korea-kim-jong-un-coin-meeting
 
They are still for sale at the White House Gift Shop. No joke.

On sale now. I think a bargain! Souvenirs of the decline of the American empire under "trump" will surely rise in value just like Nero's fiddle! The Mooch's jockstrap - - priceless.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[lannarebirth]

8 hours ago, mfd101 said:

Mentioning Libya was hardly something that anyone would do who (1) had a brain and (2) actually wanted to meet for discussion, compromise & deal.

 

Meanwhile, Iran is watching. Reminding them of Khadafi's fate is scarcely helpful in current circumstances.

 

Just how do you see a compromise? We're going to normalize relations with this criminal against humanity? A compromise is we protect him from the retribution of his citizenry and he gets to choose where he spends his life in exile on our dime.

[Dumbastheycome]

14 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

This is both a good and a bad thing.

 

This is a good thing as it has become clear, or perhaps more clear, that the summit meeting was not going to produce desired results, and when a summit of leaders does not produce the desired results, there is no where else to go. Better that it be cancelled rather than have a failure.

 

This is a bad thing as dealing with N Korea is such an impossibility that I was coming around (and still am) to the idea that perhaps Trump could deal with Kim Von Fat Boy. At this time twenty years ago, I was sitting in a classroom doing my Masters degree and we were discussing how one could deal with N Korea. Conventional means simply don't work; as much as I have a low opinion of Trump, I was and am willing to give him a shot. Unless someone has a better idea...?

 

I think this also demonstrates the danger of electing an American President who essentially does not have any experience. Yes, some people believe that Trump's business dealings and skills are transferable to the Presidency/Politics, but I do not. And, I do not see any evidence to support a claim that they do.

 

I would hope that the S Koreans and the Americans continue their efforts. There HAS been some progress made, and if the professionals are allowed to do their thing for a while, perhaps there can be enough progress to merit a summit in the future.

 

The alternative is to leave a loser maniac with nukes all by himself to stew....

 

Which  could  also  that demonstrate  attaining a  Masters  Degree  in  ( ? )  is   just as   futile as  a  Bachelors  degree in Navel  Fluff  Plucking.

Ex  spurts  in  contemplation  no  matter  how  much  they  study  will  never  find a  predictive   analysis  of  lunacy !

 

 

[Trouble]

14 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

This is both a good and a bad thing.

 

This is a good thing as it has become clear, or perhaps more clear, that the summit meeting was not going to produce desired results, and when a summit of leaders does not produce the desired results, there is no where else to go. Better that it be cancelled rather than have a failure.

 

This is a bad thing as dealing with N Korea is such an impossibility that I was coming around (and still am) to the idea that perhaps Trump could deal with Kim Von Fat Boy. At this time twenty years ago, I was sitting in a classroom doing my Masters degree and we were discussing how one could deal with N Korea. Conventional means simply don't work; as much as I have a low opinion of Trump, I was and am willing to give him a shot. Unless someone has a better idea...?

 

I think this also demonstrates the danger of electing an American President who essentially does not have any experience. Yes, some people believe that Trump's business dealings and skills are transferable to the Presidency/Politics, but I do not. And, I do not see any evidence to support a claim that they do.

 

I would hope that the S Koreans and the Americans continue their efforts. There HAS been some progress made, and if the professionals are allowed to do their thing for a while, perhaps there can be enough progress to merit a summit in the future.

 

The alternative is to leave a loser maniac with nukes all by himself to stew....

 

"I think this also demonstrates the danger of electing an American President who essentially does not have any experience. Yes, some people believe that Trump's business dealings and skills are transferable to the Presidency/Politics, but I do not. And, I do not see any evidence to support a claim that they do."

 

It's always interesting to me that people think being in business means there is no background for the presidency and that you have to have experience in politics to be successful. I would submit that one of the biggest problems we have is that politicians never get anything done, speak out of both sides of their mouth, and generally are ineffectual. Politicians rarely take much of a stand on anything and are always trying to work both sides and play it safe to win reelection. That is why anyone who wants to get something done as President runs up against a stone wall. At least successful business people are used to accomplishing something.  Frankly, I would like to see Congress filled with people who have had leadership positions in the real world and who have been successful. I'm a bit tired of the lazy creeps now occupying Congressional office.

[lannarebirth]

8 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

No he doesn't. He's lost face and his master in China won't be happy.

 

Trump has now made Kim say he's ready to meet "any time, any where' rather than been seen to be the one deciding if, when and where and calling the shots.

 

Trump certainly has his faults, and isn't exactly Mr. Charisma, but he's playing these games well albeit in a very different way to the double speak of the career politicians.

 

 

 

These people talk about "diplomacy" as if diplomacy had actually ever worked in the past. Diplomacy gave Kim nuclear weapons.

[lannarebirth]

5 hours ago, sirineou said:

If you were a country and you faced an existential threat would you react with  "malice" toward that threat or will you be all rainbows and unicorns? If Iran had armed forces in Mexico or any other american continent country don't you  think the US would react with "malice"?

The US is complaining that Russia attempted to interfere in the US election, Didn't the US overthrow the democratically elected government in Iran and install Shah of Iran who with the help of the CIA and SAVAK brutally suppressed democracy in  Iran for decades?

Would NK need Nuclear weapons if it was allowed to  succeed or fail of it's merits rather than  subversion , existential threats and  sanctions designed to starve millions of people and topple the regime? 

Who is the Axis of evil?

 

 

I disagree with most of America's foreign policy, especially with respect to the Middle East. That said, the topic is North Korea,  who has threatened the US and its North Pacific allies with nuclear tipped ballistic missles. The US or those allies do not need the world's help, permission or acceptance for whatever it feels it must do to neutralize that growing threat. 

[mfd101]

41 minutes ago, lannarebirth said:

 

Just how do you see a compromise? We're going to normalize relations with this criminal against humanity? A compromise is we protect him from the retribution of his citizenry and he gets to choose where he spends his life in exile on our dime.

Take the deals done with the Soviet Union after the Cuban missile crisis in 1962. It took a couple of decades to get assorted agreements in place (communications, missile reductions, agreement on how to manage issues in future etc). Yes, negotiations, compromises & deals can be conducted with people you despise when your survival is at stake.

 

As it is for several million human beings in SK, NK and (now apparently) California & no doubt places in between