Thai Prisons Bursting At Seams, Reforms Needed: Panel

[stanleycoin]

24 minutes ago, Yann55 said:

 

Poor people, yes. Critics of the government , no. So it's only half BS, stanley, not total.

 

Much as I disapprove of a military junta seizing power with a coup and then running the country with - to say the least - questionable abilities in the realm of politics, economics, sociology, psychology etc, I am always astounded by the way most Westerners (especially those who know virtually nothing about Thailand) seem to view the situation here, and are ready to compare it with, say, Chile under Pinochet.

 

YES, it's a military rule, and NO, it has NOTHING in common with Pinochet, or Marcos, or Idi Amin, Mao, Stalin or Fidel Castro's regimes. Thai prisons are NOT full of political opponents, people are NOT kidnapped in the middle of the night and tortured for expressing dissent, Thai citizens are NOT afraid to say what they think to their friends because they know it takes a lot more to get arrested.

 

This almost systematic distortion of reality, in most Western media and thus Western minds, says a lot not about Thailand, but about the manipulation of information and how easily we can be fooled into confusing opinion with fact.

 

When information is being so grossly distorted, one must question who benefits the most from such manipulation.

 

 

Will.  settle for 75% BS,  Not half

poor people are bad as well, despite what some people will have you believe.

 

It's a fair cop gov, but society is to blame !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Edited June 4, 2018 by stanleycoin

[gandalf12]

First cull, execute the murderers

[300sd]

3 hours ago, webfact said:

Solving the overcrowding problem requires alternative approaches and systemic changes throughout the justice system, from police and prosecutors up through the courts and prison system,

There is a lot of truth in this above statement.

 

Police: Make sure that a crime has really been committed, not fabricated.

Prosecutors: Believe someone other then the police! Do your job honestly.

Judges: In the first court everyone is guilty! Why is this? Do your job unencumbered, with integrity. Abide by the law with your decisions: "innocent until proven guilty and beyond a reasonable doubt" comes to mind. Have the whole court case on tape, not just what the judge wants. The appeal courts get a biased view otherwise. Have the sentence fit the crime.

Prison system: Treat you inmates with compassion, some are as innocent as you. Inmates good behavior levels should begin when they are incarcerated, not when their case is finalized. Be more lenient with your parole system. You know these people better then most.

 

Yes it's a lot to ask...

[gandalf12]

2 minutes ago, 300sd said:

There is a lot of truth in this above statement.

 

Police: Make sure that a crime has really been committed, not fabricated.

Prosecutors: Believe someone other then the police! Do your job honestly.

Judges: In the first court everyone is guilty! Why is this? Do your job unencumbered, with integrity. Abide by the law with your decisions: "innocent until proven guilty and beyond a reasonable doubt" comes to mind. Have the whole court case on tape, not just what the judge wants. The appeal courts get a biased view otherwise. Have the sentence fit the crime.

Prison system: Treat you inmates with compassion, some are as innocent as you. Inmates good behavior levels should begin when they are incarcerated, not when their case is finalized. Be more lenient with your parole system. You know these people better then most.

 

Yes it's a lot to ask...

Are you still talking about Thailand?

[darksidedog]

While the prisons are filthy, stinking and pestilent, the bigger problem is actually what passes for a judicial system. There is no free bail for anything, so thousands of poor people are in jail for petty offences. Many serve far longer than the actual time for their crime, because of the time it takes to actually get to court. Add to that the fact that judges here are not overly bright and are incapable of deciphering logic, so find people guilty regularly for things they didn't do, rather than risk making a mistake. Then loony sentences for minor offences. And loony sentences for drugs across the board. Approaching zero rehabilitation, it is all about punishment.

The whole system sucks and needs to be ripped up and something workable put in its place.

[Bezdomny]

They should ask Kim Kardashian for some advice. ?

[stanleycoin]

4 minutes ago, darksidedog said:

While the prisons are filthy, stinking and pestilent, the bigger problem is actually what passes for a judicial system. There is no free bail for anything, so thousands of poor people are in jail for petty offences. Many serve far longer than the actual time for their crime, because of the time it takes to actually get to court. Add to that the fact that judges here are not overly bright and are incapable of deciphering logic, so find people guilty regularly for things they didn't do, rather than risk making a mistake. Then loony sentences for minor offences. And loony sentences for drugs across the board. Approaching zero rehabilitation, it is all about punishment.

The whole system sucks and needs to be ripped up and something workable put in its place.

That's so true. 

Crazy sentences some times for minor stuff.

[stanleycoin]

20 minutes ago, gandalf12 said:

First cull, execute the murderers

That's a bit full on,  but yes for the child killers. 

Edited June 4, 2018 by stanleycoin

[gandalf12]

13 minutes ago, stanleycoin said:

That's a bit full on,  but yes for the child killers. 

It is accurate though. I am referring to murder not manslaughter

[stanleycoin]

1 minute ago, gandalf12 said:

It is accurate though. I am referring to murder not manslaughter

Still not sure,   but would add cop killers to the list.

[Happyman58]

See you are always laughing when they send corrupt cops to inactive posts. Now you can see their reason why they don't send them to jail. The jails are just too full. Oh boy other countries should take a leaf out of Thailand's way of thinking

[greenchair]

1 hour ago, stanleycoin said:

Your just belly aching.  his richer than me BS !!!!!

 

No. Those are the facts. Look it up. All the research shows the rich get special privileges. 

Hence the name "privileged " .

And they do consider themselves to be the good people. Poor people should be punished for breaking laws and the rich are rarely held accountable. 

Call a spade a spade. 

[Srikcir]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

Despite a population of only about 70 million, the kingdom has the world’s sixth largest prison population. 

The country has the largest prison population and the highest incarceration rate among Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) member states¹ and the world’s highest incarceration rate of women.

It appears that in Thailand prisoners detained for drug-related crimes has the highest population vs prison population facing other charges.

However, the prison population does not reflect detained hundreds of civilians at military bases across Thailand for their political affiliation and opinions, including criticism of the junta. Notably, the Nakhon Chaisri temporary detention facility inside the 11th Army Circle base in Bangkok used to detain civilians since the 2014 military coup.

https://www.fidh.org/IMG/pdf/rapport_thailand_688a_web.pdf

Lèse majesté and the computer crimes laws have resulted in many outspoken critics going to prison during the Prayut military regime.

https://www.asiasentinel.com/opinion/thailand-political-prisoners/

As also did the Referendum Act and the current Political Act enacted by the junta-appointed legislative branch; the former resulting in two eight-year girls arrest!

Notable is the peak in prison population and rate over a sixteen-year period occurring during the Prayut regime. http://www.prisonstudies.org/country/thailand

That peak may represent a very aggressive junta policy against political criticism.

 

The problem in identifying the extent of Thailand's political prison population is a lack of transparency and specifically the now junta-defanged Thailand Human Rights Commission downgraded by the UN Human Rights Council in 2015 to essentially observer status. It is unable to investigate and compel testimony.

 

¹Thailand has approximately 40% of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations’ prison population, despite having only 10% of the bloc’s total population. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-drugs-thailand-prisons/soaring-prison-population-prompts-thailand-to-re-think-lost-drug-war-idUSKCN0ZX01J

[stanleycoin]

23 minutes ago, greenchair said:

No. Those are the facts. Look it up. All the research shows the rich get special privileges. 

Hence the name "privileged " .

And they do consider themselves to be the good people. Poor people should be punished for breaking laws and the rich are rarely held accountable. 

Call a spade a spade. 

Call a spade a spade, totally agree.

some poor people are bad,  just like some rich are bad.

Fill the jails up with the lot,  I would.

But the notion that, because someone comes from a poor back ground makes it ok

to commit crime, just because society is maybe a bit slanted against them,   is total borrax.  That is what your trying to say ?

Some people are brought up to distinguish right from wrong, regardless of class.

Bet you don't come from a poor family !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

[dorchester]

Maybe they could consider taking so low level drug user and put them to use cleaning the beaches.They could have a incentive program of some sort

[RickTik]

[trainman34014]

This will be at the bottom of the 'Reform' pile then, so it should get dealt with sometime in the next 100 years !

[anon4637435435]

Im surrounded by criminals that police refuse to do anything about. Seems a wall around thailand will do the trick.

[Morch]

This calls for a new crackdown: Good Inmates In, Bad Inmates Out.

[watcharacters]

4 minutes ago, Morch said:

This calls for a new crackdown: Good Inmates In, Bad Inmates Out.

 

Very very smart, Morch.    Very smart of you indeed.

 

Any more genius suggestions?

 

 

Edited June 4, 2018 by watcharacters

[Srikcir]

4 hours ago, 300sd said:

Yes it's a lot to ask.

Yet there's much more to be reformed.

I'd add as limited examples (so many more exist):

• a lower court finding of "not guilty" cannot be appealed by the prosecution
• prosecution must always begin in the lower court, not in the Supreme Court
• assign a competent defense lawyer with no conflict of interest within the judicial system or prosecution to "qualified" defendants
• establish firm sentencing and bail guidelines, not "let's make a deal"
• criminal prosecution proceeds regardless of any civil settlement
• eliminate laws that rely on "good morals and intentions" as standards for violations
• take religion out of the court
• assure no judicial conflicts of interests

[geronimo]

7 hours ago, cornishcarlos said:

 

Top gaoler hey ?? 

How do they decide who is top gaoler !! 

Is it like employee of the month, at a Tesco store ?

He's in charge of the top floor I think it means ....

 

[watcharacters]

24 minutes ago, geronimo said:

He's in charge of the top floor I think it means ....

 

 

 

I never reached "employee" of the month.

[CantSpell]

8 hours ago, mikebell said:

The prisons are full of poor people or critics of the Government.

Aye, they should swap regular prison population with Ministry of inactive posts... Then they will have actual criminals behind bars....

[rosst]

Decriminalisation of drugs is a good start but no cost saving as mandatory fully funded rehabilitation is the only way that works. Remove the profit motive by government run dispenseries for registered addicts and that may slow down the numbers starting on the path to drugs. 

Using prison labour to build and service prisoners is also useful. 

[bkk6060]

7 minutes ago, rosst said:

Decriminalisation of drugs is a good start but no cost saving as mandatory fully funded rehabilitation is the only way that works. Remove the profit motive by government run dispenseries for registered addicts and that may slow down the numbers starting on the path to drugs. 

Using prison labour to build and service prisoners is also useful. 

Like so many on here you are hoping for a 1st world response when in reality this place is still a 3rd world correctional system.

What you suggest will never happen.

 

Bottom line is do not commit crimes, do/sell drugs,get arrested, etc.

Otherwise, suffer the consequences because it is, what it is....

[kaorop]

and how many actual society destroying corrupt gov officials should be in prisons, 50%, 70%?

 

fact is as society decays and social reforms are not in place, more and more turn to drugs and many end up in prison..

case in point

 

the current powers that be are quite happy to see that increase in use, they are top of the food chain and have the kitchens.

[KhunFred]

Turn ;em loose. Potsmokers tend not to be a public risk.

[johnnytuc]

15 hours ago, ramrod711 said:

A good place to start might be decriminalizing expression of political views and abandoning the stunningly inappropriate 30 year sentencing of mushroom pickers.

Agree but also how about for minor offences set up work gangs to clean up the country of all the plastic and other rubbish !

[apophyss]

17 hours ago, stanleycoin said:

Use the prison population to build them, chain gang style.

 

 

No, they will tattoo the map on their back...