Trump says firms doing business in Iran to be barred from U.S. as sanctions hit

[Chomper Higgot]

There’s a twisted irony in Trump singling out Iran, the birthplace of Zoroastrianism which at its core had the belief in the eternal struggle between Truth and The Lie.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Just now, Morch said:

Iran isn't "singled out", nor are Iran-US relations something created by Trump. Unless mistaken Russia is under sanctions as well, though not of Trump's making.

 

AFAIK, nothing the U.S. has done with Russia -- either by Trump or without him -- has gone so far as this latest round of sanctions aimed at Iran -- basically saying that any international business that does business in Iran will be barred from dealing with the U.S. government.

 

Maybe someone else knows more, but AFAIK, the list of foreign countries where the U.S. has imposed that kind of blanket, drastic sanction has got to be very small.

 

Quote

Britain, France, Germany and the EU as a bloc said in a joint statement on Monday: "We deeply regret the reimposition of sanctions by the U.S."

[Morch]

5 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Now that you've delivered your anti-Muslim rant....

 

You might consider that all of this Iranian rhetoric lately has come only AFTER Trump unilaterally decided to withdraw the U.S. from the international nuclear weapons accord that had been reached with Iran, and which Iran was honoring/abiding by, according to most accounts. And then begin imposing additional U.S. sanctions against Iran.  What kind of message does that send re the U.S. and honoring its diplomatic commitments?

 

None of the other international participants to that agreement have gone on the war path against Iran -- only Trump and Bolton and Co.

 

You want to talk about nuclear weapons threats?  It wasn't Iran, but instead, North Korea that's been undertaking major nuclear weapons tests and provocative missile launches in recent years. And yet there's Trump palling around with dictator Kim and later (totally falsely) asserting that North Korea was no longer a nuclear threat.

 

You're drinking the right-wing anti-Muslim war mongering Kool-aid.

 

 

 

Iran made threats about blocking the Strait of Hormuz at other times in the past, making this about Trump is a bit far fetched. The same goes for its usual rhetoric vs. the US - been around long before Trump became POTUS.

 

But even if this was the case - then regardless of anything Trump said or did, such threats would be over the top. Essentially, more of a hostage situation, not even a direct threat to the US.

 

Not that I support Trump's moves regarding Iran - quite possibly things could have been achieved while remaining within the framework of the Iran Deal. That said, the manner in which the previous administration signed up for this agreement wasn't all that straightforward either. Not sure that both examples were the highlights of US politics and diplomacy.

 

As for "war path" - what war would that be?

[Odysseus123]

10 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

There’s a twisted irony in Trump singling out Iran, the birthplace of Zoroastrianism which at its core had the belief in the eternal struggle between Truth and The Lie.

Ah yes..

 

The eternal struggle between Ahura Mazda and Ahriman..

Always relevant because it establishes one of the essential props of Western atavism-thus making it an easy psychological ploy in this type of infantile propaganda.

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Iran made threats about blocking the Strait of Hormuz at other times in the past, making this about Trump is a bit far fetched. The same goes for its usual rhetoric vs. the US - been around long before Trump became POTUS.

 

But even if this was the case - then regardless of anything Trump said or did, such threats would be over the top. Essentially, more of a hostage situation, not even a direct threat to the US.

 

Not that I support Trump's moves regarding Iran - quite possibly things could have been achieved while remaining within the framework of the Iran Deal. That said, the manner in which the previous administration signed up for this agreement wasn't all that straightforward either. Not sure that both examples were the highlights of US politics and diplomacy.

 

As for "war path" - what war would that be?

You are missing the elephant in the room.

 

Trump’s vindictive driven need to wreck anything done by Obama.

[Morch]

5 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

AFAIK, nothing the U.S. has done with Russia -- either by Trump or without him -- has gone so far as this latest round of sanctions aimed at Iran -- basically saying that any international business that does business in Iran will be barred from dealing with the U.S. government.

 

Maybe someone else knows more, but AFAIK, the list of foreign countries where the U.S. has imposed that kind of blanket, drastic sanction has got to be very small.

 

 

Well, Russia is a wee bit "bigger". Easier to carry "full" sanctions against a smaller opponent. For example, North Korea. Other than Trump's personal issues with Russia, I just don't think the US could pull off something on this scope on that front - and the reaction would be more serious. Iran was under a rather severe international sanctions regime for years, that didn't seem to bother people half as much as the US going about it solo.

[sawadeeken]

6 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Now that you've delivered your anti-Muslim rant....

 

 

Well then Mr. Tall Guy....... You 'Bow' to allah........

The US entered that Iran deal under a muslim 'loving' President.......... Not Trumph........

Now Trump is at the helm he is calling the shots.......If he can keep the USA from 'Bowing to allah', I will back him.........

[Morch]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

You are missing the elephant in the room.

 

Trump’s vindictive driven need to wreck anything done by Obama.

 

If you say so. Guess that wraps it up then, no need to address details or other considerations.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Just now, sawadeeken said:

Well then Mr. Tall Guy....... You 'Bow' to allah........

The US entered that Iran deal under a muslim 'loving' President.......... Not Trumph........

Now Trump is at the helm he is calling the shots.......If he can keep the USA from 'Bowing to allah', I will back him.........

 

You're seriously deluded... If you think Trump is anti-Muslim and that's why you like him, what's he done with Saudi Arabia lately? You remember, the country whose nationals were the majority of the 9/11 hijackers...

 

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/306990-trump-appeared-to-register-eight-companies-in-saudi-arabia

 

Quote

 

During a rally on August 21, the day Trump created four of those companies, he said he gets along well with Saudi Arabia.

"They buy apartments from me," Trump said during the Alabama rally. "They spend $40 million, $50 million. Am I supposed to dislike them? I like them very much.”

In January of this year, Trump said on Fox News he "would want to protect Saudi Arabia.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

1 minute ago, Morch said:

 

If you say so. Guess that wraps it up then, no need to address details or other considerations.

 

Well if you wish to ignore the elephant.

[Morch]

7 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Well if you wish to ignore the elephant.

 

Well, if you wish to ignore anything but your own simplistic take....

[Spidey]

1 hour ago, sawadeeken said:

Don't you know what is happening ????????

Iran is making threats agains't the US (and Isreal and other allies) with their Nuclear weapons... And 'Threats' of closing or blockadeing the shipping lanes that world oil supplies travel.... (and they are basically muslim driven).........

EITHER YOU ARE WITH US OR YOU ARE AGAINS'T US........

I'm not a 'Trump' fan but I back him for the 'one thing' that he don't like muslims and don't want more of them within our borders......... After seeing how 'they' don't want to blend with other societies, but want to live by their own rules... In other countries.... and eventually try to convert all the other countries to 'their beliefs' .......

NO THANKS..... I DON"T want to worship 'allah'...... I like the freedom of choice I have now in the USA........

I've been to 91 countries in this world and won't give up my USA citizenship (or passport) for any of them.... (Especially a n 'islamic' state where 'Soi Dogs' and women are treated equally)..... You can relocate to these 'Islamic' countries (I won't miss you) but NO-WAY do I want Iran and some other Islamic countries to have any effect on MY USA....

I am with Trump on this ONE faction.......

You clearly don't know what's happening.

Iran aren't making any threats because they don't have any nuclear weapons. Thanks to the deal that Trump has just broken.

 

The current troubles in the Middle East have devolved into a conflict between Sunnis and Shiites. Iran is the main protagonist of the Shiites, Saudi is the main protagonist of the Sunnis. (Al Qaeda and ISIS are both Sunni organisations and founded in and backed by Saudi Arabia).

 

Trump is merely siding with the Saudis (probably because his companies have done dodgy deals with them and he's seriously in hock to them.

 

Trump, like you, knows diddly squat about international affairs/politics and is just sucking up to his paymasters.  

[candide]

14 minutes ago, sawadeeken said:

Well then Mr. Tall Guy....... You 'Bow' to allah........

The US entered that Iran deal under a muslim 'loving' President.......... Not Trumph........

Now Trump is at the helm he is calling the shots.......If he can keep the USA from 'Bowing to allah', I will back him.........

And of course, Saudi Arabia, one of the main ally of Trump on this case and one of the main beneficiary of a potential decrease of Iran's power, is ok? ?

 

In case you may not know, compare the role of Saudi Arabia and the role of Iran in supporting international terrorism:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/State-sponsored_terrorism

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Well, if you wish to ignore anything but your own simplistic take....

Then why, if the Iran’s threats to maritime passage are so serious has the rest of the world refused to follow Trump on Iran?

[Odysseus123]

2 minutes ago, candide said:

And of course, Saudi Arabia, one of the main ally of Trump on this case and one of the main beneficiary of a potential decrease of Iran's power, is ok? ?

 

In case you may not know, compare the role of Saudi Arabia and the role of Iran in supporting international terrorism:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/State-sponsored_terrorism

Indeed.

A lay down misere...as we call it.

 

The US' second greatest ally in the Middle East.Sticks to  them like poo on a blanket.

 

 

[candide]

7 hours ago, Roadman said:

You are assuming that all other countries are going to side with the US. I would not be so sure of that as Trump is firing of saunctions and tarrifs left right and centre that many will consider their other trading allies are  a better trade bet than the US. 

Sorry, I was not clear. I don't assume anything. What I want to stress is that preventing Iran to export oil and the possible retaliations by Iran are quite likely to result in an increase in oil price. In case it would lasts long enough, it would have a strong negative economic impact on countries which are not producing oil.

Thanks to shale oil, the USA are much less dependent on oil imports than before, so they would not suffer too much from an increase in oil price That's a big strategic change compared to the period of time when previous conflicts occured in this region. The USA are now able to stand a relatively long lasting oil crisis.

[Spidey]

20 minutes ago, candide said:

The USA are now able to stand a relatively long lasting oil crisis.

More importantly, it will push the price of oil up. Saudi Arabia is in serious financial trouble due to the low oil price that has been maintained in recent years.

 

An increase in oil prices would be a lifesaver for Trumps paymasters.

[Different]

Until Iran wicked government act normal, sanctions will remain.

[Spidey]

7 minutes ago, Different said:

Until Iran wicked government act normal, sanctions will remain.

Are you Sunni?

[Scott]

Posts and replies removed for a variety of reasons.

 

 

[bristolboy]

3 hours ago, candide said:

Sorry, I was not clear. I don't assume anything. What I want to stress is that preventing Iran to export oil and the possible retaliations by Iran are quite likely to result in an increase in oil price. In case it would lasts long enough, it would have a strong negative economic impact on countries which are not producing oil.

Thanks to shale oil, the USA are much less dependent on oil imports than before, so they would not suffer too much from an increase in oil price That's a big strategic change compared to the period of time when previous conflicts occured in this region. The USA are now able to stand a relatively long lasting oil crisis.

Why wouldn't the US  economy snd consumers suffer badly from high oil prices? Most of the benefit will flow to the wealthy few.

[Nickymaster]

The US has almost no allies left. Trump has insulted basically everybody. It's the US against the world now. In a few years Trump will be gone but the damage will last for decades. I honestly feel sorry for Americans who see what is going on but can't do much about it.

 

Edited August 8, 2018 by Nickymaster

[Jingthing]

19 minutes ago, Nickymaster said:

The US has almost no allies left. Trump has insulted basically everybody. It's the US against the world now. In a few years Trump will be gone but the damage will last for decades. I honestly feel sorry for Americans who see what is going on but can't do much about it.

 

You're exactly right and thanks for the understanding that the majority of Americans do not approve of this horror show. The longer he's in power, the more damage is done, but there has already been very serious damage done. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

By the way, for the few remaining Trump fans who bizarrely and wrongly think this is about their hero standing up to the anti Christian Muslims...

 

It's worth remembering, that when Trump's final so-called anti-Muslim U.S. travel ban was finally upheld by the U.S. Supreme Court, it didn't include quite a few Muslim countries, chief among them Saudi Arabia, which absolutely is and long has been one of the largest exporters and proponents of Muslim fundamentalism, not to mention the native country to most of the 9/11 hijackers.

 

lMHO, Trump is far more despising of poor and colored people, from America AND other countries, than he is of Muslims in general.  Black and browns don't have any place in Trump's Make America White Again World. But Muslims appear to be perfectly fine for him, especially if they're RICH Muslims who have the money to buy and invest in condos, hotels, and other capitalist money making ventures that he values or is involved in.

 

Here are the countries on the final Trump travel ban list: Iran, Libya, Syria, Yemen, Somalia, Venezuela and North Korea. Personally, I don't have any problem with a U.S. travel ban on people from any of those countries totally unrelated to Muslim issues and solely related to being terrorist, extremist, bad actor countries.

 

But if terrorism and international aggression were the factors, then various other countries certainly belonged on the same list, including Russia, Saudi Arabia and others. And that's why at the outset, I called Trump a hypocrite for his recent aggression toward Iran. He wants to go after Iran, but is fine to let even worse countries continue untouched.

 

If there's an Iran crisis, it's going to be one of Trump's own making.

 

Edited August 8, 2018 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Nickymaster]

4 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

By the way, for the few remaining Trump fans who bizarrely and wrongly think this is about their hero standing up to the anti Christian Muslims...

 

It's worth remembering, that when Trump's final so-called anti-Muslim U.S. travel ban was finally upheld by the U.S. Supreme Court, it didn't include quite a few Muslim countries, chief among them Saudi Arabia, which absolutely is and long has been one of the largest exporters and proponents of Muslim fundamentalism, not to mention the native country to most of the 9/11 hijackers.

 

lMHO, Trump is far more despising of poor and colored people, from America AND other countries, than he is of Muslims in general.  Black and browns don't have any place in Trump's Make America White Again World. But Muslims appear to be perfectly fine for him, especially if they're RICH Muslims who have the money to buy and invest in condos, hotels, and other capitalist money making ventures that he values or is involved in.

 

Here are the countries on the final Trump travel ban list: Iran, Libya, Syria, Yemen, Somalia, Venezuela and North Korea. Personally, I don't have any problem with a U.S. travel ban on people from any of those countries totally unrelated to Muslim issues and solely related to being terrorist, extremist, bad actor countries.

 

But if terrorism and international aggression were the factors, then various other countries certainly belonged on the same list, including Russia, Saudi Arabia and others. And that's why at the outset, I called Trump a hypocrite for his recent aggression toward Iran. He wants to go after Iran, but is fine to let even worse countries continue untouched.

 

If there's an Iran crisis, it's going to be one of Trump's own making.

 

+ Trump’s Immigration Ban Excludes Countries With Business Ties

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2017-trump-second-immigration-ban-conflict-of-interest/

[candide]

59 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

Why wouldn't the US  economy snd consumers suffer badly from high oil prices? Most of the benefit will flow to the wealthy few.

They would suffer. But much less than before and than countries which have to import most of the oil they need.

[Different]

3 hours ago, Spidey said:

Are you Sunni?

I am naturally born Muslim as you and rest of all mankind then raised to honor my parents as human value we share regardless of religion.

I am a Sunni but open minded Muslim believer in prophecy of Muhammad, which I'm obliged to do rituals like prayer and fasting like Muslim Christians pray and fast differently.

As for Iranian Mullahs they have one purpose is to destabilize Arab regions, Iraq, Lebanon, Syria and now in Yemen.  Now I know after all these years that my government which I disagree with on many issue still must fight back where it hurts real bad using common shared US-Saudi cooperation is doing great job implementing harsh sanctions.

 

P.S I believe in one world religion, God's chosen religion which God reveled to all his prophets and messengers before.

Edited August 8, 2018 by Different

[Jingthing]

11 minutes ago, Different said:

...

 

P.S I believe in one world religion, God's chosen religion which God reveled to all his prophets and messengers before.

That kind of statement gives me shudders coming from any religion. Can't you just believe what you believe and let other people believe or not believe as they wish? 

[Spidey]

2 minutes ago, Different said:

I am naturally born Muslim as you and rest of all mankind then raised to honor my parents as human value we share regardless of religion.

I am a Sunni but open minded Muslim believer in prophecy of Muhammad, which I'm obliged to do rituals like prayer and fasting like Muslim Christians pray and fast differently.

As for Iranian Mullahs they have one purpose is to destabilize Arab regions, Iraq, Lebanon, Syria and now in Yemen.  Now I know after all these years that my government which I disagree with on many issue still must fight back where it hurts real bad using common shared US-Saudi cooperation is doing great job implementing harsh sanctions.

 

P.S I believe in one world religion which is Islam which God reveled to all his prophets and messengers.

Islam is 2 world religions, Sunni and Shiite. You have been in conflict with each other since the birth of Islam.

 

Not by coincidence, the 4 countries that you mention have Shiite minorities in their population, all of which have been marginalised and oppressed by their Sunni brothers. Iran is fighting their cause, just as Saudi is fighting the Sunni cause in Yemen by the wholesale bombing and slaughter of innocent civilians.

 

I applaud your world religion philosophy on Islam but your Sunni loyalties are clearly clouding your religious philosophy.

[candide]

54 minutes ago, Different said:

I am naturally born Muslim as you and rest of all mankind then raised to honor my parents as human value we share regardless of religion.

I am a Sunni but open minded Muslim believer in prophecy of Muhammad, which I'm obliged to do rituals like prayer and fasting like Muslim Christians pray and fast differently.

As for Iranian Mullahs they have one purpose is to destabilize Arab regions, Iraq, Lebanon, Syria and now in Yemen.  Now I know after all these years that my government which I disagree with on many issue still must fight back where it hurts real bad using common shared US-Saudi cooperation is doing great job implementing harsh sanctions.

 

P.S I believe in one world religion, God's chosen religion which God reveled to all his prophets and messengers before.

So you are on the same side as sawadeeken. I think you will be both very happy to be allied with each other. ?