Changes to retirement visa income affidavit requirement for Americans?

[Wuvu2]

 

I saw the following posted in Chiang Mai by a visa assisting company.

 

"Urgent; If you are a USA citizen and use an affidavit for your retirement visa extension, you will now need to show proof of the amount declared. This can be a statement from social security or your pension provider. Please note the amounts have to match the number stated on the affidavit. This is for renewal and for first time applicants. Please request for these statements now as they can take time to obtain."

 

Is this true also at Jomtien or other locations? What if one's income comes from other than Social Security or formal pension? This is the case for many who were self-employed.

[dabhand]

Only seems like a month ago when this topic last surfaced.

 

Oh, it was:

 

https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/1047827-another-change-for-us-citizens/

 

 

[likerdup1]

Scare mongering once again. From what I heard this Chang Mai incident was isolated. I think we would have heard about it if there were multiple reports. There are many expats each day who use income affidavits for their extensions of stay based on retirement.

 

I was just at Chonburi immigration today to make sure what paper work I will need for my extension in case there were any changes since my last visit. There was no mention of having to have bank statements to back up an Embassy income affidavit.

 

Edited August 21, 2018 by likerdup1

[gk10002000]

I don't have a pension, I don't collect social security yet.  I do have over one million USD invested in dividend and interest paying things, stocks, bonds, Funds, etc.  I can show the income they produced last year, and Etrade has a simple income estimator that lists the amounts of dividend and interest for any period in the future. Bank statements per say won't show much as I have not withdrawn a single penny from my brokerage account or IRA accounts yet since I am still working.  I guess we shall see in the future what they may need or want.  If they get too picky, well, so be it.  I can be fine with two SETVs with a 30 day extension each year for a total of 180 days and not go for the visas with retirement extensions.  I could always do the 800k baht but that would be a last resort since I prefer to keep my monies in my home country and invested where they are

[ubonjoe]

Old news and false info on a agents website.

No recent reports of anybody having to show back up proof for their income affidavit.

Just used one for my extension here in Ubon on the 10th with no questions asked.

[atyclb]

can condo ownership in thailand be used in lieu of the 800k baht (assuming the condo is worth that or multiples of that amount) ?

[ubonjoe]

3 minutes ago, atyclb said:

can condo ownership in thailand be used in lieu of the 800k baht (assuming the condo is worth that or multiples of that amount) ?

No it cannot be used.

[MamaSan]

My friend & I went on the same day.  He used an agency and I did it solo.  We both presented US affidavits alone but were required to produce back-up documentation. Unfortunately, he had added the amounts from multiple sources incorrectly (off by about $20) and his agency required him to return to the US Consulate and pay for yet another statement showing the corrected amount before submitting the documents again.

We both wondered afterwards if our back-up alone would have been sufficient – it seems a fair amount of money to pay for something that is no longer accepted…

[desktop]

  Seems that it was referencing a requirement at the Embassy to obtain the affidavit, not Thai immigration.   Wrong again.

Edited August 22, 2018 by desktop

[Wanderer555]

Applied for and received my annual USA Income Affidavit at the Chiang Mai consulate last week. 

No verifying income statement was required and the affidavit was issued within 10 mins. 

Last week, I also inquired at the Udon Thani immigration and there are no changes from last year for my Retirement extension of stay. 

I will submit the paperwork this week and update the forum. 

Cheers 

[MamaSan]

36 minutes ago, MamaSan said:

My friend & I went on the same day.  He used an agency and I did it solo.  We both presented US affidavits alone but were required to produce back-up documentation. Unfortunately, he had added the amounts from multiple sources incorrectly (off by about $20) and his agency required him to return to the US Consulate and pay for yet another statement showing the corrected amount before submitting the documents again.

We both wondered afterwards if our back-up alone would have been sufficient – it seems a fair amount of money to pay for something that is no longer accepted…

To clarify - this all happened at CM Immigration - not at the Consulate

[Wuvu2]

3 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

Old news and false info on a agents website.

No recent reports of anybody having to show back up proof for their income affidavit.

Just used one for my extension here in Ubon on the 10th with no questions asked.

Thanks Joe - Over the many years you seem the best informed. Thanks for all your support of countless members. 

 

 Can I ask a followup - If a person works outside Thailand but resides in Thailand much of the year, OR works for a home-country company online as "digital nomads" may do,  is there a problem using that income for the "over 50 long stay visa" we call "retirement"?  Please advise if you know both strictly legally and "in practice". 

 

Thanks again for your help.

W

 

[ericg1953]

I know it’s off subject but in all my years past I have used an income statement to renew my visa yearly. This year I have the 800k in the bank and was going to use the bank statement to meet the requirement. I’ve moved in the last month to another province and was wondering if the local SCB branch will issue the bank letter even tho my account is from another province. 

 

I ask because the banks here can be very difficult about transactions from one province to another.  

 

Thanks

[ubonjoe]

13 minutes ago, Wuvu2 said:

 Can I ask a followup - If a person works outside Thailand but resides in Thailand much of the year, OR works for a home-country company online as "digital nomads" may do,  is there a problem using that income for the "over 50 long stay visa" we call "retirement"?  Please advise if you know both strictly legally and "in practice". 

Any income can be used to apply for an extension of stay based upon retirement. There is no requirement that it has to be from a pension of any kind.

Whether working online is legal or not is another discussion but the general consensus is that you can do it without a problem.

If on the off chance you were asked for backup proof by immigration you could show it going into a bank account as proof you have the income.

 

[ubonjoe]

5 minutes ago, ericg1953 said:

I’ve moved in the last month to another province and was wondering if the local SCB branch will issue the bank letter even tho my account is from another province. 

It should not be a problem at any branch of the bank. Many have done it before.

[Max66]

You're right it is off subject. Instead of hijacking this thread why don't you start your own . Then you can babble all you want. 

[Max66]

2 hours ago, MamaSan said:

My friend & I went on the same day.  He used an agency and I did it solo.  We both presented US affidavits alone but were required to produce back-up documentation. Unfortunately, he had added the amounts from multiple sources incorrectly (off by about $20) and his agency required him to return to the US Consulate and pay for yet another statement showing the corrected amount before submitting the documents again.

We both wondered afterwards if our back-up alone would have been sufficient – it seems a fair amount of money to pay for something that is no longer accepted…

I did it a week ago in CM. No backup required. Just affadavit. .. maybe you two looked like deadbeats. 

[1130bobs]

I just did my annual renewal for retirement using ONLY the USA affidavit, signed 4 months before.  No problem in Chiangrai.  But they do want owner ID  as well as  house book copy , which was not needed in earlier years.

[ericg1953]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

It should not be a problem at any branch of the bank. Many have done it before.

Thanks 

[pmarlowe]

As we have seen there are several ways to do it. I prefer keeping the 800k in the bank for two reasons.

1. you only need an up to date bankbook and a letter from your branch (I use SCB).

2. you might want to think about being liquid to that amount locally in case of a short term emergency rather than waiting for an overseas transfer.

Not everyone can manage this and others simply will not agree. Just trying to be helpful.

[Suradit69]

30 minutes ago, Max66 said:

maybe you two looked like deadbeats. 

I think some people who do have problems do so because there is something about their appearance or behavior that raises suspicions about something submitted with applications.

 

In any event, I always get Social Security annual statement and documentation proving pension payments, etc. It's not all that much of a burden and if they want it, you're covered.

 

And of course there is no requirement that you actually bring Baht 65,000 a month into the country, but if your Thai bank records show that you have, on average, brought in at least that amount, it makes your claim credible.

Edited August 22, 2018 by Suradit69

[Rama]

Yes it is in effect. I had my annual visa done last week and had to provide to immigration, not to the consulate. My visa service has sent an email to all clients telling them that is in effect for all Americans. It is only a requirement at the Chiang Mai immigration office - it is not a requirement at any other immigration office. Each office is given a lot of leeway as to how they enforce the requirements. I think Chiang Mai is doing as it is facing a huge amount of visa applicants compared to other offices and is trying to cut the number of applicants. btw, if your TM30 says you live in Chiang Mai, you can't just go to another immigration office and apply there. The other immigration offices have not changed and will accept the consulate letter without documented backup.

[George Bowman]

Just did my retirement visa in P-lok this past Monday and nothing has changed. While, I was at immigration I asked about the additional paperwork showing my income. The officer said not needed as any such paperwork could be a fake. The notarized statement from the US Embassy is what this particular branch requires. 

[HHTel]

As a Brit, I have to supply documentation showing proof of my income to the British Embassy to obtain my income letter.

 

 Surely, as an American, unless the affidavit is a complete lie then it shouldn't be a problem producing proof, should it?

[lometogo]

I’m in Chang Mai and I use Thai Assist Visa services. I obtained my retirement visa in April and all I needed was the affidavit of income statement from the US consulate.  However I spoke to THai Assist today on another matter and they told me as of today, and this could change, immigration is requiring proof of income, unlike before when the affidavit of income from the consulate was sufficient. But they are saying today, because the consulate does not verify that income, that they will not acccept it without additional proof. This probably depends upon the immigration officer you deal with but you should be prepared I believe to show more proof than simply the unverified affidavit of income from us consulate. Of course this is Thailand and the variations— from immigration office location to agent to the price of rice— can all influence what they will require. 

 

I was was also advised that you can offset guaranteed monthly income (such as social security) against the required 800,000 THB and best to have the funds in the Thai bank at least 3 months prior to applying for retirement visa or renewal. 

[North Beach Beatnik]

My American friend and I went to renew retirement visa at Promenada, Thai Immigration, 9 August, both holding US Consulate inome affidavid.

I was asked to prove my income while my friend did not.  Since I have read in Thaivisa that it “might” be required, I had copies to prove my income.  Looks like its random for that day anyway.

[Issanjohn]

11 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

Old news and false info on a agents website.

No recent reports of anybody having to show back up proof for their income affidavit.

Just used one for my extension here in Ubon on the 10th with no questions asked.

Is that completely false information?  Is the U.S. Embassy asking for it now?  Oh well if they are I can always log into my eBenefits account and pull my letters in 2 minutes that verify my monthly pension payments with the official government letter head and even the watermark on the letter.  If you're retired U.S. military and or receiving any type of VA pension if you have an eBenefits account you can login to your account and print 2 signed letters that verify your income.  I usually pull my letters once a month after every payday and I'm sure they would be enough to verify income.  That's even what the specific letter I'm referring too are actually for is income verification for anything that you might need to verify your income for.  The letters I'm talking about verifies that you're a disabled veteran and how much your compensation and pension is per month.  I always bring those letters with me to the embassy just in case whenever I get my proof of income affidavit and to immigration just in case but in almost 5 years of living here no one has ever asked me to show actual real proof of my income. Basically at the embassy you just sign the proof of income affidavit swearing and affirming that you do receive whatever income you receive and they just take your word for it although if I remember right you do sign under oath under the penalty of perjury that you are receiving the income on an official government document.  Has any of that changed over the past year?  

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

10 hours ago, Wanderer555 said:

Applied for and received my annual USA Income Affidavit at the Chiang Mai consulate last week. 

No verifying income statement was required and the affidavit was issued within 10 mins. 

Last week, I also inquired at the Udon Thani immigration and there are no changes from last year for my Retirement extension of stay. 

I will submit the paperwork this week and update the forum. 

Cheers 

 

And I got my income affidavit from the U.S. Embassy in BKK last week, and absolutely no change from prior years.

 

Going to BKK Immigration with the affidavit later this week.

 

Edited August 22, 2018 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[ubonjoe]

7 minutes ago, Issanjohn said:

 Is the U.S. Embassy asking for it now?

No they are not asking for it. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

6 minutes ago, Issanjohn said:

Is that completely false information?  Is the U.S. Embassy asking for it now?

 

No, the U.S. Embassy is not... Not in CM. Not in BKK.

 

Thai Immigration, however, always reserves the right to ask to see documentation as part of reviewing one's extension application.  Most of the time, however, Immigration does not also.