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Forecasters unanimous: U.S.-China trade war bad for economy - Reuters poll


webfact

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Forecasters unanimous: U.S.-China trade war bad for economy - Reuters poll

By Shrutee Sarkar

 

2018-09-20T004049Z_2_LYNXNPEE8J00Z_RTROPTP_4_USA-TRADE-CHINA.JPG

FILE PHOTO: China Shipping containers sit on a ship in the Port of Los Angeles after being imported to the U.S., California, October 7, 2010. REUTERS/Lucy Nicholson/File Photo

 

BENGALURU (Reuters) - The U.S. economy will expand at a robust pace in coming quarters but slow to 2 percent by the end of 2019, according to forecasters polled by Reuters who unanimously said the escalating trade war with China was bad economic policy.

 

In a sign the trade war is not likely to end any time soon, President Donald Trump on Monday imposed a 10 percent tariff on about $200 billion worth of Chinese imports and threatened duties on around $267 billion more if Beijing retaliates, which it has.

 

In the meantime, the U.S. economy was forecast to grow at an annualized pace of 3.1 percent this quarter, up slightly from 3.0 percent forecast last month, followed by 2.8 percent in the fourth quarter, according to the latest poll.

 

All 70 economists who answered an additional question in the Sept 12-19 survey said the trade conflict between the world's top two economies is bad for U.S. growth, posing downside risks to what is otherwise an upbeat outlook for the near-term.

 

"Absolutely -- it is a bad policy and definitely negative. But it is not bad enough to throw us into a recession, unless it translates to a big negative for confidence and sentiment," said Jim O'Sullivan, chief economist at High Frequency Economics.

 

"It's kind of like - we have nothing to fear, but we should," O'Sullivan said, trying to describe the delicate situation.

 

A decade after U.S. investment bank Lehman Brothers collapsed, triggering a devastating financial crisis, the U.S. economic recovery has been unusually lengthy.

 

Growth is on a solid footing, at least for the near-term, juiced by aggressive tax cuts passed late last year. And a strong labor market underpins the Federal Reserve's plans to raise interest rates further this year and next.

 

The dollar has surged this year as well and Wall Street is trading near record highs, as many emerging market assets have buckled and retreated.

 

"The trigger point for the pain is really hard to predict – the stock market has a lot of momentum and optimism but if we keep raising tariffs then it will cause a correction," said Ethan Harris, head of global economics at BofAML.

 

"It feels like we are in a transition period where the trade war is going from being a minor irritant to a concern, and eventually it will start to impact investment plans."

 

The latest Reuters consensus for U.S. growth showed slight upgrades for several quarters in the coming year but still is forecasting a slowdown to 2.0 percent in the final quarter of 2019, less than half the last reported rate of 4.2 percent.

 

The median probability for a recession in the next year held at just 15 percent. But it increases to 35 percent over the next two years, with the most pessimistic call at 75 percent.

 

"Despite tariffs, emerging market gyrations and political drama in Washington, there seems to be no stopping the American economy in the near-term. Boosted by fiscal stimulus, economic growth is expected to top the G7 in 2018," noted James Orlando, senior economist at TD Securities.

 

"(But) as the fiscal sugar rush fades, economic growth is expected to moderate...risks from trade tensions and uncertainty around the path of fiscal policy clouds the outlook farther out on the horizon."

 

The Trump administration's aggressive tax cuts have already pushed the government's budget deficit higher by almost a third so far in the current fiscal year compared to the same period one year ago.

 

Expectations for inflation and the Fed's rate path were largely unchanged from last month.

 

All 113 economists polled forecast the Fed to hike rates when it meets Sept 25-26. It is expected to follow that up with one more before the end of this year, taking the fed funds rate to 2.25-2.50 percent.

 

But medians showed only two hikes next year, compared to three increases based on the Fed's own dot plots.

 

When asked what could bring the next recession closer, about three-fifths of 68 respondents said faster Fed rates hikes than what are currently expected was the top worry.

 

Over 20 percent of respondents listed the trade war as the top reason why the next U.S. economic downturn might be brought closer. Remaining responses were varied, including a significant correction in stock markets and a further dollar rise.

 

(Analysis and polling by Manjul Paul and Indradip Ghosh; Editing by Ross Finley and Chizu Nomiyama)

 
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-- © Copyright Reuters 2018-09-20
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28 minutes ago, MadMuhammad said:

And how are his finances faring now? Nothing is without risk and everyone falls at some stage. 

It’s how you pick yourself up that defines you, no?

Why don't we wait for the Mueller Report to see if Trump's financing since his bankruptcies is above board?  There has been a ton of speculation that he has been getting Russian Mafia loans. 

https://themoscowproject.org/collusion/eric-trump-funding-need-russia/

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2 hours ago, webfact said:

Forecasters unanimous: U.S.-China trade war bad for economy - Reuters poll

Forecasters don't seem to be unanimous. This poll is next to useless in predicting anything due the the wide variance in opinions. It has about as much value as Thailand's NIDA polls which is zero.

1 Negative comment: 

"Absolutely -- it is a bad policy and definitely negative. But it is not bad enough to throw us into a recession, unless it translates to a big negative for confidence and sentiment," said Jim O'Sullivan,

2. Sit on the fence comment: (by same commentator as above):

"It's kind of like - we have nothing to fear, but we should," O'Sullivan 

3. Positive comment:

"Despite tariffs, emerging market gyrations and political drama in Washington, there seems to be no stopping the American economy in the near-term. Boosted by fiscal stimulus, economic growth is expected to top the G7 in 2018," noted James Orlando.

People can choose whichever comment they like best and then use it to promote their own belief.

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I wouldn't mind seeing some reductions in economic growth if it meant redistributing the pie in a more fair manner.

 

With consumer spending accounting for the majority of the GDP, I don't see how they can reasonably expect the economy to keep growing unless more money is put into the hands of consumers.  

 

Average Americans are already spending pretty much 100% of what they make, and have taken on all the debt they can (and more).  And since the '70s, their income has stagnated, with the vast majority of "economic growth" being enjoyed by the top 1%. 

 

Meanwhile:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGbRbdwJhrg

 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, impulse said:

I wouldn't mind seeing some reductions in economic growth if it meant redistributing the pie in a more fair manner.

 

With consumer spending accounting for the majority of the GDP, I don't see how they can reasonably expect the economy to keep growing unless more money is put into the hands of consumers.  

 

Average Americans are already spending pretty much 100% of what they make, and have taken on all the debt they can (and more).  And since the '70s, their income has stagnated, with the vast majority of "economic growth" being enjoyed by the top 1%. 

 

Meanwhile:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGbRbdwJhrg

 

 

 

And unfortunately it is not just America as that is exactly who the top countries' economists planned it to benefit  ( the top 1% ) since the the 1950's.   Riding on the back of Western populist policies against the alternative , communism, the people in the West,  just like their communist counterparts in the East ,  were brainwashed. The East with abhorrent communist policies to benefit the communist 1% Elite and in the West with almost equally unfair "Democratic" policies where the top 1% benefits from the poorer 99%. 

Edited by Esso49
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1 hour ago, pegman said:

Why don't we wait for the Mueller Report to see if Trump's financing since his bankruptcies is above board?  There has been a ton of speculation that he has been getting Russian Mafia loans. 

https://themoscowproject.org/collusion/eric-trump-funding-need-russia/

It will be interesting regarding underworld loans for sure.

In my opinion that article merely demonstrates a adept businessman recognising a business oppurtuniyy in an otherwise untapped market.

There was a huge amount of Russian money waiting to be spent in the 90’s onwards. 

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1 hour ago, simple1 said:

Go back and review the OP, then apply your skills at comprehension.

You find it easier to criticise than voice a viewpoint yourself? Do you have some difficulty in expressing yourself?

This is a forum where members can express an opinion. It is not a platform for lazy armchair critics such as yourself who lack the ability to present any opinion but are happy to carp about others who do. 

By the way, I suggest you go back and review my comments. I did not give any opinion about the US - China trade war. I merely commented on the questionable value of such surveys.

I know Noosaville is a sleepy hollow but please try to stay awake.

Edited by Cadbury
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3 minutes ago, Cadbury said:

You find it easier to criticise than voice a viewpoint yourself? Do you have some difficulty in expressing yourself?

This is a forum where members can express an opinion. It is not a platform for lazy armchair critics such as yourself who lack the ability to present any opinion but are happy to carp about others who do. 

Agreed, therefor you should read before commenting.

 

Your comment "People can choose whichever comment they like best and then use it to promote their own belief." simply finds no basis in the OP, which is very clear: this is bad for the economy.

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2 hours ago, dcutman said:

Finally we have a president committed to undoing the damage of 30 years of stupid trade policy.

 

 

When you say "we"  are you saying you are a USA citizen who has the right to vote   in the USA?

 

 

 

Edited by watcharacters
clarification about voting in the USA
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2 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Many people think something should be done about China's trade practices, therefor Trump should have gathered support from Western Europe is stead of first alienated these countries and then started the war on his own accord.

 

 

You ignored  my post.     I said I'd prefer to see China and the UK go face to face.    Leave the USA out of it, please.

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4 minutes ago, Cadbury said:

You find it easier to criticise than voice a viewpoint yourself? Do you have some difficulty in expressing yourself?

This is a forum where members can express an opinion. It is not a platform for lazy armchair critics such as yourself who lack the ability to present any opinion but are happy to carp about others who do. 

How misinformation can be considered 'opinion' you may like to clarify.

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9 minutes ago, watcharacters said:

 

 

You ignored  my post.     I said I'd prefer to see China and the UK go face to face.    Leave the USA out of it, please.

I did not ignore it at all, I indicated one of the things wrong with this present war. There should be a united front, not isolated countries. But6 it seems you disagree with that, and would like the UK to take up China by itself.

Edited by stevenl
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1 minute ago, simple1 said:

How misinformation can be considered 'opinion' you may like to clarify.

It seems you don't call your self simple1 for no reason at all. Please Simon identify what "misinformation" you refer to. This is not a "riddle" forum. Grow up.

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17 minutes ago, Cadbury said:

It seems you don't call your self simple1 for no reason at all. Please Simon identify what "misinformation" you refer to. This is not a "riddle" forum. Grow up.

I suppose you think insult is your best form of deflection. However, to answer the blindingly obvious, misinformation in your post #7

 

 

Edited by simple1
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16 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Agreed, therefor you should read before commenting.

 

Your comment "People can choose whichever comment they like best and then use it to promote their own belief." simply finds no basis in the OP, which is very clear: this is bad for the economy.

Maybe it is bad for the economy in the opinion of the OP and yourself and others. But some others may have the opposite view. I couldn't give a rat's either way.

It is about a Reuters opinion poll on which I base my comments; not an opinion formed by Cub Reporter Shrutee Sarkar. 

Polls can have outcomes to suit many opinions. Whether you and Shrutee believe it to be bad for the economy is of small interest to me. Similarly those who believe it to be good for the economy is likewise of little interest to me.

I prefer to wait and see what happens as the trade conflict gets further entrenched.

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Just now, simple1 said:

I suppose you think insult is your best form of deflection. However, to answer the blindingly obvious, misinformation in your post #7

Another riddle Simon? To particularly what misinformation do you refer, please specify or is this just a game for you?

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21 minutes ago, Cadbury said:

Maybe it is bad for the economy in the opinion of the OP and yourself and others. But some others may have the opposite view. I couldn't give a rat's either way.

It is about a Reuters opinion poll on which I base my comments; not an opinion formed by Cub Reporter Shrutee Sarkar. 

Polls can have outcomes to suit many opinions. Whether you and Shrutee believe it to be bad for the economy is of small interest to me. Similarly those who believe it to be good for the economy is likewise of little interest to me.

I prefer to wait and see what happens as the trade conflict gets further entrenched.

All doesn't matter.

 

You were reacting to the OP, and your conclusion was not based on the OP at all but on your own opinion, while pretending it was based on the OP. Fine, but don't pretend otherwise.

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I know the trade war is bad for the international companies profits. I am not sure about everything else.

I know China steals and copies technology and also does not follow through on agreements to

open up its markets to foreign companies. They promise a great deal and deliver very little.

That said companies who open up production plants there know what they are getting into so I have little

sympathy for them regarding forced technology transfer and intellectual property theft.

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19 minutes ago, Ulic said:

I know the trade war is bad for the international companies profits. I am not sure about everything else.

Bad for the domestic SME's importing Chinese products and/or components used in manufacturing domestic products. They have the choice to pass on the tariff cost and lose sales or absorb tariff costs and lose profit margins. In the short term absorbing the extra tariff cost might be bearable but likely not beyond a year.

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