Extreme Brexit could be worse than financial crisis for UK: BoE

[dick dasterdly]

1 hour ago, dick dasterdly said:

Fair enough, but I'm waiting for a remainer to say that they have been given a 'holiday'.

 

22 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

Grouse might help you out . . . .

 

Has grouse ever been given a 'holiday'?

 

If so, I hope he will tell us.

 

Even if he doesn't, I hope another remainer will come forward and tell us that they have been given a 'holiday'.

 

Edit - Sorry, I've a bit of a 'bee in my bonnet' about this - and so would appreciate hearing from remainers that received 'holidays' - preferably before I'm banned for mentioning it or the posts are deleted....

Edited December 17, 2018 by dick dasterdly

[Jip99]

12 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

Reentry into the WTO has to be negotiated. And other members can delay the process. I've read that it could take a couple of years. I've yet to see a Brexiter in this forum acknowledge this.

 

 

I have read differently - so we will consign your BS to the Project Fear bin........ next.

[anon676545345]

15 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

There's also the fact that WTO rules, contrary to Brexiters expectation, don't kick in the moment the UK leaves the EU. Reentry into the WTO has to be negotiated. And other members can delay the process. I've read that it could take a couple of years. I've yet to see a Brexiter in this forum acknowledge this.

 

Common knowledge that we’ll stay on current WTO terms till new terms are negotiated. You’d know this if you read the news, not just lapped up the BBC’s propaganda. 

[Grouse]

23 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said:

I would be prepared to see "Leave with no deal" as an option on the referendum.

Sent from my SM-A500F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Parliament will never accept that. It's the only point on which there is a real majority. 

[melvinmelvin]

10 minutes ago, Chartist said:

 

Common knowledge that we’ll stay on current WTO terms till new terms are negotiated. You’d know this if you read the news, not just lapped up the BBC’s propaganda. 

 

news are not in control of this

the WTO members control this

 

as far as I know WTO has not recorded a valid decision that UK may continue to trade with the

EU schedule, until a UK schedule as been accepted

 

 

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

Incidentally, am I wrong in thinking that only brexiteers are given 'holidays'?

 

Genuine question, that may (of course....) result in my ban from the forum ☹️.

If it improves your state of equanimity, I can assure you that suspensions seem to be awarded evenhandedly. I have been brought to book on a number of occasions. I try hard  to stay within the rules now 

[dick dasterdly]

Just now, Grouse said:

If it improves your state of equanimity, I can assure you that suspensions seem to be awarded evenhandedly. I have been brought to book on a number of occasions. I try hard  to stay within the rules now 

So you have received 'holidays'?

 

Genuine question, as it would certainly make me feel that they are being handed out evenly.

[Grouse]

33 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

So you have received 'holidays'?

 

Genuine question, as it would certainly make me feel that they are being handed out evenly.

Yes

[evadgib]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Prepare for the UK to be shafted.

Wot, like this?

https://www.gov.uk/government/announcements?keywords=trade&taxons[]=all&subtaxons[]=all&announcement_filter_option=all&departments[]=all&people[]=all&world_locations[]=all&from_date=&to_date=

[My Thai Life]

1 hour ago, bristolboy said:

There's also the fact that WTO rules, contrary to Brexiters expectation, don't kick in the moment the UK leaves the EU. Reentry into the WTO has to be negotiated. And other members can delay the process. I've read that it could take a couple of years. I've yet to see a Brexiter in this forum acknowledge this.

You've raised an interesting point. 

 

I'd be interested to know what terms of trade in your opinion the UK would be operating under in the event of a "no deal".

[evadgib]

48 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

So you have received 'holidays'?

 

Genuine question, as it would certainly make me feel that they are being handed out evenly.

I've not seen Vogie all day....

[tebee]

1 minute ago, My Thai Life said:

You've raised an interesting point. 

 

I'd be interested to know what terms of trade in your opinion the UK would be operating under in the event of a "no deal".

In the intervening time we can trade on whatever tariffs we want, but equally other counties can enforce whatever tariffs they want on out exports.

 

So if someone stuck a 200% tariff on say UK built cars, but not any other counties cars, we could do nothing to stop it.

 

When we are a WTO  member again we could ask them to enforce the most favoured country rules again, but until then we can do nothing but retaliate. 

[My Thai Life]

14 minutes ago, tebee said:

In the intervening time we can trade on whatever tariffs we want, but equally other counties can enforce whatever tariffs they want on out exports.

 

So if someone stuck a 200% tariff on say UK built cars, but not any other counties cars, we could do nothing to stop it.

 

When we are a WTO  member again we could ask them to enforce the most favoured country rules again, but until then we can do nothing but retaliate. 

So you're saying that in your opinion we'd be operating outside of any framework at all?

 

By the way, I'm sure you know that the UK is a WTO member (since 1995, and GATT since 1948). Here's the UK-WTO page for interested readers.

 

https://www.wto.org/english/thewto_e/countries_e/united_kingdom_e.htm

Edited December 17, 2018 by My Thai Life

[bristolboy]

14 minutes ago, tebee said:

In the intervening time we can trade on whatever tariffs we want, but equally other counties can enforce whatever tariffs they want on out exports.

 

So if someone stuck a 200% tariff on say UK built cars, but not any other counties cars, we could do nothing to stop it.

 

When we are a WTO  member again we could ask them to enforce the most favoured country rules again, but until then we can do nothing but retaliate. 

Also, it's important to keep in mind that WTO rules are about tariffs. It's virtually useless against other unfair trade practices. Whereasm because of the single market, unfair trade practices within the EU are virtually non-existent

[My Thai Life]

2 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

Also, it's important to keep in mind that WTO rules are about tariffs. It's virtually useless against other unfair trade practices. Whereasm because of the single market, unfair trade practices within the EU are virtually non-existent

It was interesting to hear Tebee's response, despite the fact that he seems to be unaware that the UK is in the WTO.

 

But I still haven't heard yours. Do you have an opinion on this topic, after all you raised it.

[bristolboy]

5 minutes ago, My Thai Life said:

So you're saying that in your opinion we'd be operating outside of any framework at all?

 

By the way, I'm sure you know that the UK is a WTO member (since 1995, and GATT since 1948). Here's the UK-WTO page for interested readers.

 

https://www.wto.org/english/thewto_e/countries_e/united_kingdom_e.htm

I'm not sure what being a WTO member means in this case. On the one hand, the UK is submitting a schedule for its services that duplicate the rules of the EU. But on the other hand, if another WTO member objects, then acceptance of this schedule can be put on hold. So clearly there is a difference in status between the kind of membership the UK has and the membership of other WTO members.

[My Thai Life]

1 minute ago, bristolboy said:

I'm not sure what being a WTO member means in this case. On the one hand, the UK is submitting a schedule for its services that duplicate the rules of the EU. But on the other hand, if another WTO member objects, then acceptance of this schedule can be put on hold. So clearly there is a difference in status between the kind of membership the UK has and the membership of other WTO members.

Well it's good to hear your opinion. Re your last sentence, as far as I know the UK has the same membership status as other nations. The fact that the UK will be making substantial schedule changes (we assume) doesn't alter its membership status as such. The WTO is involved in all kinds of arbitration, it's a key part of its job, it's not a special treat just for the UK.

[My Thai Life]

16 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

Whereasm because of the single market, unfair trade practices within the EU are virtually non-existent

I don't want to sidetrack from what might turn out to be an interesting conversation about WTO. But I disagree with this statement. In my opinion the EU has institutionalised unfair practice on a huge scale - most notoriously with the CAP.

[melvinmelvin]

57 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

I'm not sure what being a WTO member means in this case. On the one hand, the UK is submitting a schedule for its services that duplicate the rules of the EU. But on the other hand, if another WTO member objects, then acceptance of this schedule can be put on hold. So clearly there is a difference in status between the kind of membership the UK has and the membership of other WTO members.

not really difference in membership

 

but other wto members have their schedule sorted and accepted, uk has not

 

a bunch of countries have expressed concerns re uk's proposed schedule,

usa, new zealand, australia, russia +++++++

 

will take time to sort this,

will hardly be sorted come april fools day

 

 

[Grouse]

9 hours ago, My Thai Life said:

You've raised an interesting point. 

 

I'd be interested to know what terms of trade in your opinion the UK would be operating under in the event of a "no deal".

Car boot

[samran]

20 hours ago, grumpy 4680 said:

    I forgot, brexiteers want to stop freedom of movement.

 

         Rubbish,   Brits just want some control over the numbers, thats not an unreasonable demand, 

Erm, um....well.

 

When you control something it isn’t free anymore. 

 

But no matter - I take your point. You just wanted a crackdown on people with strange accents entering your country.

[My Thai Life]

56 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Car boot

And this comment is evidence of the high level of intelligence you believe you have?

[My Thai Life]

8 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

will hardly be sorted come april fools day

There are several reasons why the schedule won't be fully ratified by that date. Are you aware of any?

 

And in your opinion what is the effect of not having a fully ratified schedule?

[My Thai Life]

1 hour ago, samran said:

Erm, um....well.

 

When you control something it isn’t free anymore. 

 

But no matter - I take your point. You just wanted a crackdown on people with strange accents entering your country.

Well all movement of people every where is controlled in some way.

 

The UK voted to return to the international norm.

 

I've got the impression from some of your other posts that you're not from an EU country, so you may not be aware that the UK was never in schengen ayway.

 

The reason that UK citizens voted to control immigration was principally the strain on public services as far as I know.

 

We've always had people with strange accents, including Brummies, Scousers, Yorkies and Americans.

Edited December 18, 2018 by My Thai Life

[melvinmelvin]

16 minutes ago, My Thai Life said:

There are several reasons why the schedule won't be fully ratified by that date. Are you aware of any?

 

And in your opinion what is the effect of not having a fully ratified schedule?

stops you from trading the way you want

 

[Grouse]

40 minutes ago, My Thai Life said:

And this comment is evidence of the high level of intelligence you believe you have?

No but it IS evidence that you are humourless.

 

BTW why is it that so many Brexiters do not know the difference between intelligence and education? I blame education!

Edited December 18, 2018 by Grouse

[My Thai Life]

It's often said that Brexiters promised the easiest trade deal in the world. This is what was actually said:

 

"Coming to a free trade agreement with the EU should be "one of the easiest in human history" because our rules and laws are already the same, the international trade secretary has said.

Liam Fox is to set out his vision of the UK's trading relationship with the rest of the world after Brexit.

"The only reason we wouldn't come to a free and open agreement is because politics gets in the way of economics," Dr Fox told the Today programme."

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/uk-40667879/eu-trade-deal-easiest-in-human-history

 

[My Thai Life]

14 minutes ago, Grouse said:

No but it IS evidence that you are humourless.

 

BTW why is it that so many Brexiters do not know the difference between intelligence and education? I blame education!

I'm sure that if you knew something about the key issues you would give us the benefit of your much paraded intelligence and education, rather than just humourless one liners.

 

So far on a topic raised by a remainer - the way trade would work in the event of no deal - the leading lights of the remain posters on this forum have demonstrated no understanding at all - I'll rephrase that, about 10% understanding, plus the usual "humour" from yourself, and even one gentleman who is unaware that the UK is actually in the WTO.

Edited December 18, 2018 by My Thai Life

[owl sees all]

The EU is coming apart at the seams. Other countries are watching the UK battle with the non-elected eurocrats with interest. They could be thinking about doing the same as the UK. Jumping a sinking ship.

 

Greece has been devastated, countries have been asked to vote again, monetary budgets refused, and all the while big business and spokespeople from the City of London (not a part of the UK) and the Bank of England (a private bank) are telling us how terrible it will be for 'the people' if we leave. 

 

Well, 'the people' did speak, and they voted LEAVE. Not a very long word, but one which many have trouble comprehending.

 

It is interesting to note that similar arguments were used for those countries (who re-voted), as is now the case in the UK, to get them to change their minds.

Edited December 18, 2018 by owl sees all

[bristolboy]

10 hours ago, My Thai Life said:

I don't want to sidetrack from what might turn out to be an interesting conversation about WTO. But I disagree with this statement. In my opinion the EU has institutionalised unfair practice on a huge scale - most notoriously with the CAP.

Whatever you think about CAP, that's an internal affair. The same way that in the United States all sort of rules either require subsidies paid for by taxes or rules that raise the prices of various agricultural commodities by protecting them from foreign competition. Most nations enforce protections of their agricultural products. 

And it's dubious how much an exit from the EU will lower food prices. The UK currently gets about 50 percent of its food from domestic sources. Labor costs for agriculture will rise dramatically once the UK exits. Or, given the higher costs and given that your wish to end protectionism if agriculture becomes reality, it's likely that that sector of the British economy will face a severe decline.