Why is this air con unit so cheap?

[Hal65]

https://www.lazada.co.th/products/air-mitsui-chofu-12000btu-r32-mu-13ec-i250802632-s387102660.html?spm=a2o4m.searchlist.list.1.481c5ff0hQ1AjX&search=1

 

8,400 thb for a 12,000 BTU unit. In Big C it cost 17,000 for a unit of that power. A little higher at power buy.

 

They include free install at those local stores. I imagine I could pay someone 500 thb, maybe 1000 at most to get it done. 

 

Is Mitsui Chofu a low quality brand? Anything else to be wary of?

Edited December 5, 2018 by Hal65

[manarak]

apparently a new Thai manufacturer. I'd say they are a very new company just starting out with all the risks it means for you. can't say anything about quality, but you can figure the odds yourself.

[sometimewoodworker]

8 hours ago, Hal65 said:

They include free install at those local stores. I imagine I could pay someone 500 thb, maybe 1000 at most to get it done. 

Standard install cost is around 2,000+

[Carlosm]

Cheapest install is 2,500 baht, i've just shopped around.

I've the exact same unit in my bedroom, bought from Lazada, nice and cold, no problems.

[wgdanson]

12 minutes ago, Carlosm said:

Cheapest install is 2,500 baht, i've just shopped around.

I've the exact same unit in my bedroom, bought from Lazada, nice and cold, no problems.

YET !   

[Enoon]

9 hours ago, manarak said:

apparently a new Thai manufacturer. I'd say they are a very new company just starting out with all the risks it means for you. can't say anything about quality, but you can figure the odds yourself.

 

Selling Air-cons since at least March 2013:

ราคาแอร์มิตซุย โชฟุ อีเล็คทริค(MITSUI CHOFU ELECTRIC )

 

 

 

[johng]

from their website

แอร์ Mitsui Chofu รุ่น MS-13EC32/MU-13EC32 ขนาด 12,000BTU 7,500 บาท

that's very cheap and I might be tempted to  try one...even if it only last a few years

but they say 12 year warranty on compressor and 3 year warranty on  coils

so good for at least 3 years (maybe)

[atyclb]

inverter ac's are worth paying a bit more for

[eyecatcher]

Its not particularly cheap, but you areall comparing with what you paid at a big box store.

I paid 10k supplied and fitted a new 13kbtu LG inverter just last year from an independant air con specialist.

If the fitting was say 2500bt, then my LG woild have been 7500bt 

 

So cheap?....no, normal price.

[johng]

1 minute ago, eyecatcher said:

I paid 10k supplied and fitted a new 13kbtu LG inverter just last year from an independant air con specialist. 

Well that's cheap ,  do you have the details of this "independent air con specialist"  ??

[Pedrogaz]

17 minutes ago, atyclb said:

inverter ac's are worth paying a bit more for

Do you have any data to support this? I originally bought 5 a/c units with inverters at a significant extra cost over ordinary models. I have since bought a fourth 5 non inverter models.....I must say that my electricity bill has not risen at all with the new units.

[Dazinoz]

8 minutes ago, Pedrogaz said:

Do you have any data to support this? I originally bought 5 a/c units with inverters at a significant extra cost over ordinary models. I have since bought a fourth 5 non inverter models.....I must say that my electricity bill has not risen at all with the new units.

Inverter units are more expensive than standard units because of the heaps of electronics in them. This also means that if they fail they can be very expensive to repair. In Australia it was often just as cheap to replace the whole unit. I could imagine the same here. Inverter units, again because of the electronics are more prone to damage by power surges and vermin such as geckos, mice etc. In a non inverter unit the compressor cuts in and out to control the temperature whereas an inverter unit the compressor is running a lot more at varying speeds to control temperature within a narrow range. Again, due to electronics they are susceptible to heat and if the out door unit is mounted in direct sun they are "smart enough" to derate themselves when the electronics get too hot and thus don't deliver the rated output. If you buy a unit that is just big enough for the room then it runs at full power most of the time and any savings are lost. Having said all that I did have one in my bedroom in Australia as I worked shift work and it was much better at controlling a constant temp and usually quieter,

[Dazinoz]

11 hours ago, manarak said:

apparently a new Thai manufacturer. I'd say they are a very new company just starting out with all the risks it means for you. can't say anything about quality, but you can figure the odds yourself.

My first split AC in Australia was a Fujitsu General. The installer said it was a new brand and did not know what it was like. Well I changed it out for an inverter model after 19 years of use and I put it in my workshop and was still going a several years later when I moved to Thailand. So you just really don't know.

[Pedrogaz]

Thanks for the information. 

[manarak]

4 minutes ago, Dazinoz said:

My first split AC in Australia was a Fujitsu General. The installer said it was a new brand and did not know what it was like. Well I changed it out for an inverter model after 19 years of use and I put it in my workshop and was still going a several years later when I moved to Thailand. So you just really don't know.

odds are what they are: odds.

[Fruit Trader]

42 minutes ago, eyecatcher said:

Its not particularly cheap, but you areall comparing with what you paid at a big box store.

I paid 10k supplied and fitted a new 13kbtu LG inverter just last year from an independant air con specialist.

If the fitting was say 2500bt, then my LG woild have been 7500bt 

 

So cheap?....no, normal price.

There are deals to be found outside big stores. A local air shop had a huge pile of LG 12k BTU inverter for 10,500 and some Haier 10k BTU for 6000. Not including install cost.

 

If you have the skills to fit a split AC and dont need to extend the lines, you can just pay to have the lines evacuated as most come ready charged from factory.  

[Seeall]

56 minutes ago, atyclb said:

inverter ac's are worth paying a bit more for

a good topic...  both myself and my  old AC guy cant seem to see any savings with the Inverter story..

[thailand49]

1 hour ago, eyecatcher said:

Its not particularly cheap, but you areall comparing with what you paid at a big box store.

I paid 10k supplied and fitted a new 13kbtu LG inverter just last year from an independant air con specialist.

If the fitting was say 2500bt, then my LG woild have been 7500bt 

 

So cheap?....no, normal price.

That is a great deal, My service guy for 12 years replace my old with a 13,000 BTU LG Inverter for 15,000 fully installed.  Told me my bill should go down 500 baht and sure enough, it did and it is really quiet too.

[eyecatcher]

1 hour ago, johng said:

Well that's cheap ,  do you have the details of this "independent air con specialist"  ??

absolutely, I know of three here in Chiang mai, and have previously steered TV members there.

 

I researched almost everyone selling aircon before buying and came to the conclsion that the shiny home pros/global/siam/et al are marking up the smaller 12k btu units by an average of 35-45% on the price of your local independants.

Even the lazada and online stores are upto 20% more expensive and then you still have to find someone to fit it.

 

but if you want to shop around you can find good prices on almost everything you want to buy.

[eyecatcher]

1 hour ago, Fruit Trader said:

There are deals to be found outside big stores. A local air shop had a huge pile of LG 12k BTU inverter for 10,500 and some Haier 10k BTU for 6000. Not including install cost.

 

If you have the skills to fit a split AC and dont need to extend the lines, you can just pay to have the lines evacuated as most come ready charged from factory.  

I reckon you are referring to same one I have. 10500 rings a bell but that included fitting, and its actually a 13k btu (12750 I think) it has no13 in the serial number.

the point is try to avoid the big box stores if you want to be careful with your money

[eyecatcher]

28 minutes ago, thailand49 said:

That is a great deal, My service guy for 12 years replace my old with a 13,000 BTU LG Inverter for 15,000 fully installed.  Told me my bill should go down 500 baht and sure enough, it did and it is really quiet too.

on the LG models, there are two that are almost identical. its like those special edition cars you could buy 6 months before the new model came out.

in the LG case, yes, I looked at two that were the same except this newest version(possibly yours) had to me what was a very unnecessary feature.

I forget exactly, but if I said the expensive model claimed to de-ionize the air at the same time then that's why I thought "5k extra for something I don't even understand, bollx to that"

[atyclb]

1 hour ago, Seeall said:

2 hours ago, atyclb said:

inverter ac's are worth paying a bit more for

a good topic...  both myself and my  old AC guy cant seem to see any savings with the Inverter story..

 

some good info about pros and cons of both styles.

 

http://www.aire-acondicionado.com.es/en/inverter-air-conditioner/

[BigT73]

In most of cases inverters will be useless in Thailand as houses/condos are poorly insulated.

[sometimewoodworker]

5 hours ago, BigT73 said:

In most of cases inverters will be useless in Thailand as houses/condos are poorly insulated.

Just wrong. Many/most  A/c units are over sized, giving poor to bad dehumidification, costing more than is needed for the unit and high power consumption, and shortening the motor life by repeatedly switching it on and off.

 

Put in an inverter of the same power and you will see a reduction in power usage as well as solving the other shortcomings. There are plenty of people who have made significant savings.

 

There are a few cases where the A/C is undersized so an inverter will provide no savings.

 

[BigT73]

5 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

Just wrong. Many/most  A/c units are over sized, giving poor to bad dehumidification, costing more than is needed for the unit and high power consumption, and shortening the motor life by repeatedly switching it on and off.

 

Put in an inverter of the same power and you will see a reduction in power usage as well as solving the other shortcomings. There are plenty of people who have made significant savings.

 

There are a few cases where the A/C is undersized so an inverter will provide no savings.

 

Invertors are great IF there is proper insulation, most houses condos here have single brick.  The sun heats these bricks and its constantly radiating heat even after the sun goes down a long time, then as soon as the invertor switches off the room heats up.  Back where I am from we double brick or if single brick we insulate with a layer of batts walls and ceilings.  Even the windows here are poorly designed  letting cold escape easily. 

If you built your own place or have top quality build I would agree with your post.

[l4ml4m]

1 hour ago, sometimewoodworker said:

Just wrong. Many/most  A/c units are over sized, giving poor to bad dehumidification, costing more than is needed for the unit and high power consumption, and shortening the motor life by repeatedly switching it on and off.

 

Put in an inverter of the same power and you will see a reduction in power usage as well as solving the other shortcomings. There are plenty of people who have made significant savings.

 

There are a few cases where the A/C is undersized so an inverter will provide no savings.

 

 

You are so kind to explain to people who know nothing how an inverter works ❤️

 

 

 

[KittenKong]

7 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

Put in an inverter of the same power and you will see a reduction in power usage as well as solving the other shortcomings. There are plenty of people who have made significant savings.

I replaced an old no-name air-con with a new inverter model several years ago. I made an immediate saving on electricity costs of about 50-70% but I cant be sure how much of that is to do with the inverter and how much to do with it just being new. One thing that is sure: the new air-con paid for itself within 18 months as has continued to save me money ever since.

 

The other really big differences with inverter units are:

1. They dont "clunk" when they turn on and off, and they are quiet in use as for a lot of the time they are not running at full speed.

2. You get a nice uniform cooling effect that varies smoothly as needed, rather than the abrupt switching from full cooling to zero cooling that you get from a non-inverter model.

 

So for me inverter is the only way to go and I would never consider buying a non-inverter model at any price.

[atyclb]

2 hours ago, KittenKong said:

I replaced an old no-name air-con with a new inverter model several years ago. I made an immediate saving on electricity costs of about 50-70% but I cant be sure how much of that is to do with the inverter and how much to do with it just being new. One thing that is sure: the new air-con paid for itself within 18 months as has continued to save me money ever since.

 

The other really big differences with inverter units are:

1. They dont "clunk" when they turn on and off, and they are quiet in use as for a lot of the time they are not running at full speed.

2. You get a nice uniform cooling effect that varies smoothly as needed, rather than the abrupt switching from full cooling to zero cooling that you get from a non-inverter model.

 

So for me inverter is the only way to go and I would never consider buying a non-inverter model at any price.

 

i think the ac is inverted to dc and it is variable speed dc motor that powers it and can slow and speed up thus not needing to power on and off (clunk) continually

[sometimewoodworker]

9 hours ago, BigT73 said:

Invertors are great IF there is proper insulation, most houses condos here have single brick.  The sun heats these bricks and its constantly radiating heat even after the sun goes down a long time, then as soon as the invertor switches off the room heats up.  Back where I am from we double brick or if single brick we insulate with a layer of batts walls and ceilings.  Even the windows here are poorly designed  letting cold escape easily. 

If you built your own place or have top quality build I would agree with your post.

Proper insulation is completely irrelevant when comparing the benefit of inverter to regular A/C.

 

Proper insulation is totally relevant when talking about comfort,  economics, and sound reduction, and that will provide benefit whichever type of cooling you use.

 

You also don't seem to realise that the inverter doesn't switch off when the correct temperature is reached (you are attributing regular A/C behaviour to an inverter) it progressively reduces it's cooling effect until an equilibrium is reached and maintains that output. So no significant change of room temperature by your cinder blocks or red brick "storage heater"

 

So to make it simple.

Old Standard oversized regular AC replaced by new regular same size AC = save money 

Old Standard oversized regular AC replaced by new inverter same size AC = save more money 

 

Old  undersized regular AC replaced by new same size AC = save money 

Old  undersized regular AC replaced by new same size inverter AC = Do not save money, but waste on technology that is no benefit 

[BigT73]

13 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

Proper insulation is completely irrelevant when comparing the benefit of inverter to regular A/C.

 

Proper insulation is totally relevant when talking about comfort,  economics, and sound reduction, and that will provide benefit whichever type of cooling you use.

 

You also don't seem to realise that the inverter doesn't switch off when the correct temperature is reached (you are attributing regular A/C behaviour to an inverter) it progressively reduces it's cooling effect until an equilibrium is reached and maintains that output. So no significant change of room temperature by your cinder blocks or red brick "storage heater"

 

So to make it simple.

Old Standard oversized regular AC replaced by new regular same size AC = save money 

Old Standard oversized regular AC replaced by new inverter same size AC = save more money 

 

Old  undersized regular AC replaced by new same size AC = save money 

Old  undersized regular AC replaced by new same size inverter AC = Do not save money, but waste on technology that is no benefit 

Thanks for clarifying quite interesting for future punters.  When I did my reno I went the insulation route walls and ceilings, I didnt purchase the inverter type as once the place cools it retains it for hours, I just have a few ceiling fans on.  Overall I dont need the a/c for more than a few hrs a day. I personally hate ac units and avoid them where I can.

 

19 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

Old  undersized regular AC replaced by new same size inverter AC = Do not save money, but waste on technology that is no benefit 

The statement you made about oversized a/c units in Thailand your above statement is where my conclusions from your original posts were at.