So I want to be a landlord...

[Ganador]

 Hi. Any landlords out there in TV forum? I have a condo in Bangkok which I rarely use as I am now living abroad. Its just sitting there vacant for most of the year, so I thought about renting it out.

 

My juristic admin manager, who manages several units for absent farangs, says he will handle everything (for a "reasonable" fee) -- finding the tenant, preparing the lease contract, and depositing the rental payments to my bank account every month.

 

Sounds fairly simple and straight forward. But what is the downside... what could possibly go wrong, besides the tenant defaulting on his rent or damaging my property?

 

For example, could there be issues for me with the Tax Office or Immigration Dept (TM30) or some other problems. Any advice and suggestions from TV forum landlords welcome and appreciated.

 

[Mavideol]

I am a landlord (live in Thailand) and have been dealing juristic person(s)/management, so far didn't found any honest ones but maybe they are out there, just not my luck..... in your case not living in Thailand, trusting a juristic person to collect money on your behalf??? hummmm risky very risky... cash is a temptation for anybody dealing with it

[madmen]

I am a landlord (live in Thailand) and have been dealing juristic person(s)/management, so far didn't found any honest ones but maybe they are out there, just not my luck..... in your case not living in Thailand, trusting a juristic person to collect money on your behalf??? hummmm risky very risky... cash is a temptation for anybody dealing with it

Landlord here and personally know several farang living OS that got ripped off by their agent.
How.. Renting their room out nightly or weekly and pocketing the proceeds and never finding permanent tenants for obvious reasons

Air bnb is the best bet as you get paid by them direct. Just put down minimum rental 6 to 12 months but you need somebody to hand over the keys and handle any problems. You could pay some one to do that

[smutcakes]

I would never let the Juristic Management or Building Management do it. They are paid by all Co-owners out of Common Fee to manage the common areas of the property, not waste time dealing with private individual unit business at the expense of the common area. It is unfair on other Co-owners.

 

Kind of ironic people complaining about unscrupulous management leasing out theirs and other units, when Co-owners should not ask the management to do it in the 1st place. Som na na i would say. Organize it yourself, or with an external agency not by the management who are paid by all.

[KittenKong]

9 hours ago, smutcakes said:

I would never let the Juristic Management or Building Management do it. They are paid by all Co-owners out of Common Fee to manage the common areas of the property, not waste time dealing with private individual unit business at the expense of the common area. It is unfair on other Co-owners.

Indeed. Building management should not be doing this at all and only a very badly-run building would allow it.

 

That said, there is no reason to assume that an external agency would necessarily be any more or less competent, or any more or less honest. And one could argue that the building management might be a safer bet as they are less likely to run away than some outside agencies.

[KittenKong]

9 hours ago, Ganador said:

My juristic admin manager, who manages several units for absent farangs, says he will handle everything (for a "reasonable" fee) -- finding the tenant, preparing the lease contract, and depositing the rental payments to my bank account every month.

How much is "reasonable"?

 

As long as you insist on only long-term tenants, and as long as a suitable deposit is taken then you probably wont have too much trouble. Short-term tenancies are bound to go wrong sooner or later and will probably result in money going astray, as mentioned. They may also be contrary to your building regs.

 

You are supposed to declare the income at the tax office. You also have the responsibility of reporting any farang living in your condo to Immigration, though the agent would probably do that for you as part of his job.

 

Never trust anyone and always assume that you are being lied to.

 

[worgeordie]

Think very carefully before you do this, especially when your not

even going to be in the country,so many things can go wrong and

do,bad tenants and suspect agents that promise the World,but

don't deliver,if you don't need the income from it don't bother,

who are you going to get to do any repairs if say the water leaks,

problems with electricity , etc,etc, 

regards worgeordie

[vinegarbase]

They can also rip you off with sudden repairs. 

 

Hey Mr. Overseas Moneybags, your AC went out and it was 5,000 for a new compressor. Meanwhile there was never anything wrong with your AC.

 

Why don't you just sell it if you aren't using it anymore?

[GinBoy2]

When I was living full time in Thailand I had 4 units in Noble Remix as rentals.

 

Frankly I wouldn't have trusted the Juristic office further than I could spit to manage then.

 

Problem is, you are probably used to having professional property management companies, who for a fee take care of everything for you. That really doesn't exist in Thailand.

 

So you are a little bit between a rock and  hard place

 

There are a host of real estate agents who will find you tenants, although once again, don't expect the credit, background checking you might be expecting. They will find you a tenant and just charge their fee, then they are done.

 

What I did, was establish a relationship with a couple of the maintenance guys and one of the cleaning ladies, who I could trust.

That way I could always get things taken care of.

 

As for rent, always require a direct deposit into your Thai bank account, that way you dont have to worry.

 

Lease contracts are pretty straightforward, and literally unenforceable, so don't fret about that. I can send you a copy of one of mine if you want

 

I always had Japanese expats as renters. They are fairly low maintenance, pay the rent on time, and when they move out the expat network can often get you a new renter without bothering with an agent

[baansgr]

As one of my clients who had rental properties all over the world said to me years ago.... Why in every other country do I get bills for maybe 1.763 or 3,271 and other similar figures but in Thailand it's always 5.000 or 10.000 or 15.000 Round amounts .strange huh

[alex8912]

Where in Bangkok is condo and can you walk to the BTS? 

I rented my one bed out for 8 years for 6-9 months when I was away. It was near Chong  Nonsi BTS between Sathorn and Silom. I used Craigslist and it was easy. Had foreign tenants always who paid a great rent 21k to 25k for 54 sq meters. Had a Thai friend who picked up rent ( but a direct deposit is probably ok) and he called management if their was a maintenance issue. I was ALWAYS the person who picked my tenants before I left and I know this is probably why I never had a bad one. I also returned every security deposit because my condo was never left in worse than normal wear and tear condition. My feeling about shorter term AIR BNB is just let’s say “ not good” too maybe people who don’t care.  I know my experience was perfect and many posters who actually offer advise on here have probably never even owned a rental before and just like to complain so take these messages lightly. 

As a side note I sold my condo in less than 30 days when the building was 20+ years old for a very nice profit ( plus all the rent $$$) to a single FEMALE Thai professional who about 90% of posters on here say would NEVER buy an older condo lol.  

[smutcakes]

18 minutes ago, alex8912 said:

Where in Bangkok is condo and can you walk to the BTS? 

I rented my one bed out for 8 years for 6-9 months when I was away. It was near Chong  Nonsi BTS between Sathorn and Silom. I used Craigslist and it was easy. Had foreign tenants always who paid a great rent 21k to 25k for 54 sq meters. Had a Thai friend who picked up rent ( but a direct deposit is probably ok) and he called management if their was a maintenance issue. I was ALWAYS the person who picked my tenants before I left and I know this is probably why I never had a bad one. I also returned every security deposit because my condo was never left in worse than normal wear and tear condition. My feeling about shorter term AIR BNB is just let’s say “ not good” too maybe people who don’t care.  I know my experience was perfect and many posters who actually offer advise on here have probably never even owned a rental before and just like to complain so take these messages lightly. 

As a side note I sold my condo in less than 30 days when the building was 20+ years old for a very nice profit ( plus all the rent $$$) to a single FEMALE Thai professional who about 90% of posters on here say would NEVER buy an older condo lol.  

You make a good point about you meeting the tenants directly. I do find even executives in the company i work seem to be incapable of really analyzing farangs when they 1st meet them. The amount of times they employ farangs who any other farang could see as totally unsuitable within an instant is alarming. If executives find this difficult i imagine that other Thai's also find it difficult to pick up telling signs on whether a tenant is likely to be a pain in the ass or good.

 

 

[smutcakes]

23 minutes ago, alex8912 said:

Where in Bangkok is condo and can you walk to the BTS? 

I rented my one bed out for 8 years for 6-9 months when I was away. It was near Chong  Nonsi BTS between Sathorn and Silom. I used Craigslist and it was easy. Had foreign tenants always who paid a great rent 21k to 25k for 54 sq meters. Had a Thai friend who picked up rent ( but a direct deposit is probably ok) and he called management if their was a maintenance issue. I was ALWAYS the person who picked my tenants before I left and I know this is probably why I never had a bad one. I also returned every security deposit because my condo was never left in worse than normal wear and tear condition. My feeling about shorter term AIR BNB is just let’s say “ not good” too maybe people who don’t care.  I know my experience was perfect and many posters who actually offer advise on here have probably never even owned a rental before and just like to complain so take these messages lightly. 

As a side note I sold my condo in less than 30 days when the building was 20+ years old for a very nice profit ( plus all the rent $$$) to a single FEMALE Thai professional who about 90% of posters on here say would NEVER buy an older condo lol.  

I bold another pertinent point. I am 99% sure those who are the most vociferous in their comments regarding leasing out have never owned or tried to lease out a property here.

[madmen]

How much is "reasonable"?

 

As long as you insist on only long-term tenants, and as long as a suitable deposit is taken then you probably wont have too much trouble. Short-term tenancies are bound to go wrong sooner or later and will probably result in money going astray, as mentioned. They may also be contrary to your building regs.

 

You are supposed to declare the income at the tax office. You also have the responsibility of reporting any farang living in your condo to Immigration, though the agent would probably do that for you as part of his job.

 

Never trust anyone and always assume that you are being lied to.

 

Actually in BKK you don't need to report to immigration. I had been reporting for years before finding out its not necessary.

 

No reporting last 2 years and no fines. I believe I got the info from Ubon Joe but it was a while ago so not totally sure

 

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/973943-tm30-at-bangkok-immigration/

[KittenKong]

1 hour ago, madmen said:

Actually in BKK you don't need to report to immigration. I had been reporting for years before finding out its not necessary.

As usual in Thailand: ask three Thais the same question and get three completely different answers, and all will probably be wrong.

 

Some people in Bangkok do seem to have been required to do this:

 

I dont know what the real truth is, but if I was a landlord in Bangkok I would file the form if only for peace of mind. Thankfully I am not a landlord here and hopefully never will be.

[Ulic]

Rent for less than the going rate so you have more people wanting to rent your apartment. Select the one with stable income/employment. Renting while you are out of the country is not a good idea. Selling or letting it sit empty would be my choice. 

[Ulic]

1 hour ago, madmen said:

Actually in BKK you don't need to report to immigration. I had been reporting for years before finding out its not necessary.

 

No reporting last 2 years and no fines. I believe I got the info from Ubon Joe but it was a while ago so not totally sure

 

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/973943-tm30-at-bangkok-immigration/

If your tenants don't have any interaction with immigration there is no need to worry. Or you can have them self report as the "house-master", with the lease and appropriate paperwork. The problems occur when the tenant doesn't know he/she has to do a TM30 report and then turns up at immigration requesting an extension of stay or any other paperwork. Just put it in writing to the tenant in the lease so he/she knows they are responsible for the TM30 report. AirB&B stays are generally short term so no worries about the TM30. For long-stay, there may be a problem. In any case, you will need a maintenance/repair/cleaning service to look after problems that inevitably arise if you are out of the country. 

[madmen]

If your tenants don't have any interaction with immigration there is no need to worry. Or you can have them self report as the "house-master", with the lease and appropriate paperwork. The problems occur when the tenant doesn't know he/she has to do a TM30 report and then turns up at immigration requesting an extension of stay or any other paperwork. Just put it in writing to the tenant in the lease so he/she knows they are responsible for the TM30 report. AirB&B stays are generally short term so no worries about the TM30. For long-stay, there may be a problem. In any case, you will need a maintenance/repair/cleaning service to look after problems that inevitably arise if you are out of the country. 

Good points about tm 30 to consider

. Most if not all modern condos have a team of maintenance guys provided through juristic. I have a great relationship with them and it's just a matter of picking up the phone as there are several English speakers in juristic office.

[Sheryl]

Actually in BKK you don't need to report to immigration. I had been reporting for years before finding out its not necessary. 

No reporting last 2 years and no fines. I believe I got the info from Ubon Joe but it was a while ago so not totally sure

 

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/973943-tm30-at-bangkok-immigration/

There have been recent reports that they have begun to enforce this in Bkk.

 

But to date, Bangkok and elsewhere, it is the foreign renter who gets fined if it is not done rather than the landlord..

 

PRobably because Immigration can easily charge the renter when they come in for extension but has no ready way to locate or fine the (usually Thai) landlord.

 

I think there is a way you can authorize your renters to file the TM30. Ask in the Visa forum.

 

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

 

[Autonuaq]

this is Thailand there are many things you are probably totally not aware of or you missed in the news. The easiest way is to sell the place and do investment in a place that is made for things like you plan now to do. There are many place and they have good rate of interest as well the management you do need in the way you want to do all. Do not forget all is changing in Thailand rapidly. which also makes things like you want or plan as long as Thailand is still attractive workable.

 

There are much better places to invest in Thailand or abroad and do have good returns.

[Autonuaq]

2 hours ago, Sheryl said:

There have been recent reports that they have begun to enforce this in Bkk.

 

But to date, Bangkok and elsewhere, it is the foreign renter who gets fined if it is not done rather than the landlord..

 

PRobably because Immigration can easily charge the renter when they come in for extension but has no ready way to locate or fine the (usually Thai) landlord.

 

I think there is a way you can authorize your renters to file the TM30. Ask in the Visa forum.

 

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

 

well depending on where you in Thailand> i know that there are some landlords or hotels have been fined for not reporting even the short stays or the moving in and out the provinces for the time stated that needed to be reported.

 

TM 30 and TM 28 are needed to fill out as well the report of address when you stay longer outside the province as mentioned in the rues that apply. 

 

[Mad mick]

best tip for would be landlord ,keep your money in your pocket

[GinBoy2]

On 1/24/2019 at 2:05 PM, Mad mick said:

best tip for would be landlord ,keep your money in your pocket

It's a tad complicated. If you're in it for the long term rental biz, it sorta works out, although the variables on where are huge, even in BKK.

 

Lots of people quote square meter price inflation, but that almost never applies to previous build, where more than often the price actually decreases. You can look at the condo building they are building next door and they are asking 25% more than yours. Dream on if you think it applies to your building too.

 

I owned 4 units as rentals in BKK, so I'm fairly well aware of the ups and downs of the rental and subsequent equity 

 

 

[KittenKong]

8 hours ago, GinBoy2 said:

Lots of people quote square meter price inflation, but that almost never applies to previous build, where more than often the price actually decreases. You can look at the condo building they are building next door and they are asking 25% more than yours. Dream on if you think it applies to your building too.

If you buy somewhere popular and where there is no empty land nearby then you may well see some price inflation over time. You may also see it if some new transport link opens up within walking distance of your building.

 

But that really only applies to areas like central Bangkok. Everywhere else has masses of undeveloped land. Pattaya/Jomtien for example has many acres of empty or only slightly developed land on or near the beach, suitable for hundreds of condo buildings.