Retirement extension using 800K - New v Old rule comparison.

[elviajero]

The new rule - if using 800K (min) in a Thai bank to prove income - now requires a minimum balance of 800K to be maintained for 2 months before the extension application, and 3 months after permission to stay is granted. For those that leave 800K in the bank all year - there is no impact. However, those that drawdown an income during the 5 months following the initial transfer will need to initially transfer more to cover the extra 3 months that the balance needs to be maintained;

 

Old rule = Initial transfer of 800K plus 2 x monthly drawdown.

New rule = Initial transfer of 800K plus 5 x monthly drawdown.

 

Here are a couple of examples comparing the initial transfer amount required for the old and new rules; for a new retiree.

 

Example 1.

If you intend to drawdown 65,000 pm you need to initially transfer;

Old rule = 930,000

New rule = 1,125,000

Extra = 195,000

 

 

Example 2.

If you intend to drawdown 40,000 pm you need to initially transfer;

Old rule = 880,000

New rule = 1,000,000

Extra = 120,000

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 3, 2019 by elviajero

[onera1961]

Great analysis. Can we have a chart please for people who are better at visual information?. An interactive charge where you can plug in drawdown amount will be even better. Thanks.

Edited February 4, 2019 by onera1961

[lamyai3]

Since these new rules on the lump sum method were published last week, the 65k pm income method has emerged looking way superior (apart from those who've had the lump sum on deposit for years and benefited from the exchange rates). Total yearly commitment is 780,000, with each monthly deposit available for immediate withdrawal.

[Puchaiyank]

Goodness, there is still life in that dead horse...I was sure it had been beaten to death with the last three threads concerning the 800k baht requirement.  ????

[scubascuba3]

Great analysis. Can we have a chart please for people who are better at visual information?. An interactive charge where you can plug in drawdown amount will be even better. Thanks.

would you like an android app? if so we'll get onto it right away

[DrJack54]

Elviajero, you refer to drawn down. What if I want just put 800k in one account + 400k in another account. Never touch them. Then also have 3rd a/c for just daily/weekly expenses. Would that work. 

[Boon Mee]

6 hours ago, Puchaiyank said:

Goodness, there is still life in that dead horse...I was sure it had been beaten to death with the last three threads concerning the 800k baht requirement.  ????

Indeed. 

Guess the KISS method (keep it simple, stupid) by plunking that 800k baht in the bank and leaving it there aside from quarterly updates to the passbook hasn't cought on yet. 

[rak sa_ngop]

KISS is great except that some immigration offices (so I am told) will not allow stagnant accounts, they want to see movement showing that the funds are being used to pay for the retirees living costs. So now that they have changed their minds will they say that they want to see you spending 400,000 baht over a period of 7 months to qualify for an extension.....jeeez what a mess.

[farcanell]

8 hours ago, elviajero said:

The new rule - if using 800K (min) in a Thai bank to prove income - now requires a minimum balance of 800K to be maintained for 2 months before the extension application, and 3 months after permission to stay is granted.

Is the 400,000 minimum at all times no longer an issue?

[spetersen]

I don't understand, What about a letter from your bank proving foreign deposits , of 65000 THB every month or more, together with income affidavit from your Embassy or consulate. Does it also need 800K/400K sitting in a Thai bank for months ? The vast majority are still Issue them with the exception of four countries.

[ubonjoe]

8 minutes ago, spetersen said:

I don't understand, What about a letter from your bank proving foreign deposits , of 65000 THB every month or more, together with income affidavit from your Embassy or consulate. Does it also need 800K/400K sitting in a Thai bank for months ? The vast majority are still Issue them with the exception of four countries.

If you have proof of income from an embassy there is no requirement to transfer the 65k baht into the country every month. You might be asked to produce backup proof of it is all you might need.

No need to have money in the bank if you can meet the 65k baht income requirement.

[george11]

9 hours ago, onera1961 said:

Great analysis. Can we have a chart please for people who are better at visual information?. An interactive charge where you can plug in drawdown amount will be even better. Thanks.

That good idea, an Excel worksheet would fit the bill.

[DrJack54]

Can you still bring in 25k USD in green if you happen to be visiting the fatherland. Keep your bank receipts of withdrawl from home bank and super rich conversion slip here. Or not possible now?

[george11]

8 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

If you have proof of income from an embassy there is no requirement to transfer the 65k baht into the country every month. You might be asked to produce backup proof of it is all you might need.

No need to have money in the bank if you can meet the 65k baht income requirement.

Thank you, for the simplest explanation for the monthly income requirement. 

[offset]

9 hours ago, lamyai3 said:

Since these new rules on the lump sum method were published last week, the 65k pm income method has emerged looking way superior (apart from those who've had the lump sum on deposit for years and benefited from the exchange rates). Total yearly commitment is 780,000, with each monthly deposit available for immediate withdrawal.

That is ok if you spend 65k a month but is you spend less that that the money will accumulate until you have 800k in your account

[Expattaff1308]

2 hours ago, rak sa_ngop said:

KISS is great except that some immigration offices (so I am told) will not allow stagnant accounts, they want to see movement showing that the funds are being used to pay for the retirees living costs. So now that they have changed their minds will they say that they want to see you spending 400,000 baht over a period of 7 months to qualify for an extension.....jeeez what a mess.

I keep a second (running account) for my ins and outs while keeping the 800k static to meet the Imm needs. Just show them both accounts.

Edited February 4, 2019 by Expattaff1308

[scubascuba3]

Can you still bring in 25k USD in green if you happen to be visiting the fatherland. Keep your bank receipts of withdrawl from home bank and super rich conversion slip here. Or not possible now?

That's the same as using an ATM, expected to not be accepted by the IO, but no one has discussed with Immigration

 

[DrJack54]

12 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

That's the same as using an ATM, expected to not be accepted by the IO, but no one has discussed with Immigration

 

I will cry if that stops

[Suradit69]

10 hours ago, onera1961 said:

Great analysis. Can we have a chart please for people who are better at visual information?. An interactive charge where you can plug in drawdown amount will be even better. Thanks.

And while you're at it could you clean up the dishes from last night's Super Bowl party and start another load of laundry? That would be super.

[moonseeker]

Just out of curiosity: Would 2 bankbooks with each 400 K and 3 months seasoned be acceptable for extension?  MS>

[Suradit69]

10 hours ago, Puchaiyank said:

Goodness, there is still life in that dead horse...I was sure it had been beaten to death with the last three threads concerning the 800k baht requirement.  ????

You're quite new to Thai Visa aren't you?

 

Anything worth kvetching about can go on for what seems like years. And it doesn't really matter if there are multiple threads that raise the same questions since it's easier to start a new thread than read any of the preceding 101 identical  threads. Thai Visa members are a hearty, resilient bunch.

[mfd101]

1 hour ago, offset said:

That is ok if you spend 65k a month but is you spend less that that the money will accumulate until you have 800k in your account

Which means that, over time, you can kill 2 birds with one stone ...

 

[mfd101]

1 hour ago, scubascuba3 said:

That's the same as using an ATM, expected to not be accepted by the IO, but no one has discussed with Immigration

 

Of course you can keep doing both of those things - bring in cash & use atms. And I will keep doing both for amounts over the 65K monthly - it's easy & VERY cheap. But whether you can use them for TI purposes is a different matter. I would be surprised if cash will wash with TI! And the atm manifestly doesn't count because no money passes between the claws of a Thai bank (even if it's a Thai bank atm you're using), so the Thai bank won't give you the statement you need every 12 months.

[digger70]

4 hours ago, rak sa_ngop said:

KISS is great except that some immigration offices (so I am told) will not allow stagnant accounts, they want to see movement showing that the funds are being used to pay for the retirees living costs. So now that they have changed their minds will they say that they want to see you spending 400,000 baht over a period of 7 months to qualify for an extension.....jeeez what a mess.

KISS is the way to go ,,, Term deposit 800 + K THB ,,,worked for me for years and will still work,,,  now just update the term deposit book every 3 months until they change it to more THB. 

 

[scubascuba3]

Of course you can keep doing both of those things - bring in cash & use atms. And I will keep doing both for amounts over the 65K monthly - it's easy & VERY cheap. But whether you can use them for TI purposes is a different matter. I would be surprised if cash will wash with TI! And the atm manifestly doesn't count because no money passes between the claws of a Thai bank (even if it's a Thai bank atm you're using), so the Thai bank won't give you the statement you need every 12 months.

The ATM issue has been done to death but it could be proved to Immigration but unfortunately they say talk to the hand

[DJ54]

12 hours ago, elviajero said:

The new rule - if using 800K (min) in a Thai bank to prove income - now requires a minimum balance of 800K to be maintained for 2 months before the extension

Is the “KY” given free at time of New rule approval or we need to purchase it separately? Or suggest they use one of the dispenser

when you get your number. 

 

Kidding aside thanks for the information.......

[jesimps]

2 hours ago, offset said:

That is ok if you spend 65k a month but is you spend less that that the money will accumulate until you have 800k in your account

That is my cunning plan of attack if I can convince them that my monthly income (using TransferWise (TW) to SCB) is coming from abroad. I'm starting my contingency plan tomorrow by going to TI for a Residency Letter to open a Bangkok Bank (BB) account. Yes I do realise that not all TW transfers go direct to BB but feel that with say 10 of the 12 shown as international, I stand a fighting chance of it being accepted. Meanwhile, I'm keeping a weather eye on other's extension experiences at Jomtien.

[elviajero]

10 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Elviajero, you refer to drawn down. What if I want just put 800k in one account + 400k in another account. Never touch them. Then also have 3rd a/c for just daily/weekly expenses. Would that work. 

If you have 800K in an account that you never touch then that meets the financial requirement.

 

You can have as many other accounts as you want. If you don’t touch the 800K in account 1 immigration might ask how you fund your stay, in which case you can show your other accounts.

Edited February 4, 2019 by elviajero

[elviajero]

5 hours ago, farcanell said:

Is the 400,000 minimum at all times no longer an issue?

No. You need to keep a minimum 400K balance in the account. 

[lamyai3]

4 hours ago, offset said:

That is ok if you spend 65k a month but is you spend less that that the money will accumulate until you have 800k in your account

You can do that if you want to, but other than making sure the 65k comes in every month as a foreign transfer, you don't otherwise need to lock up the money with the income method.

 

I'm not talking about people who are unable to raise the 800k, rather those who are unhappy about being forced to tie up their money in this way. The deposit is mostly locked in now and can't be used as an emergency fund or rest of the year income in anything like the same way it could previously. Hence, if you value financial liquidity without jeopardising the validity of your visa extension, the income route will give you a lot more of it. And when you deduct actual living expenses from the 65k, the surplus 20 or 30k that someone might not need is a far smaller de facto requirement for someone who is here year round.

 

Of course, this route is also far more trouble than it was prior to the scrapping of embassy letters, and may no longer be practical in many cases, especially for people who spend part of their year out of Thailand and need the income for that. 

Edited February 4, 2019 by lamyai3