Teacher Licence - PGCE or Masters

[Cosmic Nic]

Hello. I've been teaching English to High School kids in a small town in Nakhon Sawan Province for 5 and a half years and I'm on my 3rd Teacher Licence Waver. My plan is to return to England and go to University this October for a year so that I can come back to Thailand and apply for my full Teaching Licence. I've read that I need a 'Degree in education or a (post) graduate diploma in education / teaching profession' and was planning to do a postgraduat course 'MA Teaching English to Speakers of Other Languages.' I figure this would be more suitable than a PGCE since it has a language component. I would be really grateful if anybody could give me any advice at all on this. I've spoken to Khurusapa and they say either a Bachelors or Masters in Education would be fine, so long as it's from an accredited University and I have 1 years experience teaching. Slightly confusingly this experience must be after I've gained my new teaching qualification (so the 5 years I've already taught won't count) and I've heard from conflicting sources that I can get on a 4th waver on the basis that I'll be working towards the Teacher Licence, or that the wavers will be reset completely after I've been out the country for a year. I hope somebody out there can give me some advice. My ultimate goal is to become a better teacher and be able to work in a decent school which pays a decent salary so I can start saving for the future and start a family (i.e. quite a bit more than the 30,000 baht I'm on at the moment). Thanks in advance!

[BobbyL]

I don't know the ins and outs of the TL waivers etc.

 

If you're going home for a year do a PGCE (perhaps in Secondary English?) that gets you QTS and then you should be able to get into an international school / high bilingual school. You should triple your current salary, although you would most likely have to move. 

 

You won't get into one with just an MA as that course does not give you QTS. I am finishing my MA in education at the moment and I'll be honest it is pretty tedious. 

 

If you do plan for a PGCE I would apply ASAP. I got onto my course in January to start in the September. 

[BritManToo]

4 minutes ago, BobbyL said:

do a PGCE (perhaps in Secondary English?) that gets you QTS

1 year for the PGCE PLUS 1 year working in a high school to get QTS.

[BobbyL]

Just now, BritManToo said:

1 year for the PGCE PLUS 1 year working in a high school to get QTS.

Incorrect. You get both of them in one year now. 

[otherstuff1957]

If the Masters is an MA and not an MEd it might not get you a Thai teacher's license. 

 

The International Schools that follow the British curriculum seem to outnumber the ones that follow a US curriculum, so a PGCE would probably be a better choice if that is your ambition.

[dakineto]

To get a teaching license in Thailand, you could try to enroll in the graduate diploma in teaching profession program, offered by St Theresa International College in Bangkok. See here: https://www.stic.ac.th/postgraduate-program/graduate-diploma-in-teaching-profession

 

[janejira]

You can also look into the PGCEi through the University of Nottingham.

 

It is completed online with a one-week face-to-face component (in Bangkok). It does not offer QTS but credits earned can be applied towards a master's in ed (also completed online) and the PGCEi is recognized with the Krusapha.

[BobbyL]

I would add another thing to definitely think about as you mentioned about starting a family. Nearly all of the international schools offer free education to children of staff. A lot of the more exclusive private bilingual schools do not. This was one of our big issues when we moved back here from England and thankfully something we shouldn't now need to worry about. 

 

If you're thinking of settling here long term it could well be worth biting the bullet and going home for a year to get fully qualified and aiming for a job at an international school. TES as usual has many posts at the moment and has been busy since November. 

 

Many people also say that just because you have a PGCE and QTS but have not completed your NQT year you won't get into an international school. I think ideally yes, they prefer to appoint staff with full UK experience, but I know of two schools in Bangkok (high level) who have appointed staff that are currently doing their PGCE this academic year (although I will add they are both female and that does have an advantage here).  

[smotherb]

The PGCE is not a master's degree. If you simply want to teach English in primary or secondary schools here in Thailand, the PGCE may be the more efficient way to go. However, if you have a degree and some experience in a field taught at university and want a better paying university job, it may be better to get the masters in that field.  I know of three comparative examples.

 

The first is a Welsh lady with a PGCE, an MEd, and several years experience teaching English in Thailand. She is now teaching Education in English at Mahidol University making B80k/mo plus on-campus housing.

 

The second, is an American man with an MEE and practical experience in engineering. He also taught English at secondary schools in Thailand before he realized his Electrical Engineering degree and experience were more valuable. He teaches Electrical Engineering at Chulalongkorn University and enjoys a six figure monthly salary, substantial housing allowance, office stipend and tuition waivers for children.  

 

The third, is a Danish woman with a PhD in Anthropology and experience as a university researcher in Anthropology and a field anthropologist. She teaches Anthropology in English at Mahidol university. Not sure what she makes, but my Welsh friend listed above says she believes it is in the B140k/mo range with on-campus housing, tuition waiver for children, research stipend, office stipend, and paid sabbatical.    

 

While my third example does have a PhD and considerable experience, the other two had only master's degrees and experience; yet spent valuable time at NES teachers' salaries without benefits.

 

 

[davidst01]

do the masters at nottingham uni or the pgce. you can do it all online and dont have to return to the uk. do it whilst you still teach in thailand.

[fin5prtw]

On 2/18/2019 at 7:18 AM, BobbyL said:

Incorrect. You get both of them in one year now. 

It depends on which route you take, there are various routes to teaching nowadays in the UK. 

If you are going back to the UK, the best route would be to get a PGCE with QTS via the SKITT or School Direct route. This will set you up for the best opportunities in Thailand at international schools. If you don't want to leave, you can do your M.Ed or PGCEi while based in Thailand, as long as you have some contact time (not entirely online), then you can get your Thai teachers licence following completion. It won't give you as many good opportunities as gaining a PGCE/QTS/UK teaching experience, but it should get you in at a 2nd or 3rd tier international school and your licence. 

[BobbyL]

1 hour ago, fin5prtw said:

It depends on which route you take, there are various routes to teaching nowadays in the UK. 

If you are going back to the UK, the best route would be to get a PGCE with QTS via the SKITT or School Direct route. This will set you up for the best opportunities in Thailand at international schools. If you don't want to leave, you can do your M.Ed or PGCEi while based in Thailand, as long as you have some contact time (not entirely online), then you can get your Thai teachers licence following completion. It won't give you as many good opportunities as gaining a PGCE/QTS/UK teaching experience, but it should get you in at a 2nd or 3rd tier international school and your licence. 

Yes, that is correct. I did a School Direct one a few years ago. However, all the people who I know who have done the university based PGCE have also obtained QTS at the end of that year. 

[ozmeldo]

Hold your nose and do the Filipino thing. You'll never be teaching in a school that will pay you for that master's. There's plenty online that will fill the chasm of knowledge left by the Filipino school. If you are on top of your game and can work in BKK no reason you can't make 60-70k.

 

If you do go for the full monty, at least you're British because British schools will not hire Americans.

 

I'd be doing an MEd plus maybe a DELTA if you want to teach English. Definitely not tesol, it won't qualify you for a license and doubt int'l schools would be interested as most kids are L1 or at least ESL intl schools. Regular public's, education degree all the way. Instant license and respect.

 

By the time you go through all that drama, teaching will have changed. I think you're looking at well over five years said and done. Recoup that money in Thailand? Maybe.

 

Country is ever increasingly politically unstable.

 

I love teaching but glad it's a second career, I'd never want to put the time and money into such a sketchy risk reward endeavor.

Edited February 21, 2019 by ozmeldo

[Loaded]

University of London PGCE is only 80k thb.

Sent from my CPH1701 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[oldwelshman]

On ‎2‎/‎25‎/‎2019 at 5:15 PM, Loaded said:

University of London PGCE is only 80k thb.

Sent from my CPH1701 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Do you have  link? My son currently filling forms to come here and I am looking for info on internet for him. He has a BA Hons 2:1 and currently supply teaching in UK. We are looking t possibility to do PGCEi Nottingham or the M Ed Bangkok School of Management or possible this UCL one to get access to international school posts.

 

[Loaded]

6 hours ago, oldwelshman said:

Do you have  link? My son currently filling forms to come here and I am looking for info on internet for him. He has a BA Hons 2:1 and currently supply teaching in UK. We are looking t possibility to do PGCEi Nottingham or the M Ed Bangkok School of Management or possible this UCL one to get access to international school posts.

 

https://london.ac.uk/courses/teacher-development

[stament]

On 2/21/2019 at 12:33 PM, fin5prtw said:

It depends on which route you take, there are various routes to teaching nowadays in the UK. 

If you are going back to the UK, the best route would be to get a PGCE with QTS via the SKITT or School Direct route. This will set you up for the best opportunities in Thailand at international schools. If you don't want to leave, you can do your M.Ed or PGCEi while based in Thailand, as long as you have some contact time (not entirely online), then you can get your Thai teachers licence following completion. It won't give you as many good opportunities as gaining a PGCE/QTS/UK teaching experience, but it should get you in at a 2nd or 3rd tier international school and your licence. 

If you do the iPGCE can you then do QTS in England thereafter or isn't the iPGCE recognised in the UK towards QTS?

[BobbyL]

On 8/13/2019 at 9:37 AM, stament said:

If you do the iPGCE can you then do QTS in England thereafter or isn't the iPGCE recognised in the UK towards QTS?

As far as I know the PGCEi is not considered a qualification to teach in a UK school. 

[guru]

If you do the iPGCE can you then do QTS in England thereafter or isn't the iPGCE recognised in the UK towards QTS?

The PGCE (or iPGCE) is awarded by the university and QTS is awarded by the General Teaching Council. Each can be independent to the other and you could get QTS by working at a school and meeting the standards without doing a PGCE but I don’t know how employers feel about that. Likewise if you do both the traditional way, through the university, in theory, you could be awarded QTS and fail the PGCE and vice versa depending on what criteria you meet.

[stament]

Is the iPGCE recognised at all in TH? Is there any real advantage to having it because if you don't have the QTS then you aren't a qualified UK teacher so it seems to me that you won't get any more money in TH but it might differentiate you slightly from someone with a degree and a TEFL? Thoughts on this?

[guru]

Is the iPGCE recognised at all in TH? Is there any real advantage to having it because if you don't have the QTS then you aren't a qualified UK teacher so it seems to me that you won't get any more money in TH but it might differentiate you slightly from someone with a degree and a TEFL? Thoughts on this?

The vast majority of teachers I work with here have PGCE/QTS or equivalent. I do know of a few who have secured international school positions without QTS but not many. Depends how desperate the school is to fill a vacant position. Those few that I do know without QTS have an MEd or iPGCE and experience. Personally, if at all possible I would recommend going back and getting PGCE/QTS which opens many more doors.

[BobbyL]

On 8/16/2019 at 5:39 AM, stament said:

Is the iPGCE recognised at all in TH? Is there any real advantage to having it because if you don't have the QTS then you aren't a qualified UK teacher so it seems to me that you won't get any more money in TH but it might differentiate you slightly from someone with a degree and a TEFL? Thoughts on this?

Generally the top internationals schools wouldn't employ you without a PGCE, QTS and experience in the UK. However, as guru said, there are exceptions. A colleague told me that Wellington were desperate for an EYFS teacher to start this month and hired someone with only a PGCEi. 

 

Mid - level international schools or the better bilingual schools would be the more likely places. My friend works at a reasonable international school in Bangkok with just a PGCEi. He is on around 80k but no international teacher benefits.

 

IMO, if you're thinking of making a real career teaching here then the benefits are a huge enticement to perhaps go home for a few years and get a PGCE and QTS.

 

Bite the bullet, I did. 

[sunnyboy2018]

You need a TEFL/TESOL qualification surely? 

[BobbyL]

22 hours ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

You need a TEFL/TESOL qualification surely? 

To do what?

[stament]

On 8/21/2019 at 4:10 PM, sunnyboy2018 said:

You need a TEFL/TESOL qualification surely? 

Still in Udon?