Britain's Labour Party splits over Brexit and anti-Semitism

[welovesundaysatspace]

3 hours ago, vogie said:

Come the next General Election, they will all be history. 

The Tories and the Labour you mean?

 

2 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

If they had any honour they will call a by-election, then their electorate decide who they are supposed to be representing.

There was a vote already. Are you trying to overturn the democratic will of the people who voted them in? 

 

1 hour ago, Grouse said:

What a great bunch of women; charming, well spoken and educated

 

Brexiters will hate them because they are SO much brighter than they are.

Seeing women capable of more than a “Han’sum man” and four-in-a-row victory must be pretty irritating for the average Brexiteer.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 20, 2019 by welovesundaysatspace

[Jingthing]

Is there any hope left there will be a new referendum on doing Brexit at all? I certainly hope so as I think the people would speak differently if given the chance.

 

Quote

 

Disgusted by Brexit hard-liners, three lawmakers abandon Theresa May’s Conservative Party

 

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/disgusted-by-brexit-hard-liners-three-lawmakers-abandon-theresa-mays-conservative-party/2019/02/20/20f77b30-3503-11e9-af5b-b51b7ff322e9_story.html

[melvinmelvin]

41 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

The Tories and the Labour you mean?

 

There was a vote already. Are you trying to overturn the democratic will of the people who voted them in? 

 

Seeing women capable of more than a “Han’sum man” and four-in-a-row victory must be pretty irritating for the average Brexiteer.

 

 

 

 

are there no female brexiteers?

 

[baboon]

35 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Is there any hope left there will be a new referendum on doing Brexit at all? I certainly hope so as I think the people would speak differently if given the chance.

 

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/disgusted-by-brexit-hard-liners-three-lawmakers-abandon-theresa-mays-conservative-party/2019/02/20/20f77b30-3503-11e9-af5b-b51b7ff322e9_story.html

JT, it is supposed to be Parliament's job to sort these things out, not dump the crap on the 'Too difficult' pile back on the people for fear of losing their seats and returning to the real world they think is fine for the rest of us.

No, let them earn their money and face deselection and their rightful place in the gig economy they saw fit for the rest of us.

[welovesundaysatspace]

12 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

are there no female brexiteers?

 

Why would you think so? 

[melvinmelvin]

9 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Why would you think so? 

you said

 

Seeing women capable of more than a “Han’sum man” and four-in-a-row victory must be pretty irritating for the average Brexiteer.

 

that is why I was wondering

 

[champers]

Theoretically this new grouping; and any others who join them; could all resign their seats on the same day. The resulting simultaneous by-elections would almost be a de facto mini general election. Would the LibDems stand against them?

Personally, I think the new grouping is doomed to fail. They are a 1 issue group, with the directly opposing view to UKIP. UKIP only ever had 1 elected MP and are now in dissaray.

The new group will never agree on issues other than Remain and won't differentiate themselves from the LibDems.

[welovesundaysatspace]

28 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

you said

 

Seeing women capable of more than a “Han’sum man” and four-in-a-row victory must be pretty irritating for the average Brexiteer.

 

that is why I was wondering

 

And I’m still wondering why that made you wonder. 

[welovesundaysatspace]

A new group in Parliament, free to vote and speak as they like, can now make the case for a softer Brexit, or even a second vote, and do so in ways that could damage both the government and the opposition. (...) If the movement swells, it could create the momentum for a second referendum and push one party or another (probably the Labour Party) to formally back such a vote. It could terrify Conservative Brexiteers into backing May on her deal. It could completely break the parliamentary arithmetic and cause the UK to stumble into a no deal. It could force a general election in which all 11 lose their seats. (CNN)

[tebee]

1 hour ago, melvinmelvin said:

are there no female brexiteers?

 

Women are more sensible ...

[welovesundaysatspace]

28 minutes ago, champers said:

Theoretically this new grouping; and any others who join them; could all resign their seats on the same day. The resulting simultaneous by-elections would almost be a de facto mini general election. Would the LibDems stand against them?

Personally, I think the new grouping is doomed to fail. They are a 1 issue group, with the directly opposing view to UKIP. UKIP only ever had 1 elected MP and are now in dissaray.

The new group will never agree on issues other than Remain and won't differentiate themselves from the LibDems.

Brexit has redrawn the ideological lines of politics in the UK. Professor Sara Hobolt at the London School of Economics explained that there "are more people now who are willing to identify as either Brexiteers or Remainers than as supporters of any party. This new divide is more tribal than old party politics, with both groups tending to be inherently distrustful of one another." (CNN; https://edition-m.cnn.com/2019/02/20/uk/confusing-brexit-is-confusing-intl-gbr/index.html?r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.de%2F)

[nauseus]

31 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

A new group in Parliament, free to vote and speak as they like, can now make the case for a softer Brexit, or even a second vote, and do so in ways that could damage both the government and the opposition. (...) If the movement swells, it could create the momentum for a second referendum and push one party or another (probably the Labour Party) to formally back such a vote. It could terrify Conservative Brexiteers into backing May on her deal. It could completely break the parliamentary arithmetic and cause the UK to stumble into a no deal. It could force a general election in which all 11 lose their seats. (CNN)

????

[nauseus]

24 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Brexit has redrawn the ideological lines of politics in the UK. Professor Sara Hobolt at the London School of Economics explained that there "are more people now who are willing to identify as either Brexiteers or Remainers than as supporters of any party. This new divide is more tribal than old party politics, with both groups tending to be inherently distrustful of one another." (CNN; https://edition-m.cnn.com/2019/02/20/uk/confusing-brexit-is-confusing-intl-gbr/index.html?r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.de%2F)

????

[SheungWan]

1 hour ago, champers said:

Theoretically this new grouping; and any others who join them; could all resign their seats on the same day. The resulting simultaneous by-elections would almost be a de facto mini general election. Would the LibDems stand against them?

Personally, I think the new grouping is doomed to fail. They are a 1 issue group, with the directly opposing view to UKIP. UKIP only ever had 1 elected MP and are now in dissaray.

The new group will never agree on issues other than Remain and won't differentiate themselves from the LibDems.

Focus on the group and the issues for the next 6 weeks. That is what is required. Longer term doom can wait.

[welovesundaysatspace]

24 minutes ago, nauseus said:

????

 

23 minutes ago, nauseus said:

????

????

[SheungWan]

So then, the 7, 8, are saying, there is an alternative to tamely lining up behind Corbyn. Some of those on this forum who did fall in line may have cause to reflect.

[SheungWan]

6 hours ago, vogie said:

Come the next General Election, they will all be history. 

The next General Election is not the key item on the agenda.

[SheungWan]

11 hours ago, vogie said:

This tweet has been removed from the Young Labour website.

 

 

 

11 hours ago, stevenl said:

Nothing anti-semitic about that tweet.

The comment is pretty emblematic of the problem in the Labour Party.

[Prissana Pescud]

Corbyn is a different politician. I suspect Sanders in US is of a similar ilk.

But Corbyn politics dared to criticise Israel over its murderous attitude towards another race of people that have equal,

if not more right to live in Palestine without the huge land grabs that Israel imposes.

And that is called anti semite. 

[smedly]

4 hours ago, elliss said:

 

       Where  do you suggest we go?,   surely not Thailand ,  what ever next .

we take pride in our nation and remove the German shackles to allow the UK to trade and compete on the world stage - the Germans/EU worst nightmare

 

yes we will continue to buy German cars and French wine but we will do it as a free Nation - if they don't like that arrangement then tough

 

The thing we refer to as the EU went from a Trading partnership (which was fine) to a Political power grab dictatorship and now heading towards a Military empire - lets get back to trading together and see were it goes from there - it really is history repeating itself - I hope I am wrong but the track record and history of humanity is quite dire - have we moved on ? I don't think so  

[smedly]

1 hour ago, SheungWan said:

The next General Election is not the key item on the agenda.

unfortunately if there was ever a time to call a snap General Election - it is now

 

we have a group of elected MP's that got a seat in Parliament based on their respective party manifesto's - the same group of people that are calling for another referendum because they keep saying - 1. people didn't know what they were voting for 2. things have changed - well yes things have changed - you just cancelled the ticket that got you a seat - so on principle alone you (the defectors) need to stand by your convictions and get a mandate from the people that put you in this privileged position and get approval from them for what you are doing - hypocrisy has just hit an all new high if they don't 

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Brexit has redrawn the ideological lines of politics in the UK. Professor Sara Hobolt at the London School of Economics explained that there "are more people now who are willing to identify as either Brexiteers or Remainers than as supporters of any party. This new divide is more tribal than old party politics, with both groups tending to be inherently distrustful of one another." (CNN; https://edition-m.cnn.com/2019/02/20/uk/confusing-brexit-is-confusing-intl-gbr/index.html?r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.de%2F)

Please don't write in italics. My Italian is poor.

[SheungWan]

3 hours ago, smedly said:

unfortunately if there was ever a time to call a snap General Election - it is now

we have a group of elected MP's that got a seat in Parliament based on their respective party manifesto's - the same group of people that are calling for another referendum because they keep saying - 1. people didn't know what they were voting for 2. things have changed - well yes things have changed - you just cancelled the ticket that got you a seat - so on principle alone you (the defectors) need to stand by your convictions and get a mandate from the people that put you in this privileged position and get approval from them for what you are doing - hypocrisy has just hit an all new high if they don't 

Just love watching the Hard Brexiteers try to jump in bed with the Corbynistas.

Edited February 20, 2019 by SheungWan

[SheungWan]

3 hours ago, smedly said:

we take pride in our nation and remove the German shackles to allow the UK to trade and compete on the world stage - the Germans/EU worst nightmare

yes we will continue to buy German cars and French wine but we will do it as a free Nation - if they don't like that arrangement then tough

The thing we refer to as the EU went from a Trading partnership (which was fine) to a Political power grab dictatorship and now heading towards a Military empire - lets get back to trading together and see were it goes from there - it really is history repeating itself - I hope I am wrong but the track record and history of humanity is quite dire - have we moved on ? I don't think so  

Rotten Empire Loyalists don't seem to have moved on.

[SheungWan]

4 hours ago, Prissana Pescud said:

Corbyn is a different politician. I suspect Sanders in US is of a similar ilk.

But Corbyn politics dared to criticise Israel over its murderous attitude towards another race of people that have equal,

if not more right to live in Palestine without the huge land grabs that Israel imposes.

And that is called anti semite. 

Covering up and deflecting open anti-Semitism inside the Labour Party by Corbyn crowd attracting the support of the usual suspects around here.

Edited February 20, 2019 by SheungWan

[Laughing Gravy]

8 hours ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

There was a vote already. Are you trying to overturn the democratic will of the people who voted them in? 

That is very rich coming from you.

People voted on their party's manifestos not on the politicians personal believes. They should do the right and honourable thing and stand again as they seem to have changed their stance and party.  I doubt these trough self serving MP's will though.

 

[SheungWan]

11 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

That is very rich coming from you.

People voted on their party's manifestos not on the politicians personal believes. They should do the right and honourable thing and stand again as they seem to have changed their stance and party.  I doubt these trough self serving MP's will though.

Individuals are elected to Parliament not manifestos. You are thinking of European Party Lists. Never mind. Nonetheless some Brexiteers gearing themselves up to denounce the House of Commons as the next Enemy Of The People if they dare to contradict the HB message.

Edited February 21, 2019 by SheungWan

[Laughing Gravy]

10 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Individuals are elected to Parliament not manifestos. You are thinking of European Party Lists. Never mind. Nonetheless some Brexiteers gearing themselves up to denounce the House of Commons as the next Enemy Of The People if they dare to contradict the HB message.

They support and actively campaign on party manifestos. Anyway lets see the likes of Soubry at the next election. It will be bye bye.

[SheungWan]

1 minute ago, Laughing Gravy said:

They support and actively campaign on party manifestos. Anyway lets see the likes of Soubry at the next election. It will be bye bye.

As if both Parties stood on Mangled Brexit manifestos and Labour additionally on a Lets Tolerate anti-Semitism ticket. As for the next election, worry first about the breakaway impact on the Brexit outcome. Can't be doing anything for Hard Brexiteer nerves right now.

[Laughing Gravy]

8 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

As if both Parties stood on Mangled Brexit manifestos and Labour additionally on a Lets Tolerate anti-Semitism ticket. As for the next election, worry first about the breakaway impact on the Brexit outcome. Can't be doing anything for Hard Brexiteer nerves right now.

I am fine, it is the remainers frothing at the mouth in the belief that Brexit won't happen or they get another referendum so to ensure we stay in the EU.