What Brexit game is EU playing? British parliament leader Leadsom asks

[smedly]

44 minutes ago, samran said:

Sure, you can buy all the BMW's and french win you like. Its up to the UK to set its own rules regarding what it imports and under what conditions.

 

But you are now without a trade deal, and stuck OUTSIDE the EU's internal market. So good luck selling your stuff to them on the same terms you can now.

 

As with basic trade, you need to be able to sell your stuff to be able to buy their stuff. And they won't be as easy on you now you are outside the tent.

lets see how that works out

 

we buy a lot more from the EU than they do from us and when I say EU  - 90% of what we buy is from 5 EU countries not 27

 

when we leave they will be right back at the table the next week and all the BS will be gone as we will have already left

[Spidey]

8 minutes ago, smedly said:

you cannot have people from a foreign country voting in the UK

It would be a referendum of all the people affected by the change, i.e. the people of Northern Ireland and the people of the Irish Republic. It would be the democratic thing to do. You do want democracy don't you?

[samran]

Just now, smedly said:

lets see how that works out

 

we buy a lot more from the EU than they do from us and when I say EU  - 90% of what we buy is from 5 EU countries not 27

 

when we leave they will be right back at the table the next week and all the BS will be gone as we will have already left

Im not sure how you see that as a position of strength? 

 

Let’s reword what you have said.

 

The Uk relies more heavily on product from Europe than they rely on product from the UK.

 

They will still sell to you and you are going to more or less have to let THEIR stuff in without hassle. Cause you need it.

 

They will be less willing to reciprocate. 

 

They win. The UK,  not so much...

[LucysDad]

5 minutes ago, samran said:

Fair play. 

 

But there must be one somewhere, right? 

 

 

Have you got it ?

 

 

Buggered if I can find it.

 

 

Probably still in David Cameron's briefcase.

[Basil B]

I am sure when we ask for an extension the EU will want guarantees it is not indefinite,

[samtam]

2 minutes ago, samran said:

Im not sure how you see that as a position of strength? 

 

Let’s reword what you have said.

 

The Uk relies more heavily on product from Europe than they rely on product from the UK.

 

They will still sell to you and you are going to more or less have to let THEIR stuff in without hassle. Cause you need it.

 

They will be less willing to reciprocate. 

 

They win. The UK,  not so much...

Brits don't "need" BMWs or EU products. They want them, but not at any cost.

[Basil B]

2 minutes ago, Spidey said:

It would be a referendum of all the people affected by the change, i.e. the people of Northern Ireland and the people of the Irish Republic. It would be the democratic thing to do. You do want democracy don't you?

Brexiteer's prefer 'selective democracy'

[samtam]

1 minute ago, Basil B said:

I am sure when we ask for an extension the EU will want guarantees it is not indefinite,

And the EU27 will only agree to an extension if they know the likely outcome, as in acceptance of the current Withdrawal Agreement, with its Irish backstop, or another referendum, or remaining in the EU, or additional requirements, as they see fit..

[smedly]

5 minutes ago, samran said:

The Uk relies more heavily on product from Europe

relies is the wrong word - pretty much everything we buy from the EU can be bought elsewhere - we don't rely on anything

 

except the shit sandwiches lol

[vogie]

3 minutes ago, Basil B said:

Brexiteer's prefer 'selective democracy'

Remainers talking about democracy is like Pol Pot talking about human rights.

[Basil B]

2 minutes ago, samtam said:

And the EU27 will only agree to an extension if they know the likely outcome, as in acceptance of the current Withdrawal Agreement, with its Irish backstop, or another referendum, or remaining in the EU, or additional requirements, as they see fit..

Very true but they are at this time refraining from trying to force the British government down any road, I would not be supersized if there were a few carrots on the table if we were to remain. 

[baansgr]

13 minutes ago, samran said:

Im not sure how you see that as a position of strength? 

 

Let’s reword what you have said.

 

The Uk relies more heavily on product from Europe than they rely on product from the UK.

 

They will still sell to you and you are going to more or less have to let THEIR stuff in without hassle. Cause you need it.

 

They will be less willing to reciprocate. 

 

They win. The UK,  not so much...

I believe You have that back to front.

On a side note,  some of the most staunch lefties support leaving 

Edited March 10, 2019 by baansgr

[smedly]

3 minutes ago, Basil B said:

Very true but they are at this time refraining from trying to force the British government down any road, I would not be supersized if there were a few carrots on the table if we were to remain. 

that would need to be one hell of a carrot for us to give it the slightest consideration - we want out of the EU Power grabbing (military) Empire ASAP

 

expect more to follow

[samran]

14 minutes ago, smedly said:

relies is the wrong word - pretty much everything we buy from the EU can be bought elsewhere - we don't rely on anything

 

except the shit sandwiches lol

You make your own pretty good sh!t sandwiches. No need to import those.

 

Very true you can get most things elsewhere. But given supply chain integration and relative distance, other things being equal, you aren't going to import something from half way across the world when the infrastructure is there to get it to you from 300 miles away over the channel.

Edited March 10, 2019 by samran

[samran]

8 minutes ago, baansgr said:

I believe You have that back to front.

On a side note,  some of the most staunch lefties support leaving 

um, okay. Do tell.

 

What makes you think I'm a hairy lefty?

[samtam]

5 minutes ago, smedly said:

that would need to be one hell of a carrot for us to give it the slightest consideration - we want out of the EU Power grabbing (military) Empire ASAP

 

expect more to follow

I'm not sure the EU could give UK anything more than it already still (just) has, as a full member of the EU. If we remain, it will be on the same terms, and an understanding that UK will subscribe to "ever closer" union etc, an EU Army, and all the other things UK has most definitely said it didn't want, (along with some of the less strident EU members, such as the Netherlands etc).

[cliveshep]

I remember how it was before the EU, how we traded with the rest of the commonwealth. I remember New Zealand lamb and butter and how cheap it was, a far cry from today's prices.

 

Here in LOS we buy milk from New Zealand apparently, not actually produced here. Bloody expensive too, petrol is cheaper but tastes like shit in tea! However the point is that milk comes refrigerated, in ships that have travelled around 13,000 km to get to BKK. So with the UK, if we don't produce enough milk domestically (and we used to) there are other places we can buy it from. Countries like Switzerland or Norway perhaps? 

 

We are NOT reliant on the EU but those food producers who can see a vanishing customer are not going to just sit back and do nothing just because that drunken little man in Brussels says so. And while Governments might love the EU, the peoples in their countries do not, Macron has found that out in a poll this week, no amount of changing how it works will make the people accept the EU, the greater % of French now want out, and in Merkel's Germany I suspect they to would like to be out too. The 4th Reich isn't working for them as it contains too many Muslims from Libya and Somalia preying on their wives and kids unchecked because it is politically correct to indulge in rabid "diversification".

 

So the Brexit the majority voted for 3 years ago was "we've had enough, goodbye" and is not that which Theresa May has interpreted as "we your government know best what is good for you and our plan(s) are best and we are going to finagle staying in one way or another, plus we all get EU pensions later on too".

Edited March 10, 2019 by cliveshep

[tebee]

3 hours ago, nauseus said:

As the "negotiations" have been pretty much secret it's hard to say that "the only possible outcome of this was the deal May and the EU agreed upon". You sound like May.

interesting that the EU have been perfectly open with what deals they prepared to offer, depending on the UK's red lines.

 

UK and May  have been secretive and refused to "show their hand"

 

Is it because they know that hand is a busted flush ?

 

or is it because they have no idea what they do want ? 

[nauseus]

26 minutes ago, tebee said:

interesting that the EU have been perfectly open with what deals they prepared to offer, depending on the UK's red lines.

 

UK and May  have been secretive and refused to "show their hand"

 

Is it because they know that hand is a busted flush ?

 

or is it because they have no idea what they do want ? 

What real details of these "negotiations" have ever been published. Probably no meeting minutes either - the EU's preferred choice of record-keeping and transparency. Ha ha.

[nauseus]

32 minutes ago, cliveshep said:

I remember how it was before the EU, how we traded with the rest of the commonwealth. I remember New Zealand lamb and butter and how cheap it was, a far cry from today's prices.

 

Here in LOS we buy milk from New Zealand apparently, not actually produced here. Bloody expensive too, petrol is cheaper but tastes like shit in tea! However the point is that milk comes refrigerated, in ships that have travelled around 13,000 km to get to BKK. So with the UK, if we don't produce enough milk domestically (and we used to) there are other places we can buy it from. Countries like Switzerland or Norway perhaps? 

 

We are NOT reliant on the EU but those food producers who can see a vanishing customer are not going to just sit back and do nothing just because that drunken little man in Brussels says so. And while Governments might love the EU, the peoples in their countries do not, Macron has found that out in a poll this week, no amount of changing how it works will make the people accept the EU, the greater % of French now want out, and in Merkel's Germany I suspect they to would like to be out too. The 4th Reich isn't working for them as it contains too many Muslims from Libya and Somalia preying on their wives and kids unchecked because it is politically correct to indulge in rabid "diversification".

 

So the Brexit the majority voted for 3 years ago was "we've had enough, goodbye" and is not that which Theresa May has interpreted as "we your government know best what is good for you and our plan(s) are best and we are going to finagle staying in one way or another, plus we all get EU pensions later on too".

The UK still produces a lot of milk but the extra requirement is mainly supplied by Ireland, similar to beef. That's why the Irish farmers will suffer particularly, financially, if there is no trading agreement.   

 

 

[cliveshep]

Ireland will get a choice the same as all the other EU countries - sell to us at competitive rates or not - your choice. Somehow I can see milk and beef crossing the border still with a blind eye on both sides! After all - HM Customs like a cuppa and a burger too!

[samran]

13 minutes ago, nauseus said:

The UK still produces a lot of milk but the extra requirement is mainly supplied by Ireland, similar to beef. That's why the Irish farmers will suffer particularly, financially, if there is no trading agreement.   

 

 

Why will the Irish suffer? Are the UK going to close off their markets?

[SheungWan]

1 hour ago, vogie said:

Remainers talking about democracy is like Pol Pot talking about human rights.

From Hard Brexiteers who both favoured Royal Prerogative plus free bonus of not having a clue about Pol Pot.

[nauseus]

2 minutes ago, cliveshep said:

Ireland will get a choice the same as all the other EU countries - sell to us at competitive rates or not - your choice. Somehow I can see milk and beef crossing the border still with a blind eye on both sides! After all - HM Customs like a cuppa and a burger too!

Well Varadkar has already suggested to Irish farmers that they start growing more fruits and nuts! So as long as our cocoa supplies are undisturbed then we should survive! 

 

 

[samran]

50 minutes ago, cliveshep said:

I remember how it was before the EU, how we traded with the rest of the commonwealth. I remember New Zealand lamb and butter and how cheap it was, a far cry from today's prices.

 

Here in LOS we buy milk from New Zealand apparently, not actually produced here. Bloody expensive too, petrol is cheaper but tastes like shit in tea! However the point is that milk comes refrigerated, in ships that have travelled around 13,000 km to get to BKK. So with the UK, if we don't produce enough milk domestically (and we used to) there are other places we can buy it from. Countries like Switzerland or Norway perhaps? 

 

The whole reason NZ primary products are so expensive has nothing to do with the EU or the Commonwealth. The UK famously negotiated a carve out for NZ lamb and butter during its accession to the EEC. They still exist. 

 

The reason their prices are higher is because in the interim half the world has been lifted out of poverty, so places like China and the middle east now want those same products too, and they are willing to pay for it. Don't blame the EU for that.

 

Oh, and you know, you can already buy stuff from Switzerland and Norway? Not sure what that has anything to do with anything. And you know both of them are more or less in the common market anyway.

 

50 minutes ago, cliveshep said:

 

We are NOT reliant on the EU but those food producers who can see a vanishing customer are not going to just sit back and do nothing just because that drunken little man in Brussels says so. And while Governments might love the EU, the peoples in their countries do not, Macron has found that out in a poll this week, no amount of changing how it works will make the people accept the EU, the greater % of French now want out, and in Merkel's Germany I suspect they to would like to be out too. The 4th Reich isn't working for them as it contains too many Muslims from Libya and Somalia preying on their wives and kids unchecked because it is politically correct to indulge in rabid "diversification".

 

Wow, this is just a confused economic illiterate diatribe mixed with Merkel and immigrant bashing. Standard Brexiter fare and logic. 

[SheungWan]

59 minutes ago, tebee said:

interesting that the EU have been perfectly open with what deals they prepared to offer, depending on the UK's red lines.

UK and May  have been secretive and refused to "show their hand"

Is it because they know that hand is a busted flush ?

or is it because they have no idea what they do want ? 

It is about the Ireland border. The UK wants a deal but doesn't know how to deliver.

Edited March 10, 2019 by SheungWan

[vogie]

1 minute ago, SheungWan said:

From Hard Brexiteers who both favoured Royal Prerogative plus free bonus of not having a clue about Pol Pot.

Don't confuse Pol Pot with Bettys Hot Pot.

[SheungWan]

15 minutes ago, cliveshep said:

Ireland will get a choice the same as all the other EU countries - sell to us at competitive rates or not - your choice. Somehow I can see milk and beef crossing the border still with a blind eye on both sides! After all - HM Customs like a cuppa and a burger too!

Do tell us how the Good Friday Agreement is going to pan out with a No-deal Hard Brexit.

[SheungWan]

10 minutes ago, samran said:

Why will the Irish suffer? Are the UK going to close off their markets?

Brexiteers still think the UK 'owns' Ireland and therefore border issues can more or less be discounted.

[samran]

21 minutes ago, cliveshep said:

Ireland will get a choice the same as all the other EU countries - sell to us at competitive rates or not - your choice. Somehow I can see milk and beef crossing the border still with a blind eye on both sides! After all - HM Customs like a cuppa and a burger too!

and watch the other 180 members of WTO sue your @r3es off for allowing that to happen.