Micro cider brewery - laws and regs?

[Batty]

Hi there.  Wasnt really sure where to post this... Apologies if it is in the wrong group.

 

I'm wondering if anyone could recommend a specialty lawyer who could help navigate the laws and regs surrounded alcohol brewing in Thailand?  Specifically, cider.

 

I want to have a go at home brewing, maybe setting up a small unit locally and doing it there, initially with a goal of supplying local pubs/bars and shops, and with a lot of luck and hard work maybe take it one step further than that.   But obviously there is a whole minefield of legal issues to get around first.  I'm hoping it might be possible to set up a company in my wife's name and obtain a work permit through that, but this is Thailand and we all know nothing is ever that easy.

 

Before even addressing the work permit issue, I have just found out that its virtually impossible to get a license to brew beer here in Thailand unless you are a large scale from the get-go.  The laws require you to brew 100,000 liters per year AND have capital of 10,000,000 in the bank.  What is it with Thailand and its archaic, arbitrary laws that always seemed to be aimed at making life harder?  It makes no sense to me how they seem to go out of there way to make everything so difficult.  Because of this law, most microbreweries set up their brewhouses in Cambodia, Malaysia or Laos - where the laws are not so tough - and then import to Thailand encuring all the taxes that go with it.  Madness I know, but there it is.

 

I can't find any info anywhere regarding cider, and if the laws are any different for that.  Im guessing the law is just the same in that regard - booze is booze, at the end of the day I guess and if it is so hard to legally brew beer, I doubt it will be any different for cider.  Im hoping there might be a lawyer out there who can advise differently.

 

Im not getting my hopes up - the chances of this getting past the first stage of company formation and licensing are very small, I know that.  I'm guessing almost impossible.  Hopefully, there is a lawyer out there can prove me wrong if anyone could suggest one.  many thanks in advance ????

 

 

 

 

[KarlS]

There is a microbrewery in Phuket who for sure do not brew 100,000Litres/year - 

http://www.fullmoonbrewwork.com/blog-news/

[vogie]

I have sent you a link, not sure if I was allowed to post on here, as technically it is illegal.

[KarlS]

7 minutes ago, vogie said:

I have sent you a link, not sure if I was allowed to post on here, as technically it is illegal.

Mmm -- I think you sent that link to the wrong person.

[vogie]

Sorry indeed it was sent to the wrong person.

Edited March 18, 2019 by vogie

[robertson468]

1 hour ago, KarlS said:

There is a microbrewery in Phuket who for sure do not brew 100,000Litres/year - 

http://www.fullmoonbrewwork.com/blog-news/

There is also one on Samui and have to admit their beer is rather nice, but I think the problem is selling it outside their own premises, but don't quote me on that.

[DepDavid]

I have sent you a link, not sure if I was allowed to post on here, as technically it is illegal.

Posting the link or brewing the beer?


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[crazykopite]

I buy Strongbow and Magners in my local Macro so you would have fierce competition from these major suppliers is it worth the investment I doubt it .

[PoorSucker]

52 minutes ago, robertson468 said:

There is also one on Samui and have to admit their beer is rather nice, but I think the problem is selling it outside their own premises, but don't quote me on that.

Correct, can only sell on premises. 

[madmitch]

The laws are in place to protect ThaiBev and Boon Rawd who don't want to have their near monopoly dissipated in any way; Thailand is not the place for innovative entrepreneurs.

 

They don't brew cider as far as I know but Siam Winery, another large Thai corporation with similar political clout, do (Moose).

 

A few years ago there was a company near Hua Hin who brewed Tropical Nuclear Cider. I have no idea what happened to it. 

 

Good luck, and if by some miracle (aka cat in hell's chance!) we get a more progressive Government in place later this year maybe we may see some changes in these monopolistic laws. 

[AhFarangJa]

2 hours ago, Batty said:

What is it with Thailand and its archaic, arbitrary laws that always seemed to be aimed at making life harder? 

It is about the hi so elite making sure there is no competition........how many breweries are listed in Thailand, how many tobacco companies..............

[madmitch]

1 minute ago, PoorSucker said:

Correct, can only sell on premises. 

Full Moon products are available outside of the pub but I think they are shipped overseas for bottling and then returned with tax! How ridiculous!

[vogie]

8 hours ago, PoorSucker said:

Correct, can only sell on premises. 

@PoorSucker, can I post a link on here to a homebrew website in Thailand?

 

[rwill]

Maybe talk to someone from here. 

https://www.facebook.com/NonthaburiBrewing/

 

 

[cracker1]

There is a microbrewery in Samui who for sure do not brew 100,000Litres/year - 

[PoorSucker]

12 hours ago, cracker1 said:

There is a microbrewery in Samui who for sure do not brew 100,000Litres/year - 

They are only selling on the premises. 

[PoorSucker]

18 hours ago, vogie said:

@PoorSucker, can I post a link on here to a homebrew website in Thailand?

 

PM link to me. 

[mtls2005]

18 hours ago, rwill said:

Maybe talk to someone from here. 

https://www.facebook.com/NonthaburiBrewing/

 

 

https://bk.asia-city.com/nightlife/news/nonthaburi-brewing-company-mead

 

"The company is legally registered with a fermented alcohol license, which grants them the right to produce non-distilled beverages like wine, cider and mead, but not beer."

 

First time I recall hearing about this type of license.

 

 

[vogie]

This website will give information on the laws about homebrewing in Thailand, and much more. ????

 

http://www.homebrewthailand.com/forum/

[Batty]

On 3/18/2019 at 12:21 PM, vogie said:

I have sent you a link, not sure if I was allowed to post on here, as technically it is illegal.

Yup got it thanks mate, I replied.

[Batty]

On 3/18/2019 at 2:52 PM, crazykopite said:

I buy Strongbow and Magners in my local Macro so you would have fierce competition from these major suppliers is it worth the investment I doubt it .

That doesn't make much sense mate.  You are basically saying anything other than a large brand will fail?  For a kick off, strongbow is awful - blimey I dont think I have ever met anyone who liked the stuff (no offence).  Its one of those ciders that people reach for when there is nothing else available.  Magners blew up a few years ago on the back of some clever marketing and whilst it does taste ok, its still not realy proper cider and costs a flipping fortune.  They use corn starch syrup and add all sorts of E numbers to get a bit of taste back into it.

 

Craft cider can be made and sold a heck of a lot cheaper - and it tastes loads better, and those are the two strengths you play off when you sell it.  Its as simple as that really.  Craft cider sells like hotcakes in other countries, and these same countries also sell strongbow and magners - thats where you point falls down realy.

 

Dont get me wrong, its not an easy task and the chances of failing are much higher than getting this stocked in every bar in Thailand lol.  But when did that ever stop anybody.  Youve got to have go, havent you.