Refused visa for thai GF. 2nd attempt help

[backinsept]

Hi
I just opened a refusal letter for my Thai GF to visit UK.
Just looking for assistance on what i can do in my 2nd attempt.

Refusal reasons were.
1. Reviewer not confident of return
2. Call made to employer. Not answered
3. Bank statement does not show salary income on a regular period
4. Bank statement name in Thai script

 

Addressing the points
1. Not sure what more i can do. 5 years of strong relationship proof. But she has no kids. No land or assets.
2. Not much i can do but provide another number and notify her manager to anticipate a call.
3. She works in a bar/hotel and earns 25k as a cashier/receptionist. Gets paid in cash. And deposits into account when she can be bothered... should i even provide her bank statement as i will be sponsoring her? Thought it might be worthwhile as she has 70k in there but omitting it next time may avoid questions??
4. My fault. Should of had it translated.

P.S submission took 15 days from submission to result

Can i apply again immediately?

Thanks

[theoldgit]

Yes, she can re-apply immediately but she needs to fully address the reasons in her refusal, and submit a strong case, otherwise she will be refused again.

 

It would be helpful if your girlfriend could post her refusal letter, with her personal details redacted, I'm afraid that your bullet points aren't really enough to go on.

 

Maybe she should say in her covering letter that the hotel/bar is busy and sometimes calls are unanswered, not sure that I'd really be convinced by that arguement though, but it's worth a try, as you say maybe she should encourage the hotel staff to be a little more on the ball during Embassy office hours after she's resubmitted her application.

As to your points regarding her first application, how did she demonstrate your relationship previously, do you live in Thailand or the UK? 

There's more to her bank statement than confirming her income, if the cash you give her for the trip, and maybe more is what she relies on, what incentive is there for her to return? 

She really needs to demonstrate her ties here, she might not own property but she must live somewhere, did she provide details of her accomodation here? 

Not being bothered to bank her salary isn't really a good answer, she needs to be bothered. 
We really need to see the redacted letter.

[Orton Rd]

Had a similar problem as self employed wife never banks income such as it is. What I did was to get a letter from my MP supporting the application, surprised when it worked so might be worth a try.

[backinsept]

4 hours ago, theoldgit said:

Yes, she can re-apply immediately but she needs to fully address the reasons in her refusal, and submit a strong case, otherwise she will be refused again.

 

It would be helpful if your girlfriend could post her refusal letter, with her personal details redacted, I'm afraid that your bullet points aren't really enough to go on.

 

Maybe she should say in her covering letter that the hotel/bar is busy and sometimes calls are unanswered, not sure that I'd really be convinced by that arguement though, but it's worth a try, as you say maybe she should encourage the hotel staff to be a little more on the ball during Embassy office hours after she's resubmitted her application.

As to your points regarding her first application, how did she demonstrate your relationship previously, do you live in Thailand or the UK? 

There's more to her bank statement than confirming her income, if the cash you give her for the trip, and maybe more is what she relies on, what incentive is there for her to return? 

She really needs to demonstrate her ties here, she might not own property but she must live somewhere, did she provide details of her accomodation here? 

Not being bothered to bank her salary isn't really a good answer, she needs to be bothered. 
We really need to see the redacted letter.

I demonstrated relationship with:

- pictures, chat messages, flight itinerary to other countries (no visa required), remittance payments, passport stamps of over 10 trips. All over the span of 5/6 years

 

I live in the UK

 

We attached her apartment bill, she rents.

 

I have attached the refusal letter.

 

Thanks

[roo860]

You can pay for a faster process with the visa agency in Chiang Mai or Bangkok, won't change the outcome though.

As for the bank statement, she can ask for one in English, my wife's bank Kasikorn supply her with one, no problem.

 

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[backinsept]

9 hours ago, Orton Rd said:

Had a similar problem as self employed wife never banks income such as it is. What I did was to get a letter from my MP supporting the application, surprised when it worked so might be worth a try.

What did the letter contain if you don't mind sharing some details.

 

Thanks

[Orton Rd]

Long time ago can't recall it now, actually never saw the MP all done through her office, and free of course. Something about supporting the application and being assured of her return to Thailand

[crazykopite]

15 hours ago, Orton Rd said:

Had a similar problem as self employed wife never banks income such as it is. What I did was to get a letter from my MP supporting the application, surprised when it worked so might be worth a try.

Difference is you state your wife he states his girlfriend there is a big difference big issue as I see it is she is paid in cash my friend was turned down 4 times but in the end he married her and a year later she was given her visa.

[ronaldo0]

Had similar problems. Refused for nonsense reasons like no money despite her having over a million bht in her account, can’t afford return flight ticket etc.

Have lost interest in applying that much so now will apply in few years for third and last time to go on holiday to uk ! Several people I know with zero money , jobs and few months in a relationship got visas using the same agency in bkk first time of applying ! Although it cost them a bit for using the agency .

[Orton Rd]

Two of the reason for our refusal was I. I went to Thailand 3 times a year so why did she need to go to the UK. 2. Similar one, I was retiring soon to live in Thailand so why the need for her to visit me. Not much we could do about those 'reasons'. They actually tried to press a settlement visa on her at one time, they were about £400 back then.

[1FinickyOne]

The other side of the logic is that it has little to do with you and your ability to guarantee, and everything to do with whether or not it is worth her while to return... if she could make 2x the salary in Britain as a maid, why would she return? 

 

That is the real question that needs to be answered.. 

[brewsterbudgen]

The refusal letter is clear. It's not the lack of funds as such, it's because they are not satisfied her job is genuine. The bank statement in Thai script could be for anyone.

 

It is essential that they can speak with her employer if she reapplies. Get the personal mobile number for her boss.

 

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[seajae]

they need proof she has commitments in Thailand that she will want to come back for, children, family etc as well as a permanent job. Without this they usually knock them back as they have nothing to show that ties them to the country to return. The fact she works in a bar, has no regular payments going into her bank account doesnt help. We took a friend to Australia a couple of years ago to show his methods with plants at an expo, he was married but only a buddhist wedding, he didnt own land his wife did & his business was not registered, he couldnt show regular payments into his account so they knocked him back 3 times until he got his wife to actually state they were married and had a daughter plus listed all the land she owned. They stated in the knock backs that he would do a runner in Australia because he had no ties to Thailand that would make him return, your GF is in the same boat, until she can show she does have a reason to return she will have problems

[theoldgit]

16 hours ago, Orton Rd said:

Had a similar problem as self employed wife never banks income such as it is. What I did was to get a letter from my MP supporting the application, surprised when it worked so might be worth a try.

Whilst I don't doubt that your MP wrote the the UKVI, or whatever it was called then, but I can assure that it would have little or no impact on the application.
The only time a letter from a MP may sway a decision is if the original decision fell outside of the Immigration Rules in force at that time.

[superal]

25 minutes ago, kenk24 said:

The other side of the logic is that it has little to do with you and your ability to guarantee, and everything to do with whether or not it is worth her while to return... if she could make 2x the salary in Britain as a maid, why would she return? 

 

That is the real question that needs to be answered.. 

So what is the best statement to convince them that she will return to Thailand ?

My lady was refused 4 years ago and I have not applied again but now reconsidering it however reading events like this are discouraging . Our refusal ? similar reasons to the posters . All despite my lady has her own house and business ( all cash from her restaurant  ) plus takes care of her elderly mother . So nothing has changed since the last application and I fear a second refusal  . Very annoying when the UK seems to admit masses of immigrants and does not allow a UK resident to have his partner a tourist visa . If Thailand applied the same rules to UK tourists to Thailand there would be repercussions . Not level playing fields for sure . Read somewhere that it was best not to mention her boyfriend at all in the application and only the places of interest to be visited . Also if to be part of an organised tour to the UK is more likely to succeed .

[Tomahawk21]

i had a g.f i took to the uk a few years back. not working, living with me no land house, car or baby.

supply pictures of other places you and been together dates etc they need history of the relationship. i put 300,000 baht in her account also. all went OK for me.

good luck. 

[Maverell]

Strange old world. I have lived in in Thailand for 15 years now (Tourist then Work Permit and now Retirement). I live with my Thai g/f now and have done for over 3 years (rented house). She has had 2 visit visas for the UK in that time and had no issue with both applications. She doesn't work and her only assets are a car. Her only 'income' is what I give her every month as a housewife (25k). I think the issue with the OP is that he lives in the UK. Their relationship is probably seen as sound but what is in her life for her to return to Thailand ?

[brewsterbudgen]

Everyone's application is different as everyone has different circumstances.

If the OP's girlfriend can provide proper proof of her employment (letter from employer confirming her entitlement to holiday and confirmation of the date she will return to work, telephone confirmation of all this, payslips/tax receipts that link to her bank account) I don't see why her visa will be denied, unless there is something else in the refusal letter that has not been posted.

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[Tomahawk21]

12 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said:

Everyone's application is different as everyone has different circumstances.

If the OP's girlfriend can provide proper proof of her employment (letter from employer confirming her entitlement to holiday and confirmation of the date she will return to work, telephone confirmation of all this, payslips/tax receipts that link to her bank account) I don't see why her visa will be denied, unless there is something else in the refusal letter that has not been posted.

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theirs normally a bit more the the refusal then they print. it obviously just did not stand up on its own merits. the OP needs to put down as much HONEST information as possible.

[theoldgit]

Without wishing to sound pedantic, it's the OP's girlfriend who needs to satisfy the decision maker that she will return to her home country at the conclusion of her planned trip, she's tha applicant not the OP.

If he sends her cash every month to supplement her income from her employment, that could work against her, as has already been pointed out already, the Entry Clearance Officer could be forgiven for assuming she'd be better off living with him in the UK, and she may well try and circumnavigate the Immigration rules and remain in the UK at the conclusion of her visit.

Topping up her account, padding the account, is generally seen as a bad idea, especially just prior to an application.

involving an MP, would not help the applicant, unless they could identify that the Immigration Rules have been improperly or unfairly applied, reading the notice of refusal, they don't seem to have been.

The relationship with the OP doesn't seem to be in dispute, just keep in mind that the UKVI specifically advise against supplying photos.

The applicant has supplied details of her accomodation, but her employement seems to be in doubt, her income does seem to be on the high side for her type of employment, something that couldn't be verified.

 

 

[stud858]

If someone signs up as guarantor what does the guarantee include? Or is there no such official thing? Obviously it would not include the exiting back to home country or the op's gf would have a visa

[theoldgit]

If someone signs up as guarantor what does the guarantee include? Or is there no such official thing? Obviously it would not include the exiting back to home country or the op's gf would have a visa

There’s no such thing, official or unofficial.
A sponsor cannot guarantee that an applicant will leave the UK after entering on a standard visit visa, and if a sponsor does submit a written guarantee, ECO’s are instructed to ignore it as its unenforceable in law.

[brewsterbudgen]

Suppose the refusal was to do that they are not convinced that your GF will return to Thailand? There is obvious a mar going round at all Embassies that any Thai lady who wants a tourist visa is not going to return to Thailand ! Had same experience in 2017 that my application was refused within 10 days after application for above statement but no reason was given or what was wrong with the application which confirmed  all requests and I informed the Embassy that we would visit Bangkok in March to be available for an interview. Absolutely disgusting what the Embassies do and collect payments for what?? 

All UK Visitor visa refusals are explained in an accompanying letter like the one posted by the OP.

There is no interview at the Embassy. Visas are granted or denied by ECOs employed by UKVI.

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[backinsept]

Thank you for all the responses.
I can tackle the employment and bank statement issue. But i feel it's a losing battle on the return to Thailand front. Other than prove that i have a strong and legitimate relationship with her. There is nothing more i can do. I stated that we are looking to get married soon (already put a ring on it) and wanted to show her my country and family. Thought that was pretty honest. Or has that worked against me? Thought the reviewer would see she wouldn't jeopardise our future to do a runner.

I've already included itinerary for trips to singapore, phuket, chiang mai.

 

Thought I got lucky to find a thai girl aged 29 with no kids, no debts, no problems. My word, how that has worked against me.
 

[wolf81]

A friend of my girlfriend had the same problem. She had a relationship with a man from the UK as well. First time got rejected. They decided to marry and then the process became easier. I believe soon she will travel to the UK with her (now) husband.

 

So yeah, if you're willing to marry, it might make it easier.

 

Personally I think marriage is almost always a bad idea, but yeah ...

Edited March 21, 2019 by wolf81

[ronaldo0]

2 minutes ago, wolf81 said:

A friend of my girlfriend had the same problem. She had a relationship with a man from the UK as well. First time got rejected. They decided to marry and then the process became easier. I believe soon she will travel to the UK with her (now) husband.

 

So yeah, if you're willing to marry, it might make it easier.

 

Personally I think marriage is almost always a bad idea, but yeah ...

Not the case . I had been married 5 years first time I applied and then married to same woman when I applied 2 years later. Denied !!

They said they didn't believe our relationship was genuine ! Despite my wife having my passport when she went to apply , wedding certificate , photos of wedding , us on holidays and letters from people saying they were at our wedding years before . Although if you have a kid it seems to help I would say !

[theoldgit]

For the avoidance of doubt nobody, husband, boyfriend, girlfriend etc, can give any guarantees that an applicant will return to their home country, such guarantees are meaningless and unenforceable.
It’s the applicant who applies, not their partner, sponsor etc, and it’s the applicant who has to satisfy the ECO that, their proposed visit is genuine, affordable and that, on the balance of probabilities, they will leave the UK on the conclusion of their proposed visit.


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[brewsterbudgen]

If her employer confirms in writing that she has been granted annual leave for her 16 day trip to the UK, and that she will be returning to her job on a specified date - and confirms all this in a telephone conversation - I would say it will go a long way to giving her an acceptable reason to return.

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[theoldgit]

A number of off topic posts, posts providing inaccurate or misleading information, along with some responses have been removed.

The OP is seeking advice in respect of his girlfriends application for a standard visit visa for the UK, not the US, Australia or Schengen, all of which have different procedures.

[rasg]

15 hours ago, wolf81 said:

A friend of my girlfriend had the same problem. She had a relationship with a man from the UK as well. First time got rejected. They decided to marry and then the process became easier. I believe soon she will travel to the UK with her (now) husband.

 

So yeah, if you're willing to marry, it might make it easier.

Yes it does as your wife doesn’t need a reason to return to Thailand. ie. She is moving to the UK permanently.