Do Residents Of Thailand Need To Declare All Their Assets?

[ballpoint]

One rarely sees such a bundle of hearsay, misleading information and downright ignorance outside the visa discussions.  Shouldn't this thread be in the jokes, laughs, and other fantasies forum?

[Naam]

11 hours ago, ukrules said:

On 4/7/2019 at 5:01 PM, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

has to DECLARE ALL HIS ASSETS ALL OVER THE WORLD !!

That's an American thing.

there are many countries with that kind of tax laws besides the U.S.

[Naam]

5 minutes ago, ballpoint said:

One rarely sees such a bundle of hearsay, misleading information and downright ignorance outside the visa discussions.  Shouldn't this thread be in the jokes, laughs, and other fantasies forum?

[david555]

Something many expatts even do not know , as I did before ….( and I am still not applying to....,  keeping my reserve under my control all times …)

We are supposed as  if bringing foreign cash in to the country ,..to sell / exchange it in a time frame to a Thai bank  (within 360 days of receipt,)

If not believe it check attachment the first yellow lines in it ….

Thai Bank regulation BOT.pdf

Edited April 9, 2019 by david555

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

12 hours ago, ukrules said:

That's an American thing.

 more and more countries are following thing american thing. that 

is why i am asking - when thailand will?

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

47 minutes ago, david555 said:

Something many expatts even do not know , as I did before ….( and I am still not applying to....,  keeping my reserve under my control all times …)

We are supposed as  if bringing foreign cash in to the country ,..to sell / exchange it in a time frame to a Thai bank  (within 360 days of receipt,)

If not believe it check attachment the first yellow lines in it ….

Thai Bank regulation BOT.pdf 75.42 kB · 1 download

thanks. well noted the maximum amount of foreign currency one can bring without declaring it, is now 15,000 USD:

 

"Any person bringing into or taking out of Thailand Thai baht bank notes, foreign currency bank notes or negotiable monetary instruments in an aggregate amount exceeding 450,000 Baht or USD 15,000 or its equivalent must declare to a customs officer."

 

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

1 hour ago, Naam said:

nonsense!

very likely. more and more countries are doing so.

[ThaiBunny]

8 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

 more and more countries are following thing american thing. that is why i am asking - when thailand will?

I've checked my crystal balls - both of them - but found no answer

[marcusarelus]

5 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

thanks. well noted the maximum amount of foreign currency one can bring without declaring it, is now 15,000 USD:

 

"Any person bringing into or taking out of Thailand Thai baht bank notes, foreign currency bank notes or negotiable monetary instruments in an aggregate amount exceeding 450,000 Baht or USD 15,000 or its equivalent must declare to a customs officer."

 

So you transfer it out using Deemoney.  Who cares.  You are not dealing with anything you have any experience with.  That's obvious. 

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

20 hours ago, emptypockets said:

It might have if the authorities see it is from a monthly pension earned in the same year. 

you are confused between "monthly pension" and "earned in the same year".

monthly pensions are not taxed in thailand.

profits from investments, however, will be taxed in thailand if brought into the country in the

same year they were earned.

that's because profits from investments held in tax heavens were not and will not

be taxed there.

in that sense, thailand is like semi - tax heaven.

you can legaly bring in your assets / profits from investments to thailand, and

you will not be taxed in thailand - if you did not bring it the same year they were earned.

[ThaiBunny]

Just now, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

that's because profits from investments held in tax heavens were not and will not be taxed there. in that sense, thailand is like semi - tax heaven.

Any suggestions for a good "tax heaven"?

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

25 minutes ago, ThaiBunny said:

Any suggestions for a good "tax heaven"?

a tax

Edited April 9, 2019 by SCOTT FITZGERSLD

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

9 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

So you transfer it out using Deemoney.  Who cares.  You are not dealing with anything you have any experience with.  That's obvious. 

yes, Deemoney is the solution for all money transfers. 

you should know as you have the experience.

[ThaiBunny]

3 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

a tax heaven is any country that does not tax profits from investments . those can be global financial centers like hong kong, singapore, swiss, luxemburg, panama, ext.

there are places like the careabean islands, jersey , cook islands ext. can be too risky, becuase many banks won't accept payments from those countries.

Ah, but they are tax havens. I'm looking for what you have recommended, a tax heaven.

[wordchild]

6 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

a tax heaven is any country that does not tax profits from investments . 

those can be global financial centers like hong kong, singapore, swiss, luxemburg, panama, ext.

there are places like the careabean islands, jersey , cook islands ext. can be too risky, becuase 

many banks won't accept payments from those countries.

maybe you can find  taxless "heaven" in the right tax haven!

Edited April 9, 2019 by wordchild

[david555]

20 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

thanks. well noted the maximum amount of foreign currency one can bring without declaring it, is now 15,000 USD:

 

"Any person bringing into or taking out of Thailand Thai baht bank notes, foreign currency bank notes or negotiable monetary instruments in an aggregate amount exceeding 450,000 Baht or USD 15,000 or its equivalent must declare to a customs officer."

 

More.....take  attention even that the foreign value on no need to declared cash normally must exchanged in that 365 day frame …… so normally may not keep it in foreign currency longer than  365 days 

I wonder how many of us do that anyway as a safe heaven ...

[david555]

23 minutes ago, ThaiBunny said:

I've checked my crystal balls - both of them - but found no answer

you don't have the pro version ….?????

Edited April 9, 2019 by david555

[ThaiBunny]

4 minutes ago, david555 said:

you don't have the pro version ….?????

I'm still trying to transfer the funds out of my tax heaven; that's why I'm, looking for recommendations for a new one

[marcusarelus]

22 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

yes, Deemoney is the solution for all money transfers. 

you should know as you have the experience.

I live in America and it works for me.  Other things I transfer with Bank of Bangkok and have for 20 years with no problems.  I don't have to wonder I have actually transferred money out of Thailand every year for 20 years. You don't have to declare your assets in Thailand and banks have a very difficult time freezing your assets.  Anything else?

Edited April 9, 2019 by marcusarelus

[khunPer]

2 hours ago, Naam said:

On 4/8/2019 at 9:21 AM, khunPer said:

Thai dividend tax is 10%, so paying Thai dividend tax might be better than one's home country tax

Thai dividend tax is levied only on dividends of stocks bought at SET and held in a Thai account.

Thanks for clarifying.
 

However, the 10% dividend tax was mentioned here, as some countries would tax dividend with the 10% Thai taxation due to double taxation agreement, if one proves that the dividend is transferred to Thailand the same year as earned; for example my Scandinavian home country instead of 27% dividend tax...????

If dividend is transferred into Thailand the following year, or later, it would be tax exempt in Thailand, and therefore could be taxed with the home country percentage or 15% for residents living abroad, depending on local tax rules.

[DogNo1]

I will be transferring 780,000 baht's worth of my retirement income into Thailand each year.  My retirement income is taxable and I pay tax on it in the USA.  The Thai Government requires (but as of now doesn't check closely) that the money that you transfer into the country comes from retirement INCOME, not savings.  Technically, it can't have been made in a previous year so it can't meet that particular Thai tax exemption. It may not be Thai practice to tax foreign-earned income but what is the law?  Two years ago, none of us were worried about paying tax to Japan for our foreign-earned income but now we are.  The new law taxing foreign-earned income was passed in 2017.  The Japanese Financial Times, the Nikei Shimbun and other economic newspapers stated that one objective of the law was to catch wealthy Japanese tax evaders who stashed their money abroad.  As we have seen recently, Thai immigration policy can suddenly change.  So, I assume, can Thai tax law.

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

2 hours ago, DogNo1 said:

I will be transferring 780,000 baht's worth of my retirement income into Thailand each year.  My retirement income is taxable and I pay tax on it in the USA.  The Thai Government requires (but as of now doesn't check closely) that the money that you transfer into the country comes from retirement INCOME, not savings.  Technically, it can't have been made in a previous year so it can't meet that particular Thai tax exemption. It may not be Thai practice to tax foreign-earned income but what is the law?  Two years ago, none of us were worried about paying tax to Japan for our foreign-earned income but now we are.  The new law taxing foreign-earned income was passed in 2017.  The Japanese Financial Times, the Nikei Shimbun and other economic newspapers stated that one objective of the law was to catch wealthy Japanese tax evaders who stashed their money abroad.  As we have seen recently, Thai immigration policy can suddenly change.  So, I assume, can Thai tax law.

EXACTLY. that is why i asked my question in this topic.

but i am not sure that The Thai Government requires  that the money that you transfer into the country (for retirement visa) comes from retirement INCOME , not savings. i did ask an IO and a thai banker, and they said the money can come from any (legal) source (for the 800K visa method).

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

3 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

I live in America and it works for me.  Other things I transfer with Bank of Bangkok and have for 20 years with no problems.  I don't have to wonder I have actually transferred money out of Thailand every year for 20 years. You don't have to declare your assets in Thailand and banks have a very difficult time freezing your assets.  Anything else?

well, sir, the thing with online money transfers is that they leave a record, and with all the new global tax law coming to our faces faster than Road Runner, maybe you don't want the whole world to know about every money movement you made in the past 25 years.

[ukrules]

7 hours ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

 more and more countries are following thing american thing. that 

is why i am asking - when thailand will?

There are 2 countries in the world who do what the US does.

 

The US and Eritrea, that's literally it in the whole world for taxing worldwide income regardless of where you live.

 

Edited April 9, 2019 by ukrules

[ukrules]

9 hours ago, Naam said:

there are many countries with that kind of tax laws besides the U.S.

This is the first I'm hearing about it.

[UKresonant]

4 hours ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

EXACTLY. that is why i asked my question in this topic.

but i am not sure that The Thai Government requires  that the money that you transfer into the country (for retirement visa) comes from retirement INCOME , not savings. i did ask an IO and a thai banker, and they said the money can come from any (legal) source (for the 800K visa method).

Showing that the funds come from a legal source is the main thing I think. After all, most Thai Pensions, unless you work for the Government, will result in just a big pile of cash in the bank, they draw down on .  The pension payment advice slips, and the corresponding credit in your account in home country proves the pension(s), including drawn-down, sources are legit.

I think the Banks are more concerned that the money passing through your account is legit and it does not infringe any sanctions, and of course they report interest etc. don't believe they are tax police.

If you collect your money together with proof of legit source, if you can have the equiv. of 12 in No 40000 or 65000 baht built up, credit that to a second account on the 30th of Dec, with 12 x subsequent SWIFT transfers setup on the 15th of the month throughout the year, that would be the belt and braces approach perhaps. Prove legit source=Yes (eg last years pension, and bank statements, or better still, a single bank letter stating the transfer on the 30th Dec is legit), Not income from the current financial year=Yes.

 

I know of at least one major annuity provider in the UK (2017) that stated they would not pay anything, even for a wife's dependent's benefit, to a non-uk account!

 

 

 

Edited April 9, 2019 by johnwf1963

[DogNo1]

My understanding is that only the 65,000 per month retirement income transferred monthly to a Thai bank in order to get the retirement extension is subject to the condition that it must be sourced from provable (if asked) retirement INCOME in the home country.  That condition does not appear to apply to the lump sum 800,000 and 400,000 in the bank method.

[Naam]

15 hours ago, khunPer said:

Thanks for clarifying.
 

However, the 10% dividend tax was mentioned here, as some countries would tax dividend with the 10% Thai taxation due to double taxation agreement, if one proves that the dividend is transferred to Thailand the same year as earned; for example my Scandinavian home country instead of 27% dividend tax...????

If dividend is transferred into Thailand the following year, or later, it would be tax exempt in Thailand, and therefore could be taxed with the home country percentage or 15% for residents living abroad, depending on local tax rules.

nice theory but i'm afraid to implement in practice would be rather difficult.

[Naam]

8 hours ago, ukrules said:

This is the first I'm hearing about it.

sorry misunderstanding. US and Eritrea are of course the only taxes which tax a citizen living abroad.

[Naam]

15 hours ago, david555 said:

More.....take  attention even that the foreign value on no need to declared cash normally must exchanged in that 365 day frame …… so normally may not keep it in foreign currency longer than  365 days 

I wonder how many of us do that anyway as a safe heaven ...

says who?