Who really suffers

[lelapin]

I read about the many farangs who will be suffering financially from the new retirement visa regulations. They are having to keep a large amount of baht in a bank account all year earning little or no interest. Maybe I have missed them but I have not read any comments about how it will affect many Thai ladies. Losing interest or not, I like many farangs, will have enough to survive living in Thailand even without that interest but it will mean that that my estate when I pass on will be less and my Thai girlfriend of 15 years will end up receiving less money from my will because of the new rules. I am sure she is not the only Thai lady that will be affected in such a way.

[mlkik]

I keep 800,000 baht in a Thai bank for my retirement extension and the interest rate is as good as the rate if I kept it in a UK bank.

[Peterw42]

Why would your estate be less? you can still will the 800k to a GF or wife, the interest is not great but its similar to bank interest back home. GF will probably get more money as almost impossible for her to chase up money thats still back in home country.

[lelapin]

I am not comparing interest rates with home & Thai banks. I have read many posts from people who make non bank investments  at higher rates and will no longer be able to do so. I am stating that they will not be the person in the long run who will be suffering from loss of investment.

[glegolo]

"Letapin". Maybe your "girlsfriend" of heavy 15 years are suffering even more because you for some reason dont marry her and make a family?? Thought about that instead of bank-interest??

 

glegolo

[lelapin]

1 minute ago, glegolo said:

"Letapin". Maybe your "girlsfriend" of heavy 15 years are suffering even more because you for some reason dont marry her and make a family?? Thought about that instead of bank-interest??

 

glegolo

With 2 wives still back in the UK that could be tricky!!!!!

 

[jacko45k]

She gets what she gets. Making sure she gets it is your job, if you are found prostate and intestate the odds are against it. Beware lawyers and police getting involved. Although a lawyer will be needed to release bank account money as a court order is needed. 

Edited April 8, 2019 by jacko45k

[gk10002000]

As far as money and interest, I keep my money fully invested in the USA and in mostly tax free investments or my ROTH IRA.  I hate paperwork, and while the FINRA 10K USD filing stuff is not hard, I hate to file paperwork with the USA if I have $10,000 USD in any overseas account.  And if I had 800k baht or about 24,000 USD on deposit in Thailand that would not only require me to file the 10k document, I would also now have to report any interest earned on that when I do my USA taxes.  Just my preference to hate to do additional paperwork or filing.  And that $24,000 USD can earn me a decent penny in the USA in my tax free investments, easily over $1,000 a year.  The fact I can afford to not earn that is irrelevant.  I got to where I am in life by not throwing away $1,000 silly nilly.  Income method was a nice simple thing and something I could easily proved and document before.  Now with the recent changes, the whole thing is a mess.  I have no desire to setup any sort of automatic transfers, or withdrawals, pay fees, risk account security, overseas issues, etc.  But, it is what it is.  Will see how things shake out in the next year when I do the Thailand thing as I semi retire

[NancyL]

I know several elderly expats who, as they got to be 80 - 85+ in age, decided to simplify their financial life and bring all their money into Thailand to make it easier for their Thai partner/spouse to access it upon their passing.  And yes, it did simplify matters when they passed compared with men who had complex financial portfolios overseas, trying to milk out the last $1 in complex investments where the legal fees and time needed to access the money were staggering upon their passing, even with properly written Final Wills.

[Joe Mcseismic]

Am going to open another savings account that also has an ATM card.

Into this account, I'll eventually have the 800k to show each year to immigration. My other savings account will be used for living expenses.

On the new account, I'll ask the missus (of 21 years) to think of a six figure number that she can remember. I will then use this number as the PIN for the new ATM card. The card will then be put into a sealed envelope which I will sign across the flap and will be stored in the draw next to my bed.

Strict instructions to the wife that she can only open and use on my death. This will take care of her whilst probate goes through in the UK which takes a few months.

Firstly, this method of separating daily expense from immigration money will stop the chance of any accidents whereby the money goes below the 800k.

Secondly, though I'll lose potential interest, there is peace of mind for both of us that she won't be left in the lurch on my death. For me, that peace of mind is worth the loss of some interest.

Edited April 8, 2019 by Joe Mcseismic

[mosan]

Suffering?

 

How can someone suffer when they receive something they never had in the first place?  

 

Now if you keep 800K/400K locked up in a Thai bank account, that is choice, not suffering...

[glegolo]

44 minutes ago, lelapin said:

With 2 wives still back in the UK that could be tricky!!!!!

 

So you are a muslim or a mormon then??? Anyhow with a girlfriend in Thailand of 15 years, and 2 wifes in the UK, maybe your worrying about bank-interests are not that much anyhow??

 

glegolo

[arithai12]

OP you claim you having 2 wives is the reason why you cannot marry your Thai gf. Apart from the bigamy angle, can you actually disinherit completely your wives? If not, then your gf will suffer much more from having to share the estate than from any lost interest.

 

[lelapin]

27 minutes ago, arithai12 said:

OP you claim you having 2 wives is the reason why you cannot marry your Thai gf. Apart from the bigamy angle, can you actually disinherit completely your wives? If not, then your gf will suffer much more from having to share the estate than from any lost interest.

 

They already have had their large settlements and do not know I live in Thailand.

[ivor bigun]

Its not the fact that i have to put 800,000 in the account the bothers me,its the fact that i cant spend my own money,end of.

Sent from my SM-A720F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[marcusarelus]

1 minute ago, ivor bigun said:

Its not the fact that i have to put 800,000 in the account the bothers me,its the fact that i cant spend my own money,end of.

Sent from my SM-A720F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

If you spent the money it would no longer be in the bank so I guess it does bother you.  I mean, I could give you the money and you put in in the bank and get a deposit slip and then withdraw the money and give it back to me.

[CanuckThai]

3 hours ago, mlkik said:

I keep 800,000 baht in a Thai bank for my retirement extension and the interest rate is as good as the rate if I kept it in a UK bank.

No argument, but that is part of the point.  Who in their right mind (back in our home countries), would park the equivalent of 800K baht in a bank, to basically lose against annual inflation?   No significant gain, no tax incentive, nada.   A reasonable investment (or brokerage) can almost guarantee a safe X points above inflation or X% over interest rates at a bank...

 

An annual burning of 20 baht bills for a humdinger of a bbq, would give a better roi than parking 800k here.

[Lacessit]

4 hours ago, mlkik said:

I keep 800,000 baht in a Thai bank for my retirement extension and the interest rate is as good as the rate if I kept it in a UK bank.

A good way to lose in the long term.

Wherever you are, banks pay 1-2% interest. They then lend it out at 6-7%.

Let's say you have funds on deposit in Australia, current interest rate 1.5%. As income, it is then taxed say at 30%. Your real rate of return is then 1% pa.

At an annual inflation rate of 3%, your capital is being chewed up at a rate of 2% per year.

In Thailand, we are forced to keep 800,000 baht on deposit. It is what it is.

IMHO anyone who keeps more than living expenses on deposit with a bank is financially illiterate.

[JustAnotherHun]

12 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

IMHO anyone who keeps more than living expenses on deposit with a bank is financially illiterate.

...or he can afford loosing 8k THB (200 and something Euros) net interest/year to be on the save side with his extension.

[Lacessit]

2 minutes ago, JustAnotherHun said:

...or he can afford loosing 8k THB (200 and something Euros) net interest/year to be on the save side with his extension.

I was referring to funds in overseas banks, not Thailand where it is compulsory.

[Caldera]

6 hours ago, NancyL said:

I know several elderly expats who, as they got to be 80 - 85+ in age, decided to simplify their financial life and bring all their money into Thailand to make it easier for their Thai partner/spouse to access it upon their passing.  And yes, it did simplify matters when they passed

In some cases, providing easy access might have also sped up their passing - something to keep in mind as well.

[JustAnotherHun]

4 hours ago, ivor bigun said:

Its not the fact that i have to put 800,000 in the account the bothers me,its the fact that i cant spend my own money,end of.

If you rent a home and have to pay a deposit you can't spend your money aswell.

[ivor bigun]

If you rent a home and have to pay a deposit you can't spend your money aswell.

I want to be able spend my money any time i want ,and bring in money when i please,also in case of an emergancy spend itwithout worrying that i will lose my visa.

Sent from my SM-A720F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[ThaiBunny]

1 minute ago, ivor bigun said:

I want to be able spend my money any time i want ,and bring in money when i please,also in case of an emergancy spend itwithout worrying that i will lose my visa.

How IS life on Fantasy Island?

[55Jay]

Matter of perspective as well.  There are some farangs here who don't consider 800k as being a lot of money. 

[Thailand Outcast]

3 hours ago, Lacessit said:

A good way to lose in the long term.

Wherever you are, banks pay 1-2% interest. They then lend it out at 6-7%.

Let's say you have funds on deposit in Australia, current interest rate 1.5%. As income, it is then taxed say at 30%. Your real rate of return is then 1% pa.

At an annual inflation rate of 3%, your capital is being chewed up at a rate of 2% per year.

In Thailand, we are forced to keep 800,000 baht on deposit. It is what it is.

IMHO anyone who keeps more than living expenses on deposit with a bank is financially illiterate.

I agree. 

 

That's why the 800k / 400k untouched is such a lousy deal.

 

Now, if the "visa agents" are allowed to keep operating, despite the new laws, "Who really suffers" with be those using the 800k / 400k method, who will be roughly paying 4000 baht more, for the same product. (visa)

 

Not to mention, they basically can not use 400k of their own money, forever.

 

Then, there is the stress of seasoning, paperwork, bank letters, fronting immigration etc etc. 

 

As you rightly point out, the 800k method runs at a financial loss for the expat, and sure does make for an expensive visa.  

 

 

[Thailand Outcast]

Just now, 55Jay said:

Matter of perspective as well.  There are some farangs here who don't consider 800k as being a lot of money. 

Matter of principle as well.

 

Since when did The Thai government, and Thai banks, become a charity that should be donated to?

[ThaiBunny]

1 minute ago, Thailand Outcast said:

Matter of principle as well. Since when did The Thai government, and Thai banks, become a charity that should be donated to?

1800?

[Snow Leopard]

It doesn't make any difference keeping 800K in a Thai Bank or any bank outside Thailand. Central and Commercial Banks will devalue it to Zero in the end anyway. 

[Thailand Outcast]

3 minutes ago, Snow Leopard said:

It doesn't make any difference keeping 800K in a Thai Bank or any bank outside Thailand. Central and Commercial Banks will devalue it to Zero in the end anyway. 

A balanced, and well managed, non aggressive fund, will return about 6% to 8%. 

 

Factor those losses into the cost of your visa, by keeping 800k in a Thai bank. 

 

What do you think the Thai banks do with your 800k?

Edited April 8, 2019 by Thailand Outcast