Do you believe in God and why

[Fat is a type of crazy]

34 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You obviously haven't been reading my posts for long. I do believe in God, but I also believe that God created life the universe and everything and then left the universe to get on with it without interfering. Did God save all the children that died yesterday because they didn't have enough to eat?

Caring is a human quality- are you saying God is human?

Black holes consume everything they can attract- assuming a black hole opened up in our galaxy, would you expect God to close the hole before it consumed planet earth and all life on it?

BTW, no zebra ever wanted to be ripped apart by lions, but we allow it to happen instead of killing all the lions.

 I said in a previous post that you seem to believe god created things at the big bang stage or before and then stopped any further interaction.  Therefore in your book the bible is a wrong account written by humans.

I wasn't sure though if you believed God looked on from afar and had an opinion or cared about the outcome. It appears you believe god has no response or presence or personality or feelings or opinion or  reaction or judgement.  Just interesting to find out from people who believe in god what that god is. 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

11 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

 I said in a previous post that you seem to believe god created things at the big bang stage or before and then stopped any further interaction.  Therefore in your book the bible is a wrong account written by humans.

I wasn't sure though if you believed God looked on from afar and had an opinion or cared about the outcome. It appears you believe god has no response or presence or personality or feelings or opinion or  reaction or judgement.  Just interesting to find out from people who believe in god what that god is. 

 

IMO God is the creator of all and everything that is comes from God and is part of God and when our temporal existence ends we return to God.

Do we humans care about an amoeba in a pond 10 thousand miles away- does God care about humans on an insignificant planet in an insignificant solar system in an insignificant galaxy? Up to you.

[Sunmaster]

5 hours ago, yodsak said:

There are eight of these herbal preparations (six to add to spread compost, two to spray on the crops, the latter two prepared in a cow’s horn, one of which has to be buried over the winter – and which is supposed to improve the “vital force” – the other buried over the summer, which is supposed to add “light”) Their base ingredients have to be derived from fermentation in animal organs (intestines, bladder, skull) They are diluted in a similar way to homeopathy, up to 1 mg / 10 kg (= 1 / 0.0000001), another theory which has failed to produce proof of efficacy.

Naturally these preparations have been and continue to be controversial, due to their lack of scientific rigour, which can clearly be illustrated by this quote from R. Steiner “The deer’s bladder is connected to cosmic forces. Even better than that, it’s almost a replica of the cosmos. So, we can significantly enhance the inherent ability of yarrow (one of the substances -ed.) to combine sulphur with other substances”  Furthermore, according to Steiner, these preparations can be imbued with “feelings” and “cosmic forces”                                     — European Scientist    biodynamics-a-very-strange-concept

Hey, well done...another copy/paste effort from you. A superficial article from an unnamed "European Scientist" on top of that. ????

I can copy/paste as well...

 

Ten things worth knowing about biodynamic farming

by Elisabeth Winkler on 5 October, 2018 in Farming

 

Licensed in over 60 countries worldwide, biodynamic farming is a method of organic farming and gardening with a specific holistic and spiritual approach to growing food sustainably.

1. How it all started

The phenomenon we now identify as the organic movement arose in the early twentieth century as agriculture started to become more industrialised and synthetic fertiliser was introduced. Biodynamic farming was born from a series of agricultural lectures in 1924 given by Austrian philosopher and social reformer, Rudolf Steiner (1861 – 1925). He had been invited to a Silesian farm estate by a group of farmers concerned about the negative impact of nitrogen fertiliser on soil quality. Drawing on traditional farming practices and his own “spiritual science” which aimed to bring scientific rigour to spirituality, Steiner suggested a set of practices and principles for sustainable agriculture. He urged his followers to test his ideas and, thanks to this approach, biodynamic farming developed through collaborative research, observation and hands-on farming practice.

2. The philosophy behind it

Rudolf Steiner developed Anthroposophy (‘anthropo’ meaning human, and ‘sophia’ meaning wisdom), a philosophy based on the premise that all beings can develop their inner potential and access a spiritual world. This philosophy has inspired an education system (Waldorf and Steiner schools), a therapeutic approach for people with learning difficulties (for example, the Camphill Communities), anthroposophic medicine, eurythmy (an expressive art movement) and biodynamic farming.

3. Demeter – the first eco-label

Named after the Greek goddess of the harvest, the orange Demeter label is the international logo used for certified biodynamic products. Founded in 1928, Demeter is the world’s first ecological food and farming trademark. Used in over 60 countries, Demeter certification verifies that biodynamic products meet international standards in the production and processing of sustainable food. Regulated in the UK by the Biodynamic Agriculture Association (BDA), Demeter’s biodynamic standards build on EU organic standards.

4. Differences between organic and biodynamic

 A UK farmer wishing to be certified for Demeter (biodynamic) accreditation must comply with EU organic regulations requiring a two-year conversion period. For biodynamic certification, Demeter standards require an additional year of conversion to include using eight mineral and plant-based preparations to activate soil life and plant growth on the land. Although there is a large body of observational evidence from farmers showing that biodynamic methods improve soil condition and plant health, more scientific research is needed. However, the long-term DOK field trials by FiBL (Forschungsinstitut für Biologischen Landbau) compared biodynamic (D for Demeter), organic (O) and conventional (K for ‘konventionell’) cropping systems suggests biodynamic practices are effective. FiBL stated: “In the biodynamic system, soil organic matter (humus) content remained stable for the first 21 years of the trial while it declined in all other systems”.

5. Biodynamic preparations for soil and plants

The highly-diluted biodynamic preparations are stirred for an hour to create a vortex and counter-vortex to oxygenate and disperse the active ingredients, then sprinkled or sprayed over soil or plants.

Two preparations, Cow Horn Manure (BD 500) and Horn Silica (BD 501) primarily prepare the fields while the remaining six ‘preps’ treat compost. Used to enhance soil biology, Horn Manure (BD 500) is made from the fresh manure of pasture-fed cows. Collected in the autumn, it is placed in a cow’s horn and buried for six months. When dug-up again, the cow pat has transformed from smelly lumps to a peaty brown-black crumble. Horn Silica preparation (BD 501) is used for plant health. Made from finely-ground quartz (a common stone or sand) and mixed to a paste, Horn Silica is buried in a cow’s horn in spring and dug-up in the autumn. Stored in a glass jar on a sunny window sill, it is diluted in miniscule quantities and sprayed as a fine mist on growing plants in the morning.

“Just as 1g of rich soil has a billion microorganisms, a biodynamic spray will have microscopic amounts of bacteria and fungi,” explains Kai Lange, diploma coordinator of the Biodynamic Agricultural College. “On one hand it is quantitative, and on other hand it is energetic – that is, the quality which goes beyond the physical body. But you do not need to believe in this for biodynamic methods to work,” he adds.

6. Have you ever wondered why cows have horns?

This question, posed by Steiner, led to practical evaluation of horns and animal health and the banning of dehorning under Demeter standards. According to a guide co-published by organic researchers FiBL, horns play a vital role in the animal’s health. There is a highly developed flow of blood to and from the horns, which appears to improve digestion and metabolism. Horns are also considered health indicators. “If a cow’s horn smells strongly, I know there is something wrong with her,” says biodynamic farmer, Christian Müller. A cow’s horns confer social status, and ensures a cow has more body space.

7. Cow dung and soil quality

Biodynamic farmers believe that cattle produce high-quality manure essential for soil health. “It is helpful to have cow dung in compost heaps, even in small amounts, to help fermentation and fertility,” says Gabriel Kaye, executive director of the Biodynamic Land Trust. The biodynamic preparation, Cow Pat Pit (or barrel preparation) can be added to the compost heap as a starter as well as being sprayed on the farmland and garden. It contains cow manure and the compost preparations and is recommended for those converting to biodynamic agriculture. Add a pinch to a bucket of water, stir for about 20 minutes, then spray, preferably in the autumn. Ask your local biodynamic farm for Cow Pat Pit or order the dried version called Mausdorf Starter from the BDA website.

8. Compost is king

Biodynamic farming aims to create healthy soil using compost and crop and grazing rotations. Uniquely, it treats the compost heap with medicinal plant-based preparations (BD 502-507) to encourage the microbial life needed for soil fertility (and which is suppressed by chemical fertiliser). “The purpose of the compost preparations is to bring about a harmonious decomposition process,” says Richard Thornton Smith, previous chair of Biodynamic Association Certification. “Biodynamic preparations enable the composted matter to stabilise and fix the nitrogen which is volatile. Their effect is to hold the decomposition process in a disciplined way to prevent nitrogen loss. If a compost heap gets too hot, it loses ammonia, a nitrogenous substance. That’s like money dropping out of your back pocket.”

9. Is biodynamic vegan?

While the diluted preparations are mineral, plant and manure-based, some use animal parts as ‘sheaths’ to hold and help activate the ingredients. For instance, BD 506 consists of dandelion flowers wrapped in a cow’s mesentery, the membrane covering the intestines. The parts come from healthy animals which have either been slaughtered for meat or old age. Steiner himself was a vegetarian, and biodynamic farming practice has the highest animal welfare at its heart.

10. Planting by the moon, stars and planets

Whilst traditional farming has long used lunar almanacs, the biodynamic calendar also includes constellations and planetary alignments. Inspired by Steiner, the biodynamic calendar, now in its 57th year, was developed by German farmer, Maria Thun (1922 – 2012) who experimented with planetary effects on planting, sowing and harvesting. Now produced by her son, Matthias Thun, the biodynamic calendar can be adapted for particular hemispheres. Although it is not mandatory for Demeter certification, the biodynamic calendar is used by farmers and gardeners.

One of the best ways to learn more about biodynamic growing is to join a local biodynamic group, visit local biodynamic farms or a Camphill Community. Rudolf Steiner’s agricultural lectures are a challenging read but provide the source material which informs biodynamic practice. For a more accessible introduction, choose The Biodynamic Year – Increasing yield, quality and flavour by Maria Thun.

Patrick Holden is Patron of the UK Biodynamic Association.

[VincentRJ]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I don't know who wrote that, but ..............................................

If you read the article you would find out. The writer is Abbie Cox who claims to be a student at one of the most “vegan friendly” campuses in the United States, according to a Princeton Review. 

"Dairy cows are mated for 2 reasons, to make them produce milk and to provide replacements for older cows."

Of course. That's very obvious. No dispute there.

"No dairy farmer is going to allow calves to suckle when they need to sell the milk to make money to survive. Calves being kept are not allowed to stay with their mothers, so I can't speak from experience as to whether the mothers abandon them or not."

Note that the statement in the quote was: "There are two main reasons why newborn dairy calves don’t stay with their mothers: for their safety and their health." You shouldn't misinterpret that as meaning there are "only two reasons".

Towards the end of the article, Abbie Cox addresses what she considers to be a common misconception on this issue. Here's the quote.

"Finally, I want to address one of the most common misconceptions I hear about why the cow and calf don’t stay together: “if they don’t separate them the calf will drink all of the milk and there won’t be any for them to sell.”
Calves get fed milk or milk-replacer. Milk-replacer is the equivalent of feeding your baby formula instead of breast milk – it’s a personal choice. Cows naturally make more milk than a calf will drink on its own, so the choice to feed replacer versus milk is one made by each individual farm."

"The bottom line is, things can and often do go wrong when the calf is left with the cow. But dairy farmers are trained to be good care takers to their animals, including the babies. That means that we feed them from a bottle or bucket to make sure they drink their milk and that it comes from a clean place. We are also able to monitor them very closely until their immune system develops, and continue to do so as they get older."

Okay? I hope I have increased your 'enlightenment'. ????

[VincentRJ]

22 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I don't know who wrote that, but ..............................................

By the way, with reference to the previously quoted article about the reasons why calves are separated from their mothers, I did an internet search on the author, Abbie Cox, and came across the following site which also has a nice photo of her.
https://cals.cornell.edu/news/abbie-cox-21-exploring-international-dairy-industry

"Abbie Cox ’21 is majoring in animal science, with a focus on dairy science. During winter break, she participated in an international study trip that traveled to China to learn more about the international dairy industry."

"Growth is only possible by leaving your comfort zone. I am currently looking out at calf hutches, free-stall barns and feed bunks. Not an unusual sight for a student pursuing a degree with a focus in dairy science — except we are in Tianjin, China, with the Cornell University Dairy Science Club (CUDS)." 

Your enlightenment should be now increasing. ????

[thaibeachlovers]

20 hours ago, VincentRJ said:

Okay? I hope I have increased your 'enlightenment'. ????

LOL. My first 2 job were on dairy farms ( for two years ). I know as much as I want to about dairy cows and dairy farming. How much experience do you have of dairy farming?

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, VincentRJ said:

"Abbie Cox ’21 is majoring in animal science, with a focus on dairy science. During winter break, she participated in an international study trip that traveled to China to learn more about the international dairy industry."

"Growth is only possible by leaving your comfort zone. I am currently looking out at calf hutches, free-stall barns and feed bunks. Not an unusual sight for a student pursuing a degree with a focus in dairy science — except we are in Tianjin, China, with the Cornell University Dairy Science Club (CUDS)." 

Your enlightenment should be now increasing. ????

55555555555555555555 21 and probably never done a real job on a dairy farm, or done a real job at anything as she is a student. I'd already worked 2 years on dairy farms and moved on to a different occupation by the age she wrote that article.

I am currently looking out at calf hutches, free-stall barns and feed bunks

LOL. In NZ dairy cows live outside in paddocks all year around- NO barn living, stalls, feed bunks etc. They eat grass in summer and hay/ silage in winter ( taken to the paddocks by tractor ). IN NZ they don't give cows ground up diseased sheep, which is why we don't have such atrocities as mad cow disease.

If she is serious about "international" dairy farming she should go to NZ.

 

[Fat is a type of crazy]

23 hours ago, Sunmaster said:

Hey, well done...another copy/paste effort from you. A superficial article from an unnamed "European Scientist" on top of that. ????

I can copy/paste as well...

 

Ten things worth knowing about biodynamic farming

by Elisabeth Winkler on 5 October, 2018 in Farming

 

Licensed in over 60 countries worldwide, biodynamic farming is a method of organic farming and gardening with a specific holistic and spiritual approach to growing food sustainably.

1. How it all started

The phenomenon we now identify as the organic movement arose in the early twentieth century as agriculture started to become more industrialised and synthetic fertiliser was introduced. Biodynamic farming was born from a series of agricultural lectures in 1924 given by Austrian philosopher and social reformer, Rudolf Steiner (1861 – 1925). He had been invited to a Silesian farm estate by a group of farmers concerned about the negative impact of nitrogen fertiliser on soil quality. Drawing on traditional farming practices and his own “spiritual science” which aimed to bring scientific rigour to spirituality, Steiner suggested a set of practices and principles for sustainable agriculture. He urged his followers to test his ideas and, thanks to this approach, biodynamic farming developed through collaborative research, observation and hands-on farming practice.

2. The philosophy behind it

Rudolf Steiner developed Anthroposophy (‘anthropo’ meaning human, and ‘sophia’ meaning wisdom), a philosophy based on the premise that all beings can develop their inner potential and access a spiritual world. This philosophy has inspired an education system (Waldorf and Steiner schools), a therapeutic approach for people with learning difficulties (for example, the Camphill Communities), anthroposophic medicine, eurythmy (an expressive art movement) and biodynamic farming.

3. Demeter – the first eco-label

Named after the Greek goddess of the harvest, the orange Demeter label is the international logo used for certified biodynamic products. Founded in 1928, Demeter is the world’s first ecological food and farming trademark. Used in over 60 countries, Demeter certification verifies that biodynamic products meet international standards in the production and processing of sustainable food. Regulated in the UK by the Biodynamic Agriculture Association (BDA), Demeter’s biodynamic standards build on EU organic standards.

4. Differences between organic and biodynamic

 A UK farmer wishing to be certified for Demeter (biodynamic) accreditation must comply with EU organic regulations requiring a two-year conversion period. For biodynamic certification, Demeter standards require an additional year of conversion to include using eight mineral and plant-based preparations to activate soil life and plant growth on the land. Although there is a large body of observational evidence from farmers showing that biodynamic methods improve soil condition and plant health, more scientific research is needed. However, the long-term DOK field trials by FiBL (Forschungsinstitut für Biologischen Landbau) compared biodynamic (D for Demeter), organic (O) and conventional (K for ‘konventionell’) cropping systems suggests biodynamic practices are effective. FiBL stated: “In the biodynamic system, soil organic matter (humus) content remained stable for the first 21 years of the trial while it declined in all other systems”.

5. Biodynamic preparations for soil and plants

The highly-diluted biodynamic preparations are stirred for an hour to create a vortex and counter-vortex to oxygenate and disperse the active ingredients, then sprinkled or sprayed over soil or plants.

Two preparations, Cow Horn Manure (BD 500) and Horn Silica (BD 501) primarily prepare the fields while the remaining six ‘preps’ treat compost. Used to enhance soil biology, Horn Manure (BD 500) is made from the fresh manure of pasture-fed cows. Collected in the autumn, it is placed in a cow’s horn and buried for six months. When dug-up again, the cow pat has transformed from smelly lumps to a peaty brown-black crumble. Horn Silica preparation (BD 501) is used for plant health. Made from finely-ground quartz (a common stone or sand) and mixed to a paste, Horn Silica is buried in a cow’s horn in spring and dug-up in the autumn. Stored in a glass jar on a sunny window sill, it is diluted in miniscule quantities and sprayed as a fine mist on growing plants in the morning.

“Just as 1g of rich soil has a billion microorganisms, a biodynamic spray will have microscopic amounts of bacteria and fungi,” explains Kai Lange, diploma coordinator of the Biodynamic Agricultural College. “On one hand it is quantitative, and on other hand it is energetic – that is, the quality which goes beyond the physical body. But you do not need to believe in this for biodynamic methods to work,” he adds.

6. Have you ever wondered why cows have horns?

This question, posed by Steiner, led to practical evaluation of horns and animal health and the banning of dehorning under Demeter standards. According to a guide co-published by organic researchers FiBL, horns play a vital role in the animal’s health. There is a highly developed flow of blood to and from the horns, which appears to improve digestion and metabolism. Horns are also considered health indicators. “If a cow’s horn smells strongly, I know there is something wrong with her,” says biodynamic farmer, Christian Müller. A cow’s horns confer social status, and ensures a cow has more body space.

7. Cow dung and soil quality

Biodynamic farmers believe that cattle produce high-quality manure essential for soil health. “It is helpful to have cow dung in compost heaps, even in small amounts, to help fermentation and fertility,” says Gabriel Kaye, executive director of the Biodynamic Land Trust. The biodynamic preparation, Cow Pat Pit (or barrel preparation) can be added to the compost heap as a starter as well as being sprayed on the farmland and garden. It contains cow manure and the compost preparations and is recommended for those converting to biodynamic agriculture. Add a pinch to a bucket of water, stir for about 20 minutes, then spray, preferably in the autumn. Ask your local biodynamic farm for Cow Pat Pit or order the dried version called Mausdorf Starter from the BDA website.

8. Compost is king

Biodynamic farming aims to create healthy soil using compost and crop and grazing rotations. Uniquely, it treats the compost heap with medicinal plant-based preparations (BD 502-507) to encourage the microbial life needed for soil fertility (and which is suppressed by chemical fertiliser). “The purpose of the compost preparations is to bring about a harmonious decomposition process,” says Richard Thornton Smith, previous chair of Biodynamic Association Certification. “Biodynamic preparations enable the composted matter to stabilise and fix the nitrogen which is volatile. Their effect is to hold the decomposition process in a disciplined way to prevent nitrogen loss. If a compost heap gets too hot, it loses ammonia, a nitrogenous substance. That’s like money dropping out of your back pocket.”

9. Is biodynamic vegan?

While the diluted preparations are mineral, plant and manure-based, some use animal parts as ‘sheaths’ to hold and help activate the ingredients. For instance, BD 506 consists of dandelion flowers wrapped in a cow’s mesentery, the membrane covering the intestines. The parts come from healthy animals which have either been slaughtered for meat or old age. Steiner himself was a vegetarian, and biodynamic farming practice has the highest animal welfare at its heart.

10. Planting by the moon, stars and planets

Whilst traditional farming has long used lunar almanacs, the biodynamic calendar also includes constellations and planetary alignments. Inspired by Steiner, the biodynamic calendar, now in its 57th year, was developed by German farmer, Maria Thun (1922 – 2012) who experimented with planetary effects on planting, sowing and harvesting. Now produced by her son, Matthias Thun, the biodynamic calendar can be adapted for particular hemispheres. Although it is not mandatory for Demeter certification, the biodynamic calendar is used by farmers and gardeners.

One of the best ways to learn more about biodynamic growing is to join a local biodynamic group, visit local biodynamic farms or a Camphill Community. Rudolf Steiner’s agricultural lectures are a challenging read but provide the source material which informs biodynamic practice. For a more accessible introduction, choose The Biodynamic Year – Increasing yield, quality and flavour by Maria Thun.

Patrick Holden is Patron of the UK Biodynamic Association.

This may be obvious, but throughout history there are people who couldn't fully explain things through known science, and so use a mixture of scientific testing and some religion or spirituality to try and make sense of the world e.g. Isaac Newton. There inability to use science is not necessarily a fault because science wasn't there yet to test the theories.

The scientists among us may not like this but if you are living in the dark ages or the stone age, say, it must be hard just to say 'I have no idea' and so you might build a theory of the world based on partly on testing and partly by patching other beliefs together so you can get some contentment.

Someone like Steiner seems to deserve some merit as you point out for being a forerunner of discussing organic and natural farming techniques as per your post. He wasn't the first by any means but had some ideas that many follow today. Having said that it seems the basis of his beliefs were often pretty out there and in part strange and often non scientific.

You could say he had some good big ideas but his building blocks were pretty shaky as per Yodsak's post. 

I guess you can give someone credit for having a good 'big idea' about farming but still note that many of the specifics of what he believed had, and still have, little scientific merit. Given he lived in the 20th century too, the excuse that science had not caught up may also not apply, and his reliance on astrology and other beliefs could be deemed to be lazy and ill informed.

[thaibeachlovers]

41 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

The scientists among us may not like this but if you are living in the dark ages or the stone age, say, it must be hard just to say 'I have no idea' and so you might build a theory of the world based on partly on testing and partly by patching other beliefs together so you can get some contentment.

I hope you are not claiming that science is now capable of determining whether or not God exists. When it comes to faith and spirituality, science might as well still be in the dark ages, IMO.

[Tagged]

13 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I hope you are not claiming that science is now capable of determining whether or not God exists. When it comes to faith and spirituality, science might as well still be in the dark ages, IMO.

You have to admit, comapare to what we do know about science so far, they have proven alot more about universal life than religion have or what we can prove about god? Unless every scientific proof is a proof of god? 

 

 

[Sunmaster]

2 minutes ago, Tagged said:

Unless every scientific proof is a proof of god? 

This is a very good question. 
The way I see it, it's exactly like that. If "God" is All There Is (which should be the inevitable logical conclusion for the definition of an ultimate GOD)...the Cosmic Consciousness...then everything you do within this system is also inevitably connected and related to this CC. 
Meaning, whatever science discovers about the way nature works, is then by definition a step closer to revealing "God", or better....revealing the material manifestations of the CC.

[mauGR1]

On 3/17/2021 at 7:40 AM, Fat is a type of crazy said:

You believe in God. You appear to recognise the life of an animal on a factory farm has a degree of cruelty to it. You probably recognise that animals have feelings, awareness, pleasure and pain. You justify it by saying you have to eat. I do something similar though I don't justify it and just try to eat animals treated a bit less cruelly at the margins. In that sense we are both without an ethical leg to stand on if you accept that animals don't want to be treated this way.  

What do you think god has to say? 'I made them tasty so get in for your chop' or  ' I created a world where animals roamed free and were eaten from time to time - you have used your free will to create an abomination of overeating and factory farms and cruelty'.  

If god doesn't care I wonder if it is a god worth following. 

A little common sense can be useful here.

Despite being vegetarian since my teens, I'd probably eat meat or fish if i had nothing else to eat.

The eskimos could not survive without eating meat, it's too cold up there. 

I am at the moment in the lucky situation that i can choose what to eat, so I'm not eating meat, but not everyone on this planet are so lucky. 

[mauGR1]

On 3/14/2021 at 4:33 AM, yodsak said:

Asimov was president of the American Humanist Association.  ‘’Good without a god’’ a non-profit organisation that advances secular humanism , a philosophy of life that, without theism or other supernatural beliefs, affirms the ability and responsibility of human beings to lead personal lives of ethical fulfilment that aspire to the greater good of humanity.

 Thanks to the inspiration of our friends in Britain, we've started our own atheist bus ad campaign in Washington DC     religion-advertising-atheism-bus    

There would be no humanism without Jesus' message of love and freedom imho. 

Trying to be a better person should suffice,  there's no need to campaign for atheism, as it serves no purpose, apart from signaling your unjustified hate for other people's beliefs. 

[mauGR1]

On 3/18/2021 at 11:10 AM, Sunmaster said:

This is a very good question. 
The way I see it, it's exactly like that. If "God" is All There Is (which should be the inevitable logical conclusion for the definition of an ultimate GOD)...the Cosmic Consciousness...then everything you do within this system is also inevitably connected and related to this CC. 
Meaning, whatever science discovers about the way nature works, is then by definition a step closer to revealing "God", or better....revealing the material manifestations of the CC.

Yep, science IS God , or CC, but, as usual, people get confused between "science " and "humans' interpretation of science ".

[Tagged]

51 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

There would be no humanism without Jesus' message of love and freedom imho. 

Trying to be a better person should suffice,  there's no need to campaign for atheism, as it serves no purpose, apart from signaling your unjustified hate for other people's beliefs. 

Common, that was a low kick to be you! Long time before Jesus, those kind of knownledge and messages started to flourish around the globe by many others before him and after him, and he just picked up the trend and with help from those time storytellers made them more known by magic and smoke 

Edited March 20, 2021 by Tagged

[mauGR1]

32 minutes ago, Tagged said:

Common, that was a low kick to be you! Long time before Jesus, those kind of knownledge and messages started to flourish around the globe by many others before him and after him, and he just picked up the trend and with help from those time storytellers made them more known by magic and smoke 

Well, if you want to think that way, it's your right. 

As I can see that you don't have a great opinion,  nor a bit of knowledge about Jesus and his words,  I'm not going to waste time discussing it.

"Forgive them, 'cause they don't know what they're doing"

[Fat is a type of crazy]

1 hour ago, mauGR1 said:

There would be no humanism without Jesus' message of love and freedom imho. 

Trying to be a better person should suffice,  there's no need to campaign for atheism, as it serves no purpose, apart from signaling your unjustified hate for other people's beliefs. 

I agree Jesus had a good message that few christians truly live by but I guess none of us are perfect. For what it is worth I find that lots of  christians and lots of atheists are good people. 

I don't think of atheists hating the religious. They  find themselves having to defend and build a case for their position. Less now than in the past. Try being atheist 100 years ago or 500 years ago.

Part of being a good person can be taking responsibility for yourself. Not relying on forgiveness of your sins. If you do bad you have to live with the consequences. Maybe that is really really hard because we all sin and it's a heavy weight to carry.

Atheists would feel hate can come from the religious and their reliance on the church and the good book to back up their arguments. 

I suppose religious people feel the opposite. They might feel atheists might take advantage of the unknowability of god to take cheap shots and be smart alecs.

 

[mauGR1]

5 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

I agree Jesus had a good message that few christians truly live by but I guess none of us are perfect. For what it is worth I find that lots of  christians and lots of atheists are good people. 

I don't think of atheists hating the religious. They  find themselves having to defend and build a case for their position. Less now than in the past. Try being atheist 100 years ago or 500 years ago.

Part of being a good person can be taking responsibility for yourself. Not relying on forgiveness of your sins. If you do bad you have to live with the consequences. Maybe that is really really hard because we all sin and it's a heavy weight to carry.

Atheists would feel hate can come from the religious and their reliance on the church and the good book to back up their arguments. 

I suppose religious people feel the opposite. They might feel atheists might take advantage of the unknowability of god to take cheap shots and be smart alecs.

 

I appreciate your common sense.

When I talked about hate of religion,  or christianity,  I was being a bit provocative. 

In fact, apart from the choice of words,  I am quite in agreement with your post, there are still lots of people posing as Christians, while being not Christians at all.

I hope you'll not be offended if I consider you a believer, as you seem to be honestly searching for the truth. 

[Tagged]

2 hours ago, mauGR1 said:

Well, if you want to think that way, it's your right. 

As I can see that you don't have a great opinion,  nor a bit of knowledge about Jesus and his words,  I'm not going to waste time discussing it.

"Forgive them, 'cause they don't know what they're doing"

You can not claim I do not have a great opinion, neither knownledge about the construction about jesus. You are kind of funny thow in your try, but ......

[Fat is a type of crazy]

19 hours ago, mauGR1 said:

I appreciate your common sense.

When I talked about hate of religion,  or christianity,  I was being a bit provocative. 

In fact, apart from the choice of words,  I am quite in agreement with your post, there are still lots of people posing as Christians, while being not Christians at all.

I hope you'll not be offended if I consider you a believer, as you seem to be honestly searching for the truth. 

Thanks. Not sure what I believe though. It's an interesting thing to consider in itself. 

[Tagged]

21 hours ago, mauGR1 said:

Yep, science IS God , or CC, but, as usual, people get confused between "science " and "humans' interpretation of science ".

You seems sonsure, but Im not sure you are as dure as you seems. 

Still the question is, how can anybody be sure what they believe, feel or see is a reality or the truth ? 

 

I prefer to leave it open but I can not deny my feelings, what I see or my experiences. Still it is an open question to most of us who is still sane in an beautiful insane world and universe.

 

Peace out

[sanuk711]

.

[yodsak]

On 3/17/2021 at 10:22 AM, Sunmaster said:

Hey, well done...another copy/paste effort from you. A superficial article from an unnamed "European Scientist" on top of that. ????

Thanks. The author was Jean-Charles Estoppey.  A link was provided. > biodynamics-a-very-strange-concept.  TES doesn't do superficial.

The European Scientist gives the floor to researchers and experts who wish to explain to our fellow citizens the ins and outs of the scientific debates taking place in Europe.  TES seeks to rise above the level of political speeches that are all too often biased or reductionist. Instead, we seek to bring hard science, research, and data to the fore in Europe's most heated debates over energy, environmental protection, agriculture, data, and public health.

.

These days biodynamic agriculture is often assumed to be a standard of excellence in agriculture or viticulture, although it widely misunderstood by the general public, who presume it to be a category of organic farming.

 

[thaibeachlovers]

On 3/20/2021 at 7:22 PM, Fat is a type of crazy said:

I agree Jesus had a good message that few christians truly live by but I guess none of us are perfect. For what it is worth I find that lots of  christians and lots of atheists are good people. 

I don't think of atheists hating the religious. They  find themselves having to defend and build a case for their position. Less now than in the past. Try being atheist 100 years ago or 500 years ago.

Part of being a good person can be taking responsibility for yourself. Not relying on forgiveness of your sins. If you do bad you have to live with the consequences. Maybe that is really really hard because we all sin and it's a heavy weight to carry.

Atheists would feel hate can come from the religious and their reliance on the church and the good book to back up their arguments. 

I suppose religious people feel the opposite. They might feel atheists might take advantage of the unknowability of god to take cheap shots and be smart alecs.

 

Once again I have to point out that faith is not the same as religion and believing in God does not necessarily make one religious.

Yes, one can be a good person and not believe in God, just as one can be religious and not be a good person, but faith is outside religion and being good or not.

IMO being religious does not change what one is, but believing in God does change one's outlook on life eg "I"do not end when my body dies.

[thaibeachlovers]

18 hours ago, sanuk711 said:

.

If Jesus was here now, he's have something unpleasant to say to the Pope about what they did with his message of salvation through belief and doing unto others etc.

IMO the Pope has little in common with the poor carpenter of Nazareth, and the organisation he heads has little to do with faith.

[Fat is a type of crazy]

36 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Once again I have to point out that faith is not the same as religion and believing in God does not necessarily make one religious.

Yes, one can be a good person and not believe in God, just as one can be religious and not be a good person, but faith is outside religion and being good or not.

IMO being religious does not change what one is, but believing in God does change one's outlook on life eg "I"do not end when my body dies.

This may have been discussed before but I feel that faith and being religious, as against being tied to a particular religion,  are fairly similar so I went to google. I guess faith can be solitary whereas being religious suggests being part of a group. You could be religious and just have your own religion and this is the same as faith. 

“Faith is personal and mysterious and individualistic and inexpressible and indefinable. Religion is merely the language that you can use to express what is fundamentally inexpressible, to define what is undefinable,”  says Reza Aslan.

You could say that you don't believe in one true path so faith is enough. But it could be that the decision not to follow a particular path is in itself a path and makes you religious - your own slightly vague religion. By definition if you believe in god then you believe there is a structure too it but you are just not sure what it is. So you are religious but you are just not sure how to define it in detail.  The statement 'There is a god' could be deemed religious as such.

 

 

[Tagged]

Halleluja, create your own meaning with life!? God sake, thats what I have been doing all my life so far and still do, as most do if not told something else they belive in. Anyway, respect for this man, he touch many themes with a delicate talk and understandable for most. 

 

 

https://web.facebook.com/watch/?v=1548911501963360&_rdc=1&_rdr

[thaibeachlovers]

8 hours ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

This may have been discussed before but I feel that faith and being religious, as against being tied to a particular religion,  are fairly similar so I went to google. I guess faith can be solitary whereas being religious suggests being part of a group. You could be religious and just have your own religion and this is the same as faith. 

“Faith is personal and mysterious and individualistic and inexpressible and indefinable. Religion is merely the language that you can use to express what is fundamentally inexpressible, to define what is undefinable,”  says Reza Aslan.

You could say that you don't believe in one true path so faith is enough. But it could be that the decision not to follow a particular path is in itself a path and makes you religious - your own slightly vague religion. By definition if you believe in god then you believe there is a structure too it but you are just not sure what it is. So you are religious but you are just not sure how to define it in detail.  The statement 'There is a god' could be deemed religious as such.

 

 

My understanding of "religion" is that it is an organisation with rules to follow to achieve salvation. Given every religion has different rules I don't believe any of them has the answer, so I go with faith which is something personal and unique to every individual with faith, IMO.

Eg, I don't believe that the creator of life the universe and everything cares whether I stand up, or sit down during a religious service, but the congregation do.

[mauGR1]

19 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Given every religion has different rules I don't believe any of them has the answer

I tend to agree with your post in general,  i believe any religion originally comes from revelations from the "spirit of nature", and they're initially supposed to be a tool to create harmony, but if we compare different religions,  and take out the differences,  what is left is probably very close to the truth. 

Something like, "what is unfair to you,  it's unfair to others" or "don't wish to others what you don't wish to yourself ".

[ivor bigun]

I dont believe there is a God ,but it amazes me that two religions that actually believe in him and his prophet,see them and him in such different ways ,Christians aresupposed to be all about love and peace and you dont see a lot of them killing and bombing people ,while the Muslims seem to see him as a vengfull sort of a guy ,or so it seems from what we constantly see in the papers day after day after day ,now what about the Jews who actually invented him?