British Labour leader Corbyn set to back second Brexit referendum - report

[sanemax]

5 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

You’re right that you don’t know the legal rules.  

 

 

Yes, I did state that myself , there is no need for you to confirm that 

[sammieuk1]

Lucky he didn't fall on a rabbi from that fence he's been sitting on for the last 3 years ????

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, sanemax said:

I do take personal responsibilities for my own actions , I am not a "blame everyone else" kind of guy , but it is the UK Goverments job to implement the will of the people .

Except it’s not ‘the will of the people’.

 

At the time of the referendum the result was 37% of the electorate voted Leave.

 

Every indication is that support for Brexit is fading.

 

37% is not ‘the will of the people’.

 

Not by a long way, and getting longer.

[Loiner]

1 hour ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

You’re right that you don’t know the legal rules. They only need to take the result into consideration. It’s advisory only, and therefore not necessarily pointless. 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Referendums can only be advisory in the UK. The Supreme Court have confirmed that. 

 

A government and parliament can take that advice on board, if they wish, but have to decide what to do about it.

 

Parliament, not the government, is sovereign and must decide.

Only advisory, schmisery. You are still flogging another dead Remainer horse. The referendum was three years ago and we have had legislation passed through Parliament since then to ensure we Leave the EU:

 

1)      European Union (Notification of Withdrawal) Act 2017

The Article 50 process start was delayed by Theresa May (and Gina Miller etc), but Parliament agreed we then had 2 years to Exit

2)      European Union (Withdrawal) Act 2018

Legislated for our Exit and confirmed the date by 29^th March 2019, No more Parliament decision is necessary, despite two extensions.

3)      European Union (Withdrawal Agreement) Bill 2017–19

Merkel/May Surrender Treaty was kicked out three times already by both Remainers and Leavers. We are currently still stuck here, waiting to Exit without this trick pre-deal deal.

[sanemax]

33 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Except it’s not ‘the will of the people’.

 

At the time of the referendum the result was 37% of the electorate voted Leave.

 

Every indication is that support for Brexit is fading.

 

37% is not ‘the will of the people’.

 

Not by a long way, and getting longer.

Lets not get back to the basics .

Votes are counted on the basis of the number who voted and NOT the amount of people able to vote (and who didnt vote)

  Lets not get the discussion down to the simple level 

[dick dasterdly]

3 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

 

"True. Whose fault was that?"

 

Politicians and remainers.  It certainly wasn't the fault of those who voted or support leave.

 

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Yep, Brexit through and through.

 

It’s always somebody else’s fault.

 

 

Taking responsibility for backing a pipe dream with no plan attached,  o way is that accepable.

Please try to argue the point made, not the poster.

 

And, FWIW, I was on the fence until after the referendum result was announced and the result ignored.

[tebee]

24 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

 

Please try to argue the point made, not the poster.

 

And, FWIW, I was on the fence until after the referendum result was announced and the result ignored.

The result is not being ignored, just no one knows how to implement it. TM tried, but no one like her solution. Her view of what leave meant is not others and it appears  no other version of leave has sufficient support either.

 

So how do we leave when we can not agree what leave means ? 

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, sanemax said:

Lets not get back to the basics .

Votes are counted on the basis of the number who voted and NOT the amount of people able to vote (and who didnt vote)

  Lets not get the discussion down to the simple level 

Agreed, and votes not cast are not counted as ‘the will of the people’.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, dick dasterdly said:

 

Please try to argue the point made, not the poster.

 

And, FWIW, I was on the fence until after the referendum result was announced and the result ignored.

And now you got off the fence and blame this mess on anybody but those who voted for it.

[soalbundy]

10 hours ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Good news. This will make Brexiteers go nuts again. I can already hear them

moan “betrayal” and post a collage of Internet memes. 

Yes unfortunately Brexit is getting boring now, like a Thai soap opera, it was funny in the beginning but now all the juice has gone.

[evadgib]

1 hour ago, dick dasterdly said:

 

Please try to argue the point made, not the poster.

 

And, FWIW, I was on the fence until after the referendum result was announced and the result ignored.

I had never heard of Farage until he fell out of a helicopter and didn't pick up this 'Brexiter' baton until forced into it by the Recruiting Sergeants loitering in these pages.

After the results of last week it's clear I wasn't alone.

Thank you Team Remain! 

Edited May 29, 2019 by evadgib

[geoffbezoz]

1 minute ago, soalbundy said:

Yes unfortunately Brexit is getting boring now, like a Thai soap opera, it was funny in the beginning but now all the juice has gone.

And just as a Thai soap, completely rubbish

[evadgib]

48 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

And now you got off the fence and blame this mess on anybody but those who voted for it.

Interesting, given some who might have voted were disenfranchised by the '15 year' Malarky while others (that were never eligible in the first place) are deliberately creating an illusion to the contrary...

Edited May 29, 2019 by evadgib

[Basil B]

2 hours ago, Loiner said:

 

Only advisory, schmisery. You are still flogging another dead Remainer horse. The referendum was three years ago and we have had legislation passed through Parliament since then to ensure we Leave the EU:

 

1)      European Union (Notification of Withdrawal) Act 2017

The Article 50 process start was delayed by Theresa May (and Gina Miller etc), but Parliament agreed we then had 2 years to Exit

2)      European Union (Withdrawal) Act 2018

Legislated for our Exit and confirmed the date by 29^th March 2019, No more Parliament decision is necessary, despite two extensions.

3)      European Union (Withdrawal Agreement) Bill 2017–19

Merkel/May Surrender Treaty was kicked out three times already by both Remainers and Leavers. We are currently still stuck here, waiting to Exit without this trick pre-deal deal.

Get your Brexit blinkers off...

 

It is Brexit horse the is dead with Corbyn still trying to ride it. 

[Loiner]

17 minutes ago, Basil B said:

Get your Brexit blinkers off...

 

It is Brexit horse the is dead with Corbyn still trying to ride it. 

You've only got to focus on where we are with the legislation. The referendum is done and won. Almost three years ago now, and the result was to Leave. Remainers have still not managed to kill off the Leave result, or the all important subsequent legislation.

Despite other runners and riders falling by the wayside, the Leave horse fortunately is slowly trotting towards No Deal!

[evadgib]

10 minutes ago, Loiner said:

You've only got to focus on where we are with the legislation. The referendum is done and won. Almost three years ago now, and the result was to Leave. Remainers have still not managed to kill off the Leave result, or the all important subsequent legislation.

Despite other runners and riders falling by the wayside, the Leave horse fortunately is slowly trotting towards No Deal!

I have to agree, but sometimes it feels like...

thanks to the likes of Bercow & co.

[Basil B]

37 minutes ago, Loiner said:

You've only got to focus on where we are with the legislation. The referendum is done and won. Almost three years ago now, and the result was to Leave. Remainers have still not managed to kill off the Leave result, or the all important subsequent legislation.

Despite other runners and riders falling by the wayside, the Leave horse fortunately is slowly trotting towards No Deal!

400-160 said no to no deal.

Edited May 29, 2019 by Basil B

[tebee]

2 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

 

Please try to argue the point made, not the poster.

 

And, FWIW, I was on the fence until after the referendum result was announced and the result ignored.

Brexit isn't pizza. You can no more "deliver" Brexit than you can world peace.

Brexit is like a muddy field that stretches over the horizon. It will bog politicians down for generations, while the UK keeps on crumbling.

[sanemax]

5 minutes ago, tebee said:

Brexit isn't pizza. You can no more "deliver" Brexit than you can world peace.

Brexit is like a muddy field that stretches over the horizon. It will bog politicians down for generations, while the UK keeps on crumbling.

We spent five years fighting in Europe in WW2 , this current campaign has only been going on for 3 years now

[Loiner]

19 minutes ago, Basil B said:

400-160 said no to no deal.

Only indicative therefore not important.

The Withdrawal Act is still the law and doesn't need a deal.

[welovesundaysatspace]

4 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Only indicative therefore not important.

The Withdrawal Act is still the law and doesn't need a deal.

But do you really believe there exists a PM candidate who would actually take over the responsibility and put his name under a no-deal Brexit (and who would be voted in)? Unless most Brexiteers, those guys have something to lose. I would actually bet some money on this and donate it should I be wrong (I’m sure there would be a development fund to rebuild the UK after a no-deal suicide). 

[aright]

6 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

But do you really believe there exists a PM candidate who would actually take over the responsibility and put his name under a no-deal Brexit (and who would be voted in)? Unless most Brexiteers, those guys have something to lose. I would actually bet some money on this and donate it should I be wrong (I’m sure there would be a development fund to rebuild the UK after a no-deal suicide). 

It doesn't have to be a PM candidate. If a deal has not been cobbled together and approved by October 31st Mr Macron will make the decision for us, because he has said he will not approve an extension and therefore we will be leaving with no deal.

[dunroaming]

12 hours ago, Thailand said:

Sadly today it's a vote winner and with the current turmoil in British politics a general election is a great possibility later this year and this turd could be in number 10.

No way the Tories will call a  general election.  They know that would be the end for them.  As Hunt has said parliament will not let a no-deal Brexit through and that would trigger a GE.  That really scares the Conservatives and makes Johnson less likely unless he changes tack completely.  Of course with Boris that is very possible.

 

Corbyn has no choice but to back a second referendum as he tries to stop Labour losing even more ground.  The panic in the main two parties is astonishing and I have to say somewhat pleasing.  It is time for them to radically change their arrogant stance.  Neither party cares a jot about the country, only what benefits them.

[welovesundaysatspace]

10 minutes ago, aright said:

It doesn't have to be a PM candidate. If a deal has not been cobbled together and approved by October 31st Mr Macron will make the decision for us, because he has said he will not approve an extension and therefore we will be leaving with no deal.

Macron blocking an extension is even less likely than finding a PM candidate who will put his name under a no-deal Brexit. 

[aright]

51 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Macron blocking an extension is even less likely than finding a PM candidate who will put his name under a no-deal Brexit. 

Macron wants to avoid Brexit 'polluting' EU after 31 October

Macron added: “That’s why I spoke. But I did not try to act alone. If I had wanted, the French veto would have been enough to block unanimity. We have, with [the Belgian prime minister] Charles Michel and Chancellor Merkel in particular, built a consensus around 31 October, that is to say before the establishment of the new [European] commission, to prevent the next mandate being polluted by this subject we’ve been talking about for three years.”...……….

The EU’s leaders could be faced with the question of whether to extend the UK’s membership of the bloc once again in the autumn, but there are growing concerns that UK MEPs’ presence in the European elections will undermine its credibility as an EU institution.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/may/22/macron-wants-to-avoid-brexit-polluting-eu-after-31-october

[vogie]

10 hours ago, stephenterry said:

Before making a statement that has been skewed by the media and by polarised MPs e.g. ERG and DUP, have you read May's deal so that you can come to an independent opinion on the veracity of it?

 

Bearing in mind, the last parliament vote on her deal was pretty close, so the term 'nobody in the country wants' is untrue.  

Sorry for the late reply, we have journeyed to Rangsit for a bereavement on my wifes side.

 

The only reason the vote was so close is that nobody wanted to go through the rigmarole of an EU election, that went well didn't it. 

If ThaiVisa is anything to go by, remainers and leavers are hardly jubilant about Mays deal, it's time to regroup, rethink and back onto the offensive, not long to go now before we crash out.

[CG1 Blue]

10 hours ago, BobBKK said:

Votes are not forever. Things change. We have many votes on all sorts of things and are happy to re-vote after a few years. That's why we have general elections too. Three years of no Brexit and no deal by the party that promised to deliver it?  RE-VOTE you are a democrat after all right?

Yes we do have votes on all sorts of things, and we re-vote AFTER those things have been implemented. 

If we didn't have remainers putting a spoke in the wheel at every opportunity we would have left the EU by now, and THEN we could have had a 2nd referendum a few years down the line. 

[CG1 Blue]

7 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Except it’s not ‘the will of the people’.

 

At the time of the referendum the result was 37% of the electorate voted Leave.

 

Every indication is that support for Brexit is fading.

 

37% is not ‘the will of the people’.

 

Not by a long way, and getting longer.

"Every indication is that support for Brexit is fading."

Do you actually believe this? Did you know that the Brexit Party easily won in the UK EU elctions, and that they became the biggest single individual party in the European Parliament just a few days ago? 

 

Last night I reluctantly started watching Storyville: Brexit Behind Closed Doors. This two part documentary follows Brexit from the the Brussels side. It is a Belgian reporter filming the Brexit discussions in Brussels, focusing mainly on Guy Verhofstadt.  Verhofstadt, the former Belgian PM who advocates a federal Europe. He talks of a federal Europe having the ability to fight the threat from the USA and from Russia. 

 

I know you are  Belgian Mr Higgot, so I get why you have a similar mindset (i.e. you need to be in a big gang because you're a relatively small / weak country). And it must be nice for you having the EU Parliament on the doorstep, and all the attention and revenue this creates for little Belgium. 

 

Anyway, I had some sneaking admiration of GV's style (direct, outspoken, honest etc.), and he's a very interesting character. But the arrogance and contempt he and his EU colleagues display towards the UK is quite shocking. I'm sure if this documentary was watched by more Brits the numbers would be more like 90/10 in favour of leave. 

 

The saddest thing I realised is that if the UK continues to send meek UK politicians to Brussels to negotiate (e.g. like May/Robbins), we'll never get anywhere. The UK team should be lead by a strong leader, and complimented by successful British business leaders. 

 

 

[Loiner]

3 hours ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

But do you really believe there exists a PM candidate who would actually take over the responsibility and put his name under a no-deal Brexit (and who would be voted in)? Unless most Brexiteers, those guys have something to lose. I would actually bet some money on this and donate it should I be wrong (I’m sure there would be a development fund to rebuild the UK after a no-deal suicide). 

Yes, I do. It could still be Boris or Raab. The EU are already worried about the Merkel/May Surrender Treaty being torn up next week and rumours have already started about them offering another extension. Simply standing up to the EU would earn such a PM kudos around the world and a place in history. Delivering a clean Brexit then making them all have it with a successful economy, would probably result in a statue in Trafalgar Square. 
The only suicide so far is Theresa's, but there will be many more Remainers who have to take the jump (or be pushed) now their political deceit is known.

The UK will do just fine without them, and the EU, thanks.

[Thairealist]

12 hours ago, bristolboy said:

I guess if you repeat a lie long enough some will believe it. A big majority of Labour voters support remain. The only nonsensical evidence purveyors of the falsehood provide is that Corbyn supports, (or supported) leave. Every poll, without exception, proves that's the case. And you don't even need the polls to establish that. There is no way that over 60% of labour voters could support Brexit if the referendum was 52-48. It takes either massive gullibility or a complete inability to cope with basic maths to believe otherwise.

 

What makes your assertion even more nonsensical is that were it true, you would have to believe that Corbyn wants to commit electoral suicide by supporting another referendum. 

 

 In London I would agree with you,that the majority of Labour voters are for remain. However that is not the case in England and Wales. Where the vast majority,especially if you take away the traditional loyalty factor,are for leave.