Immigration busy fining Thais and foreigners - US man pays 5,000 baht fine for not doing 90 day report

[ianezy0]

3 hours ago, oobar said:

"Life is short. Be sure to spend as much time as possible arguing on the internet with random strangers"

 

Good to see SammyT is following his mantra.

I think we should all meet in a huge hall and have a cold beer together and discuss immigration issues. I will arrange a raised square podium with a rope around in the corner ????

[trainman34014]

7 hours ago, ThomasThBKK said:

Because he would have to report another tm30 after coming back from the hotel. If not they fine you, and they collect it from you even tho your landlord doesn't report.

According to the boss of Chiang Mai Immigration there is no need to do TM30 if you are 'away' inside Thailand, it only applies when you return to the country from abroad.    We go away regularly inside the country and i've never once been fined in many years !

Edited June 13, 2019 by trainman34014

[rexall]

2 hours ago, Fairynuff said:

I’ve never done a 90 day report, I’ve never done a TM30. I never stay in the country long enough to do 90DR. In fact I’m rarely here more than 6 weeks. The prospect of endless TM30s or paying fines just because I travel both in and outside of the country isn’t very appealing. I may well listen to the fools whose first response will be “if you don’t like it go home”. This has been home for many years but it’s starting to feel like I’m an intruder in someone else’s home, or perhaps I always was.

Of course you always were an "intruder." Aside from the reporting requirements discussed on 16 pages here,  no matter how long you live in Thailand, how many Thai spouses you have, no matter how many Thai children you have and support, you will never be a citizen.  Becoming a permanent resident is possible, but hardly worth the bother. You will never own more than 49% of a business and will be required to have a work permit if you perform any work for your own company. You will never own property except a condo with 51% Thai ownership of the building. If you are employed, your work permit "marries" you to that one employer.  All of us here make our peace with that to one degree or another, or we leave. 

However, if you didn't mention that you were talking about Thailand, and described what I have just outlined to someone shopping around for a place to live or retire, I doubt that you would make any sales!  Understandably so!

[CGW]

8 hours ago, brokenbone said:

why not electronic ankle bracelet monitor to go with any kind of visa ?

Why not indeed, the next step will be chip implants - for your own safety off course - watch this space. 

[rexall]

2 hours ago, moto77 said:

Meh, just run. 

No one has come to track me down and drag me back yet, mate. 

Of course you both realize that slaves need work permits, dontcha?

[ianezy0]

2 hours ago, Gecko123 said:

I don't know anyone who has ever expected to be treated like a king from immigration. I just don't like being treated like a runaway slave. Is that OK with you?

Be quiet and put your chains back on ya ankles!

[rexall]

1 hour ago, nikov said:

I would opt in paying 5,000 baht every three months instead of wasting my time with reporting. Too bad one can't tell if there will be other consequences than the fine. Eg. more difficult to apply for a permanent residency.

I dunno.  However, technically speaking, the purpose of fines is to deter you from breaking the law. I don't think is is an option--at least not in principle--to pay the fine instead of complying with the regulations.

[ThomasThBKK]

21 minutes ago, trainman34014 said:

According to the boss of Chiang Mai Immigration there is no need to do TM30 if you are 'away' inside Thailand, it only applies when you return to the country from abroad.    We go away regularly inside the country and i've never once been fined in many years !

Just made up stuff. Section 38 Immigration act from 1979 says otherwise.

Has a reasons hotels are doing tm30s when you arrive, no matter if you live in TH or not.

 

Local offices as always do what they do, here in BKK till last year they refused to even take tm30s.

Edited June 13, 2019 by ThomasThBKK

[IAMHERE]

Didn't do the 90 day report. How the heck did they track him down then?

[ravip]

1 hour ago, Stoker58 said:

 Naive? After 12 years living here there’s not much I don’t know about this s***hole. The only reason I’m still here at all is to please my wife, who likes to be near her children and grandchildren.

To be forced to live in a s***hole? Unbelievable!

My deepest sympathies to you. You seem disturbed due to circumstances.

[SammyT]

1 hour ago, Golden Triangle said:

Lucky you, yes it only takes you an hour once every 3 months, it doesn't take me that long as I am close to my immigration office, but I have friends that have to take the best part of a day to do the 90 Day report, it also costs in fuel & wear and tear on their vehicles, one friend was very unlucky and got rear ended at a set of lights one time.

 

He can't do 90 days online as he has no idea about the internet and stuff like that.

 

And anyway, the 90 days and TM30 are archaic and outdated, lastly, stop being another Thai apologist like others on here, my Thai daughter in law works in the UK, never has this shit to deal with. When will you idiots wake up !!

Using wear and tear on a vehicle and an accident that could have happened at any time doing anything other than a 90 day check in doesnt lend any weight to your argument, FYI. 

 

You're just another one who resorts to calling someone who has a different opinion to you a Thai apologist who see. Gold star for debating skills for you 

[madmen]

6 minutes ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

I wonder how Thais would feel, having to report every 90 days in the US, Australia or the UK even if they are there on valid visas. Better yet, I wonder how they would feel about reporting their whereabouts every time they stayed somewhere different?

 

I'm willing to bet there would be a lot of complaints and accusations of discrimination.

 

And they'd be right.

Australia will make you jump through endless hoops and then deny your GF even a tourist visa since Most gfs have a dodgy history. Lets keep it real shall we?

[greeneking]

1 hour ago, ravip said:

What exactly are these "harassment akin to a police state" that you are mentioning about?

Immigration told my wife the 90 day report is so they can check I am not mafia.

[hanuman2543]

7 hours ago, SammyT said:

I don't think you understand the true definition of a police state. I've been able to live my life hassle and worry free, throughout all coups and martial law. 

Try to voice your opinion about sensitive topics here and expect charges of defamation,  libel and slander and violation of the CCC and maybe TPC section 112 or 115. Let us know which jail you will be staying for the next 10-20 years.

[luckyluke]

2 hours ago, evadgib said:

I'm saying that your Income wasn't verified other than by your say so + whatever evidence you supplied in support.

Indeed, and pleased I am, that for 15 years now, each immigration officer I dealt with, was satisfied with the Letter of Income.

 

No any other supporting document was ever asked. 

 

But I will have to see next year. 

[Stoker58]

1 hour ago, marcusarelus said:

If you refer to Thailand as a, "s***hole" I think you know very little about the country.  I know hundreds of Pinoys, Cambodians, Burmese, Laotians, Australians and Brits who are trying desperately to stay here instead of going home.   Perhaps they know much that you don't.  Just a thought to consider.  

You don’t have a clue, do you? All you have seen is the surface. I have seen the whole society.

[Saltire]

This could be interesting. In January after a trip abroad i reported to my IO and lodged a TM30. I specifically asked if this was needed for trips in and around Thailand and was told no, not necessary, just overseas.

 

Very recently in a Facebook forum, a member who uses the same immigration office as me posted that now they need a TM30 for trips to other provinces as well. They also told him not to use the online system (even though they are very good at managing the online 90 day reports).

 

Since January I have been a few places, the last being a holiday break to Hua Hin, and now I am wondering if when i next do a TM30 and lodge my new TM6 on 10th July when I get back to Thailand, will it show up as still registered to the last hotel I stayed in? If so I will argue (politely!) that I was told otherwise in January, but who knows if it will hold up. Let's see. If all is ok I will ask them again! 

 

Incidentally I see a few folks complain they live 20 Km from their local office. I am 160 Km each way - is this a record?

 

???? 

[marcusarelus]

31 minutes ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

I wonder how Thais would feel, having to report every 90 days in the US, Australia or the UK even if they are there on valid visas. Better yet, I wonder how they would feel about reporting their whereabouts every time they stayed somewhere different?

 

I'm willing to bet there would be a lot of complaints and accusations of discrimination.

 

And they'd be right.

Do you tell hotels in Europe that they can't have your passport when you check in?  I imagine you are on some kind of tourist visa.  In America after 90 days you have to leave.  Thailand you only have to check in online or have your secretary do it for you.  I think the visa rules here are quite liberal that and the low prices are the reason so many retire here.  

[Stoker58]

43 minutes ago, ravip said:

To be forced to live in a s***hole? Unbelievable!

My deepest sympathies to you. You seem disturbed due to circumstances.

No, I just know a lot more about the country than you do.

[marcusarelus]

2 minutes ago, Stoker58 said:

You don’t have a clue, do you? All you have seen is the surface. I have seen the whole society.

I got here in 1968.  I have worked inside and outside of the Thai government and military.  I have a Thai wife and family and we are all happy.  You?  

[SammyT]

14 minutes ago, Stoker58 said:

You don’t have a clue, do you? All you have seen is the surface. I have seen the whole society.

I reckon of all the demographics I've met in Thailand, the "I've seen all of thai society and you're pretty much just a tourist who stayed too long" like yourself are easily the most obnoxious. 

[Skallywag]

Wow, 260 posts in 10 hours...just got here to page 18.  

Could miss my 90 day by chance as I tend to linger in places and lose track of time ???? 55

Maybe use this computer am typing on and try the online method...

 

Edited June 13, 2019 by Skallywag

[bontang]

10 hours ago, SammyT said:

Do your 90 day check in then, like the rest of us do. It's not rocket science. It's not even particularly hard.  

Easy as A B C I did my 90 report yesterday @JomtienYesterday. Arrived there @ 1.45pm & back in my Truck 1.55pm 5 days early & traveled back to Indonesia this morning Immigration @ Swampy were very pleased due to I follow the Rules, 

 

[Mansell]

At the rate the noose is closing I think we may be the last generation living here. Just a thought.

[GeorgeCross]

3 hours ago, evadgib said:

No they didn't.

 

well last i checked there are 195 countries in the world and so far only 4 refuse to issue income affidavits.

 

so do you want me to do the maths or would you like to borrow my calculator?

 

edit: haha just realized thailand is one of the countries so i guess i was wrong..

 

190 managed it.

 

there ya go feel better now?!

 

 

Edited June 13, 2019 by GeorgeCross

[stanleycoin]

13 minutes ago, bontang said:

Easy as A B C I did my 90 report yesterday @JomtienYesterday. Arrived there @ 1.45pm & back in my Truck 1.55pm 5 days early & traveled back to Indonesia this morning Immigration @ Swampy were very pleased due to I follow the Rules, 

 

What !!!!!!!!!!!

Why did you do 90 day report when you were leaving one day latter !!!!!!!

or am i reading your post wrong ?

 

 

Edited June 13, 2019 by stanleycoin

[BuckBee]

Milking of the last white buffalo . most are staying out of thailands pastures these days by looks of usual venues .

TM30 can be a right pain as relying on landlords and hotels can mean you mess up your extensions and it not always that easy resolve pending on helpfulness of those involved .
Should of been made far more simple, I don't want be registering TM30 for every thai friend or relatives house I may stay at for few days.

Before songkran I was at relatives house in bangkok 3 days then went chachoengsao 2 days and so forth, so in about 10 days had been at multiple addresses and to organise docs and visit officials around public hol times is next to impossible .
I don't think it that bad idea have us declare where we are but docs to support it need be easy obtain and it need easy online registration and responsible use of fines, at moment it just exploited as cash cow for disgruntled immigration offices because the extra work and chaos causing bad feelings for all parties ...

 

[thainet]

11 minutes ago, bontang said:

Easy as A B C I did my 90 report yesterday @JomtienYesterday. Arrived there @ 1.45pm & back in my Truck 1.55pm 5 days early & traveled back to Indonesia this morning Immigration @ Swampy were very pleased due to I follow the Rules, 

 

Actually I beat you by 3 minutes today..out of car, 90 day desk and back in car in 2 1/2 minutes..fookin amazing.

But very curious why Swampy immigration were pleased that you had done your 90 day report?  Swampy only has an interest on your current status, and/or overstay. 

Please explain.

 

[zhangxifu]

9 hours ago, Gecko123 said:

It's not the 90 day report alone. It's that Thailand hasn't figured out that maybe there's an easier and more convenient way to establish where someone lives, especially when you've been living in the same damned house for the last 20 years. It's also that foreigners are the ones that are being forced to make the "landlord" comply with the TM-30 report, and that this report has to be refiled everytime you stay overnight in another province. Again, it is the foreigner who most often is being fined if the report is not properly filed, not the landlord. It's also highly aggravating because the 90 day report and TM-30 (both of which are intended to establish where a foreigner is living) are totally redundant forms. One is filed by the foreigner, the other (supposedly filed by a Thai landlord, but more often than not filed by the foreigner as well) is supposed to "confirm" the accuracy of the 90 day report. Because the 90 day report follows a 90 day interval after you enter the country or since your last 90 day report, and the TM-30 report has to be filed within 24 hours of entering the country or following an overnight stay in another province, the filing of these two reports follow separate time tables, and can necessitate incessant reporting to immigration if you travel frequently. Instead of designing a reasonable reporting program which is easy to understand and comply with, immigration has this totally inefficient (not just for foreigners, but for immigration officers) system which is exhausting to comply with, inhibits travel, and results in poor compliance. This poor compliance has provided plenty of opportunities for levying fines and penalties, which unfortunately is why there appears to be little incentive to simplify the system.

Can you please name the Immigration Office that today requires new TM30 "following an overnight stay in another province"? This has been asked at Immigration Offices around the country over and over again and they always instruct new TM30 needed only if new TM6, new entry to this country, not travel within the country. 

[ThomasThBKK]

10 minutes ago, zhangxifu said:

Can you please name the Immigration Office that today requires new TM30 "following an overnight stay in another province"? This has been asked at Immigration Offices around the country over and over again and they always instruct new TM30 needed only if new TM6, new entry to this country, not travel within the country. 

bangkok....

and everthing else that follows section 38.

 

If it had anything todo with the TM6 then hotels wouldn't need todo TM30 too... Doesn't matter if you stay in a hotel or private home, they want to know where you are.