Lighting of Fires In Residential Areas

[haymanpl]

Is it legal to light fires and burn off in residential areas?

 

There's a lot of development of villas in my area and they burn off waste on a regular basis, normally on weekends creating toxic smoke.

 

I spoke to my doctor about this and he told me its illegal however the police don't enforce the law if you make a complaint.

[CharlieH]

Well if they don't/wont enforce the law, what you gonna do ? 

Your next option is to call the hotline and ask them what's next.

 

NCPO Thai government. 24 hour Call Center 1111 http://www.1111.go.th/

They deal with any and all complaints related to anything and everything.

 

[VocalNeal]

OP. You are no longer living in Kansas. Get used to it.

[sammieuk1]

Suppose you could go out at the weekends and breath easy for 5 days at home unlike the burning season in CM where you choke to death wherever you go????

[KhunBENQ]

3 hours ago, VocalNeal said:

Get used to it.

Unfortunately the one and only answer.

Here in the rural village it is unavoidable.

At the temple every afternoon they sweep the ground and burn.

Call police to the temple? OH NO.

Call yourself happy if the neighbors only burn leafs, scrub or wood and not add all their plastic waste.

 

[canopy]

There have been reports of good things happening when calling the 1111 hot line which is for english speakers in precisely such conditions. People who do nothing in the face of having their rights trampled on are cowards. Why don't you give them a call and tell what happens.

 

Edited June 29, 2019 by canopy

[cooked]

The village boss lady officially announced that we were NOT to take rubbish (in our case mostly plastic) to the neighbouring towns to put into bins there. Solution? Burn it. That's what she said.

Since then I have seen increased amounts of rubbish dumped by the roadside between here and the town, there are "no dumping" signs all along the road.. There is still one place (before there were 5 or 6) in Buriram where we can dump our sacks more or less legally, I am expecting that to disappear soon. Maybe I'll start dumping it in the boss lady's garden, I notice that she doesn't do any burning.

[VocalNeal]

1 hour ago, canopy said:

People who do nothing in the face of having their rights trampled on.......

 

...and the rights of the people to burn their waste as they see fit? 

 

For instance in Nova Scotia Canada burning is allowed between 2pm and 8 am the next day Except in dry fire hazard periods declared by the provincial government when the times change.

In the UK There are no laws against having a bonfire, but there are laws for the nuisance they can cause. Your council can issue an ‘abatement notice’ if a neighbour’s bonfire is causing a nuisance. A bonfire must happen frequently to be considered a nuisance.

 

Quote

A bonfire can be an environmentally sound way of getting rid of garden material. Of course it’s better to compost vegetative waste where you can, but as long your fire is carefully planned the result is carbon-neutral waste disposal, which isn’t something that can be said of hauling it to the tip in your car.

Bonfires can be great fun too and bonfires in the autumn are especially good; my childhood memory is full of crisp, cold autumnal days, smoky bonfires, and mugs of hot chocolate cradled in hands made dirty by hauling branches and wood and leaves for my grandparents; even now, my first thought whenever I smell a bonfire is of my grandfather.

Burning stuff is an existential pleasure that takes us back to our prehistoric roots and should be a guilt-free pleasure that everyone should be free to enjoy. Here is our guide to how to stoke a fire in your own garden with a clear conscience......

 

There are countries/states with more draconian laws but.....Plus language skills prevented me from doing a more comprehensive search

 

I would be interested to see , as a visitor in this country, exactly what so called rights you think you have.

Edited June 30, 2019 by VocalNeal

[canopy]

1 hour ago, cooked said:

The village boss lady officially announced that we were NOT to take rubbish (in our case mostly plastic) to the neighbouring towns to put into bins there.

 

A village boss is nothing more than an ordinary woman with a loudspeaker. What comes into her head has no more legal merit than the village drunk. She cannot force you or anyone to break the law. If you care to, report what she said to the pollution control department or call the hotline.

 

[canopy]

1 hour ago, VocalNeal said:

I would be interested to see , as a visitor in this country, exactly what so called rights you think you have.

 

In 2015 the Thai government launched the 1111 hotline to receive complaints from foreigners. That is a fact and it's an awesome resource to have. I am sorry that is just sour grapes to your ears. It has worked for many and it can work for you. If someone is breaking the law and it is a bother, I can't imagine not wanting to use this excellent facility designed for foreigners and you can speak in English and they then take care of it all for you. And it is 100% free to use!

 

Edited June 30, 2019 by canopy

[jackdd]

15 minutes ago, canopy said:

A village boss is nothing more than an ordinary woman with a loudspeaker. What comes into her head has no more legal merit than the village drunk. She cannot force you or anyone to break the law. If you care to, report what she said to the pollution control department or call the hotline.

Dumping the trash in the in the neighbouring village, just because they decided to pay for having their trash picked up, is probably also breaking some law, so even the village drunk could ask people to stop doing it.

[VocalNeal]

19 minutes ago, canopy said:

n 2015 the Thai government launched the 1111 hotline to receive complaints from foreigners. That is a fact and it's an awesome resource to have. I am sorry that is just sour grapes to your ears.

Not sour grapes at all. Just that something should be worthy of being reported. Not simply a dislike by some whinging farang.

 

In some ways this thread just goes to show that there are some people who are simply not happy wherever they are.

Edited June 30, 2019 by VocalNeal

[cooked]

20 minutes ago, jackdd said:

Dumping the trash in the in the neighbouring village, just because they decided to pay for having their trash picked up, is probably also breaking some law, so even the village drunk could ask people to stop doing it.

 

39 minutes ago, canopy said:

 

A village boss is nothing more than an ordinary woman with a loudspeaker. What comes into her head has no more legal merit than the village drunk. She cannot force you or anyone to break the law. If you care to, report what she said to the pollution control department or call the hotline.

 

I know for a fact that this is official policy in the area, not just something that came into her head.

So I bribe the pollution police to come along, what happens then? Tell the whole Amphur that they were wrong to declare this and it's because of that farang who lives over the road from the boss lady?

The point is that no long term strategy is in place as in most of Thailand and why should we do something when the neighbours would start dumping their stuff in our Tambon?

[canopy]

I am against illegally burning trash, dumping trash illegally, or putting trash in other people's private bins. If there is no trash pickup in your area (like mine) there are public dumpsters in Thailand. They may be far off, but you are free to use them. In my area it is the temples that most commonly provide them.

 

But I can't disagree with the tone of the responses. Everyone in the villages burns, litters, dumps their garbage along the roads and in waterways on a regular basis and no one complains and it is even advocated by the village bosses. It's just one big happy family of filth. What should you do? Is it really right to force everyone to follow Thai laws no one cares about even if it would improve their health, life expectancy, and the environment? Good question. I do my thing and let them do theirs except if someone were to burn toxic smoke and ruin my health like is happening to the OP they can be sure it would not go unnoticed and if they don't like it then that's their problem not mine. Thailand is concerned about you and will enforce their laws. All you need to do is dial 1111.

 

[VocalNeal]

54 minutes ago, canopy said:

I am against illegally burning trash,

Is it illegal? Can you tell us the statute or whatever?

 

Or is it that you believe it is illegal because nobody told you it is legal.

Some governments tell citizens what they cannot do. Others live in countries where you are told only what you can do.

There is a difference. 

[VocalNeal]

1 hour ago, canopy said:

there are public dumpsters in Thailand. They may be far off, but you are free to use them.

 

3 hours ago, VocalNeal said:

but as long your fire is carefully planned the result is carbon-neutral waste disposal, which isn’t something that can be said of hauling it to the tip in your car.

Or the public dumpster. 

 

Quote

If there is no trash pickup in your area (like mine) 

The reason there is no pickup is probably because the area doesn't get enough tax revenue to pay for it. Same for most "government" services.

 

Edited June 30, 2019 by VocalNeal

[haymanpl]

18 hours ago, CharlieH said:

NCPO Thai government. 24 hour Call Center 1111 http://www.1111.go.th/

 

Great idea however, the online form does NOT work and is clearly coded for Thai language even though the site does include an English language link. I'll call during the week and see if they can understand English enough to take a complaint.

18 hours ago, CharlieH said:

 

 

[canopy]

26 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

The reason there is no pickup is probably because the area doesn't get enough tax revenue to pay for it.

 

Many years ago I learned the government wants to provide garbage pickup in my area, but the people are dead set against it. They fight it from happening from the village boss on down and have been victorious. They love their daily plastic fires and do not want to give up that precious culture one bit for this new fangled dumpster idea pushed on them from outsiders. The village boss burns plastic and enjoys it just like everyone else. That sets a terrible example for the people of someone who should know better in theory. Again just remember village bosses are ordinary persons with a loudspeaker whose advice can be similar to that of any other ordinary person and they have no legal authority to force you or anyone else to do squat. The 1111 hotline has teeth.

 

As far as specific laws on burning are concerned I think the OP will soon find out what they are in that area. Some areas can be far more strict than others. I'll get the popcorn. This could be an interesting one to watch.

 

Edited June 30, 2019 by canopy

[haymanpl]

9 hours ago, canopy said:

There have been reports of good things happening when calling the 1111 hot line which is for english speakers in precisely such conditions. People who do nothing in the face of having their rights trampled on are cowards. Why don't you give them a call and tell what happens.

 

 

What worked very effectively for me was standing on the property border with a video camera recording the fire, as well as the people around the fire and vehicles/motorbikes on the property. This stopped the fires. Now i have proof, i can take it to the authorities and see if anyone will charge them. Regardless, it worked.

Edited June 30, 2019 by haymanpl

[canopy]

I can't say how it will turn out, but doing something is a lot better than doing nothing. For future reference when resolving disputes in Thailand it's best, but not required, to have someone intervene on your behalf instead of direct confrontation. It could be the village boss, the police, 1111, a lawyer, doctor, just anyone willing to step up to the plate and help. Village thai's are very skillful at casting blame away from themselves as ever being the problem and instead blaming you because you were the only one that complained. The go between person creates an alliance on your side and they can't pinpoint you as just a troublesome whiner as it is clear others recognize a real issue with them exists.

 

[sencelebi]

Normally it's illegal but they don't enforce the law since law enforcement officer also burn their trash. It's their way of life. You can't expect to live European life style and law enforcement in an Asian country or in other 3rd world countries.

[MartiniMan]

Very easy - first of all you talk to them and you are very polite and explain how its no good

If they continue - you turn up and again politely remind them

They lost face now

Like a small boy essentially they just have to be given a bit of a reminder

Eventually they will get the point that this is awkward or embrassing to them so they will stop the practice

But first you must make them feel awkward (very easy to do they have VERY thin skin)

Just make them very awkward and use a lot of talk about karma, bad luck, ghosts and spirits

You can tell them you just saw and heard a ghost talking last night and you are sure it is cursed now - just keep a straight face and offer a candle and incense stick to remove the bad spirit watch how long they hang around for

They are children minds learn how to play games with children and enjoy thailand u will never meet adults that are this basic anywhere in the world - ENJOY IT

[CGW]

13 minutes ago, MartiniMan said:

They are children minds learn how to play games with children and enjoy thailand u will never meet adults that are this basic anywhere in the world - ENJOY IT

They are children? all with a built in propensity for violent behaviour, so your suggesting talking "mumbo - jumbo" to them in a language most cannot speak?

I'm not convinced this is going to end "they lived happily ever after" to be honest, I am wondering who has the more childish view? ???? 

[redbull707]

I'm a freelance pollution campaigner in Thailand and I just wanted to give my three cents on the trash burning epidemic in Thailand.

 

Is Trash burning a big deal? According to public health and environmental authorities, the World Health Organization and Greenpeace, the short answer is "Hell Yes!" Without getting into too much chemistry, we know that the mixing of some chemicals creates new chemicals. When you burn products made from oil and toxic chemicals like plastics (single use, clothes from polyester), white paper products made from chlorinated wood pulp, metals and other material, you are creating a toxic and carcinogenic smoke bomb. One chemical, more scary that Thanos from Avengers, is called Dioxin. The EU and New Zealand have a ban/regulation on it because it's so nasty. Basically, it's a cancer-causing chemical from burning trash and it accumulates in your body fat. While there it destroys your DNA, weakens your immune system like HIV and causes reproductive damage that makes your babies look completely alien. Do you remember the Vietnam-American war? Agent Orange? Yeah, that nasty stuff which causes mutations in new born babies has an active ingredient called Dioxin which is what you make when you burn chlorinated stuff like PVC (the "C" means chloride) and white paper products. The WHO says, "Dioxins are highly toxic and can cause reproductive and developmental problems, damage the immune system, interfere with hormones and also cause cancer." (1)

 

Is Trash burning illegal? I have an official Thai document from the National Government that says that it's illegal to burn. Upon request, I can share it with you.

 

Why do Thais burn their trash?  Well, I think several members have touched base on this accurately. Unfortunately, trash burning  is the issue that NO ONE in the world wants to talk about. Approx. 40% of the world burns trash and that's mostly in SE Asia, Asia and Africa. As a result, tons of carcinogenic smoke circulate our earth and it's not thoroughly researched. We blame cars, planes and factories for their carbon emissions and contributions to climate change, global warming and the fact that air pollution is killing more people per year than cigarettes. Perhaps, we should be focusing our efforts on waste management. Thailand is a country of convenience which is not much different than the west. The difference is that for some reason, laws are not enforced in Thailand unless they have to be enforced. For example, the BKK government is converting boat engines of the boats to electric motors to help curb pollution. Why? Well, I think it's not to protect public health. In fact, during the no wind/PM2.5 crisis in Bangkok, the government was quoted saying (Bangkok Post) that they wouldn't do anything drastic to improve air quality unless the economy was affected. Thai's have always thrown away their trash because they used to use biodegradable coconuts, leaves and sticks for packaging. That mentality has continued in the era of Plastics. We do what's easy in Thailand. Why do you think this is the Land of Smiles?

 

What Can We Do?

 

You can join my efforts! I campaigned against trash burning with help of some alumni students and after 7 months, we won! That was back in 2015. I got fired for "damaging the reputation of the school" but I saved many students from pollution, so it was totally worth it. In Nonthaburi, a Thai women started a community group to establish a sustainable waste management system and she won! Her community remains trash burning free to my limited knowledge. In the 1990's, the daughter of the Bangkok Bank president, launched a successful campaign to educate Thai's to be more smart about not littering. It was called the "Magic Eyes" campaign.

I have learned that (1) foreigners cannot complain about anything in Thailand; your a guest in this country with the voice of an ant. (2) change comes from having a thai partner who is as passionate as you are but influential. (3) any change is possible if your thai partner can get support from many thai and if your campaign can make people in high office look better.

 

Let's Make Clean Air!

 

My name is Ken and I've been fighting for clean air since 2015. Living in a pollution-free community is a basic human right. I'm not trying to "westernize" Thailand. I'm simply informing Thai's about the dangers of pollution so that THEY can take action on this issue. I'm an educator, that's it. If you know of any Thai's or influential farangs who want to work with me on this issue, I'm happy to talk about my current strategy. I love Thailand very much and I believe that Thai people have a right to know about the negative effects of burning and littering waste has on their health and environment as well as proven sustainable solutions to prevent such pollution from making them sick if they so choose.

 

 

 

(1) https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/dioxins-and-their-effects-on-human-health

[connda]

On 6/29/2019 at 5:18 PM, haymanpl said:

Is it legal to light fires and burn off in residential areas?

Depends on the location and the time of year.  During the hot season many places have a temporary ban that is pretty much universally ignored and unenforced.  At the village level you'll get more responsiveness from most of the village heads then trying to deal with the police.  Outside of the villages, especially in cane and corn field as well as the forests the burning is normally brutal, from mid-Feb all the way though May earning Northern Thailand and title of Worst Air Quality in the World more than once.
Consider it an unsolvable problem

[redbull707]

On 6/30/2019 at 11:35 AM, VocalNeal said:

 

Or the public dumpster. 

 

The reason there is no pickup is probably because the area doesn't get enough tax revenue to pay for it. Same for most "government" services.

 

Do you support the status quo? You seem to be a champion for carcinogenic pollution, a failed waste-management system and laziness. Pollution is an enemy of every human in every country. It's nothing something that goes away like a mosquito. Historically, the greatest threat to human civilization has been disease. Where does diseases come from? T R A S H. There are somethings that we cannot our culture about when public health and environment are at urgent risk.

[redbull707]

56 minutes ago, MartiniMan said:

Very easy - first of all you talk to them and you are very polite and explain how its no good

If they continue - you turn up and again politely remind them

They lost face now

Like a small boy essentially they just have to be given a bit of a reminder

Eventually they will get the point that this is awkward or embrassing to them so they will stop the practice

But first you must make them feel awkward (very easy to do they have VERY thin skin)

Just make them very awkward and use a lot of talk about karma, bad luck, ghosts and spirits

You can tell them you just saw and heard a ghost talking last night and you are sure it is cursed now - just keep a straight face and offer a candle and incense stick to remove the bad spirit watch how long they hang around for

They are children minds learn how to play games with children and enjoy thailand u will never meet adults that are this basic anywhere in the world - ENJOY IT

You've lived here a long time. Wise words! haha

[VocalNeal]

15 minutes ago, redbull707 said:

white paper products made from chlorinated wood pulp,

Ken,

 

You need some up-to-date info here. Almost no one makes that any more. Chlorine Free is the Key and all that.....

[ThaiBunny]

1 minute ago, redbull707 said:

Where does diseases come from? T R A S H.

Really? I thought migratory-bird-borne diseases impacting on pig and chicken farms in China were the greatest opportunity for a worldwide human pandemic to develop.

[redbull707]

21 hours ago, haymanpl said:

 

What worked very effectively for me was standing on the property border with a video camera recording the fire, as well as the people around the fire and vehicles/motorbikes on the property. This stopped the fires. Now i have proof, i can take it to the authorities and see if anyone will charge them. Regardless, it worked.

Have you thought about finding a Thai who cares about this issue and starting a Change.org petition in Thai language? I can give you information about the dangers of burning. Thailand recently is considering banning cigarette smoking indoors because its "an attack on innocent children". Well, by the same logic, trash burning should be banned because its more toxic than cigarette smoke and it contaminates our rice feilds, livestock, laundry and it enters our homes.

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