Brexit trade deal clash: UK and EU spar over rules

[talahtnut]

1 hour ago, tomacht8 said:

As is well known, faith and hope can move mountains. But if I would hit 27 of my trading partners or 50% of my export business in the face ... that will be never good for my own business.

Arrogance pride comes before the deep fall.

Slap in the chops not not good business mate.

Just adapt like any other successful business.

I understand your concern over Brexit, but you

seem smart bloke, I'm sure you'll find a way

to turn it round, like many others.

Forget 'pride', its all about a passion for

trade.

Edited February 4, 2020 by talahtnut
addition

[david555]

4 hours ago, TheDark said:

It might be best to simply admit, that no-deal Brexit is going to happen. 

 

 

And the E.U. was not lying all the way , from beginning they made their goalposts ,it was only U.K. so about sel-insured who believed al the nonsense from themselves that E.U. always go flat belly at last instance …… so now you see how flat E.U. go ...

[david555]

4 hours ago, vogie said:

Isn't that what I said?

We agree in full with you 

[david555]

4 hours ago, vogie said:

Yes and we are not asking the EU to conform to our standards, which in many cases is far superior to the EUs.

 

With over a million jobs at stake over the water with a no deal, the EU needs to get real and stop playing the great I am.

yes ,....Time for the Uk to sh.it or get off the pot....

(borrowed this line from an Englishman on the Torygraph comments link... a marvelous line )

Edited February 4, 2020 by david555

[david555]

4 hours ago, samran said:

Where is this ‘Australian’ Trade deal stuff coming from? No such thing exits between Australia and the EU. 
 

Sounds like another factless sound bite which the usual suspects are happy to regurgitate. 

Just a "saving face naming" for WTO no deal 

[ThomasThBKK]

1 hour ago, izod10 said:

C.rap

      27  of which rough count 22 are hangers on,maybe 23,    buying nothing,selling everything if they can.

    Gone gone gone   good riddance   no more   UK growing faster than Germany even     not bad   but more joy to come.

    Who the hell could give a rats a.rse to inner city lives,  could not give a toss about any of them

 

 

Are you even british? You write like a russian.

 

The only thing growing in the UK is your:

 

• Debt
• Debt per CApita
• Deficit 
• underfunded Health system

While you have a giant deficit, germany is sitting on tons of money, like Apple. 

[david555]

3 hours ago, samran said:

I don’t need to know what drugs you are taking! 

Just Boris metaphors I guess 

[samran]

6 minutes ago, david555 said:

Just a "saving face naming" for WTO no deal 

The Rule Britannia brigade love a good slogan. The less words the better. Based on fact? That’s beside the point...
 

’Australian style trade deal’ sounds impressive enough to them - despite the fact no such thing exists! 

[vogie]

2 minutes ago, samran said:

The Rule Britannia brigade love a good slogan. The less words the better. Based on fact? That’s beside the point...
 

’Australian style trade deal’ sounds impressive enough to them - despite the fact no such thing exists! 

Is there something wrong with your comprehension skills, who is saying an Australian Style Deal exists certainly not me.

4 hours ago, vogie said:

What the EU are asking from the UK is totally unacceptable, the only thing Barnier didn't ask for was the crown jewels. So it looks like we will be leaving with the Australia Deal, which when a reporter was asked what it was he said "its no deal but just sounds better."

Does this clear it up, are you happy now, can you phone a friend or better still ask David, so less of this procrastinating and Lets Get Brexit Done.

[david555]

7 minutes ago, vogie said:

Is there something wrong with your comprehension skills, who is saying an Australian Style Deal exists certainly not me.

Does this clear it up, are you happy now, can you phone a friend or better still ask David, so less of this procrastinating and Lets Get Brexit Done.

"Lets Get Brexit Done."

 

?is it not done yet then  …? signed ,voted , independence celebrated ,…..and Boris banned the word already for his crew ,….new slogan in working order, even for his politic staff.!

Edited February 4, 2020 by david555

[vogie]

4 minutes ago, david555 said:

"Lets Get Brexit Done."

 

?is it not done yet then  …? signed ,voted , independence celebrated …..and Boris banned the word already for his crew ….new slogan in working order even for his politic staff.!

There is already a new slogan for the remainers, 'Achieves nothing, will continue to achieve nothing'

????????????

 

[david555]

2 minutes ago, vogie said:

There is already a new slogan for the remainers, 'Achieves nothing, will continue to achieve nothing'

????????????

 

Yes unfortunately some Brits (even If they belong remain …) don't get it …. this is end station... WTO , fully agree with you  (who could imagine that to happen ...5555)

[samran]

30 minutes ago, vogie said:

Is there something wrong with your comprehension skills, who is saying an Australian Style Deal exists certainly not me.

Does this clear it up, are you happy now, can you phone a friend or better still ask David, so less of this procrastinating and Lets Get Brexit Done.

My comprehension skills are just fine. 
 

‘Just sounds better’ basically sums it up. Making the failure of a no deal scenario sound pleasing to the ear...

 

I guess with what he’s done, putting lipstick on a pig whenever possible is going to be critical. 

 

I am being unkind though. He did promise a deal within 11 months. At least with this slogan he’ll be able to deliver on that promise - no worries at all!

Edited February 4, 2020 by samran

[tomacht8]

2 hours ago, izod10 said:

C.rap

      27  of which rough count 22 are hangers on,maybe 23,    buying nothing,selling everything if they can.

    Gone gone gone   good riddance   no more   UK growing faster than Germany even     not bad   but more joy to come.

    Who the hell could give a rats a.rse to inner city lives,  could not give a toss about any of them

 

First try to deal and understand the data, numbers, facts and statistics. After that, you can still decide who posts C.rap here.

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-datasets/product?code=tet00047

 

And ur 22 or 23 "hangers" 

Some have strong economic growth that the UK and the other major EU economies can only dream of. And condescending arrogance is generally bad for business. But interesting as you call the other smaller countries in the EU.

Edited February 4, 2020 by tomacht8

[natway09]

I think Boris should take 2 weeks holiday & when he comes back start thinking about 

protecting the workers jobs.

His ranting will only achieve more factories closing & (or moving over the water 

[Loiner]

6 hours ago, TheDark said:

EU can ask whatever it wants. So can UK as well. 

 

This is heading towards no-deal brexit.

Well let’s go straight to the default no-deal then.  No need to waste another year of EU recalcitrance and obstruction. 

The EU still thinks it can force us into BRINO in its last gasps. Even big business is holding out hopes of their cushy set up being rescued by the federalists. The sooner they all realise that’s not going to happen, the better. Somebody should tell our Rejoiners too. 

[samran]

36 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Well let’s go straight to the default no-deal then.  

Haven’t you gotten the memo? It’s called the Australian deal now! 

[talahtnut]

2 minutes ago, samran said:

Haven’t you gotten the memo? It’s called the Australian deal now! 

Strange enough, the Aussie high commissioner

for the UK was on sky news just now, and

announced that the Aussies are rubbing their

hands at the prospect of dealing with the UK,

he also mentioned that Australia deals with

the EU but would certainly not give up their

sovereignty to make any deals.

His forecast for the future of EU was not good.

 

[puipuitom]

7 hours ago, petermik said:

The EU can take a hike...the boot is on the right foot now and we will not be bullied into anything that is not in our best interests....fark them I say

Correct.

[puipuitom]

8 hours ago, smedly said:

one of many I suspect

 

Nissan has a golden opportunity to cut its losses at failing plants in France and Spain and gain UK market share in the event the EU refuses to get off its high horse leading to trade barriers.

 

 

The European Union wants to stifle our full potential as an independent nation. To quote our Foreign Secretary yesterday: "It just ain't happening!"

 

What we're not going to do is have the same dynamic where we're told there are red lines that must shift. Alignment is not on the negotiating table, it's not even in the negotiating room..." How great to be out of the EU with a government that means business!

 

Barnier and his masters in Brussels need to waken up, they are not dealing with the weak lying and inept disfunctional Traitor May and her remainer team Hammond Grieve Gauke and Robbins backed by the twisted rat Burkov

I think, the British have to get used, negociationg is not as in the past, towards the Irish, Zanzibar and Birma: "WE bring in our demands, and when you very humble accepts, maybe we will leave you a few extra crumbs". It is now a tiny Island with 65 mln consumers and a GDP of $2,828 billion against 450 mln consumers with a GDP of $  15,869 billion, so 5.6 x as large ( 2018 base) . Get used to it.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_the_European_Union

Is there anybody, who really believes, tiny UK will get a better deal than big EU.. with the EU accepting this, and will NOT ask an explanation from the other country / get the same - if better - deal as tiny UK got

Compare it with Tesco (27,4%), who hears Waitrose ( 5,4%) got a better deal !

 

Edited February 4, 2020 by puipuitom

[Monomial]

7 hours ago, smedly said:

one of many I suspect

 

Nissan has a golden opportunity to cut its losses at failing plants in France and Spain and gain UK market share in the event the EU refuses to get off its high horse leading to trade barriers.

 

 

The European Union wants to stifle our full potential as an independent nation. To quote our Foreign Secretary yesterday: "It just ain't happening!"

 

What we're not going to do is have the same dynamic where we're told there are red lines that must shift. Alignment is not on the negotiating table, it's not even in the negotiating room..." How great to be out of the EU with a government that means business!

 

Barnier and his masters in Brussels need to waken up, they are not dealing with the weak lying and inept disfunctional Traitor May and her remainer team Hammond Grieve Gauke and Robbins backed by the twisted rat Burkov

 

 

 

 

The Nissan deal could be a very interesting example of a bigger trend. If they actually plan to move part of their production to the UK in order to avoid any new trade restrictions, that may seriously hurt the EU's negotiating position. Not only does it lower the incentive for the UK to negotiate a trade deal with the EU, but it also pulls jobs and investment out of the Eurozone and into the UK. This is precisely what the EU does not want to happen, and represents a big hindrance to trying to play political hardball in this situation. The companies in the EU may not share the same political values as the politicians, and may simply work around trade barriers rather than leaving the UK market to rot as the EU would prefer.

 

The UK may not have the raw size of the EU marketplace, but if they streamline their economy enough that may not matter. The profit margins available to companies could actually be better on smaller volumes in the UK.

 

You can be Nissan will be lobbied heavily by both sides before this is over.

 

[samran]

24 minutes ago, talahtnut said:

Strange enough, the Aussie high commissioner

for the UK was on sky news just now, and

announced that the Aussies are rubbing their

hands at the prospect of dealing with the UK,

he also mentioned that Australia deals with

the EU but would certainly not give up their

sovereignty to make any deals.

His forecast for the future of EU was not good.

 

Oh dear, an Australian Tory government appointee to the Australian high commission in London (a political posting) saying nice things about the UK Tory government? Stop the presses.

 

Actually, I like George Brandis - from all accounts he is decent fellow. Yes, he'd be rubbing his hands at an Australia-UK trade deal. He knows, like the Australian and NZ negotiators, that the UK's rush to get some runs on the board trade wise, they'll need to do some quick deals. We'll happily oblige you brits for your 'quick' deal of course, but it will be hugely advantageous to us as a quid pro-quo. Your welsh farmers are already trembling in their boots, and I do envisage much easier work rights for Australians in the UK, but not much in return the other way.

 

As for giving up sovereignty? Well, every Australian government which has signed a trade deal signs up to international dispute mechanisms - where foreign judges can rule against you. Signing deals with the US has meant we had to change our IP laws to further protect their copyright- cause the US asked (nicely I guess).

 

We've also agreed with the EU about not using regional naming conventions (champagne etc) in exchange of getting our wine into the EU. But given we haven't done anything trade deal wise with the EU - of course he we haven't done much yet. 

Edited February 4, 2020 by samran

[Bluespunk]

8 hours ago, webfact said:

Johnson said he would not do that

But he will...

Edited February 4, 2020 by Bluespunk

[puipuitom]

6 hours ago, izod10 said:

UK has the power to destroy the EU,from within.   Block fishing ,rioting will occur in western EU countries property damage,loss of life too no doubt.  Millions are invested in EU fisheries ,all about to go to rot, the EU are over a barrel  and they know it.  Pity about GBP  with Boris talking tough,    but good thing short term

UK fishery industry,... the financial hart of London a 168 x so important in revenues…  And THERE  the knock-out will be the hardest, when EU consumers ( = banks, Insurance and pension co's ) decide to let a EU Judge take decissions on written ( codexed) laws in case of a dispute. not the "common-law" circus. 

[ThomasThBKK]

5 minutes ago, Monomial said:

 

The Nissan deal could be a very interesting example of a bigger trend. If they actually plan to move part of their production to the UK in order to avoid any new trade restrictions, that may seriously hurt the EU's negotiating position. Not only does it lower the incentive for the UK to negotiate a trade deal with the EU, but it also pulls jobs and investment out of the Eurozone and into the UK. This is precisely what the EU does not want to happen, and represents a big hindrance to trying to play political hardball in this situation. The companies in the EU may not share the same political values as the politicians, and may simply work around trade barriers rather than leaving the UK market to rot as the EU would prefer.

 

The UK may not have the raw size of the EU marketplace, but if they streamline their economy enough that may not matter. The profit margins available to companies could actually be better on smaller volumes in the UK.

 

You can be Nissan will be lobbied heavily by both sides before this is over.

 

 

You mean the one Nissan denies? 

 

Quote

The automaker denied the existence of the contingency plans, according to a spokesman for Nissan Europe quoted by the Financial Times. “We’ve modeled every possible ramification of Brexit and the fact remains that our entire business both in the U.K. and in Europe is not sustainable in the event of WTO tariffs,” he said.

 

lol.

[Monomial]

2 minutes ago, ThomasThBKK said:

 

You mean the one Nissan denies? 

 

 

lol.

 

Yes. I mean that one. You honestly believe that since "our entire business both in the U.K. and in Europe is not sustainable in the event of WTO tariffs" they will simply pack up and go home if WTO happens? I doubt they will just shrug and surrender 2 entire markets because of politics.  Any comments made by anyone at this point are made with an agenda.

 

What do you think they will do in the event of WTO? That is the question. There may not be public contingency plans yet, but they are being considered. Count on it.

 

 

 

[puipuitom]

28 minutes ago, Monomial said:

 

The Nissan deal could be a very interesting example of a bigger trend. If they actually plan to move part of their production to the UK in order to avoid any new trade restrictions, that may seriously hurt the EU's negotiating position. Not only does it lower the incentive for the UK to negotiate a trade deal with the EU, but it also pulls jobs and investment out of the Eurozone and into the UK. This is precisely what the EU does not want to happen, and represents a big hindrance to trying to play political hardball in this situation. The companies in the EU may not share the same political values as the politicians, and may simply work around trade barriers rather than leaving the UK market to rot as the EU would prefer.

 

The UK may not have the raw size of the EU marketplace, but if they streamline their economy enough that may not matter. The profit margins available to companies could actually be better on smaller volumes in the UK.

 

You can be Nissan will be lobbied heavily by both sides before this is over.

First of all: Nisan denied all these rumors.

 

2) there is an overcapacity of car production inside the EU. So, if one wants to leave the EU: Fantastic.

Tesla going to start in Germany, so market volume needed anyhow.  And all UK car plants are owned by organisations outside the UK, who for sure will think in exconomies of scale, especially for all investments for electric cars, do a dying UK car industry in a 5-10 years anyhow.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/15/business/cars-brexit-europe-technology.html

https://www.acea.be/statistics/tag/category/production

[david555]

1 hour ago, Loiner said:

Well let’s go straight to the default no-deal then.  No need to waste another year of EU recalcitrance and obstruction. 

The EU still thinks it can force us into BRINO in its last gasps. Even big business is holding out hopes of their cushy set up being rescued by the federalists. The sooner they all realise that’s not going to happen, the better. Somebody should tell our Rejoiners too. 

At last now you start talking sense …,???? after 3years + start understanding that " going flat belly from E.U. at the last moment in negotiations" is a fairy tale ...

 

U.K. hold the divorce papers in hand , and is still waiting in the doorway  yelling " I am going !! " or maybe just waiting somebody come to pick you up ? "TrumpTaxi" maybe ????

[baansgr]

7 hours ago, shadowofacloud said:

 

Yes, yes, and the Royal Yacht Britannia will sail the high seas again bringing new fame and glory to the empire, trade deals will flood London, with countries literally queuing around the corner of no 10. They will beg and wallow in the mire just to have the privilege of trading with the independent, powerful and mighty UK.

 

Time to wake up now and face the hangover.

 

The UK has become a complete and utter farce over the last 4 years. A pathetic joke. The country is in a completely losing position and will have to accept whatever scraps the EU or other countries throw at it. Or face decades of barely making do.

 

The main issue here is that BJ and his friends in manor houses do not care - the "austerity" measures from the last decade simply allowed these pigs to get even fatter, at the cost of the common man. And it will continue this way - widespread exploitation, back yo 19th century, back to gin lane (cheap booze from Tesco will keep the nation happy, no doubt).

 

I had to travel to the UK for work last week... Compared to my phd times in Lodnon, some 15 years ago, the country feels totally broken. Poverty is everywhere, high streets dying, people subdued and depressed, rough sleeping rampant. But you've got yer national pride and "sovereignty". Utter tosh. I am really sorry for you guys.

 

Here's a good commentary (from The Guardian, so obviously "fake news"):

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/03/boris-johnson-weak-brexit-uk

Poverty and homelessness is rampant as you say, due to the lack of and high cost of accommodation due to overcrowding, its good your PHD taught you observation skills on what problems and misery mass immigration and free movement can cause.

[izod10]

28 minutes ago, puipuitom said:

UK fishery industry,... the financial hart of London a 168 x so important in revenues…  And THERE  the knock-out will be the hardest, when EU consumers ( = banks, Insurance and pension co's ) decide to let a EU Judge take decissions on written ( codexed) laws in case of a dispute. not the "common-law" circus. 

Christ    hardly worth an answer

  UK second biggest contributor to EU 

93 billion deficit  

 38 billion membership

   All gone,finished,even the bog trotters will be up in arms   but   no fishing  now that is good news  put millions out of work in EU     really good   all gone  bye bye