Couple of questions about gold

[revgreen]

I want to buy myself a small (1/2 - 1 baht) gold chain. I saw the current price is around 23k, without much recent fluctuation. Would there be any benefit in waiting to see if it goes down? I have a few established shops in my neighborhood, should I buy there or at one of the malls? Is it really necessary to go to Yaowarat? What style of chain is most durable? I have seen a few comments saying links are a bad choice because they break easily.

[Farangwithaplan]

I'm no gold expert but I have bought and sold bars and jewellery here in the past.

 

At 23k, it is up over most of last year's prices. This is due to uncertainty. When people get worried about world issues, they buy gold. You have Corona virus causing an already mild China economy to get even more mild as well as the greater concern this virus could end up as a pandemic. Hong Kong still a mess and it's national carrier struggling badly. More airlines will be in pain if this virus is not contained and resolved quickly.

 

There is still the bubbling issue of Iran wanting to puff its chest out, Syria still on the boil, African drought, A mafia don in the white house, US - China trade agreement still on the backburner, Brexit fun has not even started yet. So my bet is that you will not see the price of gold soften in the short term And if thing get virus scary we might look back and see this price as cheap.

 

I have Used MTS for gold bar and necklace purchases as well as Bangkok Gold. It might be wise to use a mainstream company with many branches if you intend to ever sell the jewellery. It is easier and better financially to sell back to the business you bought from.

 

The gold industry is highly regulated in Thailand. Use a well known business at any of their branches and you will be fine. You will get a receipt with you purchase that is your authenticity.

 

Take your passport with you when you intend to purchase.

 

Edited February 19, 2020 by Farangwithaplan
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[bkk6060]

54 minutes ago, revgreen said:

durable? I have seen a few comments saying links are a bad choice because they break easily.

Yes they do.

Ask any LB on Beach road easy to snatch them while they give you kisses and hugs.

[revgreen]

3 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

Yes they do.

Ask any LB on Beach road easy to snatch them while they give you kisses and hugs.

 

Good that I don’t intend on any trips to Pattaya then eh?

[Farangwithaplan]

Oh, the other thing I forgot to mention is that you can sometimes negotiate down on the "making' price. This is the cost per baht of manufacturing the jewellery. More intricate designs will cost more, generally. But see if they can shave a bit off the price for making.

 

Gold bars don't have a making price attached to them.

 

[allanos]

Gold is a store of value whose price is largely determined by its supply and demand fundamentals.  In times of uncertainty, particularly short sharp world events of a "calamitous" nature, its price spikes, but it settles back down shortly afterwards to be underpinned once more by its fundamentals.

 

The uptrend over the past several months started before being triggered by things like Covid-19. Covid-19 has, however, pushed the price even further upwards.  My own opinion is that this trajectory will stay in place for the foreseeable future, possibly to take out the previous all time spot-price high around $1920 over the next eighteen months to two years.

[revgreen]

Thanks for all the answers! Got a chain today, they took 300 off the 600 labor fee. Tested the scale, saw the chain weighed, got a paper receipt. As I said, for me I just like the look, but if the price does continue upwards it's nice knowing a have a new TV or something "in the bank".

[Dazinoz]

I often laugh at people who say gold is not and investment. I bought shares in Australia as an investment and the companies failed and I lots all my so called investment.

 

Everything I read pointed to gold doing what its doing now and I have 38 baht thai gold (bars) at an average cost of 19967baht/baht. At the time of writing I could sell that gold for 23800baht/baht which gives me a total profit of 145,654 baht.

 

I will stick to my gold "non investment".

 

 

[richard_smith237]

9 minutes ago, Dazinoz said:

I often laugh at people who say gold is not and investment. I bought shares in Australia as an investment and the companies failed and I lots all my so called investment.

 

Everything I read pointed to gold doing what its doing now and I have 38 baht thai gold (bars) at an average cost of 19967baht/baht. At the time of writing I could sell that gold for 23800baht/baht which gives me a total profit of 145,654 baht.

 

I will stick to my gold "non investment".

 

A neat profit... 

 

What if someone wanted to make a ‘significant’ investment and purchase something in the region of 10MB of gold?

 

Where could they keep it? What would the volume be? how would they go about it?

 

 

[Dazinoz]

3 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

A neat profit... 

 

What if someone wanted to make a ‘significant’ investment and purchase something in the region of 10MB of gold?

 

Where could they keep it? What would the volume be? how would they go about it?

 

 

As I don't have the money to buy that much gold I have no idea.

[allanos]

51 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

A neat profit... 

 

What if someone wanted to make a ‘significant’ investment and purchase something in the region of 10MB of gold?

 

Where could they keep it? What would the volume be? how would they go about it?

 

 

That sum would buy you about 200 Kruger Rands, each of 1 oz of fine gold. The volume is not too great but best to keep in a bank vault.

[SiSePuede419]

Where are you planning on keeping this gold?

 

Just like cash, gold can be easily stolen.

 

I'd recommend a stock market index fund which can't be stolen off your neck or from your "estate". ????

Edited February 20, 2020 by SiSePuede419

[Timebandit]

6 hours ago, allanos said:

That sum would buy you about 200 Kruger Rands, each of 1 oz of fine gold. The volume is not too great but best to keep in a bank vault.

Worst place to put it! Private vault in the Bangkok Citi bank building, Silom Rd., second floor, turn right after the escalator. Don’t be a #%@&*+# fool and keep it in a bank. Krugerrands  are sh#%. 91%mixed with copper don’t even look like gold.

[Dazinoz]

7 hours ago, allanos said:

That sum would buy you about 200 Kruger Rands, each of 1 oz of fine gold. The volume is not too great but best to keep in a bank vault.

I am in Thailand so I buy Thai gold, very easy to sell if needed.

[Iron Tongue]

Unless you trade in the millions, gold is best treated as an hedge against inflation.  I think that your "profit" isn't as high as you think when you include the erosion of inflation.  

[seabass69]

9 hours ago, allanos said:

That sum would buy you about 200 Kruger Rands, each of 1 oz of fine gold. The volume is not too great but best to keep in a bank vault.

Krugerrand is not fine gold, but 22 karat 91.67%

[Curt1591]

.5 to 1 baht of gold is hardly an "investment". Most things you'll buy will immediately lose value. Gold will always have some value.

When buying a necklace, I would advise buying one that you can slip on and off without opening the clasp. Most breaks occur from the repeated bending of the clasp. 

[HuskerDo]

12 hours ago, Dazinoz said:

I often laugh at people who say gold is not and investment. I bought shares in Australia as an investment and the companies failed and I lots all my so called investment.

 

Everything I read pointed to gold doing what its doing now and I have 38 baht thai gold (bars) at an average cost of 19967baht/baht. At the time of writing I could sell that gold for 23800baht/baht which gives me a total profit of 145,654 baht.

 

I will stick to my gold "non investment".

 

 

Low reward for a BIG risk. That's less than $5,000 US dollars in profit. TINY considering the risk. Gold is one of the worst investments a person can make. It doesn't grow. It just fluctuates based on the issues in the world. Invest in companies that GROW where you can triple your money or more rather than playing with gold that is range-bound.

[Dazinoz]

4 hours ago, Iron Tongue said:

Unless you trade in the millions, gold is best treated as an hedge against inflation.  I think that your "profit" isn't as high as you think when you include the erosion of inflation.  

LOL. Firstly you contradict yourself by saying it is a hedge against inflation but inflation has eroded my profit. Secondly it is certainly better than most other "investments" I have made. And inflation doesn't affect other investments? And it has been really high in the last few years, hasn't it?

[Dazinoz]

1 hour ago, HuskerDo said:

Low reward for a BIG risk. That's less than $5,000 US dollars in profit. TINY considering the risk. Gold is one of the worst investments a person can make. It doesn't grow. It just fluctuates based on the issues in the world. Invest in companies that GROW where you can triple your money or more rather than playing with gold that is range-bound.

Really? Gold will never goto zero. A considerable number of my shares have and will NEVER get that money back. The gold here combined with 100kg of silver in Australia I am doing quite ok at the moment. Yes prices can drop but never to zero like some of my shares.

[Assurancetourix]

14 hours ago, Dazinoz said:

I often laugh at people who say gold is not and investment. I bought shares in Australia as an investment and the companies failed and I lots all my so called investment.

When you want to buy gold you should never buy "paper gold": stocks or bonds of gold mines;
but still buy physical gold.
And if possible buy 24 carat pure gold like the one sold in Vietnam; it is soft and not shiny.
In Thailand it is 23 carats.
For several months physical gold has risen steadily, which raises fears of an explosion of some stock or real estate bubbles as in Thailand where a large part of the market is on a recycled silver basis ...

[JWRC]

The other thing to consider is that with constant wearing the item will reduce in weight, the gold content is high and quite soft here and wears down over time.

[allanos]

13 hours ago, Timebandit said:

Worst place to put it! Private vault in the Bangkok Citi bank building, Silom Rd., second floor, turn right after the escalator. Don’t be a #%@&*+# fool and keep it in a bank. Krugerrands  are sh#%. 91%mixed with copper don’t even look like gold.

As to your take, above, what are you going to do if the private vault company goes bust? How much chance of getting your deposits back? Sounds like a foolish place to store valuable items, to me!

 

South African Kruger Rands are the same fineness as British Sovereigns and American Eagles.  I guess you don't have any of these excellent coins, because, according to your definition, they are all sh#%!

[allanos]

9 hours ago, seabass69 said:

Krugerrand is not fine gold, but 22 karat 91.67%

You are describing its fineness, the same as a British Sovereign and an American Eagle.  I think you are confusing the word "fine" with "pure".

[allanos]

5 hours ago, Assurancetourix said:

When you want to buy gold you should never buy "paper gold": stocks or bonds of gold mines;
but still buy physical gold.
And if possible buy 24 carat pure gold like the one sold in Vietnam; it is soft and not shiny.
In Thailand it is 23 carats.
For several months physical gold has risen steadily, which raises fears of an explosion of some stock or real estate bubbles as in Thailand where a large part of the market is on a recycled silver basis ...

If one wants to own physical gold, but not have the problems associated with physical storage, then gold etf's are the possible answer.  

 

Your investment into the etf is backed by an equal amount of physical gold, held in secure storage.  Check it out online.

 

As you say, physical gold has been on an uptrend, and is presently making 7 year highs. However, the downside is that your gold will never be worth more than the spot price at any time.  Holding paper stocks in a decent gold mine gives you the advantage of leverage, which physical gold doesn't give you. 

 

Miners are somewhat undervalued at the moment, but they will gain traction soon, I feel.  An investment there will probably deliver 2X or 3X over the next 18 months.

[allanos]

10 hours ago, Iron Tongue said:

Unless you trade in the millions, gold is best treated as an hedge against inflation.  I think that your "profit" isn't as high as you think when you include the erosion of inflation.  

The whole point about investing in gold is that it is a store of value, and has been this way for thousands of years. The Thai's, the Indians and the Chinese all know it.

 

When US stock markets tank, which is highly possible some time after Trump is re-elected in 2021, watch what happens to gold.  It will go ballistic.

 

Don't think the S & P will ever tank?  Ask Ray Dalio, of the huge hedge fund, Bridgewater.  He has just bet $1.5bn in puts that the S & P will drop before the end of March.

[HuskerDo]

11 hours ago, Dazinoz said:

Really? Gold will never goto zero. A considerable number of my shares have and will NEVER get that money back. The gold here combined with 100kg of silver in Australia I am doing quite ok at the moment. Yes prices can drop but never to zero like some of my shares.

Sounds like you invested in some pretty poor companies. You should read a tad about Benjamin Graham and Warren Buffett. They never invest in companies headed to zero. I'd say that anyone who does better investing in gold than they can do in the stock market is a poor investor and does little to no research on the companies they buy shares in. If you had put your money in a good mutual fund you'd be FAR ahead of whatever you made on the gold. 

[Dazinoz]

13 hours ago, HuskerDo said:

Sounds like you invested in some pretty poor companies. You should read a tad about Benjamin Graham and Warren Buffett. They never invest in companies headed to zero. I'd say that anyone who does better investing in gold than they can do in the stock market is a poor investor and does little to no research on the companies they buy shares in. If you had put your money in a good mutual fund you'd be FAR ahead of whatever you made on the gold. 

You think I wanted to invest in companies to goto zero?

 

My biggest loss is I paid a financial advisor for investment advise and lost $aud50,000 over 10 years in his advise.

[Percy P]

On 2/20/2020 at 5:01 PM, revgreen said:

Thanks for all the answers! Got a chain today, they took 300 off the 600 labor fee. Tested the scale, saw the chain weighed, got a paper receipt. As I said, for me I just like the look, but if the price does continue upwards it's nice knowing a have a new TV or something "in the bank".

Never been a lover to gold items there just item's. Rather put my money to a human course like family's in need,bought one family a gold ring,necklace which they could prawn should they need money. I will then pay back the prawn shop. Which.I have done inthe past. Should the family sell the item ok,that puts an end to the golden goose.

[Percy P]

On 2/20/2020 at 5:01 PM, revgreen said:

Thanks for all the answers! Got a chain today, they took 300 off the 600 labor fee. Tested the scale, saw the chain weighed, got a paper receipt. As I said, for me I just like the look, but if the price does continue upwards it's nice knowing a have a new TV or something "in the bank".

Never been a lover to gold items there just item's. Rather put my money to a human course like family's in need,bought one family a gold ring,necklace which they could prawn should they need money. I will then pay back the prawn shop. Which.I have done inthe past. Should the family sell the item ok,that puts an end to the golden goose.