I volunteer to be injected with the virus...

[Monomial]

According to Thai actuaries when I went to try and find term life insurance last year, I have a 1:192 chance (0.52%) of dying this year. At least, that is what their premiums said.  According to doctors, I have about 1:100 chance (1%) of dying from the virus. Neither thought is particularly pleasant, but I have a 100% of being financially ruined and separated from my family due to this economic evisceration the junta cum government is enforcing.

 

My business is destroyed. My savings will soon be exhausted. I have no chance of meeting the required 400k in the bank when my visa expires.  Who here thinks the government is going to offer me any relief on that requirement?  What...nobody? I have been in Thailand for 20 years. I have nothing anywhere else.

 

I will volunteer to be injected with the virus and spend 3 weeks in quarantine, if the government will simultaneously promise to stop this ridiculous lockdown and enforced closure that is designed to do nothing other than destroy families. No ventilator required. I will take my chances and hope good karma gets me through. I know others are in my position as well.

 

I've already seen those on here who will say "Let them eat cake. My retirement check comes anyway. This is a minor inconvenience." When you go to bed tonight, consider how lucky you truly are.  This economic policy is worse than the virus itself for many of us. I wanted to start this thread because I think many on here have not considered how bad this situation truly is for millions.

 

If you are facing economic ruin from this, let's hear your story. Let the wealthy and the retirees who are relaxing in their gilded towers know what is happening on the ground.

[cornishcarlos]

3 minutes ago, Monomial said:

I have been in Thailand for 20 years. I have nothing anywhere else.

 

Mmmmmmmmm... Oooopsie

[worgeordie]

12 minutes ago, Monomial said:

My business is destroyed. My savings will soon be exhausted.

After so little time ?, It's going to take a long time for things

to become anywhere near "normal", so what is your plan B. ?

regards Worgeordie

[henry2109]

I feel your pain - my sympathy. 

 

Kudos for you that you at least got some savings to hold on.

 

I am with you seeing the economic situation at least as or more concerning as the virus itself. There is certainly soon a decision to be made between health measures, e.g. restrictions, on one hand, and economy on the other hand. My prediction for Thailand: the lockdown will stay in place for this month, and then gradually will be lifted.

[Pravda]

Good thread for anyone who wants to "settle" in Thailand.

[wasabi]

I have been very poor and even homeless at points in my life so I do sympathize HOWEVER my personal philosophy after coming to Thailand for 15 years is to never depend on Thailand for income and never invest more than I can afford to lose here. This pandemic is unprecedented and many who thought they were prepared for the worst weren't. Those years of poverty made me hard core about saving money and investing it wisely. I always keep 5 YEARS living expense in cash. I am fortunate indeed but it was not luck or a privilege. It was through hard won lessons. I wish you the best of luck.

[RJRS1301]

My thoughts are with you.

I guess even if you survived the virus, will you be able to still run your business immediatley?

Stay safe.

 

[OneMoreFarang]

43 minutes ago, Monomial said:

My business is destroyed.

What is your business?

Was it ever a profitable business?

How much did you safe in the good times?

How long did it take before it was destroyed?

Do you only blame the government or are you also in part responsible for what you did and didn't do?

 

I think it's fair when employees complain. Because they are used to having their salary every month.

But business owners should know better and should be able to survive for some time even in bad times.

 

I know a few business owners, including bar owners with 0 income. They still payed their staff at the end of March. They planned for bad times, they will survive. 

[OneMoreFarang]

21 minutes ago, Pravda said:

Good thread for anyone who wants to "settle" in Thailand.

Do business owners in many other countries have no problems?

Should we all blame the Thai government? 

[Pravda]

2 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Do business owners in many other countries have no problems?

Should we all blame the Thai government? 

 

Sure. 

 

But at least back in his own country he would be getting some money, healthcare and other social programs available to citizens and permanent residents. 

 

Here he gets big fat nothing. 

[bbi1]

1 hour ago, cornishcarlos said:

 

Mmmmmmmmm... Oooopsie

I have been in Thailand for 20 years. I have nothing anywhere else.

 

I've always said, it's plain stupid to own anything in Thailand. Always rent and keep all assets and cash in your home country. Never cut ties with your home country.

[bbi1]

37 minutes ago, Pravda said:

Good thread for anyone who wants to "settle" in Thailand.

+1

 

Or for anyone considering to put any money into this country besides basic living expenses like rent and food expenses.

[bbi1]

37 minutes ago, wasabi said:

I have been very poor and even homeless at points in my life so I do sympathize HOWEVER my personal philosophy after coming to Thailand for 15 years is to never depend on Thailand for income and never invest more than I can afford to lose here.

+1, agreed.

[cornishcarlos]

4 minutes ago, bbi1 said:

 

I've always said, it's plain stupid to own anything in Thailand.

 

Not necessarily true... It's good to invest but only what you can afford to lose.

Plus have assets elsewhere for times like this..

[Pravda]

7 minutes ago, cornishcarlos said:

 

Not necessarily true... It's good to invest but only what you can afford to lose.

Plus have assets elsewhere for times like this..

 

I never agreed with this philosolhy.

 

Does Warren Buffett invest money that he can afford to lose or does he invest money to make more money?

 

Some have done really well in Thailand. Most have not.

 

 

[Bagwain]

Depending on how long they keep this charade up, I may end up being in the same boat!

[Grumpy John]

Apart from my 400.000 baht I had some money here and some money  in Australia. I get an Australian pension every fortnight paid there and when the exchange rate improves I will bring a big chunk of money here.  Hopefully the banks at both ends survive and my money doesn't disappear.  My pension should be secure but.....is it really?  If the worst comes we may all be in the same boat sailing down a well know creek!   So as much as bad luck has befriended you we may all get to be friends together!   Keep your chin up Lad,  You can always get breakfast at the wat and a clean tiled floor to sleep on. 

[Antonymous]

29 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

What is your business?

Was it ever a profitable business?

How much did you safe in the good times?

How long did it take before it was destroyed?

Do you only blame the government or are you also in part responsible for what you did and didn't do?

 

I think it's fair when employees complain. Because they are used to having their salary every month.

But business owners should know better and should be able to survive for some time even in bad times.

 

I know a few business owners, including bar owners with 0 income. They still payed their staff at the end of March. They planned for bad times, they will survive. 

You sound like someone who has never owned a business.  And the only examples you give of business owners you know are bar owners!

 

I'm retired now, but ran businesses in Thailand employing over 200 people. I dread to think what I'd be going through today if I still had those companies. Salaries and social security to pay. Production raw materials and resources to manage that would have become almost impossible in current circumstances. Impossible to export our product any longer. Zero income.

 

Not all companies are awash with cash. Most have to manage cashflow very carefully and while minor disruptions are the norm and should be covered, a major catastrophe like this can destroy everything.

 

I feel for every business owner right now.

 

I have sympathy with the Op, but have a question: how come you are running a business but still on a marriage visa needing 400K in the bank? I presume it is not a registered company?

[1FinickyOne]

1 hour ago, Monomial said:

I know others are in my position as well.

This virus is a terrible thing for small businesses.. so many will go bankrupt from no fault of their own. And there really is nothing they could have done to prevent it... I have friends in other countries feeling the same despair... 

 

However, the self quarantines are necessary to stop the spread of this deadly virus... I am retired but we are all effected in some ways. The older you get, the days become more precious, to lose a year to "distancing" etc.. is such a waste...

 

That does not minimize your situation. But, even if you could re-open, there would not likely be any customers for a while. 

 

I hope somehow this ends well for you... but I am sure the toll amongst small business will be toughest of all.

[cyril sneer]

1 hour ago, Monomial said:

My business is destroyed. My savings will soon be exhausted.

how do you know this without knowing when it can be re-opened?

[Antonymous]

26 minutes ago, bbi1 said:

 

 

 

I've always said, it's plain stupid to own anything in Thailand. Always rent and keep all assets and cash in your home country. Never cut ties with your home country.

 

You are assuming that your cash and assets are safe, or safer than in Thailand. You may be in for a nasty shock one day!

 

I came to Thailand thirty years ago, lock, stock and barrel. Moved all the money I had to Thailand. I made it my home. Determined that my money would be safer here where I could manage it, than on the other side of the world. I built businesses that provided me with employment and an income. I saved money and invested it in Thailand. My businesses were successful (still are) and my investments have multiplied my net worth many fold.

 

Very, very happy with my decision.

 

If you know what you are doing and can work hard and smart, do what I have done. If you have never built a successful business in your home country, have no professional training or experience and have no idea how to invest, don't do it. I believe the latter applies to 95% of those who come here, hence the constant negativity.

[jadee]

Antonymous - what type of businesses do you have? How are they shielded from the lockdown and looming recession/economic depression? Might be good advice for people looking to start up something over here!

[OneMoreFarang]

29 minutes ago, Antonymous said:

You sound like someone who has never owned a business.  And the only examples you give of business owners you know are bar owners!

 

I'm retired now, but ran businesses in Thailand employing over 200 people. I dread to think what I'd be going through today if I still had those companies. Salaries and social security to pay. Production raw materials and resources to manage that would have become almost impossible in current circumstances. Impossible to export our product any longer. Zero income.

 

Not all companies are awash with cash. Most have to manage cashflow very carefully and while minor disruptions are the norm and should be covered, a major catastrophe like this can destroy everything.

 

I feel for every business owner right now.

 

I have sympathy with the Op, but have a question: how come you are running a business but still on a marriage visa needing 400K in the bank? I presume it is not a registered company?

I mentioned the bar owners because their business has to close. They had not choice closing it.

I also know some other business owners who have problems but their business is still running.

Knowing bar owners does not mean I know only bar owners ????

Sure, it's difficult and very difficult. But for me it seems that if a business is in serious trouble after one month then that business was never a successful business.

[Fatman666]

This is my 32^nd year in Thailand. We run a small business. Zero income now. We have some savings and probably will survive if the worst is over in about 2 – 3 months. But should this crisis takes longer, we will be done. So this all forced me for the first time in all the long years here in Thailand to make a Plan B with thinkings to leave Thailand forever and take my Thai wife (19 years together) with me and go back to my country. Have already a appointment at my embassy next week, to discuss and clear some things for my emergency Plan B. So if the crises is longer than expected i am out of here. Will force me to start a new life episode. Sorry for my bad english. Good luck for you all.

[Antonymous]

15 minutes ago, jadee said:

Antonymous - what type of businesses do you have? How are they shielded from the lockdown and looming recession/economic depression? Might be good advice for people looking to start up something over here!

 

As I said in Post #18 I am retired now. I no longer have company interests. And though those companies have done well, they too are suffering now under this terrible lockdown.

 

There are two things that are almost certain to occur, in addition to the immediate loss of income:

 

Some employees will not wish to return when (when???) things return to normal, for a whole host of personal reasons. That can be devastating in itself to a business.

 

Some customers will not order again, either because they have gone out of business themselves, or have found alternative products or suppliers. Just when you are desperate for orders to get back on track, those orders disappear.

 

Make no mistake, this will have a devastating effect on businesses everywhere.

 

But to answer your question, I'd go for food production and food processing businesses as (some) insurance against such lockdowns in the future. People always have to eat and they are prepared to spend money on food, even during recessions and disasters.

[tomazbodner]

You can volunteer to be infected, but don't expect anything in return.

 

Unless you work this out with some pharma company trying to develop cure or vaccine...

[Monomial]

Thanks for everyone who responded so far. It was interesting seeing the different perspectives. To answer the obvious question, I run my business out of Cambodia and I travel there regularly to do the work. Obviously, I have not been able to do that for weeks.

 

I started this thread because I see many people that are not considering the bigger ramifications of this crisis.  The Financial Times ran a very good article a few days ago:

 

https://www.ft.com/content/7eff769a-74dd-11ea-95fe-fcd274e920ca

 

Some pertinent quotes:

 

"The economic lockdowns are imposing the greatest cost on those already worst off."

 

"The way we wage war on the virus benefits some at the expense of others. The victims of Covid-19 are overwhelmingly the old. But the biggest victims of the lockdowns are the young and active...Sacrifices are inevitable, but every society must demonstrate how it will offer restitution to those who bear the heaviest burden of national efforts."

 

 

On this board, I have seen many discussions of how everyone should do their part during the curfew and lockdown. I have seen disparaging of those who will not stay at home.  But I haven't seen any hint of gratitude on the part of the wealthy and retirees with guaranteed incomes for those of us who are bearing the burden of this crisis. I don't believe any group is entitled to believe that someone else should be responsible for bearing a disproportionate amount of the burden, while they reap a disproportionate amount of benefit.

 

I would like to see a lot more of the retirees on this board expressing humility and asking humbly for cooperation from those suffering, as well promising to do something to help out the less fortunate. If you have a fixed income of any amount during this period, you are very, very lucky.

 

I saw this same sense of entitlement happen during the 2011 floods. My house was on the wrong side of the big bag barrier dam that the BMA built to protect Bangkok. I was asked to suffer, so that Bangkok could be saved.  But there was no gratitude for this sacrifice, and no aid was offered by those who benefitted. When people are asked to sacrifice for the greater good, there is a social contract implied that restitution will be offered to those who bear the burden.

 

So for everyone who is wealthy or on a fixed income and believes that these lockdowns are a good idea, how much are you willing to contribute as restitution to those of us who are suffering because of this? Zero?