Choosing Internetprovider - Which connection is not infuenced by power(outages)

[Metropolitian]

There are other subforums on the area 'internet + providers' but I ask the question in the Electrical Forum as the people who knows the difference between bits an electrons are found there..mostly

 

What is your knowledge/experience with whatever provider and which package has still connectivity when there is a power outage.

 

Fiber, light trough glass.. are there repeaters ? Still working when power cuts?

  

  In my old country we had first POTS phone lines, they still work when the electricity cuts.

Later we had a digital version over pots, called ISDN, which was not working when the house electricity cuts except when using ISDN phones.

The inhouse adapter for ISDN line to 2 analog line needed an poweradapter.. But my ISDN pc adapter still got signal and internet was not offline.

In some countries we had cable tv and internet via cable, those routers also need a poweradapter.

When using an UPS solution we found that the distribution hub was powered from the grid too.. thus no signal and no internet.  The same with xDSL.

 

Now we are many years later... and another country ! ????

 

Ramble your keyboard mates

 

 

_{nb. If after a few days there are less answers or no at all, I will request a moderator to move the thread.}

[Fruit Trader]

If the power outage is widespread its down to how much of the system you are using has backup.

The fiber network needs power before it reaches passive splitters.

 

If we lose the yellow phase TOT goes off.

[bankruatsteve]

Whatever the service, if it is connected to a wi-fi router (the normal) then the router goes dark along with the electric.  I have fiber from TOT and when the electric goes out I fire up the genset and after the router comes back up everything is normal.

 

Obviously, phone service doesn't depend on electric power so that's another option.

[Metropolitian]

23 minutes ago, bankruatsteve said:

Whatever the service, if it is connected to a wi-fi router (the normal) then the router goes dark along with the electric. 

It's always on here, behind an UPS.

 

The router here also serves as a mini intranet server for the network in home.

Want it never be off.

 

[Metropolitian]

29 minutes ago, bankruatsteve said:

Obviously, phone service doesn't depend on electric power so that's another option.

Absolutely and the same router I was speaking of have the option for a 2nd failback WAN port (USB or one of the LAN) and I used to USB Stick with 4G data connected to it for when I had a poor internet connectivity.

A real good option. Especially in rural areas with 4G coverage.

The question now is for the -main- internet connection.

[Metropolitian]

41 minutes ago, Fruit Trader said:

If the power outage is widespread its down to how much of the system you are using has backup.

The fiber network needs power before it reaches passive splitters.

Many bigger splitter hubs (mainly phone services) do have a power backup.

But I am not sure about the others, hence my post.

Maybe the smaller splitter boxes have a power feed along with the data lines if needed..?

 

At my home everything in the 'data corner' stays on.

 

41 minutes ago, Fruit Trader said:

If we lose the yellow phase TOT goes off.

Yellow phase. And you are ... Russian (phase 1) English (phase 2) or American (phase 3) ?

 

 

[Fruit Trader]

10 minutes ago, Metropolitian said:

Yellow phase. And you are ... Russian (phase 1) English (phase 2) or American (phase 3) ?

Our supply phases are marked red yellow and blue which I adopted from a short period working in the UK I believe. If we lose yellow something in the local TOT shack has no backup power and goes off. TOT tells me it will be sorted one day.

 

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

FTTx networks are generally EPON or GPON and are completely passive from the datacentre to the home/business. As long as the datacentre has diesel for their generator the signal won't go down. How you power your router at home is up to you.

Having said that, we have problems with CAT at one of our sites. When the power blinks, we lose the connection and all our VoIP lines, so I figure they have a local repeater with no battery UPS or batteries that need replacing. We used to pay ~3,500 Baht per month for that line but I got so sick of the poor service in power blinks I demoted the line to a 590 Baht a month backup.

 

My rack runs on 12 or 19 volts. I have enough battery power to run for 12 hours.

 

 

 

Edited April 16, 2020 by NilSS

[Mattd]

I have UPS on both of my fibre connections and both lose the connection to the outside world when the power goes off locally, I assume it depends on whether there are any converters in the line, fibre to copper, or not, if pure fibre, then not power dependent.

[Crossy]

UPS's and genset for local power.

 

ToT fibre has never been off during a power outage that I know of but we have an AiS 3G internet thingy as backup anyway.

 

Almost seamless switch over via a TP-Link TL-ER6020 router, same functionality just rather slower (4Mbps as opposed to 500Mbps on the fibre). Madam and the grand kids probably haven't noticed, in reality I only know because I look at the logs.

 

EDIT Actually the fibre did go off during a power outage last year, but that was because someone decided that it would be a good idea to clear their land for sale using some 91 and a match. The resulting conflagration took out the fibre and the 25kV at about the same time.

 

[jmccarty]

I had a UPS on my wifi router with 3BB fibre, it continued working after the power went out until the battery in the UPS finally stopped holding a charge.  As others have said, it depends on where you are.  There is no normal set up here.

[Metropolitian]

42 minutes ago, Mattd said:

I have UPS on both of my fibre connections and both lose the connection to the outside world when the power goes off locally, I assume it depends on whether there are any converters in the line, fibre to copper, or not, if pure fibre, then not power dependent.

Would u like to share which company delivers the signal to you as this is what we/I want to know.

 

1 hour ago, NilSS said:

completely passive from the datacentre to the home/business. As long as the datacentre has diesel for their generator the signal won't go down.

The one I am looking for, or at least if there are active boosters / gateways in the line should be covered with a emergency power.

 

Is it all CAT in your cases, or only at that one site that fails?

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

We use CAT, ToT, 3bb and True. I wouldn't over think it because each area will have a different maintenance manager that will have his own set of maintenance priorities. Unless you get a leased line with Service Level Agreement, you might as well just suck it and see.

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

To add to the above, base packages are so cheap these days you might as well get 2 lines from different providers and load balance. Redundancy at this very basic level should keep your house online at all times. Let's face it, WAN is an essential service these days.

[VocalNeal]

11 hours ago, NilSS said:

get 2 lines from different providers

Yep. I had one for me and one for everyone else!

[Metropolitian]

2 hours ago, VocalNeal said:

Yep. I had one for me and one for everyone else!

It's here the same but virtually.

Using bandwith limiter for the network at which 'not-mine' are connected with, different subnet also.

And the failback (with the usb stick 3G/4G) only to mine.

 

As Nils said ' WAN is an essential service these days. ' . It sure is, for my monitoring devices and my phones, I rely on the communication apps. I don't cry if the youtube stream at missus phone interrupts ????

[Fruit Trader]

In answer to the title, I would say our local phone tower is the least influenced by power outages which is why I use it check mail when TOT falls over.

 

Other than some order mail I have nothing critical enough using WAN to justify sweating over backup. The TV cameras and some IOT can wait a few hours although I do get upset if the transmission torrent box is stuck on a favorite TV show. 

[Metropolitian]

For comparing data I need more input ????

 

 

---------------------------
| Request, for the mod(s).   |

| Move thread to IT section |

---------------------------

 

 

[Crossy]

2 hours ago, Metropolitian said:

For comparing data I need more input ????

 

---------------------------
| Request, for the mod(s).   |

| Move thread to IT section |

---------------------------

 

 

Done.

 

For future reference you can use the Report button to request a move, it's not just for complaints ????

 

[Metropolitian]

On 4/16/2020 at 3:07 PM, Fruit Trader said:

If we lose the yellow phase TOT goes off.

 

On 4/16/2020 at 3:07 PM, bankruatsteve said:

I have fiber from TOT and when the electric goes out I fire up the genset and after the router comes back up everything is normal.

 

On 4/16/2020 at 4:16 PM, NilSS said:

we have problems with CAT at one of our sites. When the power blinks, we lose the connection and all our VoIP lines,

 

On 4/16/2020 at 5:01 PM, Mattd said:

I have UPS on both of my fibre connections and both lose the connection to the outside world when the power goes off locally,

 

On 4/16/2020 at 5:14 PM, jmccarty said:

I had a UPS on my wifi router with 3BB fibre, it continued working after the power went out

 

On 4/17/2020 at 11:35 AM, Fruit Trader said:

In answer to the title, I would say our local phone tower is the least influenced by power outages which is why I use it check mail when TOT falls over.

Mine: Phone  (Both AIS and True) keeps connection but True looses the 4G and kept the 3G.

 

The few numbers till now state that:

TOT  -  Keep connected (1)  - Depending on phase (1) - Disconnect (1)

3BB  - Keep connected (1)   - Depending on phase (0) - Disconnect (0)

CAT - Keep connected (0)   - Depending on phase (0) - Disconnect (1)

Phone - Keep connected (2)  - Disconnect (0) - Slower/Emergency (1)

Unknown - Keep connected (1)   - Depending on phase (0) - Disconnect (0)  (a reply was giving without mentioning of provider name)

 

1. The status of internet at home is influenced by the use of UPS which keeps the router powered, only then we can see if the broadband line has signal.

2. The results differs per location, as someone has said depending on the maintenance of those hubs (UPS, digital-analog-digital conversions so called boosters and fiber gateways) and weak connections at moments of natural storms or disconnection caused by accidents (vehicle hit poles)

[Metropolitian]

Think that if I had choosed for the poll option at creation of this thread would make life easier ????????

[Samt78]

26 minutes ago, Metropolitian said:

 

 

 

 

 

Mine: Phone  (Both AIS and True) keeps connection but True looses the 4G and kept the 3G.

 

The few numbers till now state that:

TOT  -  Keep connected (1)  - Depending on phase (1) - Disconnect (1)

3BB  - Keep connected (1)   - Depending on phase (0) - Disconnect (0)

CAT - Keep connected (0)   - Depending on phase (0) - Disconnect (1)

Phone - Keep connected (2)  - Disconnect (0) - Slower/Emergency (1)

Unknown - Keep connected (1)   - Depending on phase (0) - Disconnect (0)  (a reply was giving without mentioning of provider name)

 

1. The status of internet at home is influenced by the use of UPS which keeps the router powered, only then we can see if the broadband line has signal.

2. The results differs per location, as someone has said depending on the maintenance of those hubs (UPS, digital-analog-digital conversions so called boosters and fiber gateways) and weak connections at moments of natural storms or disconnection caused by accidents (vehicle hit poles)

I agree with you,the results differs per location.

[OneMoreFarang]

Maybe this was mentioned already: If one provider is good in one area that doesn't mean it's also good in another area.

I.e. I had a colleague who had TRUE like me but he had the fastest available package at that time and I had officially only half his speed.

He called me from his home in Rama 3 (Luxury Condo) that his internet was too slow. I tried the same website at the same time and for me, in Sukhumvit, it was fast - with officially half the connection speed.

Speak with the neighbors and ask them what they use and how happy they are with the connection.

[Metropolitian]

8 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Maybe this was mentioned already: If one provider is good in one area that doesn't mean it's also good in another area.

Very true and already mentioned, also in my post ???? it is then an issue at the providers side or the gateways inbetween, a lack of maintenance.

The stats, when enough numbers, will show what the situation is in normal and well serviced lines.

 

8 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Speak with the neighbors and ask them what they use and how happy they are with the connection.

They don't have UPS, so when the power cuts so are their routers.

Currently I am in a bridge with a neighbor who has True (before TOT) with phone and CaTV, all shuts down because the router is.

 

[Metropolitian]

Anyone has experience with True (Fiber or copper) ?

[sead]

that would be when you decide to buy a batterybackup

 

[jomtienisgood]

On 4/16/2020 at 3:52 PM, Metropolitian said:

Many bigger splitter hubs (mainly phone services) do have a power backup.

But I am not sure about the others, hence my post.

Maybe the smaller splitter boxes have a power feed along with the data lines if needed..?

 

At my home everything in the 'data corner' stays on.

 

Yellow phase. And you are ... Russian (phase 1) English (phase 2) or American (phase 3) ?

 

 

You don't have enough phases for Chinese, Europeans, not to mention Ozz?????555555  

[sandyf]

On 4/16/2020 at 5:01 PM, Mattd said:

I have UPS on both of my fibre connections and both lose the connection to the outside world when the power goes off locally, I assume it depends on whether there are any converters in the line, fibre to copper, or not, if pure fibre, then not power dependent.

I was told by the AIS engineer that fibre connections must be within 200 metres of the distribution point so we went with 3BB as they were nearer.

That being the case, in the event of a power cut it is highly likely the distribution box would also lose power.

 

To the OP, I would think that the only reasonable arrangement for direct internet would be ADSL with UPS.

A short term solution is to use mobile phone data connected as a hotspot.

[Metropolitian]

2 hours ago, sandyf said:

I was told by the AIS engineer that fibre connections must be within 200 metres of the distribution point so we went with 3BB as they were nearer.

That being the case, in the event of a power cut it is highly likely the distribution box would also lose power.

If it has no gateways (fiber-electronic) in those distribution boxes , it won't need power.

Single Fiber cable to multi core cables is only light passing. No electronics involved.

 

Fiber cables can carry a signal quite a distance.

The perfect single node fiber cable can get to the 100km, those are fatties and for long runs.

 

The higher the speed, the shorter the distance will be

 

For multi node fibers distances are :

Classic speed 100mbit the fiber cable run is 2km

High speed fiber 1gbits limits the length to 1km

Super high speed 10gbit a boost is needed every 500meters

Very very high speed for backbones 100gbit the run is limited to 200meters

 

A hub to re-transmit the signal are needed.

 

Most hubs/distribution points supposed to have a emergency power supply anyway.

 

Quote

To the OP, I would think that the only reasonable arrangement for direct internet would be ADSL with UPS.

The same as with fiber, it depends on location whether those distribution points are serviced well and their UPS able to bridge the power cuts.

 

At consumer side it is up to the consumer to use any kind of power source to keep the router/modem powered.

Here it is with UPS/batteries.

 

Quote

A short term solution is to use mobile phone data connected as a hotspot.

That is absolutely right.

Also the failback solution in use here.

 

 

Edited April 28, 2020 by Metropolitian
$

[ChaiyaTH]

3BB always keeps working together with my UPS, we are never without Internet even when outages take 5-6 hours. 

That aside I also have a SIM router and TrueMove 4G promotion of 10mbps with unlimited data at 200 baht per month for 12 months, that takes over otherwise.

Edited April 28, 2020 by ChaiyaTH