U.S. coronavirus outbreak soon to be deadlier than any flu since 1967 as deaths top 60,000

[Bkk Brian]

11 minutes ago, overherebc said:

Flu symptoms reduction injection.

A vaccine by definition provides immunity. Flu shots don't.

no vaccine is 100% effective for any illness, so better to do away with the word vaccine altogether by your definition

 

https://www.who.int/vaccine_safety/initiative/detection/immunization_misconceptions/en/index2.html

Edited May 2, 2020 by Bkk Brian

[overherebc]

55 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

no vaccine is 100% effective for any illness, so better to do away with the word vaccine altogether by your definition

 

https://www.who.int/vaccine_safety/initiative/detection/immunization_misconceptions/en/index2.html

If you go back to my first comment/question you'll see I said  the years 'new' seasonal flu virus. It's never the same each year, sometimes milder, sometimes stronger. Flu shots will help in the cases of milder strains and might not even make a dent in the stronger strains.

Interesting you can say I advocate ridding the world of vaccines. All terms are open to interpretation. I just prefer to call it a flu shot. If in your mind that means I want to rid the world of vaccines that's up to you.

 

And to think it all started with cows a milkmaid and a little boy.

Edited May 2, 2020 by overherebc

[Bkk Brian]

31 minutes ago, overherebc said:

If you go back to my first comment/question you'll see I said  the years 'new' seasonal flu virus. It's never the same each year, sometimes milder, sometimes stronger. Flu shots will help in the cases of milder strains and might not even make a dent in the stronger strains.

Interesting you can say I advocate ridding the world of vaccines. All terms are open to interpretation. I just prefer to call it a flu shot. If in your mind that means I want to rid the world of vaccines that's up to you.

I didn't go back to my post, either one of them.

 

That said, happy to also go along with you and call it a flu shot, much like a measles shot really. Better than your original suggestion of "Flu symptoms reduction injection" 

Edited May 2, 2020 by Bkk Brian

[GalaxyMan]

1 hour ago, overherebc said:

Flu symptoms reduction injection.

A vaccine by definition provides immunity. Flu shots don't.

Nonsense. I used to get an annual flu shot when I lived in Holland. My wife was an elementary school teacher and she was always bringing various illnesses home. I was sick for 2 straight years until I started getting the vaccine. I was never sick again.

[Mavideol]

On 4/30/2020 at 6:56 AM, Mama Noodle said:

 

Nobody was scare quoting Vietnam or shutting down the global economy when this was going down. 

 

 

It wasn't just the imbecile NYC Mayor. It was Schumer, Pelosi, Biden, and everyone else on the left as well. 

you mention a lot of non important/non responsible people and purposely or inadvertently forgot to mention the one and only responsible for the mess, you know the one with the big mouth that wants to shoot disinfectant and strong light  into the body

[Crazy Alex]

1 minute ago, Mavideol said:

you mention a lot of non important/non responsible people and purposely or inadvertently forgot to mention the one and only responsible for the mess, you know the one with the big mouth that wants to shoot disinfectant and strong light  into the body

Yes, we should never forget it was China that spread the virus. Good point.

[overherebc]

1 hour ago, GalaxyMan said:

Nonsense. I used to get an annual flu shot when I lived in Holland. My wife was an elementary school teacher and she was always bringing various illnesses home. I was sick for 2 straight years until I started getting the vaccine. I was never sick again.

Still doesn't make you immune to a flu virus that mutates into a stronger virus next year or the year after. If the flu virus never mutated then it could be wiped out, but, it has always done so.

[Phulublub]

59 minutes ago, Crazy Alex said:

Yes, we should never forget it was China that spread the virus. Good point.

Are you sure?  A lot of questions being asked now, some by very reputable institutes, and some indications that it maybe did not originate in China.

 

PH

[bkk6060]

1981: the HIV vaccine is just around the corner...

Edited May 2, 2020 by bkk6060

[overherebc]

31 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

1981: the HIV vaccine is just around the corner...

Nowadays you can't go down the Edward Jenner route. Take fluid from the scabs on a milkmaids hands who had contracted cowpox from milking infected cows and inject it into an eight year old boy ( James Phipps ). 

Wait 3 weeks and then inject the boy with smallpox fluids. The boy never got sick or developed smallpox. 3 weeks from idea to end result.

Before anyone jumps I'm not saying that's the way it should be down nowadays.

Just for info. Vaccine comes from the Latin Vacca, meaning Cow.

[Starmocihc]

On 4/30/2020 at 3:40 AM, ukrules said:

The death figures attributed to COVID are pretty much meaningless at this stage, for some reason COVID is being used as the cause of death when it's far from clear that it was the cause.

 

The same thing is happening in the UK, one guy was complaining that his father who died from a terminal cancer had the cause of death listed as COVID, he'd been slowly dying of cancer for months, but suddenly it's COVID that killed him. No symptoms of COVID, just a rubber stamp.

 

I don't know why they're doing this and we probably won't find out for a long time but it's an ongoing scandal.

Fact. Even people here who were convinced of everything the deceitful MSM were feeding them a month ago, are stepping back and asking why the numbers are being fixed. It's fairly obvious why, but perhaps their cog-dis won't allow them to acknowledge it.

[candide]

The coronavirus death toll is very likely to be higher than the official numbers.

 

"Why the coronavirus may be killing more Americans than the government data says

The Post, in partnership with researchers from the Yale School of Public Health, estimated that 15,400 more people died between March 1 and April 4 than would ordinarily have been expected, a substantially higher toll than the 8,128 coronavirus deaths that were reported over that time by government agencies." 

https://www.vox.com/coronavirus-covid19/2020/4/29/21240393/voxcare-us-coronavirus-covid-19-deaths-how-many-yale

 

UK coronavirus deaths more than double official figure, according to FT study | Free to read

https://www.ft.com/content/67e6a4ee-3d05-43bc-ba03-e239799fa6ab

"The FT has gathered and analysed data on excess mortality — the numbers of deaths over and above the historical average — across the globe, and has found that death tolls in some countries are more than 50 per cent higher than usual. In many countries, these excess deaths exceed reported numbers of Covid-19 deaths by large margins."

https://www.ft.com/coronavirus-latest

[Destiny1990]

With all due respect there were here these usa members blaming Italians In Europe for not having a good hygiene and for being to touchy with each-other etc. Now What do they have to say about America  having the highest Corona death rate In the world ?

[heybruce]

4 hours ago, Starmocihc said:

Fact. Even people here who were convinced of everything the deceitful MSM were feeding them a month ago, are stepping back and asking why the numbers are being fixed. It's fairly obvious why, but perhaps their cog-dis won't allow them to acknowledge it.

The numbers are coming from governments, both local and national, and reported by news organizations.  If you dig a little you may be able to learn how each localities deaths are counted.

[Crazy Alex]

Woodstock went down during a pandemic worse than coronavirus. No shutdowns or tyranny then.

 

https://www.aier.org/article/woodstock-occurred-in-the-middle-of-a-pandemic/?fbclid=IwAR2xqCOfcDKmRiwTkZsO-we3vixFjkOVB5dSzrn8NWMh6Po34BdQDiBrslw

 

 

[candide]

12 minutes ago, Crazy Alex said:

Woodstock went down during a pandemic worse than coronavirus. No shutdowns or tyranny then.

 

https://www.aier.org/article/woodstock-occurred-in-the-middle-of-a-pandemic/?fbclid=IwAR2xqCOfcDKmRiwTkZsO-we3vixFjkOVB5dSzrn8NWMh6Po34BdQDiBrslw

 

 

Aaaah! The good old time when LSD wasn't prohibited! ????

[Crazy Alex]

3 minutes ago, candide said:

Aaaah! The good old time when LSD wasn't prohibited! ????

Woo hoo, finally something we can agree on!  ????????????????????????

[Damrongsak]

1 hour ago, candide said:

Aaaah! The good old time when LSD wasn't prohibited! ????

 

1 hour ago, Crazy Alex said:

Woo hoo, finally something we can agree on!  ????????????????????????

That was just a wee bit before my time (it became illegal in the US when I was 15).  Owsley Stanley, the "king of LSD", once attended the University I did.  Quite an interesting guy and career: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Owsley_Stanley

 

 

[Crazy Alex]

1 hour ago, Damrongsak said:

 

That was just a wee bit before my time (it became illegal in the US when I was 15).  Owsley Stanley, the "king of LSD", once attended the University I did.  Quite an interesting guy and career: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Owsley_Stanley

 

 

Interesting dude. I'm not surprised his assertion that 350,000 hits of acid were for personal use didn't fly. ????

[heybruce]

3 hours ago, Crazy Alex said:

Woodstock went down during a pandemic worse than coronavirus. No shutdowns or tyranny then.

 

https://www.aier.org/article/woodstock-occurred-in-the-middle-of-a-pandemic/?fbclid=IwAR2xqCOfcDKmRiwTkZsO-we3vixFjkOVB5dSzrn8NWMh6Po34BdQDiBrslw

 

 

The H3/N2 influenza pandemic of 1968 to 1970 killed 100,000 US citizens over two years.  The deaths of over 60,000 citizens have been attributed to Covid 19 in three months.  The actual death toll to date is assumed to be much higher, and the final death toll higher still, in spite of lock-downs, business closings, and social distancing measures. 

 

"The annual flu mortality figures published by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention are estimates produced by plugging laboratory-confirmed deaths into a mathematical model that attempts to correct for undercounting. Covid-19 death figures represent a literal count of people who have either tested positive for the virus or whose diagnosis was based on meeting certain clinical and epidemiological criteria....Using an apples-to-apples comparison, we can say that the coronavirus and the disease it causes, covid-19, have already killed eight times as many people as the flu. "   https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/05/02/theres-more-accurate-way-compare-coronavirus-deaths-flu/

 

By your own source, during the influenza pandemic:

 

"Nothing closed. Schools stayed open. All businesses did too. You could go to the movies. You could go to bars and restaurants."

 

Had there been measures to contain the '68 - '70 pandemic the death toll would have been lower.  It's reasonable to assume that Covid 19 is far more deadly than H3/N2.

[Damrongsak]

39 minutes ago, Crazy Alex said:

Interesting dude. I'm not surprised his assertion that 350,000 hits of acid were for personal use didn't fly. ????

A guy has to have a stash in case of dry times. 

 

"...By his own account, between 1965 and 1967, Stanley produced no less than 500 grams of LSD, amounting to a little more than five million doses. ..."

 

I wonder what the wholesale selling price per dose was back then.

 

Somewhere around here, I still have a book that explains how to make LSD from scratch.  IIRC it involves rye bread, chromatography columns and whatnot.  The book is probably in a box in the attic with my copy of the "Anarchist's Cookbook" and "Steal This Book". I used to have a good collection of underground comic books by Robert Crumb, but I donated them to the University of Virginia library about 45 years ago.  I wonder if they are still in the "Social Movements" collection, 555.  Mr. Natural, the Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers, Fritz the Cat, etc.  Sick dude.  He's still around.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Crumb

[metisdead]

A post with content from an unapproved YouTube source has been removed.

 

A post in violation of fair use policy and a reply has been removed:

 

14) You will not post any copyrighted material except as fair use laws apply (as in the case of news articles). Please only post a link, the headline and the first three sentences.

 

A petty back and forth bickering session has been removed.  If the bickering does not stop, a warning will be issued to stop the bickering. 

 

[Crazy Alex]

On 5/2/2020 at 6:01 PM, Damrongsak said:

A guy has to have a stash in case of dry times. 

 

"...By his own account, between 1965 and 1967, Stanley produced no less than 500 grams of LSD, amounting to a little more than five million doses. ..."

 

I wonder what the wholesale selling price per dose was back then.

 

Somewhere around here, I still have a book that explains how to make LSD from scratch.  IIRC it involves rye bread, chromatography columns and whatnot.  The book is probably in a box in the attic with my copy of the "Anarchist's Cookbook" and "Steal This Book". I used to have a good collection of underground comic books by Robert Crumb, but I donated them to the University of Virginia library about 45 years ago.  I wonder if they are still in the "Social Movements" collection, 555.  Mr. Natural, the Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers, Fritz the Cat, etc.  Sick dude.  He's still around.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Crumb

I had the Anarchist's cookbook for a while. I'm sure I've read the recipe there, and also more complicated ones on the internet. I may have a *friend* who's bought vitamin A in the past few years. The dosage made a claim of 100 mcg. I heard it was pretty good quality. So 270 mcg... WOW. ????

[frenetic]

The Trump administration projects about 3,000 daily deaths by early June.

As President Trump presses for states to reopen their economies, his administration is privately projecting a steady rise in the number of cases and deaths from coronavirus over the next several weeks, reaching about 3,000 daily deaths on June 1, according to an internal document obtained by The New York Times, nearly double from the current level of about 1,750.

 

The projections, based on modeling by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and pulled together in chart form by the Federal Emergency Management Agency, forecast about 200,000 new cases each day by the end of the month, up from about 25,000 cases now.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/04/us/coronavirus-updates.html?action=click&module=Spotlight&pgtype=Homepage

[Crazy Alex]

On 5/1/2020 at 4:41 AM, stevenl said:

My gut tells.e lockdowns work, but I can't prove it.

I'm sure they do to some extent. But at what cost?

[GalaxyMan]

On 5/4/2020 at 11:08 PM, frenetic said:

The Trump administration projects about 3,000 daily deaths by early June.

As President Trump presses for states to reopen their economies, his administration is privately projecting a steady rise in the number of cases and deaths from coronavirus over the next several weeks, reaching about 3,000 daily deaths on June 1, according to an internal document obtained by The New York Times, nearly double from the current level of about 1,750.

And in spite of this, he wants to dismantle the virus response team. Talk about stupidity on steroids. It makes me wonder if the next administration, assuming/hoping that it's not Trump, will be able to charge Trump with criminal malfeasance and manslaughter because of his willful, callous disregard for the lives of people over money. ????

 

We're now learning that the virus is constantly mutating, which means that it's going to be next to impossible to create a vaccine for.

 

From Salon: https://www.salon.com/2020/05/05/the-coronavirus-has-mutated-heres-what-that-means

 

A few pertinent paragraphs from the article:

 

A new strain of the novel coronavirus appears to be more contagious than the version that gained footing at the beginning of the COVID-19 pandemic, according to a new study led by scientists at Los Alamos National Laboratory (LANL).

 

The new strain, dubbed D614G, surfaced in Europe in February before appearing in the east coast of the United States. It has been the dominant strain across the world since mid-March, according to the report.

 

As CNN reported, it remains possible that no vaccine for COVID-19 will be made, or that it could take far longer than 18 months to create. Case in point: four decades and 32 million deaths later, the world doesn't have an HIV vaccine.

 

"Influenza is able to change itself from one year to the next so the natural infection or immunization the previous year doesn't infect you the following year. HIV does that during a single infection," Paul Offit, a pediatrician and infectious disease specialist who co-invented the rotavirus vaccine, told CNN. "It continues to mutate in you, so it's like you're infected with a thousand different HIV strands," Offit tells CNN. "[And] while it is mutating, it's also crippling your immune system."

[stevenl]

9 minutes ago, GalaxyMan said:

And in spite of this, he wants to dismantle the virus response team. Talk about stupidity on steroids. It makes me wonder if the next administration, assuming/hoping that it's not Trump, will be able to charge Trump with criminal malfeasance and manslaughter because of his willful, callous disregard for the lives of people over money. ????

 

<snip>

For relaxation matters it is much more the number of new infections than number of deaths that should be leading. But you need testing for that, and to create a safe relaxation testing, tracking and tracing. 

Edited May 6, 2020 by stevenl

[Sujo]

On 5/1/2020 at 5:41 PM, stevenl said:

It is impossible to prove a negative like that. My gut tells.e lockdowns work, but I can't prove it.

Evidence proves it works. NZ has beaten it with lockdowns. Australia has pretty much beaten it, only 100 deaths.

 

I dont like the oz pm but he is correct about the difference between herd immunity and lockdown.

 

https://www.9news.com.au/national/coronavirus-scott-morrison-covid-19-herd-immunity-death-sentence/c5b1b198-dec6-4547-a909-444f8d92db09

[stevenl]

5 minutes ago, Sujo said:

Evidence proves it works. NZ has beaten it with lockdowns. Australia has pretty much beaten it, only 100 deaths.

 

I dont like the oz pm but he is correct about the difference between herd immunity and lockdown.

 

https://www.9news.com.au/national/coronavirus-scott-morrison-covid-19-herd-immunity-death-sentence/c5b1b198-dec6-4547-a909-444f8d92db09

Good indication it works, but not proof. To proof, NZ should have kept one island open and 1 in lockdown.

[GalaxyMan]

1 hour ago, Sujo said:

Evidence proves it works. NZ has beaten it with lockdowns. Australia has pretty much beaten it, only 100 deaths.

Locking Koh Samui down certainly made a major difference. Only 7 cases, zero deaths, now virus free.

 

As for herd immunity, there is no conclusive proof that any immunity is imbued upon anyone who has had the virus. To the contrary, they are reporting that the virus is constantly mutating, thereby eliminating any chance of immunity from an essentially new virus, at least as far as your immune system is concerned.