WHO pauses trial of hydroxychloroquine in COVID-19 patients due to safety concerns

[metisdead]

Some troll posts have been removed. 

[JCauto]

8 hours ago, checkered flag said:

Ten years ago hydroxychloroquine was not being used a a malaria prevention in SEA. Since Plasmodium falciparium is resistant this drug is not in use. Malaria is no longer a problem in Thailand except in mountainous border areas, your physician was wise to not prescribe. BTbe W seeing a ID physician and travel me clinic would better than seeing a GP for tropical disease advice.

Yes, well I have been discussing it with my physician throughout my time in Southeast Asia as I often do work in forest areas near the border. We considered Hydroxycchloroquine on several appointments over the years, but after reviewing the research both decided that the best course of action would be to focus on preventing myself from getting bitten and making sure I had the hammocks and nets treated with insect repellent to use. This was because of the oft-noted psychotic incidents associated with use with different people. This worked pretty well over the years so we saw no reason to change it. Now there are new drugs for new drug-resistant malaria, but I still don't take those either for the same reasons. 

So I agree that we haven't talked about hydroxychloroquine specifically for a while, but at the end of the day we decided that mosquito prevention remained the best course of action. Good news is that I haven't had either malaria or COVID-19 yet (or dengue, another reason one might consider more care in mozzie prevention). 

[Phil McCaverty]

11 minutes ago, Stadtler said:

CNN is Fake News.

555 The words are coming out of Trump's mouth. He clearly talks about injecting disinfectant. Same video available from a variety of news sources.

[Phil McCaverty]

6 minutes ago, JCauto said:

at the end of the day we decided that mosquito prevention remained the best course of action. Good news is that I haven't had either malaria or COVID-19 yet (or dengue, another reason one might consider more care in mozzie prevention). 

Exactly what my GP in the UK told me, no hydroxychloroquine, just take a couple of bottles of deet.

 

Luckily I have since found that mozzies just don't have a taste for me. I rarely get bitten. I put that down to my daily dose of Marmite on toast.

[RJRS1301]

41 minutes ago, fred110 said:

They don't want a safe, proven drug to be used because it is cheap. They prefer to push Remdesivir.

That is the worry, it is not proven to be safe for this virus, nor of any use, that is why they have reviews, trials, and take a responsible attitude towards the efficacy.

 

[metisdead]

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Some troll posts have been removed. 

[Bluespunk]

 

9 hours ago, checkered flag said:

Over 50 years ago it was mandatory that US troops in SEA take weeking doses to prevent malaria. It's been used for a very long time so it's risks are  well know. It was the primary drug to treat malaria then and is still used for some strains of malaria today (non P falc malaria). In high dosages many drugs can cause side effects, but are well documented. I think that either one of two things is happening: 1) this is to get back at Trump: or there is no big profit for big pharma, because it's generic. 

Or, and this is the reason, there are safety concerns.

[spidermike007]

Pretty certain this has nothing to do with safety and likely an enforcement of Big Pharma preferences. Little money to be made on an existing drug that is inexpensive. People have been taking this drug for years to prevent malaria. It is infinitely safer than it's predecessor Chloroquine.  Something does not pass the wiff test here. The WHO, CDC and FDA are spectacularly corrupt agencies. I do not buy any of this. 

[RJRS1301]

6 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

 

Or, and this is the reason, there are safety concerns.

Plus. surprise surprise malaria is not a respiratory infection 

[Stadtler]

1 minute ago, RJRS1301 said:

Plus. surprise surprise malaria is not a respiratory infection 

Neither is Lupus.  Your point?

[Antonymous]

1 minute ago, Phil McCaverty said:

I think the general rule is don't post s**te by whacko conspiracy theorists, particularly when it contains dangerous misinformation.

 

In the case of discussions on WuFlu and in MANY other situations that affect all of us, debate should be encouraged and freedom of speech should prevail. Often there are genuine experts who disagree with each other. If free speech prevails we should hear all sides. Occasionally a 'fact' is twisted to suit a particular agenda, for one side or another and therefore if we only get to read or hear one side, we will be misled.

 

Read below what one of the UK’s most eminent jurists, Lord Sumption, former justice of the Supreme Court, had to say about this very recently:

 

"I am not a scientist, but it is the right and duty of every citizen to look and see what the scientists have said and to analyse it for themselves and to draw common sense conclusions. We are all perfectly capable of doing that and there’s no particular reason why the scientific nature of the problem should mean that we have to resign our liberty into the hands of scientists. We all have critical faculties and it is rather important in a moment of national panic that we should maintain them.

 

I would like to know what ThaiVisa regards as the list of approved media sources.

 

 

[Phil McCaverty]

3 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Something does not pass the wiff test here. The WHO, CDC and FDA are spectacularly corrupt agencies. I do not buy any of this. 

Wise. It really isn't good for you, despite what Trump says.

[RJRS1301]

3 minutes ago, Stadtler said:

Neither is Lupus.  Your point?

Covid19 is a respiratory infection, just in case you need Covid19 101 , sometimes leading to organ failure.

Lungs primarily involved 

 

Need the point any further?
 

Edited May 26, 2020 by RJRS1301

[Phil McCaverty]

4 minutes ago, Antonymous said:

 

In the case of discussions on WuFlu

 

 

There you go again, "WuFlu". How do you expect anyone to take you seriously?

 

 

Edited May 26, 2020 by Phil McCaverty

[spidermike007]

4 minutes ago, Phil McCaverty said:

Wise. It really isn't good for you, despite what Trump says.

Neither is death from respiratory failure. I would only use it if I was infected as part of the drug cocktail. I would never use it as a preventative and Trump was irresponsible to say so, especially without mentioning the need for zinc. However by now, we all realize how reckless the man is. No surprise there. 

[Traubert]

9 hours ago, Mama Noodle said:

 

 

Ah the daily Trump good/Trump bad thread, I'm out. Boring.

 

Have fun.

[Eric Loh]

8 minutes ago, Phil McCaverty said:

There you go again, "WuFlu". How do you expect anyone to take you seriously?

 

 

They are not serious but just trolling. 

[fred110]

29 minutes ago, RJRS1301 said:

That is the worry, it is not proven to be safe for this virus, nor of any use, that is why they have reviews, trials, and take a responsible attitude towards the efficacy.

 

It's been used for decades for several diseases such as lupus.

[Stadtler]

13 minutes ago, RJRS1301 said:

Covid19 is a respiratory infection, just in case you need Covid19 101 , sometimes leading to organ failure.

Lungs primarily involved 

 

Need the point any further?
 

Sure do.  Plaquenil is also a treatment for Lupus.

 

You didn't address this.

 

Stadtler laughs at this hit and run argumentation.

[checkered flag]

36 minutes ago, Phil McCaverty said:

Exactly what my GP in the UK told me, no hydroxychloroquine, just take a couple of bottles of deet.

 

Luckily I have since found that mozzies just don't have a taste for me. I rarely get bitten. I put that down to my daily dose of Marmite on toast.

I agree with the mozzies that you are very toxic.

[simple1]

12 minutes ago, Antonymous said:

<SNIP>

Read below what one of the UK’s most eminent jurists, Lord Sumption, former justice of the Supreme Court, had to say about this very recently:

 

"I am not a scientist, but it is the right and duty of every citizen to look and see what the scientists have said and to analyse it for themselves and to draw common sense conclusions. We are all perfectly capable of doing that and there’s no particular reason why the scientific nature of the problem should mean that we have to resign our liberty into the hands of scientists. We all have critical faculties and it is rather important in a moment of national panic that we should maintain them.<SNIP>

There are more than a few people who disagree with Sumption's views on Covid-19 management and after reading the quote above I understand why. An example at the URL below of the man's thoughts regards Covid-19 being critiqued in the Law Society Gazette.

 

I worry that Lord Sumption is in danger of breaking the injunction he set out in his Reith Lectures, that law is law and politics is politics.

 

https://www.lawgazette.co.uk/commentary-and-opinion/lord-sumption-is-wrong-on-lockdown-liberty/5104325.article

[checkered flag]

39 minutes ago, Phil McCaverty said:

Exactly what my GP in the UK told me, no hydroxychloroquine, just take a couple of bottles of deet.

 

Luckily I have since found that mozzies just don't have a taste for me. I rarely get bitten. I put that down to my daily dose of Marmite on toast.

Did your GP also caution you also about alcohol in excess? 

[RJRS1301]

28 minutes ago, fred110 said:

It's been used for decades for several diseases such as lupus.

Please explain how the treatment of Lupus is in any way similar to Sars2Covid>>Covid19 infection.

 

Lupus being an autoimmune condition and Covid19 being a respiratory viral infection.

 

Just because panadol works on pain, does not mean it will heal a fractured femur

 

Always a prudent thing to do risk and efficacy investigations.

 

[Antonymous]

39 minutes ago, simple1 said:

There are more than a few people who disagree with Sumption's views on Covid-19 management and after reading the quote above I understand why. An example at the URL below of the man's thoughts regards Covid-19 being critiqued in the Law Society Gazette.

 

I worry that Lord Sumption is in danger of breaking the injunction he set out in his Reith Lectures, that law is law and politics is politics.

 

https://www.lawgazette.co.uk/commentary-and-opinion/lord-sumption-is-wrong-on-lockdown-liberty/5104325.article

It is interesting that the linked article in the Law Society Gazette has around 60 comments from, I presume, fellow lawyers and the overwhelming view is that the writer can’t hold a candle to Lord Sumption. This comment sums it up nicely:

 

“This is a very poor article demonstrating a complete lack of risk analysis and understanding of basic probability.”

 

Coming back to the context here:

 

Lord Sumption has every right to his opinion and to express it regardless of his position and to suggest otherwise surely undermines the essence of civil liberties.

 

Regardless of my political leanings I look forward to being exposed to both sides of this and other contentious debates, particularly when relevant expert opinion is presented (linked to).

 

For example (though I can't provide a link, there are a dozen sources if you Google: Debunking the Covid Narrative - Professor Dolores Cahill)

Edited May 26, 2020 by Antonymous

[ChouDoufu]

9 hours ago, Phil McCaverty said:

There have been no substantive trials completed on this, therefore no evidence.

 

interesting how you decided to phrase this.

 

i would however correct your specific wording;  in the case of scientific studies, the proper phrasing would be "no clear evidence."

[earlinclaifornia]

2 hours ago, wombat said:

50 years of safe use then Trump mentions it and whoosh just like that its a killer....if the Donald could turn water to wine the media would accuse him of pollution 

Right, this is all the media's fault and has nothing to do with a man who has absolutely no leadership skills.

[ChouDoufu]

2 hours ago, Stadtler said:

Provide Stadtler a transcript of Trump saying exactly that.

 

Stadtler knows you cannot do this.

“I see the disinfectant, where it knocks it out in a minute. One minute. And is there a way we can do something like that, by injection inside or almost a cleaning? Because you see it gets in the lungs, and it does a tremendous number on the lungs. So it would be interesting to check that,” he said.

 

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/trump-suggests-disinfectant-as-treatment-for-coronavirus-by-injection-inside-or-almost-a-cleaning-doctors-call-the-idea-dangerous-2020-04-24

[simple1]

28 minutes ago, Antonymous said:

It is interesting that the linked article in the Law Society Gazette has around 60 comments from, I presume, fellow lawyers and the overwhelming view is that the writer can’t hold a candle to Lord Sumption. This comment sums it up nicely:

 

“This is a very poor article demonstrating a complete lack of risk analysis and understanding of basic probability.”

 

Coming back to the context here:

 

Lord Sumption has every right to his opinion and to express it regardless of his position and to suggest otherwise surely undermines the essence of civil liberties.

 

Regardless of my political leanings I look forward to being exposed to both sides of this and other contentious debates, particularly when relevant expert opinion is presented (linked to).

 

For example (though I can't provide a link, there are a dozen sources if you Google: Debunking the Covid Narrative - Professor Dolores Cahill)

 

Legal types fight like cats and dogs. IMO Sumption's narrative just doesn't stack up as reasonable for countering mitigation of Covid e.g. a subset of your quote above "it is the right and duty of every citizen to look and see what the scientists have said and analyse it for themselves and to draw common sense conclusions. We are all perfectly capable of doing" - that line of reasoning is fundamentally flawed just by reading some posts on this platform.

 

No wonder you cannot link to Debunking the Covid Narrative - Professor Dolores Cahill) as it has been removed by some major social media platforms - the Covid debate certainly brings to the fore some weirdo reasoning even from establishment types.

 

As a bit of relaxation you may like to listen to The Phantom Blues Band, as I am right now.

Edited May 26, 2020 by simple1

[Phil McCaverty]

1 hour ago, checkered flag said:

Did your GP also caution you also about alcohol in excess? 

Haven't had a drop of alcohol since mid March. Not my thing. Won't touch it until the bars open.

[ChouDoufu]

11 hours ago, checkered flag said:

Over 50 years ago it was mandatory that US troops in SEA take weeking doses to prevent malaria. It's been used for a very long time so it's risks are  well know. It was the primary drug to treat malaria then and is still used for some strains of malaria today (non P falc malaria). In high dosages many drugs can cause side effects, but are well documented. I think that either one of two things is happening: 1) this is to get back at Trump: or there is no big profit for big pharma, because it's generic. 

50 years ago (more or less) the department of defense tested nukular bombs ordering tens of thousands of soldiers and sailors to witness the tests within areas affected by radiation.

 

the tuskegee syphilis experiments were a particularly nasty affair.

 

and more recently soldiers were stationed in a former soviet chemical weapons dump, complete with x-files-esque black goo and glowing ponds

 

don't worry, the government says it's safe.  you'll be fine, soldier!