Trump pushes military response as U.S. girds for more protests

[kingdong]

9 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

‘The punk rock scene’.

 

Bless.

What was your favourite track,pretty vacant?

[rvaviator]

14 hours ago, Logosone said:

Mayor Bill de Blasio said Sunday morning that the members of the anarchist movement plan together online and that "they have explicit rules, and we're going to make all this information available today and in the days ahead."

 

New York's top terrorism official says there's evidence that members of anarchist groups from outside the city intentionally planned to incite violence at protests calling for justice in the death of George Floyd.

 

Deputy Commissioner for Intelligence and Counterterrorism John Miller said there is a high level of confidence within the NYPD that these unnamed groups had organized scouts, medics, and supply routes of rocks, bottles and accelerants for breakaway groups to commit vandalism and violence. There are strong indicators they planned for violence in advance using at times encrypted communications, he said.

 

https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/nypds-terrorism-chief-says-unnamed-groups-planned-protest-violence-in-advance/2440722/

 

Why does he not name the group?  I understand that you interpret what he is saying as this Antifa group ...

 

Why do you think he does not name them?  I am curious ...

[TopDeadSenter]

5 hours ago, simple1 said:

The end of trump's Presidency is crystallising. Jim Mattis has declared himself against trump,

 

“Donald Trump is the first president in my lifetime who does not try to unite the American people — does not even pretend to try,” 

 

“We are witnessing the consequences of three years of this deliberate effort. We are witnessing the consequences of three years without mature leadership. We can unite without him, drawing on the strengths inherent in our civil society. This will not be easy, as the past few days have shown, but we owe it to our fellow citizens; to past generations that bled to defend our promise; and to our children.”

 

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/06/james-mattis-denounces-trump-protests-militarization/612640/

1st time ever a fired employee has a chip on his shoulder?

[Logosone]

29 minutes ago, rvaviator said:

 

Why does he not name the group?  I understand that you interpret what he is saying as this Antifa group ...

 

Why do you think he does not name them?  I am curious ...

He has named the group as "anarchists", ie left wing extremists. Why does he not name exactly which Antifa group it is? Because he's an experienced and careful investigator and the investigation into which Antifa group is involved is most likely ongoing. Besides some of these Antifa groups are not like the Rose City Antifa Group, with a clear face and name. Some hide in the dark. Because they know they are criminals and would face heavy jail sentences. That is why they dress in black and hide their faces. To make it harder to be prosecuted.

 

How interesting to see so many on here support the vandalism and criminality of the Antifa groups. But that was hardly surprising.

[simple1]

15 minutes ago, TopDeadSenter said:

1st time ever a fired employee has a chip on his shoulder?

To be expected from you and similar from other trump supporters.

 

Mattis has held his tongue for a long time, now he is speaking out with trump's OTT recent behaviour, one would guess the straw that broke the camel's back. trump will need to be very careful how he responds to Mattis. If trump uses his M.O. of calling out people who disagree with him as traitors, scum and so, on I suggest will massively backfire if deployed against Mattis.

[Logosone]

10 hours ago, The Barmbeker said:

And your problem with all that is exactly...what?

Seriously...what is your problem!

They are a) a minority group, most likely smaller than the also better organized facist groups in the US (you know...the ones you constantlt ignore!) and b) they are called ANTIFA becauser it is short for anti- fascist! So you have a problem with people declaring themselves ANTI FASCISTS?

As opposed to what?

People who swallow the Antifa's sale pitch 'we're only against racism and fascists' are naive and fail to see what Antifa is actually about. We can see that all over the USA now, as they cause targeted and planned vandalism, as John Miller of the NYPD has shown. 

 

What Antifa wants is to overthrow the US government. Antifa want revolution. They want destruction. Physical Injury and murder are no problem for them and perfectly justified, because they are fanatics.

 

We've all seen with Cambodia, Russia, and Cuba how well far left fantasies pan out. 

 

Anyone who supports the vandalism, beatings and murders frankly should move to Cuba.

[Opl]

11 minutes ago, Logosone said:

He has named the group as "anarchists", ie left wing extremists. Why does he not name exactly which Antifa group it is? Because he's an experience careful investigator and the investigation into which Antifa group is involved is most likely ongoing. Besides some of these Antifa groups are not like the Rose City Antifa Group, with a clear face and name. Some hide in the dark. Because they know they are criminals and would face heavy jail sentences. That is why they dress in black and hide their faces. To make it harder to be prosecuted.

 

How interesting to see so many on here support the vandalism and criminality of the Antifa groups. But that was hardly surprising.

I've stopped counting how many times you possibly promoted/repeated "Antifa" in all your posts .. just like you did with the german test

Trump mentioned " Antifa and others", the second segment remains to be named

[sonos99]

3 men arrested . Members of rightwing group.

 

Link to Justice dept announcement 

 

https://www.justice.gov/usao-nv/pr/joint-terrorism-task-force-charges-three-men-who-allegedly-sought-exploit-protests-las

[simple1]

 

3 minutes ago, Logosone said:

<SNIP> We've all seen with Cambodia, Russia, and Cuba how well far left fantasies pan out. 

 

Anyone who supports the vandalism, beatings and murders frankly should move to Cuba.

Whatever your opinions are of Antifa they are not pro authoritarian political ideologies. So far on this forum I have not observed any support for "vandalism, beatings and murders". Accordingly your comment is inflammatory.

[Logosone]

Antifa and anarchists have hijacked Floyd protests but left won't admit it

 

Indeed, when Attorney General William Barr correctly observed that the rioting shows “antifa like tactics,” politicians and media figures both balked at the suggestion, as opposed to accepting the white supremacist or Russian option. Despite reports of antifa followers and anarchists being arrested, White House correspondent Yamiche Alcindor objected that there was “no evidence” of any activity sparked by anarchists.

https://thehill.com/opinion/civil-rights/500605-antifa-and-anarchists-have-hijacked-floyd-protests-but-left-wont-admit-it

 

[Logosone]

Police say that they arrested members of ANTIFA and numerous people from outside of the Richmond area and Virginia.

 

https://wjla.com/news/local/richmond-police-arrests-sunday-night-antifa

[Yinn]

1 hour ago, Chou Anou said:

The "small" problem being...American citizens who have dark skin being murdered by police for forging a check? Hundreds of years of empowering a small band of racists (with badges) to murder African Americans at will? Is that what you're saying?

No. 

I saying smash and steal from small business, burning and kill 12 more people isnot good solution. 

Stupid

[sonos99]

11 minutes ago, Logosone said:

Antifa and anarchists have hijacked Floyd protests but left won't admit it

 

Indeed, when Attorney General William Barr correctly observed that the rioting shows “antifa like tactics,” politicians and media figures both balked at the suggestion, as opposed to accepting the white supremacist or Russian option. Despite reports of antifa followers and anarchists being arrested, White House correspondent Yamiche Alcindor objected that there was “no evidence” of any activity sparked by anarchists.

https://thehill.com/opinion/civil-rights/500605-antifa-and-anarchists-have-hijacked-floyd-protests-but-left-wont-admit-it

 

And those on the right refuse to admit rightwing groups are also involved

 

https://www.justice.gov/usao-nv/pr/joint-terrorism-task-force-charges-three-men-who-allegedly-sought-exploit-protests-las

[OneMoreFarang]

 

 

James Mattis condemns Trump’s handling of George Floyd protests

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jun/03/james-mattis-comdemns-trump-george-floyd-protests

 

In his statement on Wednesday evening, Mattis said: “Donald Trump is the first president in my lifetime who does not try to unite the American people – does not even pretend to try. Instead he tries to divide us. We are witnessing the consequences of three years of this deliberate effort. 

 

[sonos99]

Esper next to go after publically disagreeing with Trump ?

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/03/esper-still-defense-secretary-at-the-moment-white-house-says-despite-trump-anger.html

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, kingdong said:

I thought the protests were about the death of a negro who died whilst being restrained?if a criminal act occurred it must be dealt with by a court of law,not by mob rule,seems a lot of the protests seem to be about Trump being president,perhaps this tragedy will wake a few Americans up to the fact of what a dangerous job the police have to do,I am not pro police and detest bullies but I wouldn,t like to do their job.again I say I hope this unfortunate death is resolved in a court of law.

It seems this "unfortunate death", now officially called murder, happens too often in the USA. And often the police is not held responsible for their action.

Police officers are supposed to follow the law. Excessive force is not part of the law. If they don't want to follow the law or think they are above the law they should not be police officers.

 

I am not against the police in general. They are necessary and sometimes they have a difficult job. And their behavior makes a big difference of how people feel about the police. People like fair and just police. They don't like brutal and racist police. That's why they demonstrate on the streets.

 

And the looting is obviously very bad and the police should stop it. But that looting has little to do with the actual protest.

Protesters have signs and they shout slogans. Looters loot. It's easy to see the difference. 

[johnpetersen]

2 hours ago, Logosone said:

Arrests in the highest ranks of Antifa are imminent, as Antifa aim to take the rioting to the suburbs:

 

"Agitators behind the rioting that has paralyzed the country over the past week want to move into more suburban areas, a government intelligence source has told Fox News. Much of the worry stems from the notion that many in well-armed, suburban, and rural neighborhoods won't hesitate to exercise their Second Amendment rights and elevated anxieties could lead to heavy confrontation.

 

"Antifa knows this," said the source, who spoke on the condition of anonymity. "Local and state authorities have to get a grip on this because if it moves to the suburbs, more people will die."

 

But even before riots exploded across the United States in the aftermath of George Floyd's death, federal and local officials have long been investigating the inner workings and revenue stream of the anarchist, left-wing outfit.

 

And arrests among its highest ranks may be imminent.

 

Intelligence sources pointed out that indictments have been building for some time, and a close examination of funding revenues remains under the microscope. While Antifa operates as something of a leaderless militant wing, sources closely engaged in the matter said that there are identifiable top brass driving and inciting criminal activity.

 

https://www.foxnews.com/us/antifa-arrests-coming-riots-suburbs

You'll note that in the final paragraph it's grudgingly acknowledged that "While Antifa operates as something of a leaderless militant wing..." As usual, when it comes to social turmoil, the right wants to place the blame on some sinister organization.  This kind of conspiratorial blame-shifting has a long history dating back to the times when unions began to organize in the late 19th century and continuing through the civil rights protests of the sixties and opposition to the Vietnam War.

[Chomper Higgot]

2 hours ago, Logosone said:

Arrests in the highest ranks of Antifa are imminent, as Antifa aim to take the rioting to the suburbs:

 

"Agitators behind the rioting that has paralyzed the country over the past week want to move into more suburban areas, a government intelligence source has told Fox News. Much of the worry stems from the notion that many in well-armed, suburban, and rural neighborhoods won't hesitate to exercise their Second Amendment rights and elevated anxieties could lead to heavy confrontation.

 

"Antifa knows this," said the source, who spoke on the condition of anonymity. "Local and state authorities have to get a grip on this because if it moves to the suburbs, more people will die."

 

But even before riots exploded across the United States in the aftermath of George Floyd's death, federal and local officials have long been investigating the inner workings and revenue stream of the anarchist, left-wing outfit.

 

And arrests among its highest ranks may be imminent.

 

Intelligence sources pointed out that indictments have been building for some time, and a close examination of funding revenues remains under the microscope. While Antifa operates as something of a leaderless militant wing, sources closely engaged in the matter said that there are identifiable top brass driving and inciting criminal activity.

 

https://www.foxnews.com/us/antifa-arrests-coming-riots-suburbs

Fox News and their ‘Intelligence sources’.

 

Has it occurred to you that when Trump

injected the Second Amendment into the discourse it was he, Trump, that was agitating for violence?

 

And here you are parroting references to Second Amendment.

[Logosone]

15 minutes ago, johnpetersen said:

You'll note that in the final paragraph it's grudgingly acknowledged that "While Antifa operates as something of a leaderless militant wing..." As usual, when it comes to social turmoil, the right wants to place the blame on some sinister organization.  This kind of conspiratorial blame-shifting has a long history dating back to the times when unions began to organize in the late 19th century and continuing through the civil rights protests of the sixties and opposition to the Vietnam War.

Oh please, Antifa is a sinister organization. They kill, injure, beat people up, and as we can see here they vandalise, terrorise and burn neighbourhoods. As they have done many times before. The Antifa is basically the terror arm of the left.

 

They dress in black hoodies and wear masks so that they can not be identified easily because they would be prosecuted for what they do, inciting violence and terrorising cities.

 

They are indeed a domestic terrorist organisation and hopefully after this a way will be found to pursue Antifa as the terrorist organization they are.

 

Anyone who defends, supports or encourages Antifa terrorists will then of course have to be very careful. That is one good thing that will come out of this Antifa led chaos, the will to go after Antifa will be as strong as never before and laws will no doubt be put in place to make their activities, supporters and crimes a thing of the past.

 

 

 

 

[Logosone]

10 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

“Donald Trump is the first president in my lifetime who does not try to unite the American people—does not even pretend to try.

https://amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/612640/

Well Mattis was fired in humiliating circumstances, no wonder he's having a dig.

 

However, he's totally wrong of course, the massive division of left and right was growing long before Trump came to power, and what's more, is visible in the UK, Germany, France, everywhere. 

 

It's a polarisation that was not caused by Trump at all.

[Traubert]

12 hours ago, teatime101 said:

Who would have imagined 'anti-fascist' would be seen as  a bad thing after WWII? It just shows how much fascism, aka the militant right, has taken over (or heading in that direction) in countries like India, UK, USA, Australia, China, NK, Brazil, Poland, Russia (to name the more obvious ones) and how much demonising of 'the left' has come to dominate political discourse.

Nationalists, neo-liberals, religious extremists, global corporations (and let's not forget Rupert Murdoch)- they're all working for the same end: maximum power and maximum profits.

The militant right have not taken over in China. Nor is it heading in that direction.

 

That I promise you.

[Eric Loh]

22 minutes ago, Logosone said:

Well Mattis was fired in humiliating circumstances, no wonder he's having a dig.

 

However, he's totally wrong of course, the massive division of left and right was growing long before Trump came to power, and what's more, is visible in the UK, Germany, France, everywhere. 

 

It's a polarisation that was not caused by Trump at all.

Not the cause but worse. Trump enhanced the polarization and fragmentation of the left and right and race relations with his toxic governance and rhetoric. 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/global-opinions/were-polarized-and-fragmented-at-the-same-time-trump-likes-that/2019/10/30/c2918bb4-fb48-11e9-8190-6be4deb56e01_story.html

 

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/4/9/18302159/trump-racism-race-relations-pew-survey

[simple1]

1 hour ago, Logosone said:

Oh please, Antifa is a sinister organization. They kill, injure, beat people up, and as we can see here they vandalise, terrorise and burn neighbourhoods. As they have done many times before. The Antifa is basically the terror arm of the left.

 

They dress in black hoodies and wear masks so that they can not be identified easily because they would be prosecuted for what they do, inciting violence and terrorising cities.

 

They are indeed a domestic terrorist organisation and hopefully after this a way will be found to pursue Antifa as the terrorist organization they are.

 

Anyone who defends, supports or encourages Antifa terrorists will then of course have to be very careful. That is one good thing that will come out of this Antifa led chaos, the will to go after Antifa will be as strong as never before and laws will no doubt be put in place to make their activities, supporters and crimes a thing of the past.

One assumes you're consciously ignoring the various reports pointing to far right groups encouraging and participating in violence; some examples below. Additionally I guess you're unaware anarchist ideology emanates from both the left and right extremes of politics. Got links to credible news reports Antifa members have been convicted for murder in the US?

 

• an internal FBI situation report, the bureau’s Washington, DC, field office “has no intelligence indicating Antifa involvement/presence” in the violence that took place that day.
• However, the FBI and other government agencies warn that far-right white supremacist groups will use the protests to incite violence and attack federal agents.

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/fbi-no-intelligence-antifa-weekend-violence-george-floyd-protests-2020-6?r=US&IR=T

 

https://www.voanews.com/usa/four-extremist-groups-suspected-involvement-protest-violence

[stevenl]

58 minutes ago, Logosone said:

Well Mattis was fired in humiliating circumstances, no wonder he's having a dig.

 

However, he's totally wrong of course, the massive division of left and right was growing long before Trump came to power, and what's more, is visible in the UK, Germany, France, everywhere. 

 

It's a polarisation that was not caused by Trump at all.

He didn't claim it was caused by Trump, he claims Trump is not trying to unite. Which imo is correct.

 

Your claim that he is wring is wrong, objectively, factually.

[Logosone]

38 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

Not the cause but worse. Trump enhanced the polarization and fragmentation of the left and right and race relations with his toxic governance and rhetoric. 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/global-opinions/were-polarized-and-fragmented-at-the-same-time-trump-likes-that/2019/10/30/c2918bb4-fb48-11e9-8190-6be4deb56e01_story.html

 

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/4/9/18302159/trump-racism-race-relations-pew-survey

Race relations in the US were always a problem. It's a historic fact that race riots break out with regularity in the US, many of us still remember the Rodney King riots in 1992 (when in fact the military were called in and restored order, so not sure why this is an issue now when the protests are much worse in scale).

 

Watts, Cincinatti, Newark, LA, let's not pretend this is an issue caused by Trump. I know many people dislike Trump intensely and want to blame him for everything from Nazism to slavery, but the truth is race riots happened in the US under many other presidents.

 

What really happened here? A store employee called police to ask for help because he believed a black man had paid with a fake dollar bill, refused to return  a purchased item, was awfully drunk and "not in control of himself". The police came and restrained George Floyd who had been violent. The police caused his death with excessive force, as US police are often prone to do (on any colour suspect).

 

So, big protests, justifiably so. The protests are then hijacked by political activists mainly from the left, but also right, by looters. This has gone way beyond justifiable protests. The people who ignited the violence have to be to blame. Not Trump. He's trying to put out the fire which looters, left wing antifa activists and right wing activists have caused.

 

There's people looting businesses, burning cars and shooting fellow Americans but Trump's tweets are to blame? Come on, please, be serious.

 

 

[ChouDoufu]

17 hours ago, simple1 said:

"Unnamed groups" and also referred to anarchists, as Federal people are claiming yet to be empirically determined who is who. As already mentioned far right groups have taken on the identity of Antifa for agitation and  propaganda purposes. Personally I believe the unrest will be determined to originate from criminals, together with left and right wing extremist groups. Responsibility for damage and violence by political orientation will eventually be informed to the public.

unless the official stated "left-wing" anarchists, it's just quote mining.

 

plenty of right wing groups - kkk, militias, sovereign citizens, white nationalists, anti-taxers, anti-you name it, etc - that could theoretically see violent protests or a potential race war advancing their cause.

[metisdead]

Some off topic posts, troll posts and the replies have been removed.

 

Some posts in violation of fair use policy have either been edited or removed:

 

14) You will not post any copyrighted material except as fair use laws apply (as in the case of news articles). Please only post a link, the headline and the first three sentences.

[Opl]

19 minutes ago, Logosone said:

There's people looting businesses, burning cars and shooting fellow Americans but Trump's tweets are to blame? Come on, please, be serious.

Not Trump's tweet...

A Twitter account claiming to belong to a national “antifa” organization and pushing violent rhetoric related to ongoing protests has been linked to the white nationalist group Identity Evropa, according to a Twitter spokesperson.

https://www.factcheck.org/2020/06/viral-tweet-alert-wasnt-from-antifa/

 

[Logosone]

Probably more the criminals on the ground who actually did the crimes that are to blame:

 

"Police say that they arrested members of ANTIFA and numerous people from outside of the Richmond area and Virginia."

 

https://wjla.com/news/local/richmond-police-arrests-sunday-night-antifa

[CorpusChristie]

24 minutes ago, Opl said:

Not Trump's tweet...

A Twitter account claiming to belong to a national “antifa” organization and pushing violent rhetoric related to ongoing protests has been linked to the white nationalist group Identity Evropa, according to a Twitter spokesperson.

https://www.factcheck.org/2020/06/viral-tweet-alert-wasnt-from-antifa/

 

The people doing the looting are solely to blame for their actions .

A Twitter account isn't doing the looting