Digital Nomad Visa in Estonia - Thailand next?

[wasabi]

With a likely permanent increase in people working remotely and the obvious draw of digital nomads to Thailand I think such visas in Thailand would be a bigger draw than 'High end tourists' 

 

https://sifted.eu/articles/digital-nomad-visa-estonia/

 

Approved by the Estonian parliament on June 3, this visa will allow location-independent knowledge workers to live in Estonia for up to a year while working for employers or clients outside of the country, ushering in a new era of work — one where knowledge workers aren’t tied to one desk or even one continent

[NanLaew]

Nice weather too.

 

Right now I mean.

[BritTim]

Estonia is leading the world in many aspects of the digital economy. Thailand is not. Thailand might provide a digital nomad visa in the future (perhaps ten years from now) but do not expect any swift action.

[NanLaew]

If they do, digital snowbirds could then flit between Tallinn and Bangkok.

[kingofthemountain]

Thailand is not interested at all in a ''digital nomads visa''

for some valid reasons the thai authorities are afraid of a

flux of boiler rooms and other internet scams runned by

indians and chineses under the cover of this type of visa. 

[PerkinsCuthbert]

Why would the Thai government be interested in such an insignificant cohort when local tax collection on earnings would be almost impossible?

[chainarong]

5 hours ago, kingofthemountain said:

Thailand is not interested at all in a ''digital nomads visa''

for some valid reasons the thai authorities are afraid of a

flux of boiler rooms and other internet scams runned by

indians and chineses under the cover of this type of visa. 

What Thai needs to concentrate on is a 12 month retirement visa ( RV) with no reporting, similar to Cambodia, with no strings attached 

[JackThompson]

 

3 hours ago, PerkinsCuthbert said:

Why would the Thai government be interested in such an insignificant cohort when local tax collection on earnings would be almost impossible?

As-is, they get nothing.  But stop blocking the self-employed (large and fast-growing labor sector) from spending their money here, and they get the spending AND vat-taxes paid on it, plus VAT paid on the Thai salaries funded by that spending.  Charge ~10K Baht/yr for the extension, and they get that as well.  Throw in paying income-tax on a minimum amount, to qualify for the next extensions, and they can also put that in the till.  It's all up-side. 

 

The only question, is how to structure it so most of the income goes to a few cronies, and doesn't help actual Thais in any way.  If it helps poorer Thais have upward mobility, they will torpedo it - just like they did with their "tourist" crackdowns, which focused on tour-groups, whose spending funds "connected" (Chinese owned) businesses, who pay the worst wages. 

Edited June 22, 2020 by JackThompson

[moontang]

look how disrespectful they are to volunteers willing to help Thais for free...too many tried to abuse it, just like Ed visas.  if you are really making good money, an elite visa is cheaper than two cups of Starbucks per day.  And you have zero worries about pay I g income taxes in Thailand.  Estonia is a country of 1.4 million..finally a worse comparison than the Scandies.  And it is so cold there, no one wants to be near the place 6 months of the year.  The ones I have known would drink rubbing alcohol...

[LivinLOS]

23 hours ago, JackThompson said:

 

As-is, they get nothing.  But stop blocking the self-employed (large and fast-growing labor sector) from spending their money here, and they get the spending AND vat-taxes paid on it, plus VAT paid on the Thai salaries funded by that spending.  Charge ~10K Baht/yr for the extension, and they get that as well.  Throw in paying income-tax on a minimum amount, to qualify for the next extensions, and they can also put that in the till.  It's all up-side. 

 

The only question, is how to structure it so most of the income goes to a few cronies, and doesn't help actual Thais in any way.  If it helps poorer Thais have upward mobility, they will torpedo it - just like they did with their "tourist" crackdowns, which focused on tour-groups, whose spending funds "connected" (Chinese owned) businesses, who pay the worst wages. 

I would say more like 10k a month, paid 3 monthly extensions.. 

But they would have hell to pay with other tax jurisdictions if they created a flat tax.. Estonia takes a healthy % of turnover and demands all income goes through your estonian accounts / books (I am sure people fiddle it but the rules are there) Its not a cheap solution for a self employed worker to take up this Estonian process, much easier to run a offshore or hong kong company if evasion is the goal. 

[moontang]

8 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

I would say more like 10k a month, paid 3 monthly extensions.. 

But they would have hell to pay with other tax jurisdictions if they created a flat tax.. Estonia takes a healthy % of turnover and demands all income goes through your estonian accounts / books (I am sure people fiddle it but the rules are there) Its not a cheap solution for a self employed worker to take up this Estonian process, much easier to run a offshore or hong kong company if evasion is the goal. 

Avoidance is a nicer term, and 100% legal.  

[Letseng]

On 6/22/2020 at 4:51 AM, BritTim said:

Estonia is leading the world in many aspects of the digital economy. Thailand is not. Thailand might provide a digital nomad visa in the future (perhaps ten years from now) but do not expect any swift action.

But digital nomads are no big spenders. High end tourists are.

[redpill17]

Is there really a need for special "digital nomad visa"? Just let self-employed foreigners to register a company and apply for business visa/WP.

[DrJack54]

On 6/22/2020 at 10:17 AM, kingofthemountain said:

Thailand is not interested at all in a ''digital nomads visa''

for some valid reasons the thai authorities are afraid of a

flux of boiler rooms and other internet scams runned by

indians and chineses under the cover of this type of visa. 

Perfectly summed up along with following post #6.

Just another nonsense thread.

[Max69xl]

Are you saying that digital nomads are big spenders? I beg to differ. 

[DrJack54]

1 minute ago, Max69xl said:

Are you saying that digital nomads are big spenders? I beg to differ. 

Your correct. They can make a living in a less expensive country than their own. That's the plan.

Best let the poor nomads struggle on various tourist visas and VE

[wasabi]

Most Digital Nomads staying longer than a year are either using Elite visas, a business visa or a service like Igloo where they'll act as your employer for a fee. I am not saying Elite visas can legally be used for this purpose only that is likely a common way for them to stay here. Igloo comes at a significant cost and the business visas may be too much hassle for many.

 

I think these choices only capture a small part of the market. A digital nomad visa could require taxes paid to Thailand or some type of recurring maintenance fee and ultimately be more lucrative than all the previous options. The government can yearn for Thailand 4.0 but fact is they are behind most of these digital nomads and keeping them in the shadows can't be helping. Bring them out of the shadows and Thailand can make more money from them and possibly benefit from some of their knowledgeable rubbing off on Thai people. They may not be spending as much as high end tourists but they are not cheap charlie's either when it comes to dining and taking vacations. I can't see any legitimate threat these people pose to Thais if their employers are foreign based.

[drbeach]

On 6/22/2020 at 9:51 AM, BritTim said:

Estonia is leading the world in many aspects of the digital economy. Thailand is not. Thailand might provide a digital nomad visa in the future (perhaps ten years from now) but do not expect any swift action.

I concur with you. 5-10 years from now sounds about right. Thailand will catch up eventually, but as we know, it's not exactly a leader in things technology.

[Stadtler]

18 hours ago, Max69xl said:

Are you saying that digital nomads are big spenders? I beg to differ.

Tell Stadtler about your expertise to make this statement.

[pineapple01]

They are worse than the so called Teachers here.

[kingofthemountain]

57 minutes ago, wasabi said:

Bring them out of the shadows and Thailand can make more money from them and possibly benefit from some of their knowledgeable rubbing off on Thai people.

Good luck with this one

the essential motivation for most of them to stay ''nomads'' 

is to avoid to pay any taxes or contributions to a state 

and the Thais are well aware of this fact.

Edited June 24, 2020 by kingofthemountain

[robblok]

Im sure the OAPs would not like it if there were digital nomads coming here. They would have similar income but far better looks. Poor old guys no wonder they always get their panties in a twist when they hear the word digital nomad. 

[robblok]

7 minutes ago, kingofthemountain said:

Good luck with this one

the essential motivation for most of them to stay ''nomads'' 

is to avoid to pay any taxes or contributions to a state 

and the Thais are well aware of this fact.

With the same token one could just remove the retirees. I mean they dont pay taxes here too. Why keep them. 

[kingofthemountain]

1 minute ago, robblok said:

With the same token one could just remove the retirees. I mean they dont pay taxes here too. Why keep them. 

I can not say Thailand try to keep them

making everything they can to make retire in Thailand

something difficult and costly. 

But at least with the retirees they can have some proof of income

or a nice deposit. How many digital nomads can\want put 800 000 in a Thai bank all year long?

[timendres]

1 hour ago, wasabi said:

The government can yearn for Thailand 4.0 but fact is they are behind most of these digital nomads and keeping them in the shadows can't be helping.

Few, if any, digital nomads have much of anything to offer Thais in the way of talent or education. Possibly, 10 years ago, but not today.

[robblok]

3 minutes ago, kingofthemountain said:

I can not say Thailand try to keep them

making everything they can to make retire in Thailand

something difficult and costly. 

But at least with the retirees they can have some proof of income

or a nice deposit. How many digital nomads can\want put 800 000 in a Thai bank all year long?

I think many can.. why not make the same rules. Or are you afraid of a bit of competition. 

 

 

[rumak]

12 minutes ago, robblok said:

Poor old guys no wonder they always get their panties in a twist when they hear the word digital nomad. 

just hearing the word digital is enough to get my cheeks to tighten up .  No thanks

[kingofthemountain]

2 minutes ago, robblok said:

I think many can.. why not make the same rules. Or are you afraid of a bit of competition. 

 

 

I don't do the rules in Thailand

if the Thais have fixed an age limit (50 yo) it is for a reason

(And a good reason imo) they want to reserve the jobs in Thailand to the Thais.

And i am not afraid in any way of a competition, with who and for what? The girls?

Lol there is not shortage of pussycats here, and there not will be in the next years

everyone is welcome to the party

[robblok]

1 minute ago, kingofthemountain said:

I don't do the rules in Thailand

if the Thais have fixed an age limit (50 yo) it is for a reason

(And a good reason imo) they want to reserve the jobs in Thailand to the Thais.

And i am not afraid in any way of a competition, with who and for what? The girls?

Lol there is not shortage of pussycats here, and there not will be in the next years

everyone is welcome to the party

YOu seem to swing like a leave in the wind. First you say they don't have the money. Then when i suggest no age limit you come back with you not making the rules. Seems like  an other old guy afraid of some competition with younger guys. 

 

 

[kingofthemountain]

2 minutes ago, robblok said:

YOu seem to swing like a leave in the wind. First you say they don't have the money. Then when i suggest no age limit you come back with you not making the rules. Seems like  an other old guy afraid of some competition with younger guys. 

 

 

You should read better

i don't see any swing in my answer

if they have the money, they can buy an elite visa

wich doesn't require an age limit, i don't see where is the problem

and again i am not afraid of any competition, you are just over estimating

your seduction power based only on the age