UK ready to quit EU on 'Australia terms' if no Brexit deal, Johnson says

[7by7]

1 hour ago, kingdong said:

you forgot the red bus

Indeed, another Leave campaign lie.

[7by7]

55 minutes ago, bannork said:

<snip>

There's a certain fascination in watching a reckless driver career down the road, knowing a crash is inevitable.

As a passenger on that bus, fascination is not the word I'd use!

[7by7]

7 minutes ago, nauseus said:

I haven't changed anything. You have misquoted me and you should stop. 

I have not altered anything you have posted in anyway. 

[welovesundaysatspace]

 

Quote

 

Don't you want to convert me and others to your viewpoint?

“Fundamentalism is believing something so deeply that new facts can’t sway your opinion. (...) Fundamentalists counter facts with violent emotion, scorn, or even–as in Galileo’s case–physical violence. Therefore, it’s not a good idea to argue with fundamentalists. Facts won’t matter, and the more effective your argument, the more violent the response, self-righteously driven by a conviction that you are not just wrong, you are despicable and immoral.“ (https://drkeithwitt.com/do-not-argue-with-fundamentalists-and-heres-why/)

 

— you’re wasting your time trying to have a discussion with those fanatics. 
 

 

 

Edited July 16, 2020 by welovesundaysatspace

[Loiner]

7 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 Instead of posting feeble excuses and put downs, why not really put me in my place and show everyone how you are far more knowledgeable on this subject than I by actually providing some real, concrete benefits of Brexit to the UK and us British citizens who actually live here?

 

Even if doing so means repeating yourself, surely that is no hardship for such an enthusiastic proselytiser of Brexit as yourself?

 

Don't you want to convert me and others to your viewpoint?

Already told you - I don't dance for you. I've seen you try that trick too many times. 

 

I'm sure you are the unconvertible, so I won't waste my time trying that. I will be happy to keep telling you that you are wrong, Brexit has happened, we will end the transition without major capitulation, democracy will be seen to be done, I don't care about your viewpoint and you all lost.

[melvinmelvin]

7 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

As a passenger on that bus, fascination is not the word I'd use!

that bus deserves a place in British Museum - that bus ending up in a chiang kong would not be good

several "thingies" from the campaigns should be saved for the future and displayed in misc. musea

 

would enable sods of the future to learn from past straying off common sense

 

[Loiner]

5 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

 

 

— you’re wasting your time trying to have a discussion with those fanatics. 
 

 

 

I know, but you're all still at it.

[welovesundaysatspace]

2 minutes ago, Loiner said:

I know, but you're all still at it.

Mocking Brexiteers is great entertainment ???? I feel for the Brits who will be suffering from this, but for me it’s been a very amusing 4 years so far, and it can only get better once the lorries start piling up. 

[Loiner]

1 minute ago, melvinmelvin said:

that bus deserves a place in British Museum - that bus ending up in a chiang kong would not be good

several "thingies" from the campaigns should be saved for the future and displayed in misc. musea

 

would enable sods of the future to learn from past straying off common sense

 

It must go down in PR history as one of the best advertising campaigns ever. Pity that it probably got more airtime and media publicity after the referendum than before it!

A mere forgettable sideshow for it's target audience, but right up there with those who were never ever going to vote Leave anyway. They still cannot stop talking about it.

[bannork]

28 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

As a passenger on that bus, fascination is not the word I'd use!

Too true, far better to be a long distance observer. 

[nauseus]

36 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

I have not altered anything you have posted in anyway. 

You have misquoted me and changed the context of what I have said by adding in the word 'completely'. Time to stop your nonsense now.

 

Here is the relevant part of your post 1583 (p106) for reference:

 

But all of this is very different to your original assertion that the treaty did away with the veto completely when replying to @Rookiescot

Edited July 16, 2020 by nauseus
ADDED Here is a part .......

[kingdong]

1 hour ago, 7by7 said:

Indeed, another Leave campaign lie.

what the 37  million pounds a week it costs the uk to be in the eu? oh i forgot we get thirty bob a week back and are told how and where to spend it.

Edited July 16, 2020 by kingdong

[kingdong]

57 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

Indeed, another Leave campaign lie.

what the 37 million pounds it costs britain every week to be a member of the eu? oh i forgot,we get back a rebate of thirty bob a week and are told when and how to spend it.

[kingdong]

38 minutes ago, Loiner said:

It must go down in PR history as one of the best advertising campaigns ever. Pity that it probably got more airtime and media publicity after the referendum than before it!

A mere forgettable sideshow for it's target audience, but right up there with those who were never ever going to vote Leave anyway. They still cannot stop talking about it.

they,re still harping on about it to this day,they,re obsessed.

[kingdong]

1 hour ago, 7by7 said:

As a passenger on that bus, fascination is not the word I'd use!

missed your stop did you?

[nauseus]

32 minutes ago, kingdong said:

what the 37 million pounds it costs britain every week to be a member of the eu? oh i forgot,we get back a rebate of thirty bob a week and are told when and how to spend it.

It was a lot more than that. 

[Rookiescot]

On 7/14/2020 at 5:05 PM, nauseus said:

 

The other members - i.e. the remaining 27 of today. The EU itself, is the institution of political and economic union that members have become part of.

 

Yes, the members are split re the degree of federalism, political integration AND economic integration that they want to accept.

 

But the EU project goal is for total political and economic integration into a single state.   

 

On 7/14/2020 at 5:22 PM, Rookiescot said:

And every one of those 27 members have a veto which they can use any time they dont like something.

How do you know that the EU wants to become a single state?

 

 

On 7/14/2020 at 7:14 PM, nauseus said:

No. They don't anymore. You should read the Lisbon Treaty too. 

 

On 7/14/2020 at 9:04 PM, Rookiescot said:

Nonsense. Every country (and a few regions) all retain their veto.

Why are you saying they do not?

Please point out where in the Lisbon Treaty that veto was removed.

 

On 7/15/2020 at 12:19 AM, nauseus said:

Start reading. Take your time.

 

On 7/15/2020 at 8:44 AM, Rookiescot said:

So you cant point out anywhere in the Lisbon treaty which removes a countries ability to veto.

 

On 7/15/2020 at 10:15 AM, nauseus said:

Start with Articles 16 and 238. To tell you more could be risky.

 

On 7/15/2020 at 4:00 PM, nauseus said:

Well, they are quite forgettable.

 

Finished your homework yet?

 

On 7/15/2020 at 4:09 PM, Rookiescot said:

What homework?

Oh you mean the BS you came out with about countries not having a veto?

OK yeah so they moved a lot of less important issues into a majority vote. But countries still have a veto over more important issues. As you pointed out with your example of another less important issue being moved to majority vote.

Of course if you are right then you will no longer be able to claim that Spain will veto Scotlands application to join the EU wont you?

Or are you still going to be claiming that?

 

On 7/15/2020 at 4:57 PM, nauseus said:

If you had read it you would know that it is not BS. If you think that control of foreign policy is not an important 'issue' for the UK, then I am obviously wasting my time. I have not commented on Spain in these Brexit threads, except to comment on the wasteful practises of their fishermen. 

 

 

 

On 7/15/2020 at 5:46 PM, Rookiescot said:

Excellent news. Spain no longer has a veto over Scotland joining the EU.

That's correct isn't it?

 

On 7/15/2020 at 6:06 PM, nauseus said:

You said it  not me.

 

On 7/15/2020 at 6:08 PM, Rookiescot said:

You have not answered the question.

Would Spain have the power of veto over a Scottish application to join the EU?

Yes or no?

 

On 7/15/2020 at 8:54 PM, nauseus said:

What's this? The Spanish Inquisition? ????

 

On 7/15/2020 at 9:49 PM, Rookiescot said:

Nobody expects the Spanish inquisition. 

However a simple yes or no to my question would suffice.

Could the Spanish veto an independent Scotlands entry to the EU if they wanted to?

 

22 hours ago, nauseus said:

You can turn the bright lights off now. I already told you that my only mention of Spain was to do with fishing.

 

You frequently demand answers but offer little evidence for your arguments(?) in return. That is rude.

 

Back to my JD.

 

14 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Could Spain, or indeed any other EU country, veto an independent Scotlands application to join the EU?

Yes or no?

So there you have it.

You claimed the EU goal was "total political and economic integration into a single state".

I then said "And every one of those 27 members have a veto which they can use any time they dont like something".

You then said "No. They don't anymore. You should read the Lisbon Treaty too".

 

You then became quite evasive over what it was you had actually said but its clear. You were saying that when it comes to "total political and economic integration into a single state" no country has a veto.

Which is wrong.

You then refused to answer my question about Spain (or any other country in the EU) having a veto over a Scottish application to join. This is because admitting such a thing would have undermined your argument that all countries in the EU no longer had a veto on such matters.

 

I hope this has jogged your memory of events and you will now be able to remember.

Happy to help. 

 

[7by7]

1 hour ago, Loiner said:

Already told you - I don't dance for you. I've seen you try that trick too many times. 

 

I'm sure you are the unconvertible, so I won't waste my time trying that. I will be happy to keep telling you that you are wrong, Brexit has happened, we will end the transition without major capitulation, democracy will be seen to be done, I don't care about your viewpoint and you all lost.

And you are still incapable of explaining why this is a good thing for the UK! Still incapable of giving even one single benefit Brexit will bring to the UK!

 

You are also ignoring the 53% (probably more now) of voters who said last December that want a say on the final deal. How is that democracy being seen to be done?

 

Like all Brexiteers, you only like democracy when you agree with the majority!

[7by7]

1 hour ago, Loiner said:

I know, but you're all still at it.

 It's called democracy; something you only approve of when it suits you.

[7by7]

1 hour ago, nauseus said:

You have misquoted me and changed the context of what I have said by adding in the word 'completely'. Time to stop your nonsense now.

 

Here is the relevant part of your post 1583 (p106) for reference:

 

But all of this is very different to your original assertion that the treaty did away with the veto completely when replying to @Rookiescot

Not misquoting; paraphrasing.

 

You did not use the word 'completely,' but in the context of your posts and those you were responding to, you appeared to have meant it! 

 

Even if you didn't but simply poorly worded your responses; anyone who knows anything about the treaty knows that the policy areas referred to are still subject to veto; despite your attempts to say otherwise.

 

Yes, it is time you stopped your nonsense. Read the links to Full Fact; read the links to the FCO with an open mind. If you refuse to believe links I have provided, do some research yourself. Do that and you will then see you have been fed lies and myths about the treaty.

 

[7by7]

1 hour ago, kingdong said:

2 hours ago, 7by7 said:

Indeed, another Leave campaign lie.

what the 37  million pounds a week it costs the uk to be in the eu? oh i forgot we get thirty bob a week back and are told how and where to spend it

 

No, the £350 million a week lie pasted all over Boris's bus. That lie.

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, Rookiescot said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So there you have it.

You claimed the EU goal was "total political and economic integration into a single state".

I then said "And every one of those 27 members have a veto which they can use any time they dont like something".

You then said "No. They don't anymore. You should read the Lisbon Treaty too".

 

You then became quite evasive over what it was you had actually said but its clear. You were saying that when it comes to "total political and economic integration into a single state" no country has a veto.

Which is wrong.

You then refused to answer my question about Spain (or any other country in the EU) having a veto over a Scottish application to join. This is because admitting such a thing would have undermined your argument that all countries in the EU no longer had a veto on such matters.

 

I hope this has jogged your memory of events and you will now be able to remember.

Happy to help. 

 

No, you are wrong. You are completely confused and unclear of what I said or meant. 

 

Yes, I refused to answer your question about Spain. I am allowed to do that, even though I know the answer. 

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, 7by7 said:

Not misquoting; paraphrasing.

 

You did not use the word 'completely,' but in the context of your posts and those you were responding to, you appeared to have meant it! 

 

Even if you didn't but simply poorly worded your responses; anyone who knows anything about the treaty knows that the policy areas referred to are still subject to veto; despite your attempts to say otherwise.

 

Yes, it is time you stopped your nonsense. Read the links to Full Fact; read the links to the FCO with an open mind. If you refuse to believe links I have provided, do some research yourself. Do that and you will then see you have been fed lies and myths about the treaty.

 

Ah! So I "appeared to have meant it". Tsk tsk. 

 

"Even if you didn't but simply poorly worded your responses"! - Great grammatical skills there! 

 

What policy areas did I refer to? 

 

I've read the links and did plenty of research before the referendum. Open-minded as always. 

 

The lies and myths about EEC/EU treaties involving the UK started 50 years ago. 

 

 

[melvinmelvin]

On 7/14/2020 at 8:13 PM, nauseus said:

Marks and Spencers do seem fairly competent,

 

had forgotten about this one,

anyway, will leave this for now

 

however, I have learned that the term competent (and derivatives) have a 

significantly more narrow semantics in English than in some other European languages

 

 

[Laughing Gravy]

10 hours ago, kingdong said:

what the 37 million pounds it costs britain every week to be a member of the eu? oh i forgot,we get back a rebate of thirty bob a week and are told when and how to spend it.

I am rolling over now at the Non Brits on here who have continually told us what a mistake we are doing, googling what 30 bob is

[heybuz]

On 6/28/2020 at 2:40 PM, Susco said:

Yes because Australia does very well, looking at the value of their currency. NOT

its a little above the pound at around 44 thai baht, remember you have to double it to compare,22 becomes 44.

 

[Rookiescot]

8 hours ago, nauseus said:

No, you are wrong. You are completely confused and unclear of what I said or meant. 

 

Yes, I refused to answer your question about Spain. I am allowed to do that, even though I know the answer. 

People can read the discussion for themselves and come to their own conclusions about what you meant and why you refused to answer a simple question. 

[transam]

12 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 Instead of posting feeble excuses and put downs, why not really put me in my place and show everyone how you are far more knowledgeable on this subject than I by actually providing some real, concrete benefits of Brexit to the UK and us British citizens who actually live here?

 

Even if doing so means repeating yourself, surely that is no hardship for such an enthusiastic proselytiser of Brexit as yourself?

 

Don't you want to convert me and others to your viewpoint?

There is absolutely no chance of us trying to convert folk such as yourself. A lefty is always a lefty, unless they see their lefty thing has gone tits up, which the last general election showed.

You talk about put downs, but you constantly use condescending words against members here. Put you in your place, well forum rules do not allow that kinda stuff. ????

 

But one thing is for sure, Brexit is done, the UK moves on, but you will continue to stand on your orange box, good for a laugh though, whenever you show up...

[transam]

12 hours ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Mocking Brexiteers is great entertainment ???? I feel for the Brits who will be suffering from this, but for me it’s been a very amusing 4 years so far, and it can only get better once the lorries start piling up. 

Nooooo, we are careful drivers, and drive on the "right" side of the road...????

[transam]

12 hours ago, Loiner said:

I know, but you're all still at it.

Is that 7x7.....?   ????...............????